Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

tac foley

My old Boer War Mauser carbine certainly got used, against the Brits in Sarth Efrica, but its owner came a cropper when they took on the Australians on May 10th, 1901.

Grizzly 45

Just browsing an article in the Limerick Post about the gang warfare in Limerick,an little paragraph caught my attention about the State Solicitor Micheal Murray "Having recived basic firearms training in the Garda firearms range in Templemore,the 72 year old decided,"that is carrying a gun for my own protection,I'd be making things more dangerous"...[True enough,if you dont know if you can pull the trigger in the most gravest of extremes,and cant put in the required trigger time either.]

www.limerickpost.ie/digital/2019/2019-05-04/html5/

So if this IS the case,then there must be some sort of policy or protocol,or decision making process out there with AGS to authorise concealed carry to persons at risk,but obviously only to people who are MUCH more important than the likes of us peasents.

And a further gear grinder for me is Mr Murray featured quite abit in the restricted firearms court cases here in Limerick back then.Whichthey lost.But the hyprocrisy is sickening of this state.:mad::mad: "It's Ok to train up one of our own to a basic level and give him a deadly weapon,but those who want to shoot bits of paper and steel are an utter danger to the state's public order and saftey."

Grizzly 45

Strange that an animal rights fanatic can get to meet the NPWS RE the phoenix park deer culls,and responsible deer hunting organisations cant ??? I'd put Broxton in the Greta Thunberg line of expertise on deer culling as the miserable Swedish one is on climate change .Are we letting teenagers and zealots decide policies these days??


https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/office-public-works-consider-alternative-16214288?utm_sAYOjtrAwfR3g1aHZvCFEs5kvYo

yubabill

Putting this here for future reference.

Article by Tom Clonan the other day on Drogheda gun feud quoting a research paper which concludes there is no link between gun ownership and firearm homicide.

Duhhhh.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281282103_Firearms_and_Violent_Deaths_in_Europe_An_Exploratory_Analysis_of_the_Linkages_Between_Gun_Ownership_Firearms_Legislation_and_Violent_Death

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-ireland-is-the-homicide-by-firearm-capital-of-the-eu-so-why-is-our-government-so-complacent-4615315-May2019/

deezell

yubabill wrote: »

Putting this here for future reference.

Article by Tom Clonan the other day on Drogheda gun feud quoting a research paper which concludes there is no link between gun ownership and firearm homicide.

Duhhhh.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281282103_Firearms_and_Violent_Deaths_in_Europe_An_Exploratory_Analysis_of_the_Linkages_Between_Gun_Ownership_Firearms_Legislation_and_Violent_Death

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-ireland-is-the-homicide-by-firearm-capital-of-the-eu-so-why-is-our-government-so-complacent-4615315-May2019/

That's true. Gun killers don't "own' their guns. They just borrow them.

tac foley

Here on mainland UK, it is said that a handgun without ammunition can be hired to 'do a job' ie, intimidation, for a hundred pounds, but one that has ammunition will 'cost' five hundred pounds and 'don't bring it back'.

So 'tis said............

Grizzly 45

Flemish peace institute, not known for their pro-gun ownership or anything to do with them stance.But the kernel point of their argument holds true.
Typical Clonan article...The poor army hasn't got enough of this that and the other, it's all the govts fault etc. While you are at it Tom, have a look at maybe our most restrictive gun laws in the entire EU,[Greece not the UK is actually on par with us for restrictions.] and maybe argue for once, and redeem yourself for that hatchet job you did on us in 2006. That strict gun laws only hurt the law abiding and not the criminals here?

Nekarsulm

yubabill wrote: »

Putting this here for future reference.

Article by Tom Clonan the other day on Drogheda gun feud quoting a research paper which concludes there is no link between gun ownership and firearm homicide.

Duhhhh.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281282103_Firearms_and_Violent_Deaths_in_Europe_An_Exploratory_Analysis_of_the_Linkages_Between_Gun_Ownership_Firearms_Legislation_and_Violent_Death

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-ireland-is-the-homicide-by-firearm-capital-of-the-eu-so-why-is-our-government-so-complacent-4615315-May2019/

I wonder what these "automatic handguns" the gangsters have are?
Fired at "point blank range" while on "rapid fire"?

When will a journalist bother their arše to learn even basic facts about firearms?

tac foley

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I wonder what these "automatic handguns" the gangsters have are?
Fired at "point blank range" while on "rapid fire"?

When will a journalist bother their arše to learn even basic facts about firearms?

Never going to happen, Sir. The level of ignorance of the reporting press is equalled only by that of our fine 'boys in blue'.

On both sides of the Irish Sea.

