The Tipperary GAA (Club and Intercounty) Thread

buggy beag

OAOB wrote:

Problem is that while we skip out our half forward line we still haven't consistent ball winners in our full forward line. Also the opposition half back line will have more space to drive the ball in to their forwards so could bypass Barry.

OAOB wrote:

I don't think we need to over complicate it, we need to win more 50/50 ball. Anyone know why Bergin was taken off at half time last weekend, he could be the exact type player we need up there

I think a full forward line of callanan,j mcgrath and o meara would be well capable of winning their own ball.might not win it all the time but defo more than our half forwards would.
Na no idea why he has taken off.got on plenty of ball but by god his striking at the posts is woeful.na he has been tried there before and never really worked out.he is better suited to the half back line maybe midfield at a push.

OAOB

buggy beag wrote: »

I think a full forward line of callanan,j mcgrath and o meara would be well capable of winning their own ball.might not win it all the time but defo more than our half forwards would.
Na no idea why he has taken off.got on plenty of ball but by god his striking at the posts is woeful.na he has been tried there before and never really worked out.he is better suited to the half back line maybe midfield at a push.

I think Callanan would be better served operating in a two man full forward line, if he gets space he's lethal but defences will try crowd him out.

What i like about Bergin is how he makes himself available for a pass with a lot of unselfish running through the defence. He's also good at spotting the open man. I don't remember his shooting being that poor but if it is he could probably be a good danger running aggressively at a defence and hopefully draw a free or find a andpass to a man in space. It's like the role we're asking Bonner to do but he just doesn't seem to be getting on the ball enough lately

Clonmel1000

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Tossy cant move his legs and wanders miles out the field?! Were you in Salthill on Sunday? The amount of times Galway had space in behind the half backs with a full back gone missing was cruel.

Meagher should at least have been tried this league campaign and yes im using underage as the only barometer but im still confident he offers alot more then Hamill. He is a brilliant catcher and is a far better reader of the game and he has a bit more toughness and pace. The league was for trying out new players but it would seem Ryan is set on players who are clearly not going to amount to anything and it may be too late to do anything about it by the time he realises.

The manager has made some utterly bizarre choices since the beginning of the league and now because of these decisions we're staring down the barrel of Div 1B. It would seem he is reading Premier-view for ideas in team selection because he is picking the likes of Dan McCormack and Conor Kenny who were never actually any good at underage for Tipp to begin with. Ken Hogans son is sub goalie ahead of Paul Maher??

Im not saying move Breen, or play Ronan or Paudie back there but what i am saying is that id play all of those before id play Hamill. Yes Paudie had a bad game v Johnny Glynn in 2014, but id still prefer him back there then a slow lad who goes walkabout. If your not fast then at least hold your damn position.

I wasn't in Salthill Sunday but I was at the previous 3 games and saw enough in Tossy to suggest to me that he'll have a long career in the blue and gold. Barry is our full back but we've groomed a creditable backup.

Regarding Meagher I can't comment because other than a couple of minor and u21 games I haven't seen enough of him. Fitzgibbon hurling is no barometer and the lad is beset by injury problems. I'll reserve judgment if its all the same to you.

Regarding the league and Ryan's bizarre choices well John McGrath Breen and Ronan Mahers form would suggest to me that he is moulding a team. Not sure how we're staring down the barrels of relegation either. A win on Sunday puts us in the QF.

Clonmel1000

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

I wasn't in Salthill Sunday but I was at the previous 3 games and saw enough in Tossy to suggest to me that he'll have a long career in the blue and gold. Barry is our full back but we've groomed a creditable backup.

Regarding Meagher I can't comment because other than a couple of minor and u21 games I haven't seen enough of him. Fitzgibbon hurling is no barometer and the lad is beset by injury problems. I'll reserve judgment if its all the same to you.

Regarding the league and Ryan's bizarre choices well John McGrath Breen and Ronan Mahers form would suggest to me that he is moulding a team. Not sure how we're staring down the barrels of relegation either. A win on Sunday puts us in the QF.

A defeat sees us having to go down to Cork to save our 1A status if Galway win.

