Is someone within their rights to move you out of a prebooked seat?

dr.fuzzenstein

PeterParker957 wrote: »

I'm really not sure what part of "paying thousands a year just to get to work to pay for the ne'er do wells and "we want everything for free" crowd, who then get to swan on to a packed train a minute before the off and turf a paying customer out of a seat" you don't get as being unfair ??

Other than simple bedrudgery of anyone with a job making a contribution and having to stand for an hour.

So book a seat.

Effects

magicbastarder wrote: »

i'm getting confused now. in what context can someone who has not paid, get to kick another passenger out of a seat?

Elsa Wooden Mustang wrote: »

A friend has free travel and is able to prebook a seat.
I cant see how an annual ticket holder cant do the same.

The above context perhaps?

magicbastarder

do they pay extra, or is the seat booking included in the free pass?

Night Falls

If begrudgery means being amused at the irony of someone labelling others as "we want everything for free" whilst at the same time getting massively discounted train travel, but still being annoyed at others paying to reserve a seat (when they have the exact same opportunity), then yeah, that's probably it.

The Moldy Gowl

PeterParker957 wrote: »

I'm really not sure what part of "paying thousands a year just to get to work to pay for the ne'er do wells and "we want everything for free" crowd, who then get to swan on to a packed train a minute before the off and turf a paying customer out of a seat" you don't get as being unfair ??

Other than simple bedrudgery of anyone with a job making a contribution and having to stand for an hour.

Well then drive. You will be faster.

And you need to book and pay online to reserve a seat

magicbastarder

let's actually think about how we could implement a hierarchy on public transport for us poor overburdened taxpayers.

maybe a taxpayer who has paid normally for a ticket (i.e. did not get a tax discount on it) should be given the right to evict a taxpayer travelling on a tax-discounted ticket, out of their seat.
a taxpayer travelling on a tax-discounted ticket should be able to evict someone on an FTP out of their seat. or even off the tram/train, if it's full and there's standing room only.

maybe passengers could be issued with an identifier as they board which would signify their 'right' to be on public transport?

bebeman

The best thing about these type of discussions is the FTP holders show their cards, you can tell who pays and who travels for free.
Then when you look at other discussions you can see those who bitch the most about DB/IE/BE/LUAS are those who dont contribute a penny to the running of these services, the FTP holders.

joeysoap

I worked for 40 (forty) years in my second job , first one was only for a few month in 1966. I also worked 8 years in my ‘third’ job. Loved every minute of if, so different from the second job. But I was thrown out at 65. And at 66 I got the FTA. Which I do use occasionally, maybe 4 -5 times a year. I am 68 now and healthy, thank God.

I would swap the FTA to be younger and employed again in the blink of an eye.

Hilly Bill

PeterParker957 wrote: »

I'm really not sure what part of "paying thousands a year just to get to work to pay for the ne'er do wells and "we want everything for free" crowd, who then get to swan on to a packed train a minute before the off and turf a paying customer out of a seat" you don't get as being unfair ??

Other than simple bedrudgery of anyone with a job making a contribution and having to stand for an hour.

You only paid to travel.

LuckyLloyd

Hilly Bill wrote: »

You only paid to travel.

And you're free to pay an extra €5 for an aul seat.

Isambard

imagine the scenario that there are four old ladies or a family sitting in the bay you have booked in, you evict the one in your seat and then have to sit next to the rest of them for the journey. Nice.

IE need to improve the system so that problems don't occur.

_Dara_

Effects wrote: »

The above context perhaps?

magicbastarder wrote: »

do they pay extra, or is the seat booking included in the free pass?

You have to pay to book a seat if you are a free travel card holder.

_Dara_

bebeman wrote: »

The best thing about these type of discussions is the FTP holders show their cards, you can tell who pays and who travels for free.
Then when you look at other discussions you can see those who bitch the most about DB/IE/BE/LUAS are those who dont contribute a penny to the running of these services, the FTP holders.

Have you done a detailed analysis on this? What are your findings? How much of a correlation is there?

Isambard

magicbastarder wrote: »

let's actually think about how we could implement a hierarchy on public transport for us poor overburdened taxpayers.

maybe a taxpayer who has paid normally for a ticket (i.e. did not get a tax discount on it) should be given the right to evict a taxpayer travelling on a tax-discounted ticket, out of their seat.
a taxpayer travelling on a tax-discounted ticket should be able to evict someone on an FTP out of their seat. or even off the tram/train, if it's full and there's standing room only.

maybe passengers could be issued with an identifier as they board which would signify their 'right' to be on public transport?

why not introduce Steerage and have an old goods wagon with no windows or maybe no roof for us free pass holders?

magicbastarder

_Dara_ wrote: »

You have to pay to book a seat if you are a free travel card holder.

so the person i was responding to was misrepresenting the situation, as far as i can see.

joeysoap

Anyone know if the 17.30 Dublin to Galway train is full on a Friday? Friends are traveling down in a few weeks and having read many posts on this site I think they would be well advised to book seats. (They can’t catch an earlier train owing to work). Sunday morning return - should they be ok?

