Are short men disadvantaged in the dating world?

ginandtonicsky

Phoenix Wright wrote: »

I get this regularly and personally do not take it as a compliment, I always wonder whether people are suggesting I'm fugly :P

I honestly hear so much of this that I'm convinced it's just something guys say to each other for the craic. A socially acceptable way of saying you're a bollix and I fancy your missus or something. Both my exes got it regularly and they were pretty attractive guys, these were no beauty-and-the-beast scenarios.

Anyway I digress.

I used to encounter a LOT of profiles with "6 foot 2 because apparently that matters around here" on tinder and the likes when I did online dating. I think online being so overwhelmingly based on looks means that people can set their own "rules for engagement" that probably don't reflect how they'd react if they met and connected with someone in the real world. People tend to build mental "lists" about what they want in a person online, which is something you CAN do because there are so many dating options there.

My ex was about 5'9/10 I think, last guy I was mad about was about 5'7. I'm tiny and used to feeling tiny in relationships anyway at 5 '1! I do like the dynamic of guy as protector in a totally primitive sort of way, I like being picked up and thrown around

But overall what I look for is connection, which is so hard to find but is always based on more substantial things like humour, kindness, intelligence and similar backgrounds/interests. Obviously you need to be attracted initially, but height just wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me though things like a lot of excessive weight or someone who doesn't give a single sh1t about his appearance probably would.

Pug160

Overall height matters but proportions and stature come into it too. Some people have a squat type appearance despite being a normal height. I was watching some of those face offs boxers' do before a fight recently, and couldn't help but notice that despite some of them being a similar height, one guy's shoulders was much higher up compared to the fellow who was a similar height. I know men generally have longer bodies in proportion to their height than women do, but there seems to be a fair bit of variation amongst men as well. Or at least it seems that way.

Having a very long body with shorter legs seems to be seen as a somewhat masculine trait, but whether or not it's always desrirable is perhaps up for debate. You'll notice that a lot of caricatures of supposedly masculine males draw on this, the most well known one probably being Johnny Bravo.

shakeitoff

Phoenix Wright wrote: »

I get this regularly and personally do not take it as a compliment, I always wonder whether people are suggesting I'm fugly :P

The lads always seems to be 'punching above his weight' in my experience, regardless of his looks(unless he's a David Beckham type hunk) I think it's just ribbing.

Pug160

shakeitoff wrote: »

The lads always seems to be 'punching above his weight' in my experience, regardless of his looks(unless he's a David Beckham type hunk) I think it's just ribbing.

I agree with this. It's usually just banter (the guy has red hair or something) or he is marginally less atrractive than her, due to her being glamorous. But the cases where someone is really punching above their weight would be somewhat rare.

Wibbs

ginandtonicsky wrote: »

I honestly hear so much of this that I'm convinced it's just something guys say to each other for the craic. A socially acceptable way of saying you're a bollix and I fancy your missus or something. Both my exes got it regularly and they were pretty attractive guys, these were no beauty-and-the-beast scenarios.

+1. It's a smalltalk platitude type compliment of sorts thrown out regularly. Naturally people in love tend to overestimate their partners looks, but men in particular do it more often, or vocalise it more and tend to underestimate their own attractiveness. The I can't believe she's with me/she's out of my league/I'm so lucky and so on. Their mates tend to back this up out of friendship. You've done well and all that. I've caught myself doing it once or twice TBH. Plus as a society we tend to see women as the more beautiful sex anyway. Down the years I've known very few couples with much of difference in physical attractiveness. When I have it was usually the woman being ahead and the guy was higher than average in the social scale(well known, few quid, particular talent, social presence), so even there overall attractiveness was about equal. Couples tend to balance out.

Pug160 wrote: »

I know men generally have longer bodies in proportion to their height than women do/Having a very long body with shorter legs seems to be seen as a somewhat masculine trait,

Funny enough though often repeated research has shown that it's women that have on average shorter legs and longer torsos than men(and shorter arms, wider hips etc). Custom bike makers know this. Which makes sense as men are more built for running where longer legs are an advantage. What also skews perceptions is that women tend to wear higher heels than men which artificially elongates the legs. It's rare enough we see women in flat shoes or barefoot in the media, even swimwear is cut to accentuate and elongate the legs.

