Is someone within their rights to move you out of a prebooked seat?

CIARAN_BOYLE

namloc1980 wrote: »

Get the train to Dublin from Cork a bit. Every single journey I see people get on and they get to a seat and stare at the reserved seating sign which clearly doesn't have their name on it. Usually comment to their fellow traveller, "shur let's sit here, they mightn't show up" or something to that effect. Then when the person with the booked seat shows up, you get tutting and dramatics from the people in the seat. Every time!

Well people who reserve seats can book a flexible ticket that lets them get any train that day. People often don't show up for their booked seats.

dowlingm

On VIA Rail Canada they have seating reservations but there is no seat display.
http://www.viarail.ca/en/travel-information/board-services/seat-assignment

That's because it's on your ticket and the train has staff members on it to manage. Phil Verster looking down at that from his Metrolinx office must marvel at the expenditure on headcount (often two staff in just in the Business coach because of at-seat meals for example).

How do they know if there is someone getting off at an intermediate halt? A very high tech piece of sticky paper on the overhead bag shelf.

The difference is though that VIA does not have a primary commuter service role so they ban standing and they insist that people buying multi-journey tickets book a seat for each journey.
http://www.viarail.ca/en/fares-and-packages/rail-passes/commuter-passes

For IE to do that would basically involve Dublin Commuter and DART being hived off to a Dublin area transport agency.

Skedaddle

Also, I'm unaware of any other railway company that would put commuter trains on long-distance intercity services of the distances to Sligo or Rosslare.

I mean, with Irish Rail, you wouldn't be too surprised to find the Cork MK4 or the Belfast-Enterprise operating DART services because they took some notion.

trellheim

Is that not an improvement on having no train altogether ?

Losty Dublin

Skedaddle wrote: »

Also, I'm unaware of any other railway company that would put commuter trains on long-distance intercity services of the distances to Sligo or Rosslare.

I mean, with Irish Rail, you wouldn't be too surprised to find the Cork MK4 or the Belfast-Enterprise operating DART services because they took some notion.

Happens in the U.K. Many of the trains that are meeting ferries in Wales are the equivalent of 2600/2800 class railcars.

andekwarhola

Just get out of the fcuking seat instead of waffling about your 'rights' (translation: cherry-picked rights that suit my needs at any given time).

Spanish Eyes

Are there ever any IR staff on trains to supervise and/or mediate in cases like this (booked seats occupied and the occupier refuses to move)?

That is all that is required. Unfortunately without an IR staff member it is open season and often the threat of violence or stubborness can be very intimidating.

I have to say that I haven't travelled by train for a while, but when I did with booked seats there was never anyone from IR around to sort things out. Hopefully that has changed now.

Marcusm

Skedaddle wrote: »

Also, I'm unaware of any other railway company that would put commuter trains on long-distance intercity services of the distances to Sligo or Rosslare.

I mean, with Irish Rail, you wouldn't be too surprised to find the Cork MK4 or the Belfast-Enterprise operating DART services because they took some notion.

168 Turbostars in the U.K. Would be the DMU workhorse on Marylebone to B'ham and be roughly equivalent.

Hilly Bill

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Are there ever any IR staff on trains to supervise and/or mediate in cases like this (booked seats occupied and the occupier refuses to move)?

That is all that is required. Unfortunately without an IR staff member it is open season and often the threat of violence or stubborness can be very intimidating.

I have to say that I haven't travelled by train for a while, but when I did with booked seats there was never anyone from IR around to sort things out. Hopefully that has changed now.

There will be soon but has the place gone that soft for us to need babysitters on trains.

Emme

PeterParker957 wrote: »

I've yet to have a satisfactory answer as to why someone who gets to travel for free gets a guaranteed seat and someone - me - who pays E4,050 for travel does not, unless prepared to pay even more.

Under no logic is that right.

I agree 100%. It's a hefty cut out of your salary and ideally you should be guarantee a seat for it but that is not the case. If you are paying large sums for an annual ticket you are more than likely doing it for work, not for fun. It is not fair that somebody can buy a ticket online for a day out and has the option of booking a seat for no extra cost. If you are commuting long distances every day on a train to and from work you are just as entitled to a seat as any able-bodied person. Obviously the physically incapacitated and pregnant women should get seats before anybody else.

If people book a seat on a train they should have the manners to get to it on time instead of forcing people to move around them when the train is full.