CIARAN_BOYLE

joeysoap wrote: »

Anyone know if the 17.30 Dublin to Galway train is full on a Friday? Friends are traveling down in a few weeks and having read many posts on this site I think they would be well advised to book seats. (They can’t catch an earlier train owing to work). Sunday morning return - should they be ok?

They should hook seats. Definitely. They may be ok but there is no guarantee.

Jamie2k9

The reservation system is something that IE must get sorted, since they launched the new fare structure, I can only speak for Waterford route students are booking online in higher numbers as are commuters from Carlow/Athy are also booking online.

On one particular busy train online % of seats sold has gone from around 27% to 70-75% of online capacity available. Based on set sizes the % booked seats has gone from 23% to 65-70% and it increases week by week because people are now been forced to stand so book seats the next time.

The train is guaranteed to be above capacity and a reservation system working isn't acceptable in such circumstances.

Emme

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The reservation system is something that IE must get sorted, since they launched the new fare structure, I can only speak for Waterford route students are booking online in higher numbers as are commuters from Carlow/Athy are also booking online.

On one particular busy train online % of seats sold has gone from around 27% to 70-75% of online capacity available. Based on set sizes the % booked seats has gone from 23% to 65-70% and it increases week by week because people are now been forced to stand so book seats the next time.

The train is guaranteed to be above capacity and a reservation system working isn't acceptable in such circumstances.

The system isn't working on that route. I travel on it daily and people are so p****d off they sit in booked seats on purpose. You have a fair chance of getting a seat in Carlow but from Athy on most "available" seats are booked from Kildare, Newbridge or other stations along the way onwards. Athy people aren't known for being law abiding so they just sit in the seats I can see their point.

joeysoap

How do semi- flexible and flexible work? If you dont travel on the train you have booked seats on what happens? Is that seat still showing as booked when the train departs? You catch a later train and what seat are you allocated?

Ciaran B: I have advised them to book ( seats are only €2.50 anyway). Thanks

Hilly Bill

joeysoap wrote: »

How do semi- flexible and flexible work? If you dont travel on the train you have booked seats on what happens? Is that seat still showing as booked when the train departs? You catch a later train and what seat are you allocated?

Ciaran B: I have advised them to book ( seats are only €2.50 anyway). Thanks

Your seats are only available for the service you booked. Your name will still show above the seats. It would only not show if you cancelled your booking at least an hour and a half before departure either online or over the phone.

PeterParker957

magicbastarder wrote: »

so the person i was responding to was misrepresenting the situation, as far as i can see.

No, not misrepresenting. I'm not arguing that they get a free reservation, my point was SOME people get a FTP and don't need it, they then get to pay a few quid extra (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it) and then get a seat on a packed train.

CF Friday night - mother and two kids, got on the train at 5.23pm, 2 minutes before the off. Standing room only. No names on train for booking. I and two other commuters were made to move. She then tried to get a fourth to move "as we need the space to stretch out".

She got short shrift there!!

How is that right ?????

Edit - I should point out that I left that train after standing for an hour crying with pain. I'd never describe myself as disabled but I have a condition that is painful and doesn't allow me to stand for a long period of time.

osarusan

I too have a range of convenient anecdotes at my disposal.

PeterParker957

osarusan wrote: »

I too have a range of convenient anecdotes at my disposal.

So ?

Emme

PeterParker957 wrote: »

No, not misrepresenting. I'm not arguing that they get a free reservation, my point was SOME people get a FTP and don't need it, they then get to pay a few quid extra (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it) and then get a seat on a packed train.

CF Friday night - mother and two kids, got on the train at 5.23pm, 2 minutes before the off. Standing room only. No names on train for booking. I and two other commuters were made to move. She then tried to get a fourth to move "as we need the space to stretch out".

She got short shrift there!!

How is that right ?????

Edit - I should point out that I left that train after standing for an hour crying with pain. I'd never describe myself as disabled but I have a condition that is painful and doesn't allow me to stand for a long period of time.

