FG to just do nothing for the next 5 years.

christy c

debok wrote: »

The simple truth about Ireland is that every scandal , industrial schools, Magdeline laundries, scouts, priest paedophilies, cervical cancer scandal, baby's buried,Anglo Irish collapse ,gardai whistleblower scandal etc was done under the watch of either a FF or fg led government. Every single thing. So if ye want to back them and only talk about the good they have done please acknowledge the bad stuff too.

The inverse of that is also true, every good this in this country happened under FF or FG. Every single thing. So if ye want to only talk about the bad they have done then acknowledge the good too.

But this is what happens in political threads, you have the supporters of other parties throwing around sh1te hoping some of it will stick, which naturally promotes defensiveness. And then you end up with car crash threads like this one and the SF one.

Brendan Bendar

debok wrote: »

The simple truth about Ireland is that every scandal , industrial schools, Magdeline laundries, scouts, priest paedophilies, cervical cancer scandal, baby's buried,Anglo Irish collapse ,gardai whistleblower scandal etc was done under the watch of either a FF or fg led government. Every single thing. So if ye want to back them and only talk about the good they have done please acknowledge the bad stuff too.

Done by the people of Ireland,dude.

What kind of rubbish is that?

FF or FG or a combo have ruled Ireland since the founding of the State.

Of course all crimes committed in Ireland would have been committed under those parties?

I cannot understand how certain slates amongst the populace seem to think the ‘Gubbermint’ are responsible for everything.

I would respectfully opine that if those certain slates maybe took some responsibility themselves, that those events might have been lessened or not happened.

Time folk like this took responsibility rather than depending on ‘others’ to do everything.

This ‘blame the gubbermint’ for everything lot need to have a light shone on their activities.

smurgen

Mortelaro wrote: »

Reading that won't make me believe you
You are again talking nonsense and waving the liar word around like confetti

air and sea remained open
We have only one land border and its impossible to close even if we wanted to

No it didn't. Another lie.

https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transport/slovenia-to-lift-international-air-transport-ban/138321.article

smurgen

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Of course they were real people loved as much as anyone else.

However your faux outrage and crocodile tears doesn’t mask the fact that instead of pulling together on the most serious issue the country has to deal with in a century you try to turn the event into a political football.

Now I know you will be on here as you have been for the last month pounding the pages with your rhetoric but people who understand the complexity of this event, the multi faceted problems it threw up, the huge logistical problems in acquiring supplies will appreciate the terrific effort made by all frontline personnel to keep things going on as many fronts as possible.

Ordinary decent people know that.sure, everything wasn’t perfect but displaying bile and disappointment because such a decent job was done kind of displays a certain mindset that I wouldn’t be too eager to mix with.

The same folk that use crocodile tears and that wheeled out victims of the troubles during elections and ignore the nuances associated with the conflict now accuse others of using these tactics. Couldn't make this stuff up.

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Done by the people of Ireland,dude.

What kind of rubbish is that?

FF or FG or a combo have ruled Ireland since the founding of the State.

Of course all crimes committed in Ireland would have been committed under those parties?

I cannot understand how certain slates amongst the populace seem to think the ‘Gubbermint’ are responsible for everything.

I would respectfully opine that if those certain slates maybe took some responsibility themselves, that those events might have been lessened or not happened.

Time folk like this took responsibility rather than depending on ‘others’ to do everything.

This ‘blame the gubbermint’ for everything lot need to have a light shone on their activities.

Which is just another form of the arrogance of power Brendan...'feck off, we know what is best for you.'

Man, FG don't like to be questioned!

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Which is just another form of the arrogance of power Brendan...'feck off, we know what is best for you.'

Man, FG don't like to be questioned!

Has absolutely nothing......nothing at all .....to do with my post, Francie.

James Brown

FF and FG are responsible for every action the state took or failed to take. Good and bad. That's the job.
This goes from bringing electricity to every home to turning a blind eye to the Church's abuses. Nothing in Ireland happens in a vacuum.
I would say opposition parties have a roll to play too however considering FF and FG have been interchangeable since the state was formed and had every opportunity to right any wrongs they witnessed they are more responsible than other parties in those roles too IMO, where others can call out bad policy, FF and FG have had the opportunity to rectify at some point, with the inclusion of junior partners in government to an extent.

Should a FF/FG/Green government be formed I expect we'll see more of business as usual as FF/FG try do well for their own.

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Has absolutely nothing......nothing at all .....to do with my post, Francie.

What was your post about only a plaintive..'leave the gubbermint alone' tearjerker.
'Taking responsibility' also means not standing idly by and ignoring incompetence or criminal activity. That's what happened with church and the likes of Charlie Haughey.