I don't agree with people being able to book seats on peak-time commuting trains (ie 17.35 and 18.35 Heuston to Waterford) because those trains are literally standing room only 5 minutes after the platform is called. Let people book seats on quieter off-peak trains if they want.

PeterParker957

Emme wrote: »

I agree 100%. It's a hefty cut out of your salary and ideally you should be guarantee a seat for it but that is not the case. If you are paying large sums for an annual ticket you are more than likely doing it for work, not for fun. It is not fair that somebody can buy a ticket online for a day out and has the option of booking a seat for no extra cost. If you are commuting long distances every day on a train to and from work you are just as entitled to a seat as any able-bodied person. Obviously the physically incapacitated and pregnant women should get seats before anybody else.

If people book a seat on a train they should have the manners to get to it on time instead of forcing people to move around them when the train is full.

I don't agree with people being able to book seats on peak-time commuting trains (ie 17.35 and 18.35 Heuston to Waterford) because those trains are literally standing room only 5 minutes after the platform is called. Let people book seats on quieter off-peak trains if they want.

Thank you for the common sense - finally from someone!!!

Hilly Bill

Emme wrote: »

I agree 100%. It's a hefty cut out of your salary and ideally you should be guarantee a seat for it but that is not the case. If you are paying large sums for an annual ticket you are more than likely doing it for work, not for fun. It is not fair that somebody can buy a ticket online for a day out and has the option of booking a seat for no extra cost. If you are commuting long distances every day on a train to and from work you are just as entitled to a seat as any able-bodied person. Obviously the physically incapacitated and pregnant women should get seats before anybody else.

If people book a seat on a train they should have the manners to get to it on time instead of forcing people to move around them when the train is full.

I don't agree with people being able to book seats on peak-time commuting trains (ie 17.35 and 18.35 Heuston to Waterford) because those trains are literally standing room only 5 minutes after the platform is called. Let people book seats on quieter off-peak trains if they want.

It's a hefty cut if it's taken out in one go but it's called taxsaver for a reason.

PeterParker957

Hilly Bill wrote: »

It's a hefty cut if it's taken out in one go but it's called taxsaver for a reason.

Yes, because we pay TAX. About time we got a small benefit from it.

Hilly Bill

PeterParker957 wrote: »

Yes, because we pay TAX. About time we got a small benefit from it.

Point being is that you already get a reduction in the fare but you want an allocated seat as if its a football season ticket.

Hilly Bill

PeterParker957 wrote: »

Yes, because we pay TAX. About time we got a small benefit from it.

So do the thousands of others that travel that's not on the taxsaver scheme, why should you be entitled to a seat before them?

PeterParker957

Hilly Bill wrote: »

So do the thousands of others that travel that's not on the taxsaver scheme, why should you be entitled to a seat before them?

Yeah right. The mouthy knackers heading to Limerick the other day that demanded that four people move two minutes before departure time - even when there were no names above the seats - they're taxpayers ???

You believe that and I've a unicorn you can rent.

PeterParker957

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Point being is that you already get a reduction in the fare but you want an allocated seat as if its a football season ticket.

"Reduction in the fare" - 4 grand a year just to get to work to pay these morons' benefits and you begrudge us that ?? F***s sake.

Emme

Hilly Bill wrote: »

So do the thousands of others that travel that's not on the taxsaver scheme, why should you be entitled to a seat before them?

I think that the majority of taxpaying train travellers are commuters. I agree that everyone pays some form of tax in the form of income tax (for those who are working), VAT and other stealth taxes. Wealthy pensioners also pay income tax.

It shouldn't be the case that anyone should be entitled to a seat before anyone else unless they are physically incapacitated or pregnant. However people who book online and reserve a seat at no extra cost seem to think they are entitled to a seat before anyone else and the crazy Irish Rail seat booking policy backs this up. If somebody pays €3K or more for a yearly ticket they shouldn't have to stand for twice daily long commutes. Even if they do benefit from Taxsaver a person paying €3K before taxsaver for a yearly ticket pays approximately €2,200 for their yearly ticket if they are on the lower tax rate. That is a hefty cut out of a low salary and the person will have to make sacrifices to pay it.

People should have to pay to book a seat. If they pay they will appreciate the seat and turn up on time for it. At the moment people book seats and often don't turn up to use them because they can do it for nothing and they don't value it.

The Moldy Gowl

PeterParker957 wrote: »

"Reduction in the fare" - 4 grand a year just to get to work to pay these morons' benefits and you begrudge us that ?? F***s sake.