We've conceded 5 goals in the league and Hamill was dreadful for all 5. If he is set for a long career in the blue and gold then were in for some barren years.

Clonmel1000

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A defeat sees us having to go down to Cork to save our 1A status if Galway win.

We've conceded 5 goals in the league and Hamill was dreadful for all 5. If he is set for a long career in the blue and gold then were in for some barren years.

And a win on Sunday puts us in QF.....if Galway win if we lose twice to cork if me aunt had balls etc....

Hamill has played well and has gained valuable experience. We cant just disregard a lad on the basis of a couple of league games in early spring.

Clonmel1000

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

And a win on Sunday puts us in QF.....if Galway win if we lose twice to cork if me aunt had balls etc....

Hamill has played well and has gained valuable experience. We cant just disregard a lad on the basis of a couple of league games in early spring.

Im afraid we can, because if he is this bad during the winter when conditions suit such a slow player then wait til summer with the likes of Waterford and Kilkennys are attacking and parting him like the red sea. All well and good Ryan trying young lads but he has persisted with three who clearly arent up to it while others like Fitzelle who showed some promise are nowhere to be seen

Xenophile

A quote taken from Tipp FM. He sounds a little desperate. I suggest he learn from the Brian Cody handbook. No threats just action, not at all fair on players to be threatened. They are all doing their best.


Players that don't perform to a sufficiently high standard for the county senior hurling team should expect to 'step out' of the side.

That's according to Tipp boss Michael Ryan, who believes that the level of competition within the panel means that nobody can take their place for granted

1eg0a3xv7b82of

Xenophile wrote: »

A quote taken from Tipp FM. He sounds a little desperate. I suggest he learn from the Brian Cody handbook. No threats just action, not at all fair on players to be threatened. They are all doing their best.


Players that don't perform to a sufficiently high standard for the county senior hurling team should expect to 'step out' of the side.

That's according to Tipp boss Michael Ryan, who believes that the level of competition within the panel means that nobody can take their place for granted

It was always going to be a battle for Ryan.
Tipp have players, like many other counties, that see themselves as equal or even superior to the manager.
Cody holds Kilkenny in an iron grip and through his success is untouchable.
For Ryan to make the hard decisions OShea for whatever reasons refused to, he will need the CB to back him 100%.
Ryan must feel he can drop players from the squad and not be expected to answer to senior players just like in 2011 when declan Ryan dropped a certain player only to be told by the senior players to bring him back in 2012 or else.

Clonmel1000

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Im afraid we can, because if he is this bad during the winter when conditions suit such a slow player then wait til summer with the likes of Waterford and Kilkennys are attacking and parting him like the red sea. All well and good Ryan trying young lads but he has persisted with three who clearly arent up to it while others like Fitzelle who showed some promise are nowhere to be seen

Fitzelle is injured. Comparison between the Kilkenny attack and the Waterford attack is laughable. Del boy will have one in the full forward line.

Clonmel1000

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Fitzelle is injured. Comparison between the Kilkenny attack and the Waterford attack is laughable. Del boy will have one in the full forward line.

Waterford have a very explosive attack and tore us asunder when they ran at us. The only difference is experience and decoration. Waterford have excellent players with unbelievable pace. Colin dunsford being one and the likes of Patrick Curran or Shane Bennett included

Xenophile

Xenophile wrote: »

A quote taken from Tipp FM. He sounds a little desperate. I suggest he learn from the Brian Cody handbook. No threats just action, not at all fair on players to be threatened. They are all doing their best.


Players that don't perform to a sufficiently high standard for the county senior hurling team should expect to 'step out' of the side.

That's according to Tipp boss Michael Ryan, who believes that the level of competition within the panel means that nobody can take their place for granted

If he is true to his word then fair enough. Supporters demand success and that will be nature of it forever. Ryan has to handle things with the most ruthless efficiency. Unfortunately I'm not sure he actually knows the difference between poor and good players

Clonmel1000

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Waterford have a very explosive attack and tore us asunder when they ran at us. The only difference is experience and decoration. Waterford have excellent players with unbelievable pace. Colin dunsford being one and the likes of Patrick Curran or Shane Bennett included

Tipp have excellent players with unbelievable pace also. Although you'd have them cast aside after a couple of games. Curran and Bennett are completely unproven at this level. Not sure how you think Waterford tore us apart either. They won by 1 not 10 points and when its mattered we have had their measure. Your basing a hell of a lot on one league game played in March. Dunford is pacey but headless more often than not. Anyway enough about Waterford we'll see come the end of the year where we are at in relation to them.