McMurphy

smurgen wrote: »

The guy who saying there was Covid 18?

Harris 15 said that?

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What was your post about only a plaintive..'leave the gubbermint alone' tearjerker.
'Taking responsibility' also means not standing idly by and ignoring incompetence or criminal activity. That's what happened with church and the likes of Charlie Haughey.

Nothing plaintive about anything I write, Francie.

You should have realised that by now.

I said it as it is, far too many folk blaming the government on stuff they should handle themselves.

You see Francie, there are folk, you’d be familiar, living in the past, hurlers on the ditch, always in after the event trying to distance themselves from
‘events’ as the unfold, but like the vultures of the Chobe game park are quickly in to feed on the carcass, and gorge on the skill and efforts of the hunters.

Know those kind of folk,Francie, I’m sure you know them too.;)

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Nothing plaintive about anything I write, Francie.

You should have realised that by now.

I said it as it is, far too many folk blaming the government on stuff they should handle themselves.

You think I and all the other people with relatives in care should have handled their safety and medical care ourselves?

Is this another case of Simon 'I didn't read the letter Harris's passing the buck?

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think I and all the other people with relatives in care should have handled their safety and medical care ourselves?

Is this another case of Simon 'I didn't read the letter Harris's passing the buck?

No Francie, I don’t, but you should take the issue to the person in charge.

Don’t,as is your wont, use the situation to attack the government.

Quite frankly using the issue of a relative ill in a nursing home as an excuse to hammer FG stinks.

I’ll say it plainly and clearly, it stinks.

It has no credence in your ‘arguments’ given your constant anti FG criticism and abuse over a long long time.

Not suggesting you are, to use the well hackneyed mantra of the left “telling lies” but I’m afraid your ‘arguments ‘ ring hollow,a chara.

James Brown

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think I and all the other people with relatives in care should have handled their safety and medical care ourselves?

Is this another case of Simon 'I didn't read the letter Harris's passing the buck?

In other countries there's talk of doing away with private care altogether. The idea being it's too important to leave to the private market.
Wouldn't work in Ireland. FG would swing some deal where we have to buy them out at a great loss to the tax payer no doubt.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think I and all the other people with relatives in care should have handled their safety and medical care ourselves?

Is this another case of Simon 'I didn't read the letter Harris's passing the buck?

No one is saying that, but how safe is the nursing home your relative or relatives are in?
There is an duty of care on the management of any nursing home as well as hse, hiqa and then the minister.

McMurphy

Bowie wrote: »

In other countries there's talk of doing away with private care altogether. The idea being it's too important to leave to the private market.
Wouldn't work in Ireland. FG would swing some deal where we have to buy them out at a great loss to the tax payer no doubt.

Paddy Cosgrave tweeted about that yesterday evening Mr Bow.

https://twitter.com/paddycosgrave/status/1265387930509545477?s=19

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

No Francie, I don’t, but you should take the issue to the person in charge.

Don’t,as is your wont, use the situation to attack the government.

Quite frankly using the issue of a relative ill in a nursing home as an excuse to hammer FG stinks.

I’ll say it plainly and clearly, it stinks.

It has no credence in your ‘arguments’ given your constant anti FG criticism and abuse over a long long time.

Not suggesting you are, to use the well hackneyed mantra of the left “telling lies” but I’m afraid your ‘arguments ‘ ring hollow,a chara.

So basically, it's 'shut up', say nothing as we brush this under the carpet?

It really has gotten up you guys noses that you are now properly accountable.
Will you ever learn that treating those who ask questions or who have a complaint with derision makes the problem worse. The lessons of why FG have ended up on their arse with their lowest vote ever, have not been learned, obviously.

debok

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Done by the people of Ireland,dude.

What kind of rubbish is that?

FF or FG or a combo have ruled Ireland since the founding of the State.

Of course all crimes committed in Ireland would have been committed under those parties?

I cannot understand how certain slates amongst the populace seem to think the ‘Gubbermint’ are responsible for everything.

I would respectfully opine that if those certain slates maybe took some responsibility themselves, that those events might have been lessened or not happened.

Time folk like this took responsibility rather than depending on ‘others’ to do everything.

This ‘blame the gubbermint’ for everything lot need to have a light shone on their activities.

You kinda missed my point dude and I said under the watch of the government not done by the government.
Do people actually say dude now?
I was trying to say it's all bull**** arguing about will they do this or do that in next five years. They will do the same as they have done for last 100 years and they will still be voted in again.
In fairness dude the government have to accept responsibility for some things that's why the people elect them.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So basically, it's 'shut up', say nothing as we brush this under the carpet?

