Covid 19 Part XXXIV-249,437 ROI(4,906 deaths) 120,195 NI (2,145 deaths)(01/05)Read OP

caveat emptor

Not good from India. The ex Indian PM admitted to hospital even though had been double dosed with vaccine.
He's fairly old and frail so not be an issue generally.

https://twitter.com/GabrielScally/status/1384452978086596616?s=20

berocca2016

caveat emptor wrote: »

Not good from India. The ex Indian PM admitted to hospital even though had been double dosed with vaccine.
He's fairly old and frail so not be an issue generally.

https://twitter.com/GabrielScally/status/1384452978086596616?s=20

"Mild symptoms including fever......diabetic.... heart problems.....88 years old"

He was admitted to hospital because of caution over his pre existing conditions and covid. His symptoms are mild, the vaccine works.

Jasper79

caveat emptor wrote: »

Not good from India. The ex Indian PM admitted to hospital even though had been double dosed with vaccine.
He's fairly old and frail so not be an issue generally.

https://twitter.com/GabrielScally/status/1384452978086596616?s=20

Article states he has mild symptoms of covid, not unusual surely with any variant. Hospitalized as precaution due to age and general ill health

caveat emptor

berocca2016 wrote: »

"Mild symptoms including fever......diabetic.... heart problems.....88 years old"

He was admitted to hospital because of caution over his pre existing conditions and covid. His symptoms are mild, the vaccine works.

Well he's got covid so define works. Works for most people.
Also he was vaccinated with covaxin (Indian made vaccine) for which data is fairly thin on the ground.

Poor fella looks to have lots of issues anyway. Hope he get's well soon.

yerwanthere123

Got tested for the first time in Dunmanway this morning. That swab up the nose is something else. Thankfully only took like 5 seconds though.

stephenjmcd

berocca2016 wrote: »

"Mild symptoms including fever......diabetic.... heart problems.....88 years old"

He was admitted to hospital because of caution over his pre existing conditions and covid. His symptoms are mild, the vaccine works.

I might also add he got Covaxin which wouldn't exactly be top of the list of covid vaccines at the moment, to quote an article,

"India's regulators gave the vaccine an emergency approval in January while the third phase of the trial was still underway, sparking scepticism and questions from experts."

"It all began when the regulator in January said the vaccine had been approved for restricted use in emergency situations in public interest as an abundant precaution, in clinical trial mode, especially in the context of infection by mutant strains".

Experts wondered how a vaccine was cleared for emergency use by millions of vulnerable people when its trials were still underway. The All India Drug Action Network at the time said that it was "baffled to understand the scientific logic" to approve "an incompletely studied vaccine". It said that there were "intense concerns arising from the absence of the efficacy data".

berocca2016

caveat emptor wrote: »

Well he's got covid so define works. Works for most people.
Also he was vaccinated with covaxin (Indian made vaccine) for which data is fairly thin on the ground.

Poor fella looks to have lots of issues anyway. Hope he get's well soon.

All the vaccines currently approved by the EMA have proven to be 100% effective at preventing serious illness or death. So yes, they do indeed work.

No one has stated or claimed that there is no possibility of getting mild symptoms.

Corholio

I think the actual vaccine being used is an important detail when being worried about someone picking up covid after being vaccinated. There isn't just 'the vaccine'.

I was just looking CSO on line and if you consider this is a respiratory disease in nature. The deaths from respirator diseases in say 2016, 2017, & 2018 were as below the average between them is say 4020 per year, so they're close in amplitude.

2016 was 3935
2017 was 4079
2018 was 4051

The 1st, 2nd and 3rd quarter of last year, the respiratory deaths were 1288, 797,661, total 2746 or an average of 915 per quarter . If you assume quarter 4 was 915 also then the total from respiratory issues would be 3661. less than 2016, 2017 and 2018. AND yes I know, because of lockdown it would have been several times that many will say. But if about half the deaths were old people from COVID 19, in care homes, just say 2000 why are they not added to Respiratory illness? and if they are included in the numbers, the number is still lower.

is that correct? it looks odd to me.

Turtwig

berocca2016 wrote: »

"Mild symptoms including fever......diabetic.... heart problems.....88 years old"

He was admitted to hospital because of caution over his pre existing conditions and covid. His symptoms are mild, the vaccine works.

