Is it time to join Nato

28-02-2022 2:05am

Good to see you again, gortanna. They're missing you on the ct threads.

Donald Trump · 28-02-2022 2:46am

Is it time to join NATO?

No. It's after a quarter to 2 in the morning. It's time for bed

markodaly · 28-02-2022 2:50am

Maybe it is time.

Certainly its time for Ireland to have a proper think of what it wants from its defence forces. We have the weakest defence forces by far in Western Europe and a vast amount of Ocean and airspace to defend....

The basics would be nice, but yes, NATO may be a good idea alright.

THE_SHEEP · 28-02-2022 3:10am

" Is it time to join NATO ? "

Only if there's free pints !!

28-02-2022 5:42am

Sort our own defence forces first, then decide on NATO. At least we can truly be neutral if needed then too

28-02-2022 8:00am

Do we have any friends in Congress who could wrangle some nuclear bombs for us?

28-02-2022 9:00am

Ireland's first priority is surely the survival of the Irish nation. Given Ireland's small size and geography, as few as one or two hydrogen bombs detonating on the island would extinguish our nation. In the event of a global nuclear war, we would probably be struck anyway; but that doesn't mean we should make it a certainty by joining an alliance out of which we stand to gain absolutely nothing but a nuclear target on our back.

28-02-2022 10:20am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118705768#Comment_118705768

And for that to happen, both the UK and France would need to be conquered... at which time, being a member of NATO would mean squat, nor would having a tiny military.

Captainsatnav · 28-02-2022 11:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118703566#Comment_118703566

Poland, UK, US, Canada, Estonia, Latvia, Norway, Greece, Lithuania, Denmark, Belgium, Czechia, Albania all suffered a lot moe a lot more recently at the hands of Germany, Romania, Hungary and Italy...

28-02-2022 12:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118706907#Comment_118706907

wasnt ireland already on the soviet nuclear target list?

nigeldaniel · 28-02-2022 1:02pm

100% yes The Republic should join NATO. Russia has already started a cyberwar with us in case Pro Russia folks try to make us forget. A Hybrid war would be next on their agenda which we already see signs of courtesy of some odd comments from Russia about Ireland and the Irish language of late.

Mad_maxx · 28-02-2022 2:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118703566#Comment_118703566

Poland joined a Nato alliance with Germany

most countries dont hold an infinite grudge

banie01 · 28-02-2022 4:12pm

I would be in no rush for us to join NATO.

However, the defence capability we sorely lack needs to addressed. I think even the recently released Defence Commission report is now overtaken by Geo-political reality.

We need to accept that option 3 is now the baseline. We are not and never will be capable of going toe to toe with a great power. That should not be our aim however, we must be able to provide control of our airspace and EEZ, to be able to surveil and inderdict interlopers and to present at least a notional defensive capability.

The rush to fighter jets? We certainly need the capability but I'd suggest for that we start with offering one of our European neighbours use of SNN as a western approaches base for air policing. Capability takes time to build and we should do it carefully.

Focus our resources on our Navy and on actual maritime patrol and exclusion capability. The new CASA are a good step in that direction.

We desperately need an airlift capability and we should consider joining either an Aircraft pool such as EATC.

We don't need to rush towards NATO, but certainly we should both improve our capability and integrate more with PESCO.

Neutrality and whether we are or not? Needs to be dealt with head on. Yes we have an important tradition of being militarily non-aligned. But we are a "western" nation on the edge of the EU with a huge amount of strategic value in our location for both sea and air communication as well as the cables 😉

Our only constitutional nod to neutrality is article 49. Which absent invasion, grants the power to make war to the Daíl. A referendum on whether we seek to change that article to "neutral" or to give a clearer language? Maybe, but other than many in Ireland assuming we are "legally" neutral rather than just "traditionally"? What would it gain.

The lack of devensive capability is a drum that many of us armchair generals have been banging for quite a while. The actions of Russia, the threats to Sweden and Finland and the nuclear sabre rattling only strengthens that need IMO.

