The Leinster Championship is dead.

Rolo2010

Fann Linn wrote: »

And Galway's accounts were under investigation by the Gardai the last I heard. Something about concert revenues from Salthill not accounted for.I did ask on another thread was there an outcome to their enquiries yet?

It finished. There was an audit. You could easily look this up yourself.

gormdubhgorm

Scoundrel wrote: »

I'm sorry but this is another nonsense that needs to be nipped in the bud straight away in the last two years one of Meath or Kildare have been in the super 8s i.e they were one of the best 8 teams in the country.

Amusing very selective! Meath a div 2 team nearly 2 decades! Kildare a yo yo team in NFL. Plus Kildare > underachievers in GAA pop. resources talent untapped.

ClanofLams

Funding imbalance accelerated the issue but the reality is that structures which were appropriate in the 1880s and even until the turn of the century are no longer fit for purpose. 100 years ago, Dublin had 10% of the population on the island, now that figure is north of 20% and only going one way. Dublin will never lose a Leinster Championship again under the current structures and will win 80% (conseratively) of Senior All-Irelands.

Coybig_

ClanofLams wrote: »

Funding imbalance accelerated the issue but the reality is that structures which were appropriate in the 1880s and even until the turn of the century are no longer fit for purpose. 100 years ago, Dublin had 10% of the population on the island, now that figure is north of 20% and only going one way. Dublin will never lose a Leinster Championship again under the current structures and will win 80% (conseratively) of Senior All-Irelands.

Cork, Limerick, Galway don't see anything close to the dominance of Dublin despite being the next 3 most populated areas.

It's funding, simple as that.

Did you smash it

Coybig_ wrote: »

Cork, Limerick, Galway don't see anything close to the dominance of Dublin despite being the next 3 most populated areas.

It's funding, simple as that.

Can’t really say that unless cork, limerick or galway had a population close to Dublin. Which they don’t.

Fann Linn

Rolo2010 wrote: »

It finished. There was an audit. You could easily look this up yourself.

Serious financial findings, blank cheques, rotten to the core, some of the phrases used.

Didn't know it was completed, just thought of it in the light of Dublin's finances being examined.

ClanofLams

Coybig_ wrote: »

Cork, Limerick, Galway don't see anything close to the dominance of Dublin despite being the next 3 most populated areas.

It's funding, simple as that.

I certainly think funding was a substantial factor in Dublin reaching their current dominance, it's probably not possible to figure out exactly how much. But I think it was going to be an issue later anyway (albeit without the funding imbalances that may have been twenty years from now and there's a chance, albeit slim, that for some reason population growth would stagnate in Dublin and continue to grow elsewhere).

Cork should definitely be far more competitive given their population, the other counties have less sizeable advantages eg. Galway is double Mayo's population but there is limited hurling there whereas Galway Footballers have lost out on many talents eg. Daithi Burke who would likely be a football star had he focused on it since 17/18.

I don't see any way of putting the genie back in the bottle now. Eventually the GAA will break up Dublin because a monopoly doesn't bring gate money in as the attendance at Leinster finals, half of what they were a decade ago, reflect. That's only going to continue too until change happens.

Did you smash it

What about my argument that after 133 years intercounty has run its course? Kerry and Dublin were the two best, way ahead of everyone else for the last 133 years. That doesn’t look like it’s going to change for the next ten years so what is intercounty really telling us anymore. Why bother flogging a dead horse?

Would a different competition structure with less teams and more quality be more exciting?

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

What about my argument that after 133 years intercounty has run its course? Kerry and Dublin were the two best, way ahead of everyone else for the last 133 years. That doesn’t look like it’s going to change for the next ten years so what is intercounty really telling us anymore. Why bother flogging a dead horse?

Would a different competition structure with less teams and more quality be more exciting?

Surely that's an argument for splitting Dublin as well.

Did you smash it

Rolo2010 wrote: »

Surely that's an argument for splitting Dublin as well.

Could be, but Dublin north will still go further in the championship than Offaly, Louth, wexford, Carlow, Wicklow, Laois, Westmeath every year so is it not all a bit pointless. Seems to me the system should be ripped up...if the next 10 years show nothing new.