Perhaps you should look into the option of booking a seat for yourself or start carrying a cane and say you cannot stand for long periods of time. You should not be crying with pain after a journey from a day's work.

Some of the "entitled" classes have a feudal attitude and think that taxpayers should fund their lifestyles AND give up seats for them on public transport. That mother could have taken one of the children on her knee and let the other sit in a seat. Wanting a fourth seat to stretch out... it beggars belief :eek:

The Moldy Gowl

PeterParker957 wrote: »

No, not misrepresenting. I'm not arguing that they get a free reservation, my point was SOME people get a FTP and don't need it, they then get to pay a few quid extra (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it) and then get a seat on a packed train.

CF Friday night - mother and two kids, got on the train at 5.23pm, 2 minutes before the off. Standing room only. No names on train for booking. I and two other commuters were made to move. She then tried to get a fourth to move "as we need the space to stretch out".

She got short shrift there!!

How is that right ?????

Edit - I should point out that I left that train after standing for an hour crying with pain. I'd never describe myself as disabled but I have a condition that is painful and doesn't allow me to stand for a long period of time.

Is it the chip on your shoulder that's causing your balance to be off?

Jamie2k9

PeterParker957 wrote: »

No, not misrepresenting. I'm not arguing that they get a free reservation, my point was SOME people get a FTP and don't need it, they then get to pay a few quid extra (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it) and then get a seat on a packed train.

CF Friday night - mother and two kids, got on the train at 5.23pm, 2 minutes before the off. Standing room only. No names on train for booking. I and two other commuters were made to move. She then tried to get a fourth to move "as we need the space to stretch out".

She got short shrift there!!

How is that right ?????

Edit - I should point out that I left that train after standing for an hour crying with pain. I'd never describe myself as disabled but I have a condition that is painful and doesn't allow me to stand for a long period of time.

I would have requested to see her tickets to prove she was in the correct coach.

joeysoap

PeterParker957 wrote: »

No, not misrepresenting. I'm not arguing that they get a free reservation, my point was SOME people get a FTP and don't need it, they then get to pay a few quid extra (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it) and then get a seat on a packed train.

CF Friday night - mother and two kids, got on the train at 5.23pm, 2 minutes before the off. Standing room only. No names on train for booking. I and two other commuters were made to move. She then tried to get a fourth to move "as we need the space to stretch out".

She got short shrift there!!

How is that right ?????

Edit - I should point out that I left that train after standing for an hour crying

with pain. I'd never describe myself as disabled but I have a condition that is painful and doesn't allow me to stand for a long period of time.

I’m not entirely clear on this - had she prebooked 3 seats? Can everyone clearly see the seats are pre booked? Who polices the seating policy?



Many of current generation of pensioners paid tax at 58% on very modest income, , most didn’t get a chance of university, certainly weren’t able to avail of tax saver travel, so I wouldn’t exactly say (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it)

Saying that there’s no way you should be pain after a days work, especially if it was due to having to stand for an hour on your home journey. That’s really not on. Is there any way you could get all/some annual tax saver travelers to lobby IE with a view to buying a seat at say €1 per trip and if you dont need it you don’t book it? Maybe on a week by week basis. Ie €10 a week max , €5 min if you book the seat for one way only.

PeterParker957

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

I would have requested to see her tickets to prove she was in the correct coach.

She refused to show them, to be honest at half five on a Friday everyone was looking at us like we were the bad guys.

Incidentally, as I got off I noticed the names were finally displayed and two of the four seats were booked, both males and both different names. So yes, she lied/blagged/was mistaken.

@Emme - I'm probably going to need a cane/stick at some point but I'm trying to hold off that at the moment!

Oh and to the other poster ? No, no chip - just advanced osteoarthritis with "idiopathic muscle weakness" (basically till the MRI it could be anything).

PeterParker957

joeysoap wrote: »

I’m not entirely clear on this - had she prebooked 3 seats? Can everyone clearly see the seats are pre booked? Who polices the seating policy?



Many of current generation of pensioners paid tax at 58% on very modest income, , most didn’t get a chance of university, certainly weren’t able to avail of tax saver travel, so I wouldn’t exactly say (out of money we give them, so we're paying for it)

Saying that there’s no way you should be pain after a days work, especially if it was due to having to stand for an hour on your home journey. That’s really not on. Is there any way you could get all/some annual tax saver travelers to lobby IE with a view to buying a seat at say €1 per trip and if you dont need it you don’t book it? Maybe on a week by week basis. Ie €10 a week max , €5 min if you book the seat for one way only.

I'd NEVER say pensioners - they deserve absolutely everything going and I doubt anyone would disagree with me on that.