Poppy

Danzy

Most people here will only know it is remembrance day because of it being shown on the news.

The few who are interested will go to a memorial If they can find one near by, for most people there isn't and there isn't the interest to organize one.

blanch152

citytillidie wrote: »

I hope you know the difference between the UK and Great Britain, Ireland can not and never have been part of Britain considering it is a completely different Island.

The island of Ireland as an independent united entity has never existed.

Ireland was united by the British. Before that, it was a group of independent squabbling chieftains.

Geographically, Ireland is one of the British Isles.

Those are simple facts.

zapitastas

blanch152 wrote: »

The island of Ireland as an independent united entity has never existed.

Ireland was united by the British. Before that, it was a group of independent squabbling chieftains.

Geographically, Ireland is one of the British Isles.

Those are simple facts.

Ireland is part of the North Atlantic Archipelago. The Irish government refuses to use the term British Isles. Anyone doing so is using a disputed term to antoganise

ohnonotgmail

zapitastas wrote: »

Ireland is part of the North Atlantic Archipelago. The Irish government refuses to use the term British Isles. Anyone doing so is using a disputed term to antoganise

Or using it because it is a geographical term that has been in use since before we were born.

zapitastas

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Or using it because it is a geographical term that has been in use since before we were born.

It was a geographical term that was coined for political purposes. That is why the Irish government object to its usage and the British government also refrain from using it. It is only used now in the snide way the previous poster used it

weldoninhio

Danzy wrote: »

Most people here will only know it is remembrance day because of it being shown on the news.

The few who are interested will go to a memorial If they can find one near by, for most people there isn't and there isn't the interest to organize one.

Commemoration of the soup takers. Ireland must be the only case of an entire country having Stockholm Syndrome.

ohnonotgmail

zapitastas wrote: »

It was a geographical term that was coined for political purposes. That is why the Irish government object to its usage and the British government also refrain from using it. It is only used now in the snide way the previous poster used it

Geographically, Ireland is one of the British Isles.

I dont see anything snide about that.

zapitastas

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

I dont see anything snide about that.

In the context in which it was said it was certainly implying ownership which is exactly why the term is unacceptable and is not in use anymore

citytillidie

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

But it was part of the United Kingdom which is what the poster said. You are arguing with something that wasn't said.

United Kingdom is what? United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland - Ireland is separate and they were not British they were still Irish

lawred2

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Geographically, Ireland is one of the British Isles.

I don't see anything snide about that.

It's a disputed term. Our own government does not accept its usage. And advocates the use of British and Irish Isles.

I'm not sure what you mean by

Geographically, Ireland is one of the British Isles.

As if the subject of geography was something laid down on tablets by some higher being before man learned to read.

Geopolitical place names change all the time.

British Isles is not an accepted term any longer if the intention is to include the island of Ireland.

ohnonotgmail

citytillidie wrote: »

United Kingdom is what? United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland - Ireland is separate and they were not British they were still Irish

and again you are arguing against something that wasn't said.

ohnonotgmail

lawred2 wrote: »

It's a disputed term. Our own government does not accept its usage. And advocates the use of British and Irish Isles.

I'm not sure what you mean by



As if the subject of geography was something laid down on tablets by some higher being before man learned to read.

Geopolitical place names change all the time.

British Isles is not an accepted term any longer if the intention is to include the island of Ireland.

accepted by who, exactly? under what authority?

ohnonotgmail

zapitastas wrote: »

In the context in which it was said it was certainly implying ownership which is exactly why the term is unacceptable and is not in use anymore

the implication was only in your head.

lawred2

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

accepted by who, exactly? under what authority?

Did you mean "not accepted"?

Listen - feel free to call it whatever you want - but don't be surprised when someone queries your use of it.

This state officially refuses to recognize the term. And many Irish people would be of that viewpoint. But you're free to do what you want.

ohnonotgmail

lawred2 wrote: »

Did you mean "not accepted"?

whatever. you know what i meant.

lawred2

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

whatever. you know what i meant.

cool

Danzy

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Or using it because it is a geographical term that has been in use since before we were born.

