The prom (COVID closed 31 March 2020, reopened 18 May)

They were talking about the clamping/parking in Salthill on the national airwaves yesterday

https://www.newstalk.com/podcasts/highlights-from-lunchtime-live/is-it-time-to-put-a-stop-to-illegal-parking-in-salthill-in-galway

Ludikrus

Dog fouling has been a big problem in Seamount with the influx of cars parking there. Some residents opposed to clamping changed their minds because of the dog sh1t. The place was destroyed.

zell12

Ludikrus wrote: »

Dog fouling has been a big problem in Seamount with the influx of cars parking there. Some residents opposed to clamping changed their minds because of the dog sh1t. The place was destroyed.

Free fertiliser brought to their door!

Gadgetman496

Ludikrus wrote: »

Dog fouling has been a big problem in Seamount with the influx of cars parking there. Some residents opposed to clamping changed their minds because of the dog sh1t. The place was destroyed.

Did they not supply Bio poop bags for the dog walkers?

Mrs OBumble

Gadgetman496 wrote: »

Did they not supply Bio poop bags for the dog walkers?

Why the he'll should they have to!

If you want to take Poopy for a walk, take your own shít containers

cfeeneyinterior

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Why the he'll should they have to!

If you want to take Poopy for a walk, take your own shít containers

The gardai should be brought in to close off the estates like they do when the rednecks come in forn pearse stadium.

Worn Out

It's amazing that there is still free parking on the prom. Travel most places in Europe and you would expect to pay a charge to park so close to the sea front. A charge would also make driver's think twice about their chosen means of transport and potentially reduce traffic in the area. Of course this would push traffic out in the estates but simply extend the pay parking zones. Residents would get passes.
It's surprising that the council haven't introduced this yet as a strong source of revenue.
Would you mind paying a couple of € to park on the prom? If I was in Spain, France, Italy etc I wouldn't expect free parking.
Of course this is Galway, where illegal parking is rampant and where traffic cones are required to stop people parking on double yellow lines.

saabsaab

Worn Out wrote: »

It's amazing that there is still free parking on the prom. Travel most places in Europe and you would expect to pay a charge to park so close to the sea front. A charge would also make driver's think twice about their chosen means of transport and potentially reduce traffic in the area. Of course this would push traffic out in the estates but simply extend the pay parking zones. Residents would get passes.
It's surprising that the council haven't introduced this yet as a strong source of revenue.
Would you mind paying a couple of € to park on the prom? If I was in Spain, France, Italy etc I wouldn't expect free parking.
Of course this is Galway, where illegal parking is rampant and where traffic cones are required to stop people parking on double yellow lines.

Could be a win win. Put more money into improving the prom too. Lahinch charges and it has better facilities.

what_traffic

Worn Out wrote: »

It's amazing that there is still free parking on the prom. Travel most places in Europe and you would expect to pay a charge to park so close to the sea front. A charge would also make driver's think twice about their chosen means of transport and potentially reduce traffic in the area. Of course this would push traffic out in the estates but simply extend the pay parking zones. Residents would get passes.
It's surprising that the council haven't introduced this yet as a strong source of revenue.
Would you mind paying a couple of € to park on the prom? If I was in Spain, France, Italy etc I wouldn't expect free parking.
Of course this is Galway, where illegal parking is rampant and where traffic cones are required to stop people parking on double yellow lines.

Good post - I am curious about this as Galway City Council do make a lot of money from Car parking in the City Centre. Could it be related to litigation? If Galway City Council were charging - would there would be an onus of care on them for the facilities that they charge to provide? So when the car parks and the prom floods - as they do regularly now - would they be liable?

what_traffic

what_traffic wrote: »

Good post - I am curious about this as Galway City Council do make a lot of money from Car parking in the City Centre. Could it be related to litigation? If Galway City Council were charging - would there would be an onus of care on them for the facilities that they charge to provide? So when the car parks and the prom floods - as they do regularly now - would they be liable?