I pay tax and I reserve seats. I'm not giving up my seat for you if you think you are entitled to it.

If you have such issues with the 4 Grand, get a car. Irish rail dont owe you anything

Hilly Bill

PeterParker957 wrote: »

"Reduction in the fare" - 4 grand a year just to get to work to pay these morons' benefits and you begrudge us that ?? F***s sake.

It's you that seems to begrudge anyone apart from you getting a seat. Just because the fare gets deducted out of your wages doesn't make you anymore important than anyone else on that train.

Hilly Bill

PeterParker957 wrote: »

Yeah right. The mouthy knackers heading to Limerick the other day that demanded that four people move two minutes before departure time - even when there were no names above the seats - they're taxpayers ???

You believe that and I've a unicorn you can rent.

It's not relevant if they pay tax or not.

Hilly Bill

Emme wrote: »

I think that the majority of taxpaying train travellers are commuters. I agree that everyone pays some form of tax in the form of income tax (for those who are working), VAT and other stealth taxes. Wealthy pensioners also pay income tax.

It shouldn't be the case that anyone should be entitled to a seat before anyone else unless they are physically incapacitated or pregnant. However people who book online and reserve a seat at no extra cost seem to think they are entitled to a seat before anyone else and the crazy Irish Rail seat booking policy backs this up. If somebody pays €3K or more for a yearly ticket they shouldn't have to stand for twice daily long commutes. Even if they do benefit from Taxsaver a person paying €3K before taxsaver for a yearly ticket pays approximately €2,200 for their yearly ticket if they are on the lower tax rate. That is a hefty cut out of a low salary and the person will have to make sacrifices to pay it.

People should have to pay to book a seat. If they pay they will appreciate the seat and turn up on time for it. At the moment people book seats and often don't turn up to use them because they can do it for nothing and they don't value it.

You are only entitled to a seat if you reserved one. The amount you pay for the year doesn't come into it.

Emme

Hilly Bill wrote: »

You are only entitled to a seat if you reserved one. The amount you pay for the year doesn't come into it.

I don't get value for what I pay. The trains are dirty and overcrowded. There is a problem if there is only standing room 5 minutes after the platform is called.

Irish Rail don't feel the need to improve their service because they can point to the train service Calcutta or the horrific train service in the UK and say "we're better than that so stop complaining and try not to take up too much space in the aisles because the food cart needs to be able to go up and down the train to sell tea and cakes!"

I wouldn't take the train if there were another option.

magicbastarder

Hilly Bill wrote: »

It's you that seems to begrudge anyone apart from you getting a seat. Just because the fare gets deducted out of your wages doesn't make you anymore important than anyone else on that train.

yeah, it's a bizarre argument to make. if i was paying each time for a one way ticket, could i boot a taxsaver user out of a seat on the basis that my journey has cost me more than theirs cost them?

Wheety

They should just do away with the allocated seat booking, they can't run it successfully. You should just book a train ticket online. That's it. It allows you access to the train. It's a nightmare as it is. Good luck to anyone booking a ticket that's not from originating station.

Hilly Bill

Emme wrote: »

I don't get value for what I pay. The trains are dirty and overcrowded. There is a problem if there is only standing room 5 minutes after the platform is called.

Irish Rail don't feel the need to improve their service because they can point to the train service Calcutta or the horrific train service in the UK and say "we're better than that so stop complaining and try not to take up too much space in the aisles because the food cart needs to be able to go up and down the train to sell tea and cakes!"

I wouldn't take the train if there were another option.

That's a different matter.

PeterParker957

Hilly Bill wrote: »

It's not relevant if they pay tax or not.

Yeah keep telling yourself that.

PeterParker957

magicbastarder wrote: »

yeah, it's a bizarre argument to make. if i was paying each time for a one way ticket, could i boot a taxsaver user out of a seat on the basis that my journey has cost me more than theirs cost them?

No.

listermint

Anytime i use the train i book a seat, Anytime someone was in the seat i asked them to move(which is always). One or two grumbles at being asked to move, but here look 'I literally couldnt give a Sh*** that you didnt bother your arse booking one ya cheap skate'

Simple as that, get out of my seat.

The Moldy Gowl

PeterParker957 wrote: »

Yeah keep telling yourself that.

Why is it relevant if people pay tax just to get the train?? What difference does it make, they still bought the ticket.