Grizzly 45

Scary thing is Clonan should know the basics of firearms terminology as he was a comissioned officer in the Irish army...Or maybe officers arent required to know this anymore?Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

tac foley

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Scary thing is Clonan should know the basics of firearms terminology as he was a comissioned officer in the Irish army...Or maybe officers arent required to know this anymore?Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

It is difficult to imagine the level of ignorance of things that have been a major part and parcel of the human condition since the middle end of the 14th C.

However, I look carefully for mistakes in reporting, and in all my years I have never been disappointed. I've just s**t-canned a book sent to me for contextual proof-reading, in which an otherwise superb story is ruined, for me, at least, by the invention of a totally fictitious brand of present-day English handgun makers that is the basis of a lot of the story.

When will authors realise that it is not necessary to invent a name of a gun? Or to invent a new calibre? Or to do the impossible, as in the case of the story, in which a British-made copy of the Colt SAA of 1873 is not only sold as new to the armed forces, but carried in action in WW1. AND fitted with a moderator - in the book, a 'silencer'?

Nekarsulm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Scary thing is Clonan should know the basics of firearms terminology as he was a comissioned officer in the Irish army...Or maybe officers arent required to know this anymore?Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

BattleCorp

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

One of my mates is in the army. Apparently they only have to go to the range twice a year. Well, that's according to him anyway.

On the article by Cloonan, you'd think at least he'd have some idea of what 'point blank' means.

Nekarsulm

BattleCorp wrote: »

One of my mates is in the army. Apparently they only have to go to the range twice a year. Well, that's according to him anyway.

On the article by Cloonan, you'd think at least he'd have some idea of what 'point blank' means.

I'd well believe it.
He also informed me that the inventor of the AUG was captured by the Germans when they invaded Czechoslovakia in WW2, and when they discovered the AUG prototype they demanded to know what government he was working with ( as it was so advanced)
When he denied all their claims, they shot him as a spy.

.Makes you wonder about what the hell soldiers are actually instructed about....
And we'll not talk about Army Intelligence ......

Cass

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

Ah yes, retired Lieutenant General Mark Hertling

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYjjWPvL9j0

I find it incredulous that he says:

"I've seen men hit with this weapon, and it tears the insides out"

Maybe i'm wrong, but if his men were throwing their guns at people their training needs some touch up because it's not the weapon that hits you, it's the bullets.

You know the same ones that go into this:



Goes into this:

Grizzly 45

I belive the US armed forces have an acrynom for this ...REMF/ Rear Echelon Mother F33ker.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Hertling
Seems to have the same role as Clonan with RTE,except his gig is with CNN.

Grizzly 45

tac foley wrote: »

I've just s**t-canned a book sent to me for contextual proof-reading, in which an otherwise superb story is ruined, for me, at least, by the invention of a totally fictitious brand of present-day English handgun makers that is the basis of a lot of the story.

When will authors realise that it is not necessary to invent a name of a gun? Or to invent a new calibre? Or to do the impossible, as in the case of the story, in which a British-made copy of the Colt SAA of 1873 is not only sold as new to the armed forces, but carried in action in WW1. AND fitted with a moderator - in the book, a 'silencer'?

Alternative history fiction ala Harry Turtledove??Agree,crap gun handling and descriptions are an utter crasher in good stories.Am reading at the moment a UK author [Frank Tayell,surviving the outbreak on amazon kindle for those who like this sort of stuff]who does zombie apocalypse stories,and its intresting as some is partly set in Ireland.Anyhoo, what is peeing me off is he has most of his people equipped with UK SA 80s Mk1 with silencers!! Short of throwing rocks at hordes of the zombie undead,I couldnt think of a worse gun to face the zombie apocalypse with.:eek:

tac foley

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Alternative history fiction ala Harry Turtledove??Agree,crap gun handling and descriptions are an utter crasher in good stories.Am reading at the moment a UK author [Frank Tayell,surviving the outbreak on amazon kindle for those who like this sort of stuff]who does zombie apocalypse stories,and its intresting as some is partly set in Ireland.Anyhoo, what is peeing me off is he has most of his people equipped with UK SA 80s Mk1 with silencers!! Short of throwing rocks at hordes of the zombie undead,I couldnt think of a worse gun to face the zombie apocalypse with.:eek:

I'd be all for giving the A1 to the Zombies - they'd go wrong so fast they'd be virtually unarmed after the first stoppage.

yubabill

yubabill wrote: »

Putting this here for future reference.

Article by Tom Clonan the other day on Drogheda gun feud quoting a research paper which concludes there is no link between gun ownership and firearm homicide.

Duhhhh.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281282103_Firearms_and_Violent_Deaths_in_Europe_An_Exploratory_Analysis_of_the_Linkages_Between_Gun_Ownership_Firearms_Legislation_and_Violent_Death

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-ireland-is-the-homicide-by-firearm-capital-of-the-eu-so-why-is-our-government-so-complacent-4615315-May2019/

Isn't it interesting, 10 years after new firearms legislation whose introduction was justified by gun violence here, that Tom Clonan's article and others are still complaining about said gun violence, which seems to have increased?