In the interim? We should sent out Javelin and AT4 to Ukraine.

titan18 · 28-02-2022 4:19pm

NATO is unnecessary when we have the UK on our side and UK terrority on the island. If Russia invaded, US (Shannon and politics of the US) and UK would help.

And if anyone else invaded us, it'd probably be the UK so we're fecked in or out of NATO.

Capt'n Midnight · 28-02-2022 4:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118705102#Comment_118705102

Ireland is part of the Nordic Group of the EU's Rapid Reaction Force.

Ireland has a long history as UN peacekeepers and winning the peace can be more difficult than winning the war.

We have good relations with the US and are beside France and the UK.

timmyntc · 28-02-2022 4:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118706117#Comment_118706117

We already "offer" Shannon to NATO members, why would they admit us when they already get what they want from us?

We have nothing to contribute, and the only tangible impact of joining NATO is seeing Irish soldiers shipped off to die. Best of luck lads

Cordell · 28-02-2022 4:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118706907#Comment_118706907

Ireland and and other countries need to join NATO to prevent states like Russia and China from starting a global nuclear war. There is no much value in being one of the few not bombed in the nuclear winter waiting for starvation and radiation poisoning to do the job.

marieholmfan · 28-02-2022 5:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118709263#Comment_118709263

How is the UK on our side?

The UK continues to occupy this country. The UK is Ireland's only enemy.

marieholmfan · 28-02-2022 5:06pm

positron · 28-02-2022 5:16pm

Wouldn't joining the NATO jeopardise the respect Ireland gets as a peacekeeping force. Why would anyone want to attack Ireland anyway, in or out of NATO?

As a small country with very low population density, and not much in the way of easily exploitable natural resources, Ireland should not be in the cross-hairs of any rogue states / Bond villains etc, unless of course if Ireland picks a side and starts contributing to a war.

Even if we were to divert massive amount of GDP to defense, there is absolutely no way we can compete with larger players out there. We are smaller than a medium size city of many of the more powerful nations. On the other hand, being non-aligned will help us punch above our weight-class as mediators, facilitating peace deals, (peacefully) advocating for the vulnerable etc.

Just thinking out loud.

titan18 · 28-02-2022 5:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118709492#Comment_118709492

They're not coming for the rest of the country at least. Considering our army, it'd be over in an hour.

HalfAndHalf · 28-02-2022 5:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118709492#Comment_118709492

Here we go again! 🤦‍♂️ You and Black Noel should start a band!

indioblack · 28-02-2022 5:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118709589#Comment_118709589

The Black Velvet Band?

Dav010 · 28-02-2022 5:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118709492#Comment_118709492

Not the important part though.

Tony EH · 28-02-2022 9:37pm

People need to get real about this concept.

Ireland has no defence, and even if we pumped billions into our "defence" over the next year or more, we'd still have no real defence. Almost any nation that wanted to invade would steamroller through us in a matter of, at best, months.

In addition, joining NATO comes with a list of responsibilities, the most salient of which is supporting other NATO aligned nations if they come under an attack. That means ANY NATO aligned nations, whether or not we agree with their plight or the circumstances that were the catalyst.

We are far better off maintaining our long standing neutrality that has served us well in the past and contributing to UN peacekeeping operations, which amounts to a mere pinprick as it is.

The bottom line is we don't have the resources to be a viable member of NATO...nor do we have the need.

DeadHand · 28-02-2022 10:08pm

Neutrality has served us well since the foundation of this state.

I see no compelling reason to abandon it.

We are blessed by geography in that we enjoy splendid remoteness and friendly, democratic neighbours.

Neutrality is a logical and dignified policy for a nation of our size, history and position.

Firblog · 28-02-2022 10:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118707150#Comment_118707150

Nonsense. A couple of assault ships landing in Galway, paratroopers landing at shannon and transport planes then landing, no need to try to go through UK and France to try to reach us.