Cork developments

satanta99

newuser99999 wrote: »

No they really don’t. There’s a stark contrast between Galway and Cork.

Cork is a medium sized European City with a population of 210,000 people. There are 25,000 people alone living in the dense urban core.

Galway is series of suburbs and retail parks with one tourist street and a population of around 80,000.

Reputable Rog

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

I agree with you, sadly this was an issue before covid, I would not like to live in one of the new proposed high rise apartments, but think there will be plenty who will and good for them.


The number of closed up shops on the main street of the countries second city is pathetic.


Thanks to west cork, and and lots of great places in east cork and the lower harbour like spike island the tourists were still coming, but the city offered very little.


what will a tourist think walking down the main street of the city seeing homeless junkies sleeping in boarded up shop doorways.
In the last year on patrick street alone there has been multiple vicious assaults , where people were almost killed , people stabbed on the main street of the city during the day.
Thats not counting the other incidents down side streets.
Its not good.

Ever been to San Francisco, Washington DC? Even Manhattan these days is suffering.
The City Centre is doing ok considering the challenges.

cgcsb

mire wrote: »

Cork City badly needs density - the alternative is endless sprawl and hopeless urban services - but we can achieve this without loads of high rise - the answer is mid rise [4-8 stories] combined with huge investment in public transport

The city would have to be consistently 8 stories to achieve that. Are you going to do the environmental impact statement for demolishing all of Cork's historic core to rebuild it at that level? wonder how that would go down with An Taisce.

cgcsb

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

lets be honest what is in the city that would make people want to live in it ?

This morning I was on oliver plunkett street, went past mcdonald's in winthrop street, and by the time i got to the bottom of patricks hill, i had passed more than a dozen people who looked like they have severe alcohol and substance issues.
One couple were staggering.

Then you have so many shops, even on patrick street boarded up, and dont give me the covid excuse, as the place was like that before covid.

For people who get upset by seeing a drunk person, even village life won't suit them. They'd find lots of reasons to clutch their pearls and twitch their curtains. I mean what if your neighbour were an unmarried female? Who'd want to live in such a village.

namloc1980

Cork, like any other city, has its issues. Yes it could be cleaner, yes the Council should be doing more, cars have too much space and the vacant units are a shame but Justin makes it sound like one of the fevelas in Rio. It's impossible to give rational views without someone jumping the shark and making it sound like you are taking your life into your hands any time you step onto Pana.

namloc1980

mire wrote: »

Cork City badly needs density - the alternative is endless sprawl and hopeless urban services - but we can achieve this without loads of high rise - the answer is mid rise [4-8 stories] combined with huge investment in public transport

A load of 4-8 storey blocks would be horrendous - almost Soviet style housing. Take a look at the balls Dublin made of their docklands with a sprawl of low rise boxes and little more. Don't think we should be emulating that.

cgcsb

namloc1980 wrote: »

A load of 4-8 storey blocks would be horrendous - almost Soviet style housing. Take a look at the balls Dublin made of their docklands with a sprawl of low rise boxes and little more. Don't think we should be emulating that.

High rise is essential to make up the density gaps that we have due to the city's historic core. There are 2 options to improve density really, we can demolish all of Cork city and rebuild it in 8-10 story blocks. Paris and Barcelona did this (although they kept some historic buildings) in the 19th century and in the late 20th century they ended up building high rise blocks anyway. Or we could build high rise now and tell all the Helen Lovejoys to go live in Bantry or something.

Justin Credible Darts

newuser99999 wrote: »

No they really don’t. There’s a stark contrast between Galway and Cork.

I agree, I was in Waterford on tuesday, and even during this covid period the difference was stark - to use the word you used.



sadly some cork people get very defensive, they think its the centre of the universe.


Its a grey dank city, its my home, and whilst I love my home, I am not so blinkered that i cannot see the many flaws and see the current state of the place.


I dont care if San Francisco ,Washington, London or any other place on Earth has their problems, that does not alter the state of the city in Cork.


