Arlene, Edwin, her replacement and his replacement as leader of the DUP

Hamsterchops

Edwin Poots Vs Jeffrey Donaldson

McMurphy

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Edwin Poots Vs Jeffrey Donaldson

Donaldson is a former UUP man, prob not viewed as being either hard-line enough, nor a bonafide DUPer to many members.

Poots is one of the madcap creationists I mentioned earlier..

Like being asked to choose between a dog or a cat shît sandwich. If this is the calibre or new potential leaders, the DUP are in turmoil it would seem.

realdanbreen

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Edwin Poots Vs Jeffrey Donaldson

Sir Jeffrey if you don't mind.

Dyr

McMurphy wrote: »

Donaldson is a former UUP man, prob not viewed as being either hard-line enough, nor a bonafide DUPer to many members.

Poots is one of the madcap creationists I mentioned earlier..

Like being asked to choose between a dog or a cat shît sandwich. If this is the calibre or new potential leaders, the DUP are in turmoil it would seem.

DUP have a few handy lads but none of them are MLAs and none of them are hardline enough to win over the handbanger element

O'Neill

realdanbreen wrote: »

Sir Jeffrey if you don't mind.

Jeffrey 'Daniel' O'Donaldson

Fr Tod Umptious

McMurphy wrote: »

Donaldson is a former UUP man, prob not viewed as being either hard-line enough, nor a bonafide DUPer to many members.

Poots is one of the madcap creationists I mentioned earlier..

Like being asked to choose between a dog or a cat shsandwich. If this is the calibre or new potential leaders, the DUP are in turmoil it would seem.

Donaldson and Foster left the UUP at the same time actually.

oisinog

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Edwin Poots Vs Jeffrey Donaldson

Sir Jeffrey won't take the leadership firstly he is an MP and not an MLA, you need an MLA to lead the party and hold the first minister role.

If he was co-oped into the assembley they would have to fire an MLA and this would create a bi-election in Lagan Valley and with the shifts in demographics there is the potential to loose the seat if voting shifted to UUP and alliance who had an increase in 9k in votes in the last election

suicide_circus

Reading this thread....we're no more ready for a united Ireland than they are.

oisinog

suicide_circus wrote: »

Reading this thread....we're no more ready for a united Ireland than they are.

We are not, but we need to start the work for one as it is coming and most unionists can see that, hence what is going on up here at the minute

randy hickey

Bambi wrote: »

DUP have a few handy lads but none of them are MLAs and none of them are hardline enough to win over the handbanger element

Wait, there's an element of their support base that aren't headbangers?


Many down here don't get how intrinsically intertwined the DUP is with the Free Presbyterian Church, and how deeply this affects their personal beliefs and political ideology. There is no comparitor to point to in the South.

Their deep religious faith feeds their absolute self-belief that they are right, and everybody else is not just wrong, but lesser.
Here in the South, there is a tendency to tar all Protestants with the same brush, but the Free Pre's don't think much of the other denominations, and as I said, they think very, very differently.

I honestly don't know how this religious fundamentalism can ever be reconciled with anything resembling a united Ireland.
What I do know, is that the "Sure they can all feck off back to Scotland/England if they don't like it" position is infantile nonsense.

Any UI would have to accomodate them, but short of Westminster adopting Sharia Law for the entire UK, I just can't see how they could ever be brought on board.

suicide_circus

oisinog wrote: »

We are not, but we need to start the work for one as it is coming and most unionists can see that, hence what is going on up here at the minute

True but the visceral hatred on display here....

breezy1985

oisinog wrote: »

Sir Jeffrey won't take the leadership firstly he is an MP and not an MLA, you need an MLA to lead the party and hold the first minister role.

That isn't a rule it's just usual DUP practice but nothing stopping them from going the same way as Sinn Fein.

Except not wanting to do anything the same as SF I suppose

oisinog

randy hickey wrote: »

Wait, there's an element of their support base that aren't headbangers?


Many down here don't get how intrinsically intertwined the DUP is with the Free Presbyterian Church, and how deeply this affects their personal beliefs and political ideology. There is no comparitor to point to in the South.

Their deep religious faith feeds their absolute self-belief that they are right, and everybody else is not just wrong, but lesser.
Here in the South, there is a tendency to tar all Protestants with the same brush, but the Free Pre's don't think much of the other denominations, and as I said, they think very, very differently.

I honestly don't know how this religious fundamentalism can ever be reconciled with anything resembling a united Ireland.
What I do know, is that the "Sure they can all feck off back to Scotland/England if they don't like it" position is infantile nonsense.

Any UI would have to accomodate them, but short of Westminster adopting Sharia Law for the entire UK, I just can't see how they could ever be brought on board.

The Free Ps only have 15k in membership and you also need to remember that 98% are not involved in politics.