I wouldn't see how. A standard disclaimer in every car park is "owners park at their own risk..... Not liable for any damage or loss to vehicle or property etc etc etc"

timmyntc

Deleted User wrote: »

I wouldn't see how. A standard disclaimer in every car park is "owners park at their own risk..... Not liable for any damage or loss to vehicle or property etc etc etc"

And dont they close off the other council car parks ahead of flooding?

Maybe the Salthill businesses are against paid parking. They probably don't want any limitation on the numbers parking up in Salthill.

They were able to block the cycle lane trial last year with a private meeting before the vote with apparently pro-cycle-lane councillors so they certainly seem to have control.

what_traffic

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe the Salthill businesses are against paid parking. They probably don't want any limitation on the numbers parking up in Salthill.

They were able to block the cycle lane trial last year with a private meeting before the vote with apparently pro-cycle-lane councillors so they certainly seem to have control.

Agree - thats where the pressure is alright. We pay rates ...... If the local Authority actually collected the LPT, that argument might be weakened I reckon. Huge amount of on-street car parking along the prom - the road is so wide that even installing the bi-directional cycle path on the prom - still can provide car parking for large stretch's of the Prom on the Salthilll side of the road.

what_traffic

Deleted User wrote: »

I wouldn't see how. A standard disclaimer in every car park is "owners park at their own risk..... Not liable for any damage or loss to vehicle or property etc etc etc"

They are missing out so. So its just the main street in Salthill that has P & D?

beardybrewer

Wait why are you guys in favour of taking away one of the few free places to park again? Is that seriously what Salthill needs in the long term once we're past the pandemic?

Mrs OBumble

beardybrewer wrote: »

Wait why are you guys in favour of taking away one of the few free places to park again? Is that seriously what Salthill needs in the long term once we're past the pandemic?

You must have missed the memo, Cars Are Evil.

Apparently we will all ride bicycles (which don't need parking space) to visit Salthill if there are no carparks.

?Cee?view

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

You must have missed the memo, Cars Are Evil.

Apparently we will all ride bicycles (which don't need parking space) to visit Salthill if there are no carparks.

I think taking the tram would also be acceptable, cos that's also so European and stuff...:D

what_traffic

beardybrewer wrote: »

Wait why are you guys in favour of taking away one of the few free places to park again?

There is no such thing as a free lunch! Somebody always pays.

beardybrewer

beardybrewer wrote: »

Wait why are you guys in favour of taking away one of the few free places to park again? Is that seriously what Salthill needs in the long term once we're past the pandemic?

It depends what you think is more important for Salthill

Space specifically for cars to park for free for an unlimited time

or

Space for people

zell12

beardybrewer wrote: »

Wait why are you guys in favour of taking away one of the few free places to park again? ...

Parking may be free to the motorist, because shoppers, business owners, and taxpayers are paying for it. An over-subsidised public space for storing private property

biko

Isn't that true for bike racks also? And the benches? And the playgrounds? And even the prom itself?
If the free parking spots were to be removed, what would be put in their place?

saabsaab

biko wrote: »

Isn't that true for bike racks also? And the benches? And the playgrounds? And even the prom itself?
If the free parking spots were to be removed, what would be put in their place?

Cycle lanes, bus or tram corridor, new open air trading areas

what_traffic

biko wrote: »

Isn't that true for bike racks also? And the benches? And the playgrounds? And even the prom itself?
If the free parking spots were to be removed, what would be put in their place?

Well if you can tell me how many bikes racks there are v's free parking spots down on the prom and how space they take up in comparison
We can start at that point?
Same goes for the space taken up by playgrounds vs car parking?
How much are we looking at?

There will be still loads of free parking along the prom - we just need to put a fraction of it to better use.

saabsaab

Galway city and Salthill isn't suited to car traffic anyway. Should be mainly public transport cycle lanes etc. At least have mainly one way traffic systems like Cork.

biko

Since we are just speculating I suppose a pier like in Brighton would be nice, good for the tourism too.