Parochial blindness wont change the fact there are junkies sleeping in doorways or pissheads stopping people begging on the street, multiple vicious assaults, on the main street, where one was stabbed in the middle of the day and was lucky he did not die, another slashed repeatedly with a bottle.....again during the day.


Am I happy it is like this ?...of course not,it is almost impossible to see any gardai patrolling the place, but I will be damned if some blinkered bias will try tell me what i see with me own eyes is the same everywhere else.

the beer revolu

satanta99 wrote: »

You’d swear you were living in Gotham City!

These are the types of things that happen in all cities.

There are no boarded up shops on Patrick Steeet. There are empty units from U.K. retailers that went bust during the pandemic. They will be re-let in the next few months.

It’s easy to critique the actions of the city authorities on an Internet forum but there are good initiatives rolling out all across the city.

There is a genuine sense of excitement around the city at the prospect of bars and restaurants opening for outdoor customers next week. Princes Street looks great.

Justin has a history of gross exaggeration when it comes to these matters.
I suspect he thinks he's an edgy, "tell it like it is" kind of guy.

I think it's actually kind of sad going through your life only being able to see the negatives and none of the positives around you.

Justin Credible Darts

the beer revolu wrote: »

Justin has a history of gross exaggeration when it comes to these matters.
I suspect he thinks he's an edgy, "tell it like it is" kind of guy.

I think it's actually kind of sad going through your life only being able to see the negatives and none of the positives around you.

are you saying there are no beggars and no junkies ?
no closed up shops
no vicious assaults



Which part of my post was untrue ?
You are another person who gets so defensive you automatically presume when someone says anything what you deem negative about the city, he is only doing it to be edgy.


Why is it so hard for you to accept what said which is true. Why do you appear to be so threatened by these comments ?

mike_cork

the beer revolu wrote: »

Justin has a history of gross exaggeration when it comes to these matters.
I suspect he thinks he's an edgy, "tell it like it is" kind of guy.

I think it's actually kind of sad going through your life only being able to see the negatives and none of the positives around you.

I live in Cork City Centre. I can assure Justin it's not the dystopian wasteland he seems to be trying to portray.
Yes Cork City has problems such as derelict buildings & vagrancy for example but that isn't exactly unique to Cork.
What Cork does need is
(1) More centre city apartments (and building up)
(2) Better public transport-We need less cars in the city. The lack of traffic in the city due to the past 12 months of lockdowns was amazing tbh.

Justin Credible Darts

the beer revolu wrote: »

Justin has a history of gross exaggeration when it comes to these matters..

man stabbed in broad daylight on patrick street in vicious attack

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/courtandcrime/arid-40295468.html

man attacked with broken bottle on patrick street

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40114139.html

this 40 year old was killed on patrick street

https://www.thesun.ie/news/4701067/man-assault-cork-city-centre-six-weeks/
That is not counting the death and attacks elsewhere in the city......


where are these exaggerations you speak off ?

the beer revolu

are you saying there are no beggars and no junkies ?
no closed up shops
no vicious assaults

Of course not.
Cork is a city. All cities have the above.

Which part of my post was untrue ?
You are another person who gets so defensive you automatically presume when someone says anything what you deem negative about the city, he is only doing it to be edgy.

I said that you are prone to gross exaggeration and focusing only on the negative. I never said it was untrue. Many here would seem to agree that you are exaggerating.
I don't see this as being defensive.

Why is it so hard for you to accept what said which is true. Why do you appear to be so threatened by these comments ?

I am not in the least threatened. I try to just ignore such hyperbolic nonsense but, today I couldn't help myself.

Basically, for a city of its size, Cork is relatively safe and functional.
All cities have homelessness, dereliction, substance abuse, poverty, assaults, murders and antisocial behavior. I wish it wasn't so but it is.

I'd love for Cork to have less of the above and, perhaps if more people used and lived in the city these things could improve.