The biggest challange is edcuating the Loyalists they have no leadership and some have the tendancy to follow the wrong people such as Jamie Bryson who are leading them down the road to a life of crimal records which starts a cycle in that community.

Some community workers are doing great work but you have the people who are linked to east belfast UDA and end up dealing or taking drugs

oisinog

breezy1985 wrote: »

That isn't a rule it's just usual DUP practice but nothing stopping them from going the same way as Sinn Fein.

Except not wanting to do anything the same as SF I suppose

It would take a change on the DUP rules that as far as I know can only be done at a party conference

blanch152

suicide_circus wrote: »

True but the visceral hatred on display here....

It is sad to see, and ironic that the same people putting out the hate will claim them as fellow Irishmen in a minute.

oisinog

suicide_circus wrote: »

True but the visceral hatred on display here....

It is a small miniorty of the people and the trouble is this is stemming from a number of clampets on social media

I would be deemed a Nationalist but I have friends all over the community and the digust that my loyalist friends show to the people trying to take over the loyalist community is shocking.

How many unionist polititions where out trying to talk their community out of the riots. At the same time look at SDLP or Sinn Fein with young Nationalists try to go out on the street to riot. The difference is night and day for everyone to see.

McMurphy

suicide_circus wrote: »

True but the visceral hatred on display here....

Where's this "visceral hatred" on display, it's absolutely amazing that a few people keep claiming this and when asked to point it out, they then vanish like a fart in the wind.

FrancieBrady

breezy1985 wrote: »

That isn't a rule it's just usual DUP practice but nothing stopping them from going the same way as Sinn Fein.

Don't think so. It's a rule I think. If Gavin Robinson MP were to stand he would cause a by-election in his constituency as he would have to stand down to run in a leadership contest.

Tyrone212

McMurphy wrote: »

Where's this "visceral hatred" on display, it's absolutely amazing that a few people keep claiming this and when asked to point it out, they then vanish like a fart in the wind.

In essence they're just doses looking for attention. The DUP are backward dinosaurs. The majority in the UK and Ireland think that and that's where the stick they get comes from, nothing to do with them being Unionists, all to do with them being embarrassing idiots.

McMurphy

Tyrone212 wrote: »

In essence they're just doses looking for attention. The DUP are backward dinosaurs. The majority in the UK and Ireland think that and that's where the stick they get comes from, nothing to do with them being Unionists, all to do with them being embarrassing idiots.

Pointing out that they are conservative, bigoted and many of them are creationists isn't hatred, that's just stating the bloody obvious.

I don't hate unionists or dupers, but I'm quite within my rights to factually state some of their ethics and beliefs belong to a different century and possibly planet.

rockatansky

McMurphy wrote: »

Where's this "visceral hatred" on display, it's absolutely amazing that a few people keep claiming this and when asked to point it out, they then vanish like a fart in the wind.

There's none, but one or two posters on here who just can't abide the idea of a thread on the North not involving Sinn Fein.

realdanbreen

suicide_circus wrote: »

True but the visceral hatred on display here....

I think you're getting your threads mixed up, where did you see "visceral hatred on display here" ?

FrancieBrady

rockatansky wrote: »

There's none, but one or two posters on here who just can't abide the idea of a thread on the North not involving Sinn Fein.

I think they fear that their 'They are the same up there' mantra may be rumbled if a thread on the DUP is allowed proceed without getting SF included.
Several attempts now to divert the thread bu, it has to be said, the usual obsessive posters.

mariaalice

For those who are really up on NI politics who would be the typical Alliance voter?

L1011

mariaalice wrote: »

For those who are really up on NI politics who would be the typical Alliance voter?

Centrist Unionists; more likely from the professional classes. This would be widening out a bit over time.

Tyrone212

L1011 wrote: »

Centrist Unionists; more likely from the professional classes. This would be widening out a bit over time.

Yes. I think younger people overall as well.

oisinog

mariaalice wrote: »

For those who are really up on NI politics who would be the typical Alliance voter?

I dont think there is a typical Alliance voter. At the last west minister elections I voted Allance as I considered them the best option in Lagan Valley.

I would say they attract the more pro europe unionist votes as they have no other party that would be close to their thinking. You would also get a number of Nationalists voteing for them when they see them as the best option in their constituency

awec

mariaalice wrote: »

For those who are really up on NI politics who would be the typical Alliance voter?

Moderate unionists who don't align with the DUPs views on social or cultural issues (e.g. pro gay marriage).

Pro-european unionists too.

I think they would also have voters who are ambivalent on the constitutional question, and would have voters from both the protestant and catholic communities.

McMurphy

She's gone.

Stepped down apparently.