He's fever and he's admitted to hospital. His symptoms may get worse.

You can't conclude anything about the vaccines from a single case but you have actually done something worse you have claimed the vaccine works because his symptoms are mild. There's every possibility that his condition deteriorates. If that happens you have painted yourself into a corner.

The bigger issue here is Dr Sally reporting on such a high profile isolated incident with the use of a questionable vaccine.

crossman47

rusty cole wrote: »

I was just looking CSO on line and if you consider this is a respiratory disease in nature. The deaths from respirator diseases in say 2016, 2017, & 2018 were as below the average between them is say 4020 per year, so they're close in amplitude.

2016 was 3935
2017 was 4079
2018 was 4051

The 1st, 2nd and 3rd quarter of last year, the respiratory deaths were 1288, 797,661, total 2746 or an average of 915 per quarter . If you assume quarter 4 was 915 also then the total from respiratory issues would be 3661. less than 2016, 2017 and 2018. AND yes I know, because of lockdown it would have been several times that many will say. But if about half the deaths were old people from COVID 19, in care homes, just say 2000 why are they not added to Respiratory illness? and if they are included in the numbers, the number is still lower.

is that correct? it looks odd to me.

A quick look suggests Covid deaths are classified in broad categories as Other Causes and not Respiratory. These were 3071 of these in Q2 2020 as compared to 1812 in Q2 2019.

so covid is classified as other??

so looking at below, it would read OTHER for excess deaths beyond the usual suspects being Flu, pneumonia and CLD say? but if all the folks that die every year of respiratory diseases are classified as Covid now being that they tested positive and died with it, wouldn't the years Flu, chronic disease and Pneumonia figure be tiny and then OTHER which is Covid, be large.
Sorry about this, just trying to get it right in my mind

have a link for that one you mention on 2020? the one I have is in quarters up to sept ending.



Respiratory Diseases

Deaths from diseases of the respiratory system in 2018 numbered 4,051, of which 1,920 were males and 2,131 were females. There were 1,736 deaths (42.9%) from chronic lower respiratory diseases and 1,207 deaths (29.8%) due to influenza and pneumonia. See table 3.19, 3.20, 3.21 and 3.28.

so on on below in quarter 2 April to June covid is in with all the others? bold



Diseases of the respiratory system:

Deaths from chronic lower respiratory disease numbered 365, pneumonia accounted for 207 deaths and 225 deaths resulted from all other respiratory diseases.

timsey tiger

rusty cole wrote: »

I was just looking CSO on line and if you consider this is a respiratory disease in nature. The deaths from respirator diseases in say 2016, 2017, & 2018 were as below the average between them is say 4020 per year, so they're close in amplitude.

2016 was 3935
2017 was 4079
2018 was 4051

The 1st, 2nd and 3rd quarter of last year, the respiratory deaths were 1288, 797,661, total 2746 or an average of 915 per quarter . If you assume quarter 4 was 915 also then the total from respiratory issues would be 3661. less than 2016, 2017 and 2018. AND yes I know, because of lockdown it would have been several times that many will say. But if about half the deaths were old people from COVID 19, in care homes, just say 2000 why are they not added to Respiratory illness? and if they are included in the numbers, the number is still lower.

is that correct? it looks odd to me.

Would you say that?

Turtwig

Turtwig wrote: »

The bigger issue here is Dr Sally reporting on such a high profile isolated incident with the use of a questionable vaccine.

I think that's a bit harsh, Covaxin has come in at 81% effective in interim results, and looking at the trial it appears to have been run better than AZ for example (phase 3 had a good sample size of people over 60 and of people with pre-existing conditions.)

kleiner feigling

What do people make of Luke O'Neill refusing a vaccine?
It seems so odd to me.
He says it's because he doesn't work in a hospital, although some of his colleagues collect the covid samples from the hospital (!)
Doesn't his lab literally handle covid samples and research?

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/21940808
You'll hear him say it at about 26 minutes mark.

GeorgeBailey

kleiner feigling wrote: »

What do people make of Luke O'Neill refusing a vaccine?
It seems so odd to me.
He says it's because he doesn't work in a hospital, although some of his colleagues collect the covid samples from the hospital (!)
Doesn't his lab literally handle covid samples and research?

