Fire at Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris

AudreyHepburn

jasper100 wrote: »

Where is the tragedy? Its a shrine to child molestors, magdeline laundries and paedophiles etc. This organisation has been trying to control peoples minds for centuries and caused plenty of wars.


The global outpouring of "grief" is laughable.


There are real tragedies unfolding every day around the world but nobody wants to know.


But there is nothing like a "trendy tragedy" to get people in the western world falling over themselves in an outpouring of emotion.

This kind self righteous blustering drives me mad!

First of all can we not be upset, moved, hurt etc by more than one event at a time?

Second just because lives haven’t been lost or irreparably damaged does not make this any less a tragedy. Notre Dame is an icon of culture and history generally and a symbol of Paris in particular. It’s historical, artistic and architectural importance can not be underestimated.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with child molesters, Magdalene laundries or abt of the other hyperbole you posted.

Edgware

MarkY91 wrote: »

Did you visit Notre dame? I didn't find it all that interesting inside m but outside, it is an iconic building and the tower your was amazing.

I can't believe how sad I've felt since last night upon seeing the news. I haven't felt this way since Michael Jackson died lol.

Just think how poor Bubbles felt

topper75

Sardonicat wrote: »

Paris, in English is pronounced with an 's'.
Notre Dame in English is 'Our Lady'.
They chose to name the university Notre Dame so I can't see why they don't pronounce it correctly or change it to English.

Nodder Daym doesn't mean anything in any language.

Aye but adding that s is wrong because it is not the way the French pronounce it!

Wasn't that your point about Notre Dame? :-)

One which you apply arbitrarily in order to facilitate a feeling of superiority toward people you deem not to be as sophisticated as yourself such as the dumb Americans.

My point is that when things are rendered in other languages all bets are off.

If Nodder Daym, as you render it mockingly, doesn't mean anything in any language, then how did you know what they were referring to at all - telepathy?

I have never heard an Irish person 'correctly' pronounce Notre Dame either in a casual reference when speaking English. We don't render that non-rhotic sound in notre the way the French can and do.

If you want to laugh at Americans - know the French are laughing at us.

Fastidious

wexandproud wrote: »

no your not , their are a few more on here with the same narrow minded thoughts .
why cant people who are not religious or not even big on historical events just see it simply as a tragic loss of a world famous building which millions enjoy for various reasons every year .
im not overly religious but a few years back i was in paris and for me the only thing worth seeing was notre dame .

Interesting indeed that people care so much about a ****ing building. Ironic is it that this happened during holy week
Buildings come and go but the response from the aristocracy has been ridiculous it's a sad indictment of our society. Imagine a world where billionaires pledged millions of euros to much more worthy causes

Eircom_Sucks

Eircom_Sucks wrote: »

Its a building

I mean ffs

Are there any historical buildings in the world you would deem important?

Eircom_Sucks

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are there any historical buildings in the world you would deem important?

Nope

They all irrelevant to me , life for future not the past

xi5yvm0owc1s2b

Sardonicat wrote: »

Paris, in English is pronounced with an 's'.
Notre Dame in English is 'Our Lady'.
They chose to name the university Notre Dame so I can't see why they don't pronounce it correctly or change it to English.

Nodder Daym doesn't mean anything in any language.

I was amused that Notre Dame University put out a tweet yesterday to reassure people that the university was not burning down -- that it was the cathedral in Paris that had caught fire.

As for pronunciation, Anglophone countries frequently mangle French words -- look at the Irish pronunciation of a fish or steak fillet as fill-ut!

Phonetic pronunciation of French words is fairly common in the US. The city of Versailles in Kentucky is also pronounced Ver-saylz by the locals, and they laugh at people who use the French pronunciation.

AudreyHepburn

Fastidious wrote: »

Interesting indeed that people value a ****ing building more than the countless lives lost perpetuated by religious fundamentalists. To the religious folk, sure isn't this only Gods plan!
Buildings come and go the response from the aristocracy has been ridiculous it's a sad indictment of our society. Imagine a world where billiounaires pledged millions of euros for much more worthy causes

Where has anyone on this thread or anywhere else said any remotely like that? Where has anyone said they value buildings more than the many human tragedies happening in the world.