Pug160

Wibbs wrote: »

+1. It's a smalltalk platitude type compliment of sorts thrown out regularly. Naturally people in love tend to overestimate their partners looks, but men in particular do it more often, or vocalise it more and tend to underestimate their own attractiveness. The I can't believe she's with me/she's out of my league/I'm so lucky and so on. Their mates tend to back this up out of friendship. You've done well and all that. I've caught myself doing it once or twice TBH. Plus as a society we tend to see women as the more beautiful sex anyway. Down the years I've known very few couples with much of difference in physical attractiveness. When I have it was usually the woman being ahead and the guy was higher than average in the social scale(well known, few quid, particular talent, social presence), so even there overall attractiveness was about equal. Couples tend to balance out.

Funny enough though often repeated research has shown that it's women that have on average shorter legs and longer torsos than men(and shorter arms, wider hips etc). Custom bike makers know this. Which makes sense as men are more built for running where longer legs are an advantage. What also skews perceptions is that women tend to wear higher heels than men which artificially elongates the legs. It's rare enough we see women in flat shoes or barefoot in the media, even swimwear is cut to accentuate and elongate the legs.

I must say, it's a bit of a head scratcher. I was always under the impression that there were differences in body to leg ratios (women having longer femurs perhaps?) but maybe it's not as straigtforward. Part of it must be some kind of optical illusion then, but it really doesn't seem that way as women seem to have much shorter bodies a lot of the time. I know I'm a good three inches or so taller than my sister and she seems to wear the same length jeans. Although that's only one example of course.

I'll take a further look into it.

Relative height is what matters, not absolute height. in 1900 a man who was 5'7 wouldn't have felt as short as they do nowadays and would have been considered relatively more attractive by women than he is nowadays. People born in the last 20 years have had better nutrition for height than ever before making it so that if you are 5'9 or below you feel short. Social media and internet dating have further heightened the misery for men who reach their late teens and find they are shorter than their peers, who then get to enjoy more pleasure-filled lives than them while girls reject them for something they can't help and normal-height people who don't want to hurt their feelings tell them that it "doesn't matter". Women are attracted to attractive traits, one of which is height. If you are short it is best policy to be true to reality and accept that you're not as attractive as you could have been if you were normal height.

shakeitoff

True, I'm 5'8'', I get told I'm handsome but being short has hindered me with women for sure. I think it immediately detracts from my sex appeal. I even got told I had zero sex appeal even though I was very good looking.

Triceratops Ballet

shakeitoff wrote: »

True, I'm 5'8'', I get told I'm handsome but being short has hindered me with women for sure. I think it immediately detracts from my sex appeal. I even got told I had zero sex appeal even though I was very good looking.

is 5'8 short?

I agree that it's relative height that matters. I think you could only categorically call someone below 5'6" /5'4" for a man / woman objectively short. Everything else is relative to your own height. I'd say I find tall men attractive but I'm just shy of 5'9, I've dated blokes from 5'9" to 6'5" I was attracted to all of them, and if you were to judge each of them on their looks I wouldn't say any of them were better looking than the other in any major way like on a scale of 1-10 I'd put most of them at a 7/8.

Wibbs

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

is 5'8 short?

That's what I was thinking TB. I wouldn't have thought of 5'8" as being short for a guy. Last time I checked that was the average height for men in Ireland. IIRC average height for Irish women was around 5'4".

Dial Hard

Wibbs wrote: »

That's what I was thinking TB. I wouldn't have thought of 5'8" as being short for a guy. Last time I checked that was the average height for men in Ireland. IIRC average height for Irish women was around 5'4".

I'd consider it short, yes. But I accept that my perspective is probably skewed as all the men in my family are over 6' so to me, that's average.

KrustyUCC

Is being perceived as short a disadvantage in the dating world?

I'd say Yes

Last week the girls in the office had a chat about rule breakers when dating

One girl who is 5'4 stated that she couldn't go out with any man under 5'9 due to liking going out with heels

Not one girl in the office disagreed that they would date a shorter man or any one quite close to their height and most of them have husbands over 6 foot

Triceratops Ballet

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Is being perceived as short a disadvantage in the dating world?