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/21940808
You'll hear him say it at about 26 minutes mark.

He refused it because he didn't want to jump the queue. Not anything to do with vaccine hesitancy or the like. Seems fair enough.

kleiner feigling

GeorgeBailey wrote: »

He refused it because he didn't want to jump the queue. Not anything to do with vaccine hesitancy or the like. Seems fair enough.

It's hardly jumping the queue when it's offered to you because you work in an environment containing virus samples?

timsey tiger

kleiner feigling wrote: »

It's hardly jumping the queue when it's offered to you because you work in an environment containing virus samples?

Guess he is an all round Ledge

kleiner feigling

timsey tiger wrote: »

Guess he is an all round Ledge

How? Just seems foolish to me.

wotzgoingon

I'm getting my first injection in less than two weeks. I was told it was the pfizer one.

timsey tiger

kleiner feigling wrote: »

How? Just seems foolish to me.

Even giving him no benefit of doubt, cynically he could well have decided that it would benefit his public persona more to say he gave up his chance of an early shot for somebody with a higher risk profile than the relatively small chance of catching covid. Doesn't seem foolish at all we are talking about him.

GeorgeBailey

kleiner feigling wrote: »

It's hardly jumping the queue when it's offered to you because you work in an environment containing virus samples?

I imagine that after seeing the goings-on with the Beacon and the like he didn't want to risk being put in the same basket.

kleiner feigling

GeorgeBailey wrote: »

I imagine that after seeing the goings-on with the Beacon and the like he didn't want to risk being put in the same basket.

Yeah perhaps, but people who are legitimately offered it (like LO'N) should probably take it when offered. That seems to have been the message all along, to take it when you are offered it.
It probably is a case of ego; playing a faux-hero by skipping his chance.

Turtwig

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think that's a bit harsh, Covaxin has come in at 81% effective in interim results, and looking at the trial it appears to have been run better than AZ for example (phase 3 had a good sample size of people over 60 and of people with pre-existing conditions.)

Open to correction, my understanding is that the trials haven't been completed and the data on the vulnerable cohorts is lacking?

Regardless my larger point really was about Scally taking one individual as sample to express concern over a vaccine. That's irresponsible imo. If the pm didn't get sick it would be equally as ridiculous to conclude the vaccine worked.

caveat emptor

Yeah the vaccines work by eliciting an immune response. That ex pm has a whole host of issue which would make him not a good example regardless of the particular vaccine.

iamwhoiam

kleiner feigling wrote: »

Yeah perhaps, but people who are legitimately offered it (like LO'N) should probably take it when offered. That seems to have been the message all along, to take it when you are offered it.
It probably is a case of ego; playing a faux-hero by skipping his chance.

Its not probably as we cannot know his motives . None of us can say what is probable or not

pc7

kleiner feigling wrote: »

Yeah perhaps, but people who are legitimately offered it (like LO'N) should probably take it when offered. That seems to have been the message all along, to take it when you are offered it.
It probably is a case of ego; playing a faux-hero by skipping his chance.

He said all members of his lab refused it and decided to wait their turn, bar the 3 people who regularly go to the hospital. Seems pretty decent to me.

fits

seamus wrote: »

It is, but it's because they're giving people every fighting chance.

With normal hospital numbers, you expect a covid admission to either test negative or be discharged within two weeks. So there's a fairly predictable cycle time and a fairly constant flow of discharges. If the number of new patients is low this week, then you know that the total hospital numbers will drop.

The ICU numbers are (as far as I understand it), not just people who are covid-positive, but people who are still fighting complications as a result of covid, whether they're positive or negative.

So they can be in there for weeks upon weeks. Which means that even if you have few or no new admissions to ICU this week, you're not guaranteed for the numbers to drop.

Know of two people in their 60s who were in icu for months. Over four months in one case.

kleiner feigling

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Its not probably as we cannot know his motives . None of us can say what is probable or not

That's fair, I didn't mean for my cynicism to creep in.
As you can tell, I'm not his biggest fan.
He's fine, I just get sick of hearing him everywhere.

A close friend worked in his lab until recently so I've heard he does have an ego (but I don't know him personally, and I'm sure we've all had colleagues/managers we can complain about so I take that with a pinch of salt).