All Ireland SHC Final (formerly SHC thread) - READ MOD NOTE POST #1

I said

I think tipp might have preferred a crack at cork rather than galway at this stage.
Will the blaa eaters get de burcas red suspended on appeal hopefully they will it will make it a better spectacle.

big_drive

I'm going on a Cork-Galway final

TheQuietFella

A fixed draw if you ask me! The GAA are gagging for a Tipp' vs Cork All Ireland!

BonnieSituation

TheQuietFella wrote: »

A fixed draw if you ask me! The GAA are gagging for a Tipp' vs Cork All Ireland!

They're going to be fierce disappointed.

PTH2009

TheQuietFella wrote: »

A fixed draw if you ask me! The GAA are gagging for a Tipp' vs Cork All Ireland!

The owl canisters must have had little marks on them

Tombo2001

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Biggest attendances at games this year in a long time

can thank Wexford for that. 60000 people at the Leinster final.

sally cinnamon89

davidx40 wrote: »

What a crap game today , something has to be done about this sweeper **** , its a wonder crowds are dropping away going to games , if this kind of hurling continues the game is in serious trouble ....bore fest after bore fest

Hardly a bore fest. Waterford just the better team.

TheQuietFella

BonnieSituation wrote: »

They're going to be fierce disappointed.

I hope so too!

TheQuietFella

PTH2009 wrote: »

The owl canisters must have had little marks on them

Heat them prior to the draw!

namloc1980

TheQuietFella wrote: »

A fixed draw if you ask me! The GAA are gagging for a Tipp' vs Cork All Ireland!

How was it fixed. There was a 50/50 chance that Tipp would have been drawn against Galway or Cork. Hardly a "fix".

FastFullBack

redlead wrote: »

That will have a big impact on attendances. It's a serious ordeal to get down to cork through all the traffic and then an even bigger ordeal to find parking before you have to walk a half marathon to the ground. All I was thinking about for half the game was how I was going to get out of the place. It's a lovely ground but it's in am awful location in a city that just can't absorb that level of traffic.

This 'half a marathon walk' talk is a load of BS. When Cork travel to Thurles, loads of people park by the Golf Course on the way into Thurles. That is at least a 30 min walk to the stadium. I'd bet whatever walk you had yesterday probably was less!

KevIRL wrote: »

Traffic getting into and out of cork was absolutely no bother yesterday.

Spot on. Traffic was very easy yesterday. We drove into town at 2 PM and came via City link and we got right into Centre Park road without any real traffic.

After the game we waited 20 mins and from the car park in the Marquee, we drove out via Blackrock Castle and we were on the southlink in 5 mins, zero traffic. We went west but even east where all the traffic was looked quiet, didnt look like any tunnel backup.

megapixel

Will any tickets get released on ticketmaster for the semi-finals?

FastFullBack

megapixel wrote: »

Will any tickets get released on ticketmaster for the semi-finals?

They should be released this morning. I think they were taken down until the draw was made.

Tombo2001

JRant wrote: »

The game is in bigger danger from the gombeens in HQ than anything else. Not a single thought was given to the fans this weekend. Today's game would have been a near sell out in Nowlan. Why in the name of jaysus was it all the way down in PUC. Same nonsense yesterday, should have been played in Limerick but oh no PUC has to have its gmbig weekend out and to hell with the fans.

I think a lot of the discussion around sweeper systems, where the matches are played and so on are kind of missing the point.

The GAA at its core is not about the county scene, its about the club scene. And the clubs are absolutely thriving at the moment - all over the country. Huge investment has gone in, club facilities generally speaking are very good and as a result the GAA club is the go to place for young families that want their kids to be involved in sport. For as long as that the case, then GAA games will be a thing that families do together and big crowds will be showing up to games - whether its sweeper or not, or whether its in Pairc Ui Chaoimh or Limerick or Nowlan Park.

A lot of the legendary games of GAA - like Galway winning in 1980, or Offaly in 1982 - the finals didn't play to a stadium at full capacity.