Interestingly enough it is no longer used in map or atlases.

Nick Griffin kicked up a right stink, twas 15 years ago if i recall correctly.

zapitastas

Danzy wrote: »

Interestingly enough it is no longer used in map or atlases.

Nick Griffin kicked up a right stink, twas 15 years ago if i recall correctly.

Indeed and it is really only nick Griffin and his ilk that still use it

The Rape of Lucretia

zapitastas wrote: »

Ireland is part of the North Atlantic Archipelago. The Irish government refuses to use the term British Isles. Anyone doing so is using a disputed term to antoganise

Nobody ever uses that crazy made up term, which exists only because of Irish infantile sensibilities about calling them what everybody else the world over, and normal Irish people not still sporting an anti-British chip on their shoulder - the British Isles. Ireland is on the British Isles. Get over it.

Spook_ie

Try googling North Atlantic Archipelago.

klaaaz

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Nobody ever uses that crazy made up term, which exists only because of Irish infantile sensibilities about calling them what everybody else the world over, and normal Irish people not still sporting an anti-British chip on their shoulder - the British Isles. Ireland is on the British Isles. Get over it.

Ireland ain't British. British and loyalist people like yourself who have infantile sensibilities and an anti-Irish chip on their shoulder should recognise that the British Empire hold over Ireland and the world is dead. Ireland is part of the Irish Isles, Get over it

RandomName2

klaaaz wrote: »

Ireland ain't British. British and loyalist people like yourself who have infantile sensibilities and an anti-Irish chip on their shoulder should recognise that the British Empire hold over Ireland and the world is dead. Ireland is part of the Irish Isles, Get over it

Oh rly?

I think you'll find that the British Celts colonized Ireland, and Brittonic languages had a significant hold over all of the Brit.. I mean Irish Isles .. prior to later European immigration of people like the Normans.

Ultra-nationalists do like to invent their own history though, as well as being fairly jingoistic, so you are playing the right tune.

For the other parochial folk here trying their best to sound like they have a chip the size of a bus on their shoulder, try using a dictionary.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/british-isles
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/british_isles
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/British%20Isles
https://dictionary.reverso.net/english-definition/British%20Isles/forced


If you want to sound a bit less like an ultra-nationalist, and a little less ignorant, you could always try the 'Pretanic Isles' instead if the specific reference to Welsh people triggers you so much ('Welsh', of course, being the Old English word for 'Briton').

Ipso

Welsh wasn't an old word for Britain. it derives from a word from foreigner (like Corwall, Gaul, Gall, Wallonia).

klaaaz

RandomName2 wrote: »

Oh rly?

I think you'll find that the British Celts colonized Ireland, and Brittonic languages had a significant hold over all of the Brit.. I mean Irish Isles .. prior to later European immigration of people like the Normans.

Ultra-nationalists do like to invent their own history though, as well as being fairly jingoistic, so you are playing the right tune.

For the other parochial folk here trying their best to sound like they have a chip the size of a bus on their shoulder, try using a dictionary.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/british-isles
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/british_isles
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/British%20Isles
https://dictionary.reverso.net/english-definition/British%20Isles/forced


If you want to sound a bit less like an ultra-nationalist, and a little less ignorant, you could always try the 'Pretanic Isles' instead if the specific reference to Welsh people triggers you so much ('Welsh', of course, being the Old English word for 'Briton').

Oh really, yes! The Celts were not British, they originated from elsewhere! The British Isles term was invented by the British imperialist John Dee, an ultra-British nationalist and colonialist at the time of the conquest of Ireland. You quote British dictionary sites, your British Empire is dead.

What is wrong with the term Irish Isles instead?

The Rape of Lucretia

klaaaz wrote: »

What is wrong with the term Irish Isles instead?

That there is no such thing ?
People will think you mean a few rocks of Kerry.

klaaaz

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

That there is no such thing ?
People will think you mean a few rocks of Kerry.

I had asked you about the term Irish Isles. There are plenty of islands around Ireland hence the quality term Irish Isles.