The bulk of the car park should stay, even if the CC makes it pay/display.

?Cee?view

Deleted User wrote: »

It depends what you think is more important for Salthill

Space specifically for cars to park for free for an unlimited time

or

Space for people

Are the former autonomous cars, or do they transport... people?

?Cee?view

?Cee?view wrote: »

Are the former autonomous cars, or do they transport... people?

While parked... no, they don't.

Would be interested to hear from sceptics to cycling infrastructure in Salthill on this...

Segregated cycling through Salthill would (IMO) create a great safe route connecting residential areas with Galway City and also Salthill.

Given a fixed width to allow for pedestrians, on-street parking and all the traffic lanes. What % do you think would be fair and appropriate to be dedicated to segregated cycling infrastructure?

what_traffic

what_traffic wrote: »

Well if you can tell me how many bikes racks there are v's free parking spots down on the prom and how space they take up in comparison
We can start at that point?
Same goes for the space taken up by playgrounds vs car parking?
How much are we looking at?

There will be still loads of free parking along the prom - we just need to put a fraction of it to better use.

Any response to this BIKO?

biko

I don't know know how many bikes racks there are v's free parking spots down on the prom.
There is no need for more bike racks and there is already playgrounds.
Leave the parking area in front of Bailey as it is.

Zzippy

biko wrote: »

I don't know know how many bikes racks there are v's free parking spots down on the prom.
There is no need for more bike racks and there is already playgrounds.
Leave the parking area in front of Bailey as it is.

You don't know how many bike racks there but you know there is no need for more?

biko

Zzippy wrote: »

You don't know how many bike racks there but you know there is no need for more?

I'm there often and it seems to me the bike parking is sufficient*. Is it not?
Do you not find rack space for your bike?

When I do drive there I find there is often no car parking spaces available.




*I don't see bikes thrown about anywhere except children's bikes.

zell12

Bike parking is not sufficient, hence why Council have removed an on-road car parking space outside Centra/P.O. and installed stands, capable of holding 10 bikes
10 bikes v. 1 car

Zzippy

biko wrote: »

I'm there often and it seems to me the bike parking is sufficient*. Is it not?
Do you not find rack space for your bike?

When I do drive there I find there is often no car parking spaces available.




*I don't see bikes thrown about anywhere except children's bikes.

With a young family, the rare occasions I get to the prom we drive. When the kids are older we will be cycling a lot more. But I can see past my self-interest and accept that assigning road space to parked cars that take up a lot of space at the expense of safe cycling infrastructure that could carry a lot more people is not a good use of public resources.

Important reminder that only a small proportion of the total parking spaces would be lost to provide a segregated cycle lane. The city council are to do a parking survey in Salthill this year.

There would also he a drop in demand for parking as Salthill would be more much accessible by active travel.

Mrs OBumble

what_traffic wrote: »

Same goes for the space taken up by playgrounds vs car parking?
How much are we looking at?

Playgrounds are of use to a very small subset if the population (kids age 2 until about 8). Cars are used by people of all ages.

It's perfectly appropriate to allocate public space for both of them. And to bicycle parking, too.

what_traffic

biko wrote: »

I don't know know how many bikes racks there are v's parking spots down on the prom.
There is no need for more bike racks and there is already playgrounds.

Then what are you talking about then?
Why are you comparing bike racks and playgrounds to car parking spaces then when you don't even how many of each of those there are.
Were are all these playgrounds for starters down at the Prom?

what_traffic

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's perfectly appropriate to allocate public space for both of them. And to bicycle parking, too.

Yes allocate space for everything! Now we are getting somewhere.

Mrs OBumble

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Playgrounds are of use to a very small subset if the population (kids age 2 until about 8). Cars are used by people of all ages.

It's perfectly appropriate to allocate public space for both of them. And to bicycle parking, too.

Exactly - nobody is suggesting to remove everything of any one thing, just find a better balance as Salthill is current very car and pedestrian centric.