Pablo Escobar

redlead wrote: »

JRant wrote: »

Unfortunately I'd say you're spot on. They have a big bill to pay and to hell with the fans.

That will have a big impact on attendances. It's a serious ordeal to get down to cork through all the traffic and then an even bigger ordeal to find parking before you have to walk a half marathon to the ground. All I was thinking about for half the game was how I was going to get out of the place. It's a lovely ground but it's in am awful location in a city that just can't absorb that level of traffic.

Over 100,000 cars use the Jack Lynch Tunnel alone every day and you say that the entire city of Cork can't absorb match traffic?

Django99

No matter what the draw was this morning people would believe it was fixed. Why fix the draw? People are saying the GAA or RTE would prefer certain teams in the final, why would they care? The All Ireland sells out every year and has huge viewing figures every year.

A poster wants the the travelling fans to have a say in where matches are played. How would you do this? A twitter poll?

Why does everything have to be a conspiracy theory this year when it comes to hurling? Why does everyone want to find the negatives, even when they aren't there most of the time?

davidx40

What a crap game yesterday absolute garbage to watch , i was sitting beside a Waterford man and he said after 20 minutes why did he come to watch this tennis match one sweeper clears opposite sweeper returns , all around me Waterford supporters and Wexford supporters were saying same thing , its no wonder people are not going to matches . There has to be some rule change to do away with it be it you have so many players in attacking half for puck outs something to save the game if we continue to go down this route the game is in serious trouble , Mcgrath and Fitz can say what they want but its just horrible to watch

I said

Whatever about the whinging over Davy fitz and his teams style of play he has given Wexford hurling a shot in the arm at least from grassroots up.

Powerhouse

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Probably true, Galway are head and shoulders ahead of everyone this year but it will be interesting to see how they deal with the pressure and expectation of being favourites.

I keep saying this and am beaten down on it but will say it again. Galway failed to win promotion in the League and the highest ranked team they beat in the championship was the bottom team in Division 1. Galway are a good team as they have been in recent years but I cannot see what evidence there is to say they are "head and shoulders ahead of everyone this year". They have done or been asked to do nothing in the championship that plenty of Galway teams down the years couldn't have done or that, say, Cork wouldn't easily do. Waterford beat Wexford and Offaly without much fuss either.

BonnieSituation

davidx40 wrote: »

What a crap game yesterday absolute garbage to watch , i was sitting beside a Waterford man and he said after 20 minutes why did he come to watch this tennis match one sweeper clears opposite sweeper returns , all around me Waterford supporters and Wexford supporters were saying same thing , its no wonder people are not going to matches . There has to be some rule change to do away with it be it you have so many players in attacking half for puck outs something to save the game if we continue to go down this route the game is in serious trouble , Mcgrath and Fitz can say what they want but its just horrible to watch

It's going to take a manager and team to counteract the tactics. I hate when rules are implemented to change the style of a game. It's only a recent phenomenon. Look at football... rule changes should be the last resort not the first idea.

Also all this talk of sliothairs this week got me thinking. It would be an idea to shorten the range by raising the ridge of the sliothairs and that will change the tactics of a game no end. And have official HQ supplied balls in games. No more of this team supplied shoite.

Powerhouse

Moggy13 wrote: »

Great draw for Waterford

I'd have assumed Waterford would have been equally happy with Galway in the draw.

deaddonkey15

BonnieSituation wrote: »

It's going to take a manager and team to counteract the tactics. I hate when rules are implemented to change the style of a game. It's only a recent phenomenon. Look at football... rule changes should be the last resort not the first idea.

Also all this talk of sliothairs this week got me thinking. It would be an idea to shorten the range by raising the ridge of the sliothairs and that will change the tactics of a game no end. And have official HQ supplied balls in games. No more of this team supplied shoite.

