Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

Risteard81

asimp11 wrote: »

Don't bother with load management, just have your electrician do a Cert 2 and then the ESB will upgrade your supply to 80Amp 16Kva. You will need this anyway in a few years time to plug in your home assistant robot!

The ESB desperately need this extra/off peak business since we all switched to LED lighting.

Cert No. 2 is the industrial cert (well more accurately greater than or equal to 50kVA).

podge3

Finally made my way through all this thread! I've probably forgotten most of it now.

Anyhoo, I got my first EV recently and have applied for the grant so will be getting a RECI sparky to do the install. I've been looking around at the bits that are required so I know whats being installed.

I purchased a second hand charge point that has no load balancing (I have a power shower) so I'll need a priority panel/switch. What is the difference between these 2:

https://www.meteorelectrical.com/distribution-control/consumer-units/boards/distribution-control/consumer-units-accessories-1/garo-1-row-shower-priority-metal-board.html

https://www.meteorelectrical.com/distribution-control/consumer-units/boards/distribution-control/consumer-units-accessories-1/garo-priority-shower-board-choose-priority.html

One is specifically marked for use with an EV, probably more suitable.

Something else I'm unsure about is DC protection. My charge point doesn't have this, my understanding is that until recently most don't. In the UK, the 18th edition update to the regs (722.531.2.101) requires the use of either a Type B RCD (with built in dc capability/detection) or “RCD Type A and appropriate equipment that provides disconnection of the power supply in case of DC fault current above 6mA”.

I can't find any indication that this is a requirement in Ireland but with electricity, you can't be too careful. Type B RCDs are hugely expensive so the separate DC monitoring seems more cost effective.

The more expensive priority board above says its "fully 18th Edition compliant" but it looks to have a type A RCD so must have a separate DC monitoring module to make it compliant. Unfortunately, I can find no confirmation of this.

Risteard81

It has been a requirement for years that Type B RCD protection be used if 6mA DC leakage protection isn't present. Amendment 3 to the 4th Edition introduced the requirement and it remains in the 5th Edition.

The steel priority unit is to meet BS7671 requirements. Steel is not required under I.S. 10101. Really you should leave it to the REC to design the installation and supply necessary materials. Load management/balancing is far more sensible than a shower priority unit where possible with the EVSE.

podge3

Risteard81 wrote: »

It has been a requirement for years that Type B RCD protection be used if 6mA DC leakage protection isn't present. Amendment 3 to the 4th Edition introduced the requirement and it remains in the 5th Edition.

The steel priority unit is to meet BS7671 requirements. Steel is not required under I.S. 10101. Really you should leave it to the REC to design the installation and supply necessary materials. Load management/balancing is far more sensible than a shower priority unit where possible with the EVSE.

Thanks for the info.

The sparks is doing the job and buying the bits, I'm just trying to educate myself a little. I agree that load balancing is better than a priority switch but my charge point doesn't have load balancing.

asimp11

Use a REC with some EV knowledge. It's very hard to give an assessment without on site survey. For load balancing you will need a separate energy monitor that communicates with your charger (RS485). At present
I have not seen an ESB smart meter with this compatibility. Load balancing should only really be necessary if you have more than one EV charger. My approach is to upgrade the mains from the typical 63 amp setup. With 25mm meter tails, earth electrode spike, 16mm Earth bonding and a full Cert you can request a smart meter and install a separate CU in your meter cabinet that meets I.S 10101. This way your existing fuseboard (63amp) is not getting overloaded. There is a lot more to this but if you start at the safety precautions then design the load implications to suit your existing system. After all you are connecting a 50KW+ power source into your home electrics.

asimp11

Basics. How your charger works.
So you have bought a 32Amp home charger. What's inside the box?
There are three large terminal in which to terminate your supply cable. This is usually minimum 6.0mm T&E cable, it may need to be bigger or SWA cable depending on cable run from your CU or meter box. You may also need to use a type B 40 RCBO if this is not built into your charger. Inside the box there is a circuit board with a large contactor/relay switch. This connects the supply to your cars inverter when charging. Looking at your cars charger plug these are the three large round pins in the plug, there are also two smaller pins in this plug that connect to the Chargers PCB board these are basically a sensing circuit that control the switching of the contactor. This operates in two ways, it has a high and low resistor to tell the car and charger when a connection is made. It also can send a sine wave signal to the car telling it how much power to take. You may also have some small Dip switches inside the charger to setup the following control. 1) select current output, Eg 7.2KW, 6KW, 4KW ... this might help for load balancing. 2) Enable data connection to dynamic load balancing monitor (RS485). This will vary the supply current dependant on other loads on your system. 3) Enable communication to other chargers on your system, these may be Daisey chained in a communal system. 4) You maybe able to enable smart features such as off peak control and network smart control.

So your charger is basically just a clever switch with some additional safety features that I won't bother you with.

liamog

asimp11 wrote: »

My approach is to upgrade the mains from the typical 63 amp setup.