ClanofLams

Did you smash it wrote: »

What about my argument that after 133 years intercounty has run its course? Kerry and Dublin were the two best, way ahead of everyone else for the last 133 years. That doesn’t look like it’s going to change for the next ten years so what is intercounty really telling us anymore. Why bother flogging a dead horse?

Would a different competition structure with less teams and more quality be more exciting?

Has it though? In the 2000s Armagh and Tyrone won their first ever All-Irelands. Donegal won their second title ever in the last decade despite the dominance of Dublin. If you took Dublin out of it currently, you would have Tipp, Mayo and Cavan, none of which have won an All-Ireland for almost 60 years.

Of course some counties including some of the Dublin selections in this scenario will still win more than others but change will bring about competitive championships at least.

Did you smash it

ClanofLams wrote: »

Has it though? In the 2000s Armagh and Tyrone won their first ever All-Irelands. Donegal won their second title ever in the last decade despite the dominance of Dublin. If you took Dublin out of it currently, you would have Tipp, Mayo and Cavan, none of which have won an All-Ireland for almost 60 years.

Of course some counties including some of the Dublin selections in this scenario will still win more than others but change will bring about competitive championships at least.

It’s a tough one I suppose. I give the intercounty system 10 years personally.

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

Could be, but Dublin north will still go further in the championship than Offaly, Louth, wexford, Carlow, Wicklow, Laois, Westmeath every year so is it not all a bit pointless. Seems to me the system should be ripped up...if the next 10 years show nothing new.

What counties should be merged? I suppose you could bring back the Breifne by merging Cavan and Leitrim.

Did you smash it

Rolo2010 wrote: »

What counties should be merged? I suppose you could bring back the Breifne by merging Cavan and Leitrim.

All counties should be subject to being merged and Dublin probably split. Then ur getting to even Steven on population but it’s difficult with under populated areas of the country in the west and north
Proposed split with population ,000 and home venue. South Dublin would need a new venue built.


Kildare Meath Westmeath 505. Pairc tailteann
Mayo Galway. 389. Salt hill
Cork Kerry. 689.5. Pairc hi caoimh
Clare limerick Tipperary Waterford 590. Thurles
Wexford Kilkenny Laois Carlow Wicklow 532.5. Nowlan
Offaly longford roscommon Leitrim cavan 291. Hyde
Dublin North. Croke
Dublin South no stadium
Louth Armagh Tyrone Monaghan 543. Clones
Antrim Derry down 1.4. Casement
Donegal Sligo Fermanagh 285 Enniskillen

bucketybuck

Did you smash it wrote: »

It makes a little difference to the senior county team but dublins big advantages are seen elsewhere.

I don't quite get what you mean by that comment? How does it not make a massive difference to the senior county side?

A booming and well funded club scene targeting and developing young players in by far the biggest population center in the country? That is the single biggest reason Dublin currently have a conveyor belt of top talent available, and numbers wise it is something that almost every other county will never be able to match.

thegills wrote: »

Its not all about the money lads. Its hard work talent and commitment

Rubbish. Hard work and commitment is needed but it is not the reason for Dublin's success. I see people in my county breaking their backs trying to leave no stone unturned in search of some success but the simple fact is that it is a losing battle, we are on the wrong side of a numbers game and there is nothing we can do about it.

Like I said, in years gone by it was possible for a talented group to just click, knuckle down and have a fairytale season. But those days are gone, now it is the days of video analysis and sports nutritionists etc etc. Every team is working hard, every team is prepared and there is far less chance of an upset.

And no, Cavan and Tipps wins are not evidence to the contrary, this is about the elephant in the room. Come back to me if they get within 10 points of Dublin.

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

All counties should be subject to being merged and Dublin probably split. Then ur getting to even Steven on population but it’s difficult with under populated areas of the country in the west and north
Proposed split with population ,000 and home venue. South Dublin would need a new venue built.


Kildare Meath Westmeath 505. Pairc tailteann
Mayo Galway. 389. Salt hill
Cork Kerry. 689.5. Pairc hi caoimh
Clare limerick Tipperary Waterford 590. Thurles
Wexford Kilkenny Laois Carlow Wicklow 532.5. Nowlan
Offaly longford roscommon Leitrim cavan 291. Hyde
Dublin North. Croke
Dublin South no stadium
Louth Armagh Tyrone Monaghan 543. Clones
Antrim Derry down 1.4. Casement
Donegal Sligo Fermanagh 285 Enniskillen

Any merge has to have some historical context and even that will be difficult. Sligo and Donegal don't share a border.