Don't see how shortening the range a sliotar can be hit will help. It will just make the problem worse in my opinion. Blanket defences because scores can't be got from range, it's what's already ruined football.

spideyman92

davidx40 wrote: »

What a crap game yesterday absolute garbage to watch , i was sitting beside a Waterford man and he said after 20 minutes why did he come to watch this tennis match one sweeper clears opposite sweeper returns , all around me Waterford supporters and Wexford supporters were saying same thing , its no wonder people are not going to matches . There has to be some rule change to do away with it be it you have so many players in attacking half for puck outs something to save the game if we continue to go down this route the game is in serious trouble , Mcgrath and Fitz can say what they want but its just horrible to watch

I don't understand all the whinging. It was clear as day to anyone paying attention to both teams over the last year or so what kind of game it was going to be. And people not going to matches is bull**** this year considering 60,000 went between both quarter finals compared to the 31,000 last year and 33,000 the year before for double headers.

BonnieSituation

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Don't see how shortening the range a sliotar can be hit will help. It will just make the problem worse in my opinion. Blanket defences because scores can't be got from range, it's what's already ruined football.

Not being able to just "whack the ball" out of a problem scenario will create a more intelligent game.

Football isn't "ruined". Have you seen how Dublin have played the last 6 years?

Moggy13

Powerhouse wrote: »

I'd have assumed Waterford would have been equally happy with Galway in the draw.

True..but if you're Tipp or Galway you're probably sick of playing each other or its just added motivation to win.

It will be interesting to see how Galway fare after layoff.

blue note

Django99 wrote: »

People really love to come out with extreme statements after games. Within the last few pages every team in the country has been called useless and it's been said that none of them will ever win anything. The game is dying and nobody is going to matches. Defensive hurling is ruining the game.

In reality, the 4 teams left are all at a similar level with Galway a little ahead in my opinion, but not much between any of them and results amongst themselves over this years and last years championship and league show that. Attendances this year are higher than they've been in a while, and will only increase as we come to the three biggest games of the year. There are more higher scoring games and teams scoring more than 20 points per game than ever before, consider in the 90s 1-13 and the likes could win an All Ireland final, and even in the 00s 1-14 and 0-17 were winning scores. Not a hope in hell any of those scores would come close to winning any of the remaining games. All three games will probably have both teams scoring 20+ points.

So complain about sweeper systems and whatever as much as anybody wants to, but they are actually leading to higher scoring games and in fact there are probably higher quality scores too considering they are gotten against extra defenders, or else from further out the field.

Let's not let hurling become like football where people watching the games (fans and pundits alike) are constantly moaning and yearning for the good old days when the standard was lower and the game was worse.

This is a rare sensible post. Incredibly rare recently in this thread. GAA pundits and fans absolutely love to latch onto an idea and run with it. Such as Kilkenny swarm hurling is destroying hurling, or that sweepers are destroying hurling and everyone should play a more traditional game like Kilkenny did when they were winning all those all irelands.

The defensive hurling is ruining the spectacle and driving people away. Even though scoring has never been higher and the crowds are better this year than in a long time.

Powerhouse

Moggy13 wrote: »

True..but if you're Tipp or Galway you're probably sick of playing each other or its just added motivation to win.

.

Galway-Tipperary will meet each other in championship for the fourth time in four years.........but Cork-Waterford will be meeting fir the sixth time in four years. Not sure which counties will be more sick of each other.

Powerhouse

Powerhouse wrote: »

I keep saying this and am beaten down on it but will say it again. Galway failed to win promotion in the League and the highest ranked team they beat in the championship was the bottom team in Division 1. Galway are a good team as they have been in recent years but I cannot see what evidence there is to say they are "head and shoulders ahead of everyone this year". They have done or been asked to do nothing in the championship that plenty of Galway teams down the years couldn't have done or that, say, Cork wouldn't easily do. Waterford beat Wexford and Offaly without much fuss either.

There's a few factors at play here.

Firstly 1B was a case of win two games and the league was over.
Wexford were hard at it all winter and had a warm up to the Galway game beating Limerick, despite that Galway had Wexford on the racks twice.. maybe it was fitness in the end as they just about reeled us in at the death.