It's almost always overkill for somebody to upgrade their supply to handle an EV charge point. We've handled two cars charging for around three years with a 32A charge point and a priority switch. I'd prefer to have a load sensing system instead but the priority switch has been fine.

podge3

Thanks for all the replies.

While both charger and car are only 3.3 kw, I want the install to be capable of 6.6kw in the future if/when I change the car. It should be a simple swap out for a new charger.

While I have an electric shower, I don't think I need a priority switch with a 3.3Kw charger but I'm getting one anyway. 6mm SWA is being used.

Even @ 6.6Kw, I doubt if the priority switch will ever be used as I intend to charge at night.

Having read through all this thread, I think its shocking at how much the cost of a charge point has increased. I'm hoping to come in around the €600 mark for my install but it'll be a very basic charge point - its all I need as my Leaf has charge timers etc.

Dav010

Hi all.

Sorry if this is a recurring theme.

About to take delivery of first PHEV in April. I’ve applied for grant, one of listed electricians on SEAI site installed electric gates for me a couple of years ago, did a very good job so I’ll get him to install EV charging box.

Looking through reviews and reading some (not all) of this thread, I’ve settled on the Wallbox Pulsar plus. For those of you that know about chargers, is this a good choice? The reasons I selected it are, reasonable price, small and neat it fits into a space beside ESB box at side of house, it’s smart, has a 5m cable which suits where I park.

The downsides that I’ve read are, crap customer service, occasional software update issues, no digital screen on box, there are less expensive options.

All opinions greatly appreciated.

Risteard81

Dav010 wrote: »

Hi all.

Sorry if this is a recurring theme.

About to take delivery of first PHEV in April. I’ve applied for grant, one of listed electricians on SEAI site installed electric gates for me a couple of years ago, did a very good job so I’ll get him to install EV charging box.

Looking through reviews and reading some (not all) of this thread, I’ve settled on the Wallbox Pulsar plus. For those of you that know about chargers, is this a good choice? The reasons I selected it are, reasonable price, small and neat it fits into a space beside ESB box at side of house, it’s smart, has a 5m cable which suits where I park.

The downsides that I’ve read are, crap customer service, occasional software update issues, no digital screen on box, there are less expensive options.

All opinions greatly appreciated.

SEAI don't have a list for EVSE installers - you need to go to the RECI list for that.

Wallbox Pulsar Plus is a good unit. Easy to sync to the app and you can control charging from this. Unit is hand-sized. Comes as tethered only.

Dav010

Risteard81 wrote: »

SEAI don't have a list for EVSE installers - you need to go to the RECI list for that.

Wallbox Pulsar Plus is a good unit. Easy to sync to the app and you can control charging from this. Unit is hand-sized. Comes as tethered only.

Sorry, in the FAQ on the SEAI site (https://www.seai.ie/grants/electric-vehicle-grants/electric-vehicle-home-charger-grant/ ) under “Where can I find a list of certified installers”, there is a link to this.

https://safeelectric.ie/find-an-electrician/

Risteard81

Dav010 wrote: »

Sorry, in the FAQ on the SEAI site (https://www.seai.ie/grants/electric-vehicle-grants/electric-vehicle-home-charger-grant/ ) under “Where can I find a list of certified installers”, there is a link to this.

https://safeelectric.ie/find-an-electrician/

Indeed. That is the RECI register (other than those who have requested not to appear on the online search).

Dav010

Risteard81 wrote: »

Indeed. That is the RECI register (other than those who have requested not to appear on the online search).

Good to know.

Smee_Again

I’ve a zappi charger that trips occasionally in the middle of the night, is there any way for me to safely troubleshoot any potential issues?

It’s not the dishwasher/dryer etc as these aren’t tuning at the same time.

xl500

Hi

Can anyone point me towards a source for a replacement

ABL Sursum EVCC I just want to get the EVCC Controller to replace one in a faulty unit

One like this seems to be almost impossible to get

https://www.orbit-surplus.com/product/used-abl-sursum-evcc-iec-61851-1/

Thanks
XL500

Calahonda52

I have a ABL down stairs, 4 years old, not sure which version, it was never used as the house failed the reci test so never energised.
will try post a pic at lunchtime or tonight

KCross

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I have a ABL down stairs, 4 years old, not sure which version, it was never used as the house failed the reci test so never energised.

What was the nature of the fail?
If you limited the unit to 16A would it have helped?

Presumably you have had to make do with granny cable which is not a great idea long term.

xl500

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I have a ABL down stairs, 4 years old, not sure which version, it was never used as the house failed the reci test so never energised.
will try post a pic at lunchtime or tonight

Are you selling it

xl500

KCross wrote: »

What was the nature of the fail?
If you limited the unit to 16A would it have helped?

Presumably you have had to make do with granny cable which is not a great idea long term.

No Limiting it to 16A would have made no difference it was not a high current component failure the EVSE Controller itself has failed no output to the Contactor coil

whodeeny

I'm between the Electric Ireland EO Mini Pro (€1099) and the Zappi + Hub which I've been quoted €1400 for.