I'd say Yes

Last week the girls in the office had a chat about rule breakers when dating

One girl who is 5'4 stated that she couldn't go out with any man under 5'9 due to liking going out with heels

Not one girl in the office disagreed that they would date a shorter man or any one quite close to their height and most of them have husbands over 6 foot

yeah deal breakers are deal breakers until you meet someone who's right for you who breaks them.
People say an awful lot of crap, but in reality there are very few people willing to live and die by what's on their list. I could give you a list as long as your arm of dealbreakers for me, but in reality there is only one (maybe 2 nowadays) that are hard and fast

KrustyUCC

That's true but in this case the woman is in her 40s and has never gone out with a guy less than 5'9

Seems pretty hard and fast for her to me

The more interesting thing is that the rest of the women in the office agreed with her perspective. Not one dissenting voice

We have a cross section of women from 23 - 62 in the office so that is quite a broad range of women

PlaneSpeeking

In the words of the legendary, of smallish stature and sadly missed Prince - "We're all the same height lying down and that's where it counts!"

PlaneSpeeking

KrustyUCC wrote: »

That's true but in this case the woman is in her 40s and has never gone out with a guy less than 5'9

Seems pretty hard and fast for her to me

The more interesting thing is that the rest of the women in the office agreed with her perspective. Not one dissenting voice

We have a cross section of women from 23 - 62 in the office so that is quite a broad range of women

I'm 5'1" so tbh anything above 5'8" would be a bit of a challenge!

KrustyUCC

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

In the words of the legendary, of smallish stature and sadly missed Prince - "We're all the same height lying down and that's where it counts!"

Ha true lol

Lorelli!

amandafrom97 wrote: »

For most women, tall, masculine, and confident men are like people who want a high paying job that they enjoy.

Out of those three, tall is only one thing. And I'm sure loads are but not all tall men are all three. Lots of people have ideals but they rarely meet exactly that in real life.

I don't know about online dating but I've heard how some people put a specific height. Online, it seems in general, things are very much exaggerated and alot of the normal real life interactions when first meeting someone are sidestepped. There's nothing you can really do about that except be realistic yourself.

I wouldn't have a height preference myself and I'm 5'9 so tall enough for a woman. I think irl attraction doesnt really work like that and in the past ive been attracted to tall men and shorter men. At 5'5 and a with a feminine name like Kelly, Id have no problem going out with the guy from the Stereophonics

Triceratops Ballet

KrustyUCC wrote: »

That's true but in this case the woman is in her 40s and has never gone out with a guy less than 5'9

Seems pretty hard and fast for her to me

The more interesting thing is that the rest of the women in the office agreed with her perspective. Not one dissenting voice

We have a cross section of women from 23 - 62 in the office so that is quite a broad range of women

I believe it, I've been in those groups, I've said similar in the past myself, but what people say and what people do aren't always the same. I never thought I'd go out with someone the same height as me, I used to think that was way too short, but I did, I fell in love with him and it didn't matter a bit in the end.

I'm not saying it's not a real thing at all, but I don't think anyone who thinks they don't live up to this expectation should feel like they'll never find someone, cos that's not true, it might take more self belief and a bit more swagger but not being tall isn't condemnation to a life of solitude

mvl

wonder if this is a generational thing, can (post-)millennials be having different expectations than generation X ?

anyway - I think short but with BDE have good chance of doing alright in the dating world

Triceratops Ballet

Lorelli! wrote: »

Out of those three, tall is only one thing. And I'm sure loads are but not all tall men are all three. Lots of people have ideals but they rarely meet exactly that in real life.

I don't know about online dating but I've heard how some people put a specific height. Online, it seems in general, things are very much exaggerated and alot of the normal real life interactions when first meeting someone are sidestepped. There's nothing you can really do about that except be realistic yourself.

I wouldn't have a height preference myself and I'm 5'9 so tall enough for a woman. I think irl attraction doesnt really work like that and in the past ive been attracted to tall men and shorter men. At 5'5 and a with a feminine name like Kelly, Id have no problem going out with the guy from the Stereophonics

lol I was going to ref Kelly Jones too, there's plenty of tall women who'd happily date someone who looked like him!

KrustyUCC

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

I believe it, I've been in those groups, I've said similar in the past myself, but what people say and what people do aren't always the same. I never thought I'd go out with someone the same height as me, I used to think that was way too short, but I did, I fell in love with him and it didn't matter a bit in the end.