Fast forward to league quarter finals, Waterford run ahead, it's not even that they're dominating but Galway are missing every chance they get, they click into gear and wipe Wateford out in the second half.

Play Limerick in Limerick, beat them by 10 points.
Beat Tipperary by 16 points.
Beat Dublin by 10 odd.
Score 30 times against Offaly.
And beat Wexford by 9.

In all the game this year against proper teams, Galway have broke the 20 score mark.
Including the lesser teams, that stat runs further.

The work rate of the players has been the big change, backs are clearing the ball under pressure.
That means the balls will go anywhere which makes it a backs ball.

Also on the flip side the backs are dominating and getting quality balls into the forwards hence the scoring increase.

Galway could very well of won it last year... I doubt Tipperary come through if Canning/Tuohy are swapped with Callanan/Barrett.

With last year in mind and the more settled spine to the team this year there's been a marked improvement in play and they're rightly favourites.

The rest have been dreadful in some shape or form, Cork haven't either but their blip is how real this improvement is given their form up until May.

Powerhouse

blue note wrote: »

This is a rare sensible post. Incredibly rare recently in this thread. GAA pundits and fans absolutely love to latch onto an idea and run with it. Such as Kilkenny swarm hurling is destroying hurling, or that sweepers are destroying hurling and everyone should play a more traditional game like Kilkenny did when they were winning all those all irelands.

The defensive hurling is ruining the spectacle and driving people away. Even though scoring has never been higher and the crowds are better this year than in a long time.

I'm not sure that high scoring is necessarily a guide to attractiveness or high standards. It's funny how people latch onto these ideas too as if they are immutable truths. I remember in 1995 a guy in my company commenting that the winners of the 1995 All Ireland scored 1-13 while he recalled the 1975 All Ireland Final where the winners scored 2-22. His view was immediately rubbished by an older guy who assured us that it was because defences were much tighter "these days". Now we are told that more scores means standards are going up despite the tightest defences ever. Everyone seems to think that their own era is the best.

As for increased crowds.....I'm not sure that this is necessarily to do with standards or even perceived attractiveness. Someone mentioned that Cork will bring 60k to Croke Park. Are they doing this because the game is going to be incredibly attractive in the abstract? Not at all. They are doing so because Cork are playing. This time last year the bulk of that 60k wouldn't have even watched the AI semi final. Many wouldn't have known who was playing.

Likewise the novelty of Wexford in the Leinster Final and relative novelty of Cork in the Munster final and the new Pairc Ui Chaoimh probably added to the Provincial finals and quarter finals attendance. Likewise the All Ireland Final will always have the biggest crowd because it's the All Ireland final. That should not be confused with objective questions of attractiveness of styles of play. There are many factors at play in attendances. There is always the possibility that the big crowds is a blip and might not develop into a trend. It does not necessarily mean that people so enjoy seeing 20 players compressed into a 30 yards section in the middle of the pitch that they cannot stay away.

danganabu

windy shepard henderson wrote: »

i dont think fitz tactics are good enough to make any giant leaps , if he goes more direct then it will give ye a far better chance

If Wexford went 15 v 15, they would be eaten alive, they have at least three defenders that are no where near inter-county standard.

road_high wrote: »

And it's a fine stadium...unbelievable how much taxpayers money was spent on PUC, given we already have a load of under used Grounds (such as Limerick).

The Gaelic Grounds is absolutely terrible, the mackey stand is where you would send someone as a form of punishment, the opposite stand is an uncovered stand in a ground where it rains 365 days of the year and the terraces are much too flat compared to say Cork and Thurles.

TheQuietFella wrote: »

A fixed draw if you ask me! The GAA are gagging for a Tipp' vs Cork All Ireland!

Why?? The AI final will be a sell out regardless of who is in it, so if they wanted to maximise their earnings surely it would make more sense to have the bigger draw as a semi final. Glad you are not in charge of the finances