The reason why I, and I assume others, are bothered by your posts is because they create a false (imo) picture of the reality of life in the city. This helps no one.

rounders

Admins can this conversation be spun off into it's own thread? Call it some like "Is Cork City Centre Doomed? and leave them bitch and moan over there. This thread is supposed to be about development, not the crime rates in the city and junkies

Justin Credible Darts

then back up your mouth and show me examples of these "exaggerations"

Surely you must have them since you insist on repeating the claim.

leahyl

Any more news on the Prism and whether it's still happening or what?

mike_cork

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

man stabbed in broad daylight on patrick street in vicious attack

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/courtandcrime/arid-40295468.html

man attacked with broken bottle on patrick street

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40114139.html

this 40 year old was killed on patrick street

https://www.thesun.ie/news/4701067/man-assault-cork-city-centre-six-weeks/
That is not counting the death and attacks elsewhere in the city......


where are these exaggerations you speak off ?

You can post links for similar incidents for any city in the world.
I really am not understanding the bee in your bonnet about Cork City.

marno21

This thread was once a positive update thread for new developments in Cork.

To say it’s well and truly in the gutter is an understatement.

Any chance we could go back to the days of old? The current discourse is both awful and far from the original thread.

Justin Credible Darts

mike_cork wrote: »

You can post links for similar incidents for any city in the world.
I really am not understanding the bee in your bonnet about Cork City.

I thought it was fairly obvious.


I think the city centre sucks
not the suburbs, not the county, not all the people,



But people can get all defensive, put on the blinkers, and try to spin or deflect, but the reality is the centre is in a woeful state.


This covid s no excuse either as the homeless and substance abusers were prevalent long before covid, shops were boarded up before covid, and as posted multiple vicious assaults happening on the main street. Gardai were non existent then as they are now.



That is not counting what happens off patrick street which have seen more deaths over the years.


I am from cork, this is my home, and I hate seeing it like this, but I cannot pretend its not happening either. What sort of image does it portray to see junkies sleeping on the main thoroughfare of the city in the doorways of closed up units.


My argument, is who will want to move in to these proposed new apartments in the city, would you personally like to live in a box surrounded by that...if yes is your answer, good for you, I hope you will be happy.
But I suspect a lot of people would not like to live amongst that.


These new building will make the city look more impressive, but the issues with the centre need addressing badly.

cgcsb

the beer revolu wrote: »

Justin has a history of gross exaggeration when it comes to these matters.
I suspect he thinks he's an edgy, "tell it like it is" kind of guy.

I think it's actually kind of sad going through your life only being able to see the negatives and none of the positives around you.

I do wonder what these people do when they travel to the dreaded 'outside the state' to cities and countries with moderate to high levels of crime, drug abuse and homelessness. They must only be able to travel to Ireland and Scandavia because logically everywhere else in the world must be a sh!tehole, statistically speaking.

Justin Credible Darts

cgcsb wrote: »

I do wonder what these people do when they travel to the dreaded 'outside the state' to cities and countries with moderate to high levels of crime, drug abuse and homelessness. They must only be able to travel to Ireland and Scandavia because logically everywhere else in the world must be a sh!tehole, statistically speaking.

I have been to multiple cities in france and holland, been to berlin, and london, and almost all in this country, and dont see the homeless dosing down as much in the main street as they do in cork.


You think I take some sort of joy in this ? Do you think I enjoy seeing my home town as bad as this ? Loving my home does not negate the glaringly obvious issues.



I am all for the rejuvenation of the city, christ knows it certainly needs it, but stating the obvious social problems in the city center is met with people making out I am exaggerating the problems.
This parochial biased and blinkered deflection tactic how some cities in the states are just as bad....so what ?
What has that got to do with the facts I posted.



Beer revolution claims I have exaggerated things, but he fails to show these.
I have posted links to the assaults I mentioned
anyone with a set of working eyeballs can see the closed up shops and the homeless and junkies.
The parks like bishop lucy can be no go areas at times.
Hardly ever see a garda


But you think that is fine cos some other cities are equally as bad ?