Leaning towards the EO Mini Pro. I only have 3 PV panels which generate about 0.5kW on a good, sunny day, so all the fancy extras for solar power management on the Zappi will probably be wasted on me.

Only thing I'm wary of is that Electric Ireland apparently are installing the Mini Pro Gen 1 with the Juicenet app (even though they advertise the Mini Pro 2 on their website). I've heard this app is pretty unreliable.

Does anyone here have any feedback on it?

I had to electricians out to survey the house, both were extremely keen on the Zappi over anything else but didn't have really strong reasons why you'd spend an extra €300 on it versus the EO Mini Pro. One vaguely mentioned quality and reliability being really good on the Zappi.

WayneEnterprise

whodeeny wrote: »

I'm between the Electric Ireland EO Mini Pro (€1099) and the Zappi + Hub which I've been quoted €1400 for.

Leaning towards the EO Mini Pro. I only have 3 PV panels which generate about 0.5kW on a good, sunny day, so all the fancy extras for solar power management on the Zappi will probably be wasted on me.

Only thing I'm wary of is that Electric Ireland apparently are installing the Mini Pro Gen 1 with the Juicenet app (even though they advertise the Mini Pro 2 on their website). I've heard this app is pretty unreliable.

Does anyone here have any feedback on it?

I had to electricians out to survey the house, both were extremely keen on the Zappi over anything else but didn't have really strong reasons why you'd spend an extra €300 on it versus the EO Mini Pro. One vaguely mentioned quality and reliability being really good on the Zappi.

I heard the v1 Pro app was awful - EO outsourced the app to a third party for the v1 whereas they built the v2 app in house. I went with the Pro v2 connected to solar. It’s been perfect so far but only using it since start of March, but it does have a 3 year warranty. Personally I wouldn’t go with the Zappi as it was big and ugly, whereas the Pro v2 is tiny and also connects to solar, so no brainer for me.

Gumbo

KCross wrote: »

What was the nature of the fail?
If you limited the unit to 16A would it have helped?

Presumably you have had to make do with granny cable which is not a great idea long term.

From memory Cala had issue around earthing or earth rod or some wiring upgrade that was very cost prohibitive and intrusive.

whodeeny

WayneEnterprise wrote: »

I heard the v1 Pro app was awful - EO outsourced the app to a third party for the v1 whereas they built the v2 app in house. I went with the Pro v2 connected to solar. It’s been perfect so far but only using it since start of March, but it does have a 3 year warranty. Personally I wouldn’t go with the Zappi as it was big and ugly, whereas the Pro v2 is tiny and also connects to solar, so no brainer for me.

I've a quote for the mini pro 2 coming in around the same as the Zappi (1400 pre-grant). I agree I actually prefer the minimalism of the mini pro over the Zappi. Do you get much use out of the solar functionality?

How much did yours cost installed if you don't mind sharing?

WayneEnterprise

whodeeny wrote: »

I've a quote for the mini pro 2 coming in around the same as the Zappi (1400 pre-grant). I agree I actually prefer the minimalism of the mini pro over the Zappi. Do you get much use out of the solar functionality?

How much did yours cost installed if you don't mind sharing?

€1800 but mine involved lifting the path outside my house and mounting it on a pole cemented into the ground.

Summer8181

Anyone have vw connect charger? What are the pros and cons?

KELTICKNIGHTT

Dav010 wrote: »

Sorry, in the FAQ on the SEAI site (https://www.seai.ie/grants/electric-vehicle-grants/electric-vehicle-home-charger-grant/ ) under “Where can I find a list of certified installers”, there is a link to this.

https://safeelectric.ie/find-an-electrician/

Looking for ev charger in North cork direction
Anyone have electrician who they used to install ev box that recommend.
Seems better to get electrician who already installed ev box. As talked to local electrician who never installed ev box and didn't seem to keen on installing

whodeeny

I'm looking at getting something installed in the Cork area. ePower and Southern Solar are two suppliers who have been responsive so far.

mark23

Hi all,


I have talked to a few companies and all seem to install charger from fuse board. Is it possible to install from meter box instead to avoid cabling? How thick is the cabling from the fuseboard to the charge point anyway?



Mark

Gumbo

mark23 wrote: »

Hi all,


I have talked to a few companies and all seem to install charger from fuse board. Is it possible to install from meter box instead to avoid cabling? How thick is the cabling from the fuseboard to the charge point anyway?



Mark

Yes. It’s only a new regulation since last week that you can come from the meter cabinet. When did you ask the electricians? It may not have been in force at that time.

There are people that done the CU route one day and literally the next day the regulation was allowed.

Size of cable will be designed by your REC.

mark23

Gumbo wrote: »

Yes. It’s only a new regulation since last week that you can come from the meter cabinet. When did you ask the electricians? It may not have been in force at that time.

There are people that done the CU route one day and literally the next day the regulation was allowed.

Size of cable will be designed by your REC.

Today, I asked a company https://carcharger.ie/ and esb but I wasn't talking to the engineers. Do you have a reference for that regulation that I can quote?


What is REC?


Thanks for your reply.