It really has gotten up you guys noses that you are now properly accountable.
Will you ever learn that treating those who ask questions or who have a complaint with derision makes the problem worse. The lessons of why FG have ended up on their arse with their lowest vote ever, have not been learned, obviously.

Selective accountability before the facts is a disengenous and dangerous thing, bordering on the ridiculous and kangaroo justice system, there are a good few on here more used to that type of system alright.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Selective accountability before the facts is a disengenous and dangerous thing, bordering on the ridiculous and kangaroo justice system, there are a good few on here more used to that type of system alright.

You guys are flat out trying to censor the discussion. You won't succeed but just continue to come across as arrogant and dictatorial.

christy c

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Selective accountability before the facts is a disengenous and dangerous thing, bordering on the ridiculous and kangaroo justice system, there are a good few on here more used to that type of system alright.

It was obvious from early on the the SF supporters were aching to find something to complain about, one even saying that Borris Johnson was making us look bad.

There should be an enquiry. Singapore learned a lot from SARS, hopefully we can from this.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You guys are flat out trying to censor the discussion. You won't succeed but just continue to come across as arrogant and dictatorial.

A political point scoring exercise is disengenous discussion.
I gave my opinion on it honestly, asked you for yours and, all you have thrown out are soundbites.
Do you hold Simon Harris responsible for the deaths in care homes through wrongdoing and being willfully responsible for these deaths?

debok

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Name a country that bad stuff hasn't happened in under any Govt, just a rant and of course any bad stuff that happened in the Republic was under either or.

That was my point FgFF have been the only ones in charge. So they can't blame anyone else for anything.

FrancieBrady

christy c wrote: »

It was obvious from early on the the SF supporters were aching to find something to complain about, one even saying that Borris Johnson was making us look bad.

There should be an enquiry. Singapore learned a lot from SARS, hopefully we can from this.

I voted SF because I was sick of the hollow promises of FG and FF.

Absolutely no shame in questioning these guys no matter how many channel the classic Enda...what about the 'RA? stuff.

christy c

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I voted SF because I was sick of the hollow promises of FG and FF.

Absolutely no shame in questioning these guys no matter how many channel the classic Enda...what about the 'RA? stuff.

You're barking up the wrong tree with me and the RA, I despise SF for their stupid economic policies, nothing to do with the north.

If you're not a fan of hollow promises, you may need to investigate the demographics looking after itself.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

A political point scoring exercise is disengenous discussion.
I gave my opinion on it honestly, asked you for yours and, all you have thrown out are soundbites.
Do you hold Simon Harris responsible for the deaths in care homes through wrongdoing and being willfully responsible for these deaths?

I want an inquiry into what happened. If there are people to be held to account, whether they be Nursing Home management, NPHET, HSE HIQA or Government, then they should be.

Insisting someone is guilty or innocent before this happens is wrong either way.

Fergus Finlay channeling a few guys on here and deriding people and Simon Harris already up on the 'it wasn't me' bike is totally wrong too.

dundalkfc10

Bishop of hope wrote: »

A political point scoring exercise is disengenous discussion.
I gave my opinion on it honestly, asked you for yours and, all you have thrown out are soundbites.
Do you hold Simon Harris responsible for the deaths in care homes through wrongdoing and being willfully responsible for these deaths?

I hold him partially responsible, he is the leader of the Health Service whether it's private or not.

He can't even go out in public anymore, that's how popular he is

Mortelaro

smurgen wrote: »

No it didn't. Another lie.

https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transport/slovenia-to-lift-international-air-transport-ban/138321.article

Another lie by whom?
Certainly not me

The more you and others use the lie word willy nilly,the more you devalue your use of it

I was not aware that Slovenia completely shut its airspace
I've not been able to find another EU country that completely closed its airports even in the Baltics
Perhaps you can
I've found plenty that in the tiny amount of flights that come in have like Ireland required self isolation,not all strictly enforcing it and not strictly every country either

Anyway,its moot,On the subject of Border closures in Ireland, its just not possible to close them due to Northern Ireland
Unless of course you want to advocate road closures,which I doubt

Bishop of hope

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

I hold him partially responsible, he is the leader of the Health Service whether it's private or not.

He can't even go out in public anymore, that's how popular he is

That's an honest straight answer.
Dont know much about whether he can go out publically or not.

Mortelaro

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

I hold him partially responsible, he is the leader of the Health Service whether it's private or not.

He can't even go out in public anymore, that's how popular he is

Ah c'mere now,the government are not the leader of private nursing homes
They are for profit private businesses

dundalkfc10

Mortelaro wrote: »

Ah c'mere now,the government are not the leader of private nursing homes
They are for profit private businesses

He is the leader of the health service. All nursing homes are part of the health service private or not private.