RandomName2

klaaaz wrote: »

Oh really, yes! The Celts were not British, they originated from elsewhere!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_Britons

They originated from Europe. What, do you think they came from the moon?

klaaaz wrote: »

You quote British dictionary sites, your British Empire is dead.

Why am I debating with this sort of fellow? It's like having a conversation with a skinhead.

klaaaz wrote: »

What is wrong with the term Irish Isles instead?

Because it isn't common use or with historical precedence; because Ireland is the name of a country as well as a landmass; because it is confusing as there are islands owned by Ireland, but you are talking about Great Britain as being one of the Irish islands; because doing so would simply to appease regressive nationalists, because colonization of Great Britain post-Ice Age did not affect the island of Ireland in the same way as previous migrations had done.

Ipso wrote: »

Welsh wasn't an old word for Britain. it derives from a word from foreigner (like Corwall, Gaul, Gall, Wallonia).

What was the foreigner in question?

Old English Wielisc, Wylisc (West Saxon), Welisc, Wælisc (Anglian and Kentish) "foreign; British (not Anglo-Saxon).

As a noun, "the Britons," also "the Welsh language," both from Old English.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/welsh

And from wikipedia

The Old English-speaking Anglo-Saxons came to use the term Wælisc when referring to the Britons in particular

Do people actually bother researching at all, or are they so confident in their infallibility?

klaaaz

RandomName2 wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_Britons

They originated from Europe. What, do you think they came from the moon?

You had stated that the Celts were British when they were not, they had originated from Europe and migrated from there to these islands.

RandomName2 wrote: »

Why am I debating with this sort of fellow? It's like having a conversation with a skinhead.

This is like having a conversation with a DUP follower.

RandomName2 wrote: »

Because it isn't common use or with historical precedence; because Ireland is the name of a country as well as a landmass; because it is confusing as there are islands owned by Ireland, but you are talking about Great Britain as being one of the Irish islands; because doing so would simply to appease regressive nationalists, because colonization of Great Britain post-Ice Age did not affect the island of Ireland in the same way as previous migrations had done.

Britain conquered and colonised Ireland against the Irish people's wishes, a few million Irish died in the process.
Your superior British colonial attitude which is a regressive British nationalist stance is right up there with the DUP and their fellow little Englanders whose history invented the term British Isles against the wishes of the people of Ireland when they conquered Ireland

RandomName2

klaaaz wrote: »

You had stated that the Celts were British when they were not, they had originated from Europe and migrated from there to these islands.

Generally the term Briton and Celt can be interchangeable, although we have at least one ancient Roman writer who distinguished between the two. The term Celt is itself subject to significant debate seeing as they spanned a vast area but had no written history, so pinning down the exact bounds of Celts is quite difficult. However, I'm not expecting an academically rigorous assessment by yourself on the matter, so using broad strokes here is appropriate, I believe.

klaaaz wrote: »

This is like having a conversation with a DUP follower.

Staying on message, I like that. DUP as the alien outsider though? I'd have thought you'd have gone for a scapegoat that was a bit closer to home.

klaaaz wrote: »

Britain conquered and colonised Ireland against the Irish people's wishes, a few million Irish died in the process.

Which one, Brittany or Great Britain?

Answer is, of course, neither! I think you're thinking of the Normans or the English, depending on what century your head is in. I'm skeptical of your number, seeing as that would probably be greater than the population of the Island during either period.

klaaaz wrote: »

Your superior British colonial attitude

My attitude is superior because you are behaving like a doofus. I'm embarrassed in a fellow Irish person behaving in such a fashion. Getting triggered by the term British Isles? It is literally just a name and has nothing to do with the British colonial Empire which you seem to think it is derived from.

klaaaz wrote: »

The British Isles term was invented by the British imperialist John Dee

The first written record we have of the term in English is by John Dee. That doesn't mean he invented it!

The Rape of Lucretia

klaaaz wrote: »

little Englanders, whose history invented the term British Isles against the wishes of the people of Ireland when they conquered Ireland

To be fair, there are many contemporary accounts from that era, that it was the naming of the British Isles that caused they Irish most concern as they were being invaded.