Get a grip and stop with the self righteousness. The amount of it on this thread would drive you mad! It’s possible to be upset about more than one event at the same time and to be moved by more than one type of event at once.

Eircom_Sucks

Eircom_Sucks wrote: »

Nope

They all irrelevant to me , life for future not the past

How do you feel about Eircom? You could request a username change now that you're not shackled to the past.

eagle eye

Eircom_Sucks wrote:

They all irrelevant to me , life for future not the past

I pity you that has no appreciation of art or history.
Do you often stick your hand in a fire and get burnt?
Like it's history that taught you not to.
Same with everything you learned to do from someone else.
Do you like old cars or anything old? Is so then you like history and art.

Fastidious

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

It’s possible to be upset about more than one event at the same time and to be moved by more than one type of event at once.

You're the one telling me to get a grip when you're upset over a bloody building..pathetic !

Fastidious

Fastidious wrote: »

You're the one telling me to get a grip when you're upset over a bloody building..pathetic !

You're a 5th year student doing the Leaving in 2020. I most definitely think your opinion here is worth literal shlt.

Come back to these posts when you're 30 and you'll cringe so hard, you'll permanently damage your face.

Fastidious

Deleted User wrote: »

You're a 5th year student doing the Leaving in 2020. I most definitely think your opinion here is worth literal shlt.

Come back to these posts when you're 30 and you'll cringe so hard, you'll permanently damage your face.

****ing stalker

Corby Trouser Press

Seems the consensus on here and elsewhere is that it's ok to mourn for the lost art and architecture but not for the Church or it's congregants.

Everybody is falling over themselves to express that a great place of worship being severely damaged is not really an issue at all.

"I'm not religious but..." perish the thought!

Can see the same in Irish media reporting and Official Ireland responses also.

No mention of the words "Catholic" or "Christian" in tweets by our Head of State or Head of Government.

The loss to culture and to the state is all that is being acknowledged.

Scant recognition that France's Catholics (a much persecuted group throughout the ages) are the primarily affected group.

We're lead in a lot of ways by the fundamental agnosticism of our nearest neighbours.

BBC and Sky coverage emphasising it's primacy as a tourist attraction.

John Snow on C4 News lamenting a great loss to "the French Republic".

And we nod along over here, as if Catholic Ireland never was.

wexandproud

Fastidious wrote: »

Interesting indeed that people care so much about a ****ing building. Ironic is it that this happened during holy week
Buildings come and go but the response from the aristocracy has been ridiculous it's a sad indictment of our society. Imagine a world where billionaires pledged millions of euros to much more worthy causes

where exactly did I or anybody claim it was more tragic than the terrible loss of lives in other events . people can be sad , upset , annoyed or moved in many ways by many different things and believe it or not sometimes even at more than one thing at a time .
if your so concerned about other ''worthy causes '' why don't you make contact with other wealthy people and try and sort out a few donations or maybe start in a small way with organising some sort of fund raiser

Varta

Corby Trouser Press wrote: »

Seems the consensus on here and elsewhere is that it's ok to mourn for the lost art and architecture but not for the Church or it's congregants.

Everybody is falling over themselves to express that a great place of worship being severely damaged is not really an issue at all.

"I'm not religious but..." perish the thought!

Can see the same in Irish media reporting and Official Ireland responses also.

No mention of the words "Catholic" or "Christian" in tweets by our Head of State or Head of Government.

The loss to culture and to the state is all that is being acknowledged.

Scant recognition that France's Catholics (a much persecuted group throughout the ages) are the primarily affected group.

We're lead in a lot of ways by the fundamental agnosticism of our nearest neighbours.

BBC and Sky coverage emphasising it's primacy as a tourist attraction.

John Snow on C4 News lamenting a great loss to "the French Republic".

And we nod along over here, as if Catholic Ireland never was.

Unfortunately Catholic Ireland most certainly was. More and more people are copping on to the superstitious nonsense that is religion.

Anteayer

Sardonicat wrote: »

Paris, in English is pronounced with an 's'.
Notre Dame in English is 'Our Lady'.
They chose to name the university Notre Dame so I can't see why they don't pronounce it correctly or change it to English.