Edit, link here.

https://news.sky.com/story/arlene-foster-to-step-down-as-dup-leader-and-northern-irelands-first-minister-she-tells-sky-news-12289489

Vicxas

Is this bad or good? I read that the fella odds on to replace her is far more hard-line than her.

gmisk

Arlene Foster to step down as leader of the DUP https://jrnl.ie/5422054

I honestly think the replacements are a lot lot worse....Poots makes Foster look liberal

10000maniacs

The DUP's house of cards is falling down now. Unionism is in for a torrid few years.

gmisk

gmisk wrote: »

Arlene Foster to step down as leader of the DUP https://jrnl.ie/5422054

I honestly think the replacements are a lot lot worse....Poots makes Foster look liberal

When Foster, Donaldson, and even Paisley Jr come across as the pragmatic ones who might even listen before saying no then you know you’re in trouble.

banie01

Arlene's last roll of the dice, failed!

https://twitter.com/banie01/status/1387426013886439427?s=19

realdanbreen

McMurphy wrote: »

She's gone.

Stepped down apparently.

Edit, link here.

https://news.sky.com/story/arlene-foster-to-step-down-as-dup-leader-and-northern-irelands-first-minister-she-tells-sky-news-12289489

We'll never forget you Charlene!

FrancieBrady

'She wasn't the worst'...never a truer word spoken I fear.

gmisk

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When Foster, Donaldson, and even Paisley Jr come across as the pragmatic ones who might even listen before saying no then you know you’re in trouble.

I honestly think the DUP are in trouble in general.
People are starting to finally shift away from the DUP (and to a lesser extent sinn fein) to more moderate parties like the alliance (it helps that they have an extremely capable and erudite leader) and the SDLP.
Also demographics are changing slowly towards NI having more Catholics than protestants
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-43823506

Obviously that doesn't mean more votes for sinn fein etc, but I don't know any Catholics who vote for the DUP.

awec

Vicxas wrote: »

Is this bad or good? I read that the fella odds on to replace her is far more hard-line than her.

Almost everyone in the DUP is more hard line than her.

McMurphy

briany

awec wrote: »

Almost everyone in the DUP is more hard line than her.

Scary.

For Forks Sake

For Forks Sake wrote: »

What about this forward-thinking chap?

https://www.irishnews.com/news/2013/07/03/news/dup-bids-to-ban-drink-at-beer-festival-64047/

No alcohol served during Oktoberfest?

That's just the Wurst.

circadian

Grand, they're already losing any semblance of a moderate base already, a shift to someone more fundamental should hurry that along nicely.

realdanbreen

briany wrote: »

Scary.

Not really. I've always maintained that whatever chance republicans had of forcing Britain out of the 6 counties, the Loyalists have no chance of forcing Britain back into the 6 counties once the Brits finally decide to ditch them.

Ferm001

Going by some of the commentators this morning, DUP fear losing more extreme base to the TUV than they do losing moderates to Alliance.

gmisk

https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1387317267709546503?s=19


Utterly clueless....and he is the political editor for ITV....

briany

realdanbreen wrote: »

Not really. I've always maintained that whatever chance republicans had of forcing Britain out of the 6 counties, the Loyalists have no chance of forcing Britain back into the 6 counties once the Brits finally decide to ditch them.

If a UI were to happen, maybe they could modify the clause about constitutional change by saying there could be another poll if the demographics were ever to swing back in the favour of British Unionism, with the proviso that it would be a poll in two jurisdictions (like the current border poll is), the six counties of NI and another one in GB. Even if the NI one passed, the GB one would return a big 'thanks, but no thanks.'. So, yeah, if and when they're no longer in the UK, they're out of it for good.

briany

None of you asked for it, but here's Jamie Bryson's take

https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1387433348663029761

Not that Bryson ever had much of a mask to slip off, but plainly stating that Unionism ought to be against the GFA is really laying the cards out on the table.

FrancieBrady

briany wrote: »

None of you asked for it, but here's Jamie Bryson's take

https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1387433348663029761

Not that Bryson ever had much of a mask to slip off, but plainly stating that Unionism ought to be against the GFA is really laying the cards out on the table.

I honestly don't know where else the DUP can go now. He is probably right, his mindset has the controls.

gmisk

briany wrote: »

None of you asked for it, but here's Jamie Bryson's take

https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1387433348663029761

Not that Bryson ever had much of a mask to slip off, but plainly stating that Unionism ought to be against the GFA is really laying the cards out on the table.

As you say there was no mask to slip with him, he was and is a big UVF fan.

10000maniacs

Some outlets are saying Edwin Poots will be elected as leader.
Poots comes from world he believes to be less than 10,000 years old - where a woman's role has traditionally been to take care of the children and make the tea in the Orange hall for the men returning from a hard days marching.
When Foster was elected as leader in 2016, he quipped that her greatest achievement was as a mother to her kids.
True or not, a very sexist thing to say.