Farming and the Veganism: Where love and hate collide.

_Brian

El Tarangu wrote: »

A bit, yeah. I don't see threads on the price of heifers being spammed with videos of slaughterhouses from V&V posters.


No, I just said that I found it a bit of odd fixation, that's all.

Honestly if the forum didn’t regularly immerse itself in farmer bashing and bullying you’ll find farmers don’t care.

Why a forum is allowed to regularly abuse a section of society with no oversight is bizarre, if ye were saying the same thing about travellers the forum would be shut up quicker than a vegan eating a sneaky Big Mac

richie123

El Tarangu wrote: »

With all due respect - go and whistle. I'm no more answerable for the opinions of other vegetarians than you are for the actions of other farmers.

But if we see other farmers acting the bolix we'll call them out.
You haven't been abused or put down.
All replys to you although robust were civil.
The bullying and abuse I received and others on the v and v forum was unreal.

auspicious

Lady Haywire wrote: »

Still waiting an answer auspicious?

It is one term/concept used to allow people to draw comparisons and look beyond the generally accepted language.
In that particular discussion I remember a vid posted of many sheep being clamped onto a rack, turned upside-down and artificially inseminated at high speed. It looked horrendous.
It was a discussion. You refuted the term. I retracted it. That's all.

emaherx

El Tarangu wrote: »

A bit, yeah. I don't see threads on the price of heifers being spammed with videos of slaughterhouses from V&V posters.


No, I just said that I found it a bit of odd fixation, that's all.

Don't see any farmers spamming V&V with any videos either though and certainly not on threads about vegan diets or health concerns.

But I suppose there are never V&V posters in any F&F threads?

_Brian

The point I made in the other thread in the v and v forum that got deleted.

I can look at aspects of farming like grinding chicks and say “we shouldn’t be doing that, we are better than that”

Yet I see nobody in the VandV forum looking at the behaviour of their peers and saying “don’t be abusing farmers by calling them murderers and rapists, it’s not true and bullying”

Nobody in that forum says “stop beating down on farmers” the odd bad practice doesn’t represent all animal farming.

No.

You have the extremists shooting their mouths off and everyone else sings dumb.

Not name calling and bullying farmers should be included in their charter, but that wouldn’t suit the forum agenda.

gozunda

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I find it suprising,that a thread set up to discuss another forum is allowed?

Espially since said thread was started off back of the OP being banned from forum being discussed?

Whats that got to do with my comment you quoted?

And I didnt name or create the thread. And its not to dicuss 'another forum"

Yes I got a ban for daring to point out the use of hate speech. But no I wasnt the only one that happened to. Go figure.

If you've got an issue with this thread - there's plenty of options...


Clarification: the thread is not about anyones 'ban'. Its about the arising issues from the help desk thread.

Mod: For the record, this thread was split off from another and named by me. In a hurry. The point is well made and I've changed the title. Greysides.

gozunda

gozunda wrote: »

Atracking the poster eh. How unusual....

Yeah I got a ban for daring to point out the use of hate speech. Go figure.

If you've got an issue with this thread - there's plenty over in v&v which may be more suitable for you ...

And btw the thread wasn't created or named by me ...

Havnt attacked yous?

I resent the accusation

Lady Haywire

auspicious wrote: »

It is one term/concept used to allow people to draw comparisons and look beyond the generally accepted language.
In that particular discussion I remember a vid posted of many sheep being clamped onto a rack, turned upside-down and artificially inseminated at high speed. It looked horrendous.
It was a discussion. You refuted the term. I retracted it. That's all.

You appear to be having trouble answering my original question. Can you try again?

White Clover

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Havnt attacked yous?

I resent the accusation

Have a read of the charter on the V & V forum.

auspicious

emaherx wrote: »

What?

Is it illegal to film inside factory farms anywhere? Or just the way most vegan activists do it is by trespass at the very least but often also break and entering amongst other crimes including often harm to animals.

So it's ilegal to film inside factory farms in the way it's ilegal for me to film inside your house and yet you continue to compare to nazi treatment of Jews? Very bizarre, fairly insensitive and hounstly a fairly sick perspective with a massive stretch in your comparison anyway.

People were drawing the comparison decades ago. It's imposed loss of life on a mass scale. It only happens because there is a demand for it.

gozunda

gozunda wrote: »

Attacking the poster eh. How unusual....

Yeah I got a ban for daring to point out the use of hate speech. But no I wasnt the only one that happened to. Go figure.

If you've got an issue with this thread - there's plenty over in v&v which may be more suitable for you ...

And btw the thread wasn't created or named by me ...

I don’t think he was attacking anyone in his post.

You should report it if you think there’s a problem with it rather than advising him where he should/could post it.

And you did ask for this thread to be created.

greysides

Deleted User wrote: »

Havnt attacked yous?

I resent the accusation

The matter is corrected. Blaaz was correct.

Deleted User wrote: »

I don’t think he was attacking anyone in his post.

You should report it if you think there’s a problem with it rather than advising him where he should/could post it.

And you did ask for this thread to be created.

He wasn't.

He was perfectly entitled.

He didn't.


Matter closed, move on.

gozunda

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don’t think he was attacking anyone in his post.

You should report it if you think there’s a problem with it rather than advising him where he should/could post it.

And you did ask for this thread to be created.

Well well if it isn't our favourite farming critic.
I dunno - I guess it was becsuse he was complaining about the thread being posted here ....

And yes I did ask but I certainly wasn't the first poster to do so.

I had no idea there was such a depth of feeling about the crap being pushed against farming by a few.

Or does that not suit? Ah well ...

El Tarangu

emaherx wrote: »

Don't see any farmers spamming V&V with any videos either though and certainly not on threads about vegan diets or health concerns.