I'm not saying it's not a real thing at all, but I don't think anyone who thinks they don't live up to this expectation should feel like they'll never find someone, cos that's not true, it might take more self belief and a bit more swagger but not being tall isn't condemnation to a life of solitude

Very good post

My ex was taller than me and now my current gf is shorter than me

I'd be excluded by lot of women online for being less than 6'0 but yet that's where I met my gf

Not being tall def isn't condemnation to a life of solitude but I still think overall it is perceived as being a disadvantage

Sabre0001

Step 1: Be attractive
Step 2: Don't be unattractive

And confidence definitely helps

Height seems to be important for the online dating world, and I've definitely heard it mentioned in the conversation over freedom to wear heels. While 6 foot, I can't say it's really benefited me though...

Triceratops Ballet

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Step 1: Be attractive
Step 2: Don't be unattractive

And confidence definitely helps

Height seems to be important for the online dating world, and I've definitely heard it mentioned in the conversation over freedom to wear heels. While 6 foot, I can't say it's really benefited me though...

I'd so much rather just not wear heels!! like why would you when comfort is an option!

Dial Hard

Triceratops Ballet wrote:

I'd so much rather just not wear heels!! like why would you when comfort is an option!

There's such thing as comfortable heels you know! I love me hee-highlers. And wedges. I've a particularly comfy pair that put me well over 6'.

I remember going to a sports day in a previous job and one of the managers standing beside me in my runners and going "Oh my God, you're actually really small!" Now, at 5' 7" I'm not exactly tiny but he was so used to looking me in the eye that he just assumed I was the same height as him.

I'd actually love to be another couple of inches taller. I'm the shortest person in my family apart from my mum.

One eyed Jack

Dial Hard wrote: »

I'd consider it short, yes. But I accept that my perspective is probably skewed as all the men in my family are over 6' so to me, that's average.

Same here in my family, and even in my extended family that I can think of, I've always been the shortarse at 5'10", as they were all 6ft and over. My old man was 6'7" and my son at 13 is already 6ft.

Certainly even though I've always been conscious of it, I've never thought of it as a disadvantage in dating or anything else. I don't do online dating but I would expect that given the choice between a guy who's 5'10 and a guy who's 6ft+, all other things being equal, why wouldn't a woman go for the taller guy if that's what she's into.

It's not a disadvantage for the shorter guy, it's her personal preferences is all, and I wouldn't expect they should change. It'd be like a guy lamenting the fact that being gay is a 'disadvantage' when he's eyeballing all the straight guys, what's anyone else supposed to do about it?

Sabre0001

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

I'd so much rather just not wear heels!! like why would you when comfort is an option!

I honestly have no idea

Triceratops Ballet

Dial Hard wrote: »

There's such thing as comfortable heels you know! I love me hee-highlers. And wedges. I've a particularly comfy pair that put me well over 6'.

I remember going to a sports day in a previous job and one of the managers standing beside me in my runners and going "Oh my God, you're actually really small!" Now, at 5' 7" I'm not exactly tiny but he was so used to looking me in the eye that he just assumed I was the same height as him.

I'd actually love to be another couple of inches taller. I'm the shortest person in my family apart from my mum.

Yeah it's a matter of practice and habit though I used to wear them all the time for work and could easily run for a bus in them no problem, and then I got a job with no dress code and it was all flats from then on out, my high heel wearing ability has just diminished massively! I'd like to be 5'10/11 myself too! I'm 174 cm as it is

ginandtonicsky

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

yeah deal breakers are deal breakers until you meet someone who's right for you who breaks them.
People say an awful lot of crap, but in reality there are very few people willing to live and die by what's on their list. I could give you a list as long as your arm of dealbreakers for me, but in reality there is only one (maybe 2 nowadays) that are hard and fast

Very very true. In my mind I think I know what I'm attracted to; if I handed you that list and showed you a lineup of my exes it just wouldn't tally at all. Different heights, different physiques, different physical features. What they have in common is pretty much that I laughed a lot with each of them and I had a strong emotional connection from the outset.

Amirani

It's a disadvantage yeah, but so are lots of things. A select portion of women may have it as a genuine dealbreaker, but most people are pretty flexible. Online dating does exacerbate certain things and breeds insecurity. In general, it's not going to solely result in you being unable to find a partner.