Pedestrians are top of the urban space pecking order so it's right they should have a high allocation of space (the prom, parks etc).

Do you think the road along the prom is suitable/safe for cyclists?
I don't, especially not for young or less assertive cyclists. So I think they're currently being excluded and space is being used to serve a "subset if the population" at the exclusion of others.

I think we can find a better balance.

beardybrewer

We could start getting a bit of balance by installing Coke rental bikes adjacent to the car park. The scheme is a joke how central most of the bikes are. I suppose it would put the rest of the poor cycling infrastructure into focus. So if they're seen as endorsing cyclists from outer boroughs to cycle in to the centre and then someone gets knocked down maybe they feel doing nothing is better than being culpable?

As for the prom I walk there, cycle there, and park there especially with the family. So I don't want to see parking removed but I'm all for a cycle lane where the current seaside footpath is. It would certainly be more relaxing to cycle in a designated, respected space.

saabsaab

Make it a one way system. Use the unused car lane for cycling.

Storm 10

saabsaab wrote: »

Make it a one way system. Use the unused car lane for cycling.

Where is the unused car lane in Salthill

saabsaab

Storm 10 wrote: »

Where is the unused car lane in Salthill

There isn't one but you could have it if it was just one-way.

Sandymount Dun Laoghaire is looking at such a system. Gaining support there too.

beardybrewer

beardybrewer wrote: »

We could start getting a bit of balance by installing Coke rental bikes adjacent to the car park. The scheme is a joke how central most of the bikes are. I suppose it would put the rest of the poor cycling infrastructure into focus. So if they're seen as endorsing cyclists from outer boroughs to cycle in to the centre and then someone gets knocked down maybe they feel doing nothing is better than being culpable?

As for the prom I walk there, cycle there, and park there especially with the family. So I don't want to see parking removed but I'm all for a cycle lane where the current seaside footpath is. It would certainly be more relaxing to cycle in a designated, respected space.

Agreed, you'd probably want a few stations to bridge the distance. Isolated stations are risky as someone could travel out and find no spaces or the station offline. Something like;
- Near Grattan Beach (space on the turn there)
- Salthill Village
- Blackrock

Mrs OBumble

saabsaab wrote: »

There isn't one but you could have it if it was just one-way.

Sandymount Dun Laoghaire is looking at such a system. Gaining support there too.

What roafs do you think that the returning traffic could travel along?

saabsaab

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

What roafs do you think that the returning traffic could travel along?

The R337 no other returns make it simpler.

what_traffic

saabsaab wrote: »

There isn't one but you could have it if it was just one-way.

Sandymount Dun Laoghaire is looking at such a system. Gaining support there too.

The road along the Prom is really really wide, unlike the Strand Road in Sandymount. Can easily maintain 2-way vehicular access along the prom, use the City/Salthill side of road for car parking and the prom side that is currently used for car parking as a 2-way cycle path.

Yeah thankfully a one-way system isn't needed for Salthill. Also with a two-way coastal greenway you don't have all the junctions to design for.

Space Dog

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah thankfully a one-way system isn't needed for Salthill. Also with a two-way coastal greenway you don't have all the junctions to design for.

The stretch from Claddagh Quay along Grattan Road to the R336 junction is very narrow though. I don't see how you'd fit a safe cycle lane there.

Space Dog

Space Dog wrote: »

The stretch from Claddagh Quay along Grattan Road to the R336 junction is very narrow though. I don't see how you'd fit a safe cycle lane there.

The Council's draft plan for that is to use the existing cycle lane across the South Park. Then significantly widen the footpath along Grattan Road to make a shared pedestrian/cycle space (like back of golf course but wider). At Grattan Beach, where there's no space to widen outwards, they'd remove the footpath at other side and widen the coastal side - moving the road a bit back from the coast.

The alternative to avoid the widened shared space for this stretch would probably be some form of one-way loop around part of the Claddagh and use one of the lanes.