But I suppose there are never V&V posters in any F&F threads?

From my limited experience in the V&V forum, about half of the posts are from 5 posters from F&F.

If F&F threads had a similar proportion of Veggie posters, what effect do you think that would have the forum over time?

gozunda

El Tarangu wrote: »

From my limited experience in the V&V forum, about half of the posts are from 5 posters from F&F.

If F&F threads had a similar proportion of Veggie posters, what effect do you think that would have the forum over time?

I think its largely because v&v has bugger all posters full stop. And those who post and attack farming are the same few time and time again.

White Clover

El Tarangu wrote: »

From my limited experience in the V&V forum, about half of the posts are from 5 posters from F&F.

If F&F threads had a similar proportion of Veggie posters, what effect do you think that would have the forum over time?

Wouldn't be there if we didn't have to correct the false and misleading posts.

Alot of traffic on this forum. If any poster was being disingenious, they would be pulled on it.

emaherx

El Tarangu wrote: »

From my limited experience in the V&V forum, about half of the posts are from 5 posters from F&F.

If F&F threads had a similar proportion of Veggie posters, what effect do you think that would have the forum over time?

And if F&F had the same amount of Vegan centric threads as V&V does farming ones?
it seems to work both ways, strange that

auspicious

emaherx wrote: »

So farm them using AI, you are the last person I'd expect to be an advocate of such things. Guess we'd have to give them contraceptives to prevent natural procreation though.

I don't know much about livestock needed to regenerate soil. But if it is essential, sexed-sperm would be the solution to not having to euthanize numerous males. There may be other solutions. I can't say much more on the topic atm.

greysides

Mod Advisory:

Please avoid comparisons or analogies between Concentration camps/Nazism to Factory farming on this forum.

auspicious

greysides wrote: »

Mod Advisory:

Please avoid comparisons or analogies between Concentration camps/Nazism to Factory farming on this forum.

I wouldn't of mentioned it only Gozunda brought it into the discussion.

emaherx

auspicious wrote: »

People were drawing the comparison decades ago. It's imposed loss of life on a mass scale. It only happens because there is a demand for it.

Most people be they vegan, vegetarian or omnivore wouldn't dream of making such a comparison.

In fairness the average crop of cabbage involves loss of life on a mass scale with the use of insecticide, I don't see much difference between killing insects to produce veg and killing cows for meat, however I'd never compare either to Genocide.

auspicious

Lady Haywire wrote: »

You appear to be having trouble answering my original question. Can you try again?

I know you take issue with the term. It is emotive. The difference between it and A.I. without consent could be likened to the difference between murder and slaughter.
It was retracted because I conceded the point to you.

auspicious

auspicious wrote: »

I know you take issue with the term. It is emotive. The difference between it and A.I. without consent could be likened to the difference between murder and slaughter.
It was retracted because I conceded the point to you.

Wait until,you hear what happens with pedigree texels and embryo transfer into hoggets

Resulting in,c-sections and a significant portion of these hoggets,going straight up the ramp and away to factory as soon as lambs reared


I have personally stopped buying ET rams,purely on point of principal

White Clover

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Wait until,you hear what happens with pedigree texels and embryo transfer into hoggets

Resulting in,c-sections and a significant portion of these hoggets,going straight up the ramp and away to factory as soon as lambs reared


I have personally stopped buying ET rams,purely on point of principal

Is this with all Texels, pedigree Texels or just someone you know of?
Just to be clear.....

Lady Haywire

No issue with you, your farming knowledge is incorrect,. But still my point stands.

Lady Haywire wrote: »

You only retracted it after proven wrong, so yes, that is targeting farming practice. If I hadn't replied to that, would you have changed your post?

auspicious

emaherx wrote: »

Most people be they vegan, vegetarian or omnivore wouldn't dream of making such a comparison.

In fairness the average crop of cabbage involves loss of life on a mass scale with the use of insecticide, I don't see much difference between killing insects to produce veg and killing cows for meat, however I'd never compare either to Genocide.

It's hard to remove insects and such out of the way of harvesting.
Meat is not essential to thrive. There are 6ft6in vegan from birth people out the with healthy bmi.

White Clover

White Clover wrote: »

Is this with all Texels, or just someone you know of?
Just to be clear.....

With a significant proportion of breeders,and not just texels either



Its kind of an open secret,but texels and suffock would be most prominent imo,due to amount of money tied up in em afaik

White Clover

[Deleted User] wrote: »

With a significant proportion of breeders,and not just texels either



Its kind of an open secret,but texels and suffock would be most prominent imo,due to amount of money tied up in em afaik

I don't think it is as widespread or as common as you make it out to be. And it 100% doesn't happen in commercial sheep production. I genuinely don't know any breeders that operate like that.

White Clover

White Clover wrote: »

I don't think it is as widespread or as common as you make it out to be. I genuinely don't know any breeders that operate like that.

I know of 5 different breeders,that do,id be good mates with em,they know my views/feelings on not buying ET lambs

I went to blessington premier sales a few years ago and roughly 1 in 8 was an ET lamb (i try to always buy a twin/triplet,so it shows where i check on cathaloge)

Its wrong on animals involved,what they are doing.....its easy to se why,with money tied up etc,just personally,i couldnt and wont support it



Edit: even feel AI in sheep,is excessively invasive on em tbh

auspicious

Lady Haywire wrote: »

No issue with you, your farming knowledge is incorrect,. But still my point stands.

I wouldn't of had incentive to change the post.
As I said some terms are a way to describe practices so as to be seen in a different light, to get passed what is known as cognitive dissonance. Also to be seen from the animals' perspective.
Those sheep I mentioned in vid., they weren't whooping with delight.