Someone should ask the politicians and AGS who promoted the legislation so vigorously why they targeted licensed firearms owners? The legislation seems to have had less than zero effect.

Further - and I'm putting this all up here for future reference - the Flemish Peace article, which establishes no link between legal gun ownership and homicide, was well-buried at the time of the last attempted gun ban in 2015 - said article mentions a link between gun ownership and suicide: first, it appears many suicides are done with shotguns and second, having studied Australian suicide methods before and after their 1996 gun ban, it can be said that the ban did not affect the number of suicides since, just the methodology

https://www.aihw.gov.au/getmedia/8d8a8344-59b4-43a7-8bd9-f4827a6105bb/injcat-121-10754.pdf.aspx?inline=true

The relevant data is on page 8 above.

Another link between gun ownership and domestic homicides was established in the Flemish peace article, which I do not question, but it is likely that shotguns predominate in this relationship, also.

I am not trying to justify any of the crimes and atrocities mentioned above, but I am definitely condemning wilful misdirection of blame by legislators, lobbyists and enforcement agencies.

tac foley

In any rural society, which Ireland, for the most part, still is, the shotgun is an everyday part of life, and can often be the means of leaving it when the need is felt.

The point about legislation having 100% lack of effect on gun crime is plainly obvious to anybody with the ears to listen and the eyes to read. also plainly obvious, to the point of exhaustion, is reminding the PTB that the criminal will never obey a gun law.

Grizzly 45

Even scarier is that politicians ACCEPT the fact that gun laws will not stop criminals,and have admitted to such,as did that cripple from Louth who inflicted this on us and as did the toe fetishist in the UK with the handgun ban. Gun control is never about controlling crime or criminals it is about as a government, controlling the people under you.:mad:

Grizzly 45

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I'd well believe it.
He also informed me that the inventor of the AUG was captured by the Germans when they invaded Czechoslovakia in WW2, and when they discovered the AUG prototype they demanded to know what government he was working with ( as it was so advanced)
When he denied all their claims, they shot him as a spy.

.Makes you wonder about what the hell soldiers are actually instructed about....
And we'll not talk about Army Intelligence ......

Army Intelligence ....There's an oxymoron if there ever was one!

BattleCorp

yubabill wrote: »

Someone should ask the politicians and AGS who promoted the legislation so vigorously why they targeted licensed firearms owners? The legislation seems to have had less than zero effect.

.

Well seeing as the legislation had zero effect, obviously they need new legislation to target us law abiding gun owners even harder to teach those pesky criminals a lesson. :mad::mad::mad:

tac foley

Gun control is all about control.

As a group of people, NOBODY has to put up with so much red tape and intervention into our lives as we do here in the British Isles. Except, of course, those places where private ownership of firearms is prohibited or made so expensive as to make it out of reach for the ordinary citizen.

tac foley

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Army Intelligence ....There's an oxymoron if there ever was one!

Be careful there, Mr G. You are sailing too close to my particular wind.....:cool:

Grizzly 45

Blame the late Robin Williams for that one...It's a line from Good morning Vietnam.:P

Grizzly 45

Hard to belive that one person in the most gun controlled state in the USA,had more handguns in his possesion than we do in the entire 26 counties.:eek::(

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-48221967/more-than-1000-guns-seized-from-los-angeles-home?fbclid=IwAR1u2pyk-rnODZuVDYS2csPL3XB7XYMoNkKjH7K79dqVmXYfrkNUNSQAc9Q

Gorgeousgeorge

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Hard to belive that one person in the most gun controlled state in the USA,had more handguns in his possesion than we do in the entire 26 counties.:eek::(

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-48221967/more-than-1000-guns-seized-from-los-angeles-home?fbclid=IwAR1u2pyk-rnODZuVDYS2csPL3XB7XYMoNkKjH7K79dqVmXYfrkNUNSQAc9Q

Noting looks manufactured? Maybe was just kitting them out.

One hell of a collection though

GolfVI

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

From my experience in the army there was definitely lads who simply had no interest in the gun aspect of it. Definitely not the history of the firearms anyway. They did their range practices every year and after that they were happy to never fire it again

Then for those of us like myself who were interested, the over exposure and daily use removed somewhat of the “awe” factor. After a year or two it simply became a work tool , no different than a spanner to a mechanic.

I guess its sometimes hard for civvie shooters to understand because they look at military firearms in wonder. I know i did anyway

After you fire a 105mm L118 howitzer for years theres very little out there that’ll make you go wowðŸ˜

Grizzly 45

GolfVI wrote: »

After you fire a 105mm L118 howitzer for years theres very little out there that’ll make you go wowðŸ˜

A 155mm M777 perhaps?:)