Nodder Daym doesn't mean anything in any language.

The one that always stands out to me is "ParEshans" as opposed to "Parisians" like everyone else says.

That being said a lot of people from Chicago are confused as to why It's Chick-Car-Go here.
We also tend to pronounce "Derby" as it's spelled as opposed to "Dar-be", yet we take huge offence when English people mispronounce Irish place names.

I even remember Ballybofey being called "Bally - Boffey" on the news on some Cork radio station once.

The US has "Not-er DAYme" and France has calls runners/trainers "Les baskets" due to calling Basketball "Le Basket". ... It's a two-way street.

I don't really see the point in getting annoyed. People genuinely don't know how to pronounce these things and there are odd mess-ups. You can't really expect everyone to know everything.

Also midwestern US accents cannot pronounce soft letters. There's only one "A" and a whole load of other phonemes (basic sounds) don't exist and aren't heard to them. So, they can sometimes utterly mash up anything with subtle vowels. It's not actually ignorance, it's just they literally work with fewer phonemes than most English speakers due to the way American English was standardised there.

I just don't see the point in being offended by stuff like that. It's just language and accent.

Ave Sodalis

Fastidious wrote:

****ing stalker

As much as I hate post checking, particularly when it's not relevant, when you post, your posts are there for everyone to see. Anyone who doesn't want things known, should really keep it off the internet.

Corby Trouser Press wrote:

And we nod along over here, as if Catholic Ireland never was.

I'm really struggling to see your point in this post. Would you mind clearing it up?

no.8

Fastidious wrote:

You're the one telling me to get a grip when you're upset over a bloody building..pathetic !

Pathetic person

Fastidious

Corby Trouser Press wrote: »

We're lead in a lot of ways by the fundamental agnosticism of our nearest neighbours.

Hahahahahahaahaha
Times they are changing, glory be to god.
This just goes to demonstrate the materialism that plagues the Catholic Church.. it begs the question why these cathedrals were built in the first place cause I've no doubt that this isn't what Jesus wouldve wanted.

C'est seulement un bâtiment!

Blaming the English for the decline in religion is just blatant racism. It's laughable

Church on Tuesday

jasper100 wrote: »

Where is the tragedy? Its a shrine to child molestors, magdeline laundries and paedophiles etc. This organisation has been trying to control peoples minds for centuries and caused plenty of wars.


The global outpouring of "grief" is laughable.


There are real tragedies unfolding every day around the world but nobody wants to know.


But there is nothing like a "trendy tragedy" to get people in the western world falling over themselves in an outpouring of emotion.

Apart from edgy neck-beards who still like to guffaw and stick it to the RCC because it's trendy since secondary school (not a fan myself of the RCC BTW) it's heartening to see everyday Parisians come together in spontaneous instances of hymn and collective sorrow. That shows that an event like this, relatively trivial in the grand scale of things, brings about a collective sense of good will and togetherness. It is a symbol of France AND Europe.

Irish people would feel much the same kind of sadness if the GPO was to burn to the ground or Newgrange to be wrecked.


I've never been to Paris. I'm sure for the millions of tourists that have visited Notre Dame cathedral it holds many fond memories, maybe even for some the best of their lives, hence the worldwide sadness of the burning of such an iconic and beautiful building.

o1s1n

Corby Trouser Press wrote: »

Seems the consensus on here and elsewhere is that it's ok to mourn for the lost art and architecture but not for the Church or it's congregants..

Because one is an amazing example of architecture, full of priceless art which transcends religion and can be appreciated by anyone.

The other is an outdated ideology which thankfully, people seem to be waking up from.

I don't see why you would even attempt to compare the two?

rossie1977

Eircom_Sucks wrote: »

Its a building

I mean ffs

It's not just a building. It's a monument of mankind, a marvel of human engineering that has stood for 800 years that would be irreplaceable if destroyed. Would you consider the Mona Lisa just a painting?

gozunda

Sofia Damaged Lodging wrote: »

I was amused that Notre Dame University put out a tweet yesterday to reassure people that the university was not burning down -- that it was the cathedral in Paris that had caught fire...