Hibernicis

marno21 wrote: »

This thread was once a positive update thread for new developments in Cork.

To say it’s well and truly in the gutter is an understatement.

Any chance we could go back to the days of old? The current discourse is both awful and far from the original thread.

Couldn't agree more. As a long time lurker on this thread the recent bickering and tit-for-tat posting is infuriating and renders the thread unreadable. It would never happen in the Infrastructure forum........

rounders

Hibernicis wrote: »

Couldn't agree more. As a long time lurker on this thread the recent bickering and tit-for-tat posting is infuriating and renders the thread unreadable. It would never happen in the Infrastructure forum........

I used to use boards for all my construction news/updates in Cork. Got sick of all the bickering and trolling though so found a lot more welcoming community/website elsewhere.

I won't mention the name of the site out of fairness for Boards but lets just say the name is all about tall building and urban areas

namloc1980

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

I agree, I was in Waterford on tuesday, and even during this covid period the difference was stark - to use the word you used.

Put "Waterford stabbing" into google and it's an eye opener. You're just being deliberately obtuse to get a rise out of people.

namloc1980

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40304816.html

Article in the Echo about the funding announced for Cork suburban rail on Tuesday, however:

A spokesperson for the Department of Transport said this funding will see the construction of a number of different works by August 2026.

These include a new ‘through’ platform within Kent Station to create a suburban rail network between Mallow, Midleton, and Cobh as well as the re-signalling of the suburban rail network with a view to future electrification. It will also include double-tracking of the current single-track between Glounthaune and Midleton.

Is it just me or is that a painfully slow timescale to deliver what are really fairly modest upgrades. A new platform at Kent, resignalling a very modest network and double tracking c.8km of track. 5 years is depressingly slow.

Justin Credible Darts

namloc1980 wrote: »

Put "Waterford stabbing" into google and it's an eye opener. You're just being deliberately obtuse to get a rise out of people.

I did and guess what ? It was not on the main street of the city in the middle of the day....or did you conveniently choose to ignore that.
I posted just 3 on patrick street alone in recent times. I could post dozens more from elsewhere in the city center.


Which of the following are not true ?

the junkies in doorways on the main street of this city
multiple empty store units on the main street lying empty
beggars tapping on the street
parks like bishop lucy a no go area....even in daylight
Buildings collapsing in the city due to lack of maintenance
multiple violent assaults on the main street
a distinct lack of gardai


Even if Waterford descended to the levels of cork city center, how would that alter anything I said about the city center.
Saying somewhere else is just as bad wont negate things, and the fact you think I said these home truths in order to get a rise out of you, well that says more about your mindset.

Tij da feen

namloc1980 wrote: »

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40304816.html

Article in the Echo about the funding announced for Cork suburban rail on Tuesday, however:



Is it just me or is that a painfully slow timescale to deliver what are really fairly modest upgrades. A new platform at Kent, resignalling a very modest network and double tracking c.8km of track. 5 years is depressingly slow.

They also seem to be ignoring the fact that there used to be trains (maybe still is) that would run straight from Cobh - Mallow before, using Platform 5 in Kent.

I get the need for a new platform but it's not like this was something they've never done before.

Justin Credible Darts

these new proposed stations at blarney for example, will they be just on the cork mallow line.

Will blarney to midleton be a route or will it mean changing trains at kent station ?

questionmark?

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

these new proposed stations at blarney for example, will they be just on the cork mallow line.

Will blarney to midleton be a route or will it mean changing trains at kent station ?

Straight through running. Cobh/Mallow and Midleton/Mallow.

I can imagine the Cobh/Blarney section will do well with tourists from the cruise liners.

Justin Credible Darts

questionmark? wrote: »

Straight through running. Cobh/Mallow and Midleton/Mallow.

I can imagine the Cobh/Blarney section will do well with tourists from the cruise liners.

true.


Surprised they never thought of doing Cobh to Midleton in a single return route or make it Cork Cobh Midleton.


suspect as you say the tourists would visit the jamesons brewery too