Did you smash it

Rolo2010 wrote: »

Any merge has to have some historical context and even that will be difficult. Sligo and Donegal don't share a border.

One of the great lies about sport is that fans have to identify with a team on a deep level to support it.

News to all the man utd, Liverpool fans who support those rabidly for no other reason that the teams are successful and supporting them is fun.

People support success. Identity on a deep level can still be found with your local gaa clubs. Elite sport doesn’t run off it.

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

One of the great lies about sport is that fans have to identify with a team on a deep level to support it.

News to all the man utd, Liverpool fans who support those rabidly for no other reason that the teams are successful and supporting them is fun.

People support success. Identity on a deep level can still be found with your local gaa clubs. Elite sport doesn’t run off it.

Two different sports. It's not a lie for GAA which has the current county boundaries for 130 years.

Did you smash it

Rolo2010 wrote: »

Two different sports. It's not a lie for GAA which has the current county boundaries for 130 years.

Fair enough, leave half the country condemned to support counties that are cannon fodder for the other half every year.

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

Fair enough, leave half the country condemned to support counties that are cannon fodder for the other half every year.

Merging counties won't save intercounty football. Fans will just return to club football. I'd rather have the county champions tog out for the county and scrap the All-Ireland club championships.

Enquiring

Wasn't the funding spent on coaches? That's what it was for. Dublin had close to 100 coaches paid for by the funding while some counties only had one or two. Nearly every club had their own development officer, going into schools, coaching in their clubs, putting on coaching seminars etc. There was also paid officials put in place to plan it all out and oversee it.

Did you smash it

Rolo2010 wrote: »

Merging counties won't save intercounty football. Fans will just return to club football. I'd rather have the county champions tog out for the county and scrap the All-Ireland club championships.

Many many gaa fans wouldn’t be anyway invested in clubs. They like supporting county because there are pissups in Dublin and games in big stadiums.

Enquiring

And for those denying the huge effect these coaches had on Dublin GAA, just look at the difference it's made to all levels of Dublin GAA, club, underage and women's football have all improved beyond recognition.

Rolo2010

Did you smash it wrote: »

Many many gaa fans wouldn’t be anyway invested in clubs. They like supporting county because there are pissups in Dublin and games in big stadiums.

Then it will be the end of the GAA as a national force in sport.

bucketybuck

Did you smash it wrote: »

Many many gaa fans wouldn’t be anyway invested in clubs. They like supporting county because there are pissups in Dublin and games in big stadiums.

If the GAA properly focused on the club game then the clubs would grow, the "product" would become more attractive and the bandwagoners will follow in turn.

Girly Gal

bucketybuck wrote: »

If the GAA properly focused on the club game then the clubs would grow, the "product" would become more attractive and the bandwagoners will follow in turn.

Outside of Dublin most clubs by their nature are very limited in the growth they can have due to population and parish boundaries, etc, also, people don't normally support a club they have no link to.

Dickie10

I actually thought this maybe the easiest way to solve this issue, go semi pro, get rid of county teams and use the club model . So divisions 1 and 2 maybe semi pro and ameateur outside that maybe 12 team divisons. How many dublin based clubs would there be?

gormdubhgorm

Did you smash it wrote: »

Can’t really say that unless cork, limerick or galway had a population close to Dublin. Which they don’t.

Plus vast areas of Dublin are GAA wastelands. Unlike down the country where it is at the core of the community. If you go to some places in Dublin you would not even know there was a GAA match on.

gormdubhgorm

Dickie10 wrote: »

I actually thought this maybe the easiest way to solve this issue, go semi pro, get rid of county teams and use the club model . So divisions 1 and 2 maybe semi pro and ameateur outside that maybe 12 team divisons. How many dublin based clubs would there be?

Would you not think semi-pro would kill the game? Dublin would just hoover up all the best players.

I think you are half right though. Club football will be the future and inter county football will go the way of the Railway Cup. History.

JeffKenna

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Plus vast areas of Dublin are GAA wastelands. Unlike down the country where it is at the core of the community. If you go to some places in Dublin you would not even know there was a GAA match on.

That's the case for any city in Ireland.