Interestingly the University of Notre Dame in Indiana was set up in 1842 by Irish and French brothers of the Holy Cross.

It had it's own fire approx 140 years in April 1879 when the Main Building and the library collection, was entirely destroyed by a fire.

pc7

Just for those mentioning religion, on one of the radio shows this morning (can't remember if rte or newstalk), they were talking to an Irish man living there who was talking about how he goes to mass weekly in Notre Dame (and would have gone this week for Easter celebrations) and that even with 14 million visitors it is a practicing church and integral to the local community.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b

Eircom_Sucks wrote: »

Its a building

I mean ffs

I guess we shouldn't worry if the Pyramids, the Acropolis, and the Colosseum are all gone tomorrow, either.

Nobody should care about any of our built heritage, according to you.

I'm sure you'd be fine with demolishing the GPO, Dublin Castle, and Christchurch Cathedral while we're at it.

Lotus Flower

[Deleted User] wrote: »

In fairness, that people's first reaction to such an awful event is to start trying to take some retarded political swipe at Trump or Macron or whoever is fairly tragic..

How do you know it was her "first reaction"? The discussion came up in work the morning after, maybe she had just seen the Trump tweet and felt ashamed as he's her president.

Anteayer

All of these buildings represent a lot more than the name above the door. They're huge achievements in terms of art, culture, architecture, engineering and sheer human ingenuity.

That building represents the state-of-the-art in terms of human technology of its time.

It has been everything from one of the most high and powerful seats of the Catholic Church at the peak of an absolute and theocratic monarchy, where it hosted coronations and all sorts demonstrations of the pomp and power of that regime.

It's been at the heart of an empire and saw an idealistic Republic lose its way with the coronation of Napoleon Bonaparte.

It has also been humbled by being through the revolution, during which time it was actually dismantled and turned into a Temple of Reason for a while. It's even been left to rot and even used as a food storage warehouse.

It's been through 20th century wars.

Notre Dame Cathedral has evolved into a far more human place. It's a seat of a modern Catholic Church and it coexists, very comfortably with all sorts of other views in a secular republic and it is a massive draw to people who want to appreciate it for what it is - a religious, cultural, architectural and engineering icon that is also a symbol of an ancient city that has existed for millennia through good and bad times both economically and philosophically.

It's stood for most of a millennia and will probably still be standing in another thousand years and will probably have witnessed multiple incarnations of Paris, of France, of Europe and of the church too.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b

A professor of music from the University of York has pointed out the loss to music and sound:

“I remember when first working as a recording engineer, capturing chant in Notre Dame Cathedral and noting its incredible reverberation. The building’s reverberation, its own response to sounds made within it, is so strong and rich that it really seemed as if the ghosts of its past were coming out of the walls and singing along.

“It was a light bulb moment in my appreciation and grasp of sound and recording. The fire damage to the roof of the building means that it can no longer make those same responses to sound that it has been making for over 800 years, which is tragic indeed.

“Sound reverberation could be considered a niche topic, but when you listen to the sounds that Notre Dame makes, you realise the power in its audible rendition of space, geometry, fabric and time.”

Grayson

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

Apart from edgy neck-beards who still like to guffaw and stick it to the RCC because it's trendy since secondary school (not a fan myself of the RCC BTW) it's heartening to see everyday Parisians come together in spontaneous instances of hymn and collective sorrow. That shows that an event like this, relatively trivial in the grand scale of things, brings about a collective sense of good will and togetherness. It is a symbol of France AND Europe.

Irish people would feel much the same kind of sadness if the GPO was to burn to the ground or Newgrange to be wrecked.


I've never been to Paris. I'm sure for the millions of tourists that have visited Notre Dame cathedral it holds many fond memories, maybe even for some the best of their lives, hence the worldwide sadness of the burning of such an iconic and beautiful building.

To be fair when it comes to historical buildings we normally love them because of how old they are and what they've been through rather than the religion associated with them. Think of the pyramids or new grange. It's not like either of those buildings are associated with active religions.
I don't like the church but I wouldn't want Notre dame, or Christchurch or anything like them to burn down. (Although I will say there were a few churches that were built in the 70's-80's there were abominations and wouldn't be missed).