Clonmel1000

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If he is true to his word then fair enough. Supporters demand success and that will be nature of it forever. Ryan has to handle things with the most ruthless efficiency. Unfortunately I'm not sure he actually knows the difference between poor and good players

Can you give us examples of Mick Ryan not knowing the difference between poor and good players?

evolving tipperary

The team lines out as follows;

1. Darren Gleeson Portroe
2. Cathal Barrett Holycross-Ballycahill
3. James Barry Upperchurch-Drombane
4. Conor O Brien ire g Annacarty
5. Barry Heffernan Nenagh ire g
6. Ronan Maher Thurles Sarsfields
7. Padraic Maher Thurles Sarsfields
8. Brendan Maher (Capt.) Borris-Ileigh
9. Michael Breen Ballina
10. John O Dwyer Killenaule
11. Niall O Meara Kilruane MacDonaghs
12. Noel McGrath Loughmore-Castleiney
13. Kieran Morris Moycarkey-Borris
14. John McGrath Loughmore-Castleiney
15. Adrian Ryan Templederry Kenyons
Subs:
16. Brian Hogan Lorrha Dorrha
17. Kieran Bergin Killenaule
18. Seamus Callanan Drom & Inch
19. Andrew Coffey Nenagh ire g
20. Tom s Hamill Moyne-Templetuohy
21. Dan McCormack Borris-Ileigh
22. Liam McGrath Loughmore-Castleiney
23. John Meagher Loughmore-Castleiney
24. Daire Quinn Nenagh ire g
25. Gear id Ryan Templederry Kenyons
26. Willie Ryan Clonakenny

evolving tipperary

1. Patrick Collins (Ballinhassig)
2. Cillian Burke (Midleton)
3. Stephen McDonnell (Glen Rovers) Captain
4. Conor O Sullivan (Sarsfield)
5. Cormac Murphy (Mallow)
6. Christopher Joyce (Na Piarsaigh)
7. Lorcan McLoughlin (Kanturk)
8. Paul Haughney (Midleton)
9. John Cronin (Lisgould)
10. Brian Lawton (Castlemartyr)
11. Bill Cooper (Youghal)
12. Conor Lehane (Midleton)
13. Luke O Farrell (Midleton)
14. Seamus Harnedy (St Ita s)
15. Patrick Horgan (Glen Rovers)

Subs:
16. Anthony Nash (Kanturk)
17. Stephen Murphy (Blackrock)
18. Shane O Neill (Bishopstown)
19. Niall Cashman (Blackrock)
20. Daniel Kearney (Sarsfield)
21. William Egan (Kilbrin)
22. Patrick Cronin (Bishopstown)
23. Paidie O Sullivan (Cloyne)
24. Alan Cadogan (Douglas)
25. Stephen Moylan (Douglas)
26. William Leahy (Aghada)

Clonmel1000

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Can you give us examples of Mick Ryan not knowing the difference between poor and good players?

Hamill, McCormack, Kenny. Hamill and McCormack have started 4 of the 5 games

Rasputin11

Deleted User wrote: »

Hamill, McCormack, Kenny. Hamill and McCormack have started 4 of the 5 games

Kieran Morris playing on Sunday.

Rasputin11

Rasputin11 wrote: »

Kieran Morris playing on Sunday.

So I see. Good he deserves a crack. Done well for the inters last year. Good little sticksman but maybe too small but still though its good to try him. Cork may suit him down to pal. Clare have nimble lads, maybe we can bring through some of our own

Rasputin11

Kieran Morris is miles off the standard required for county hurling, it's actually worrying that Ryan thinks he's worthy of playing in an important game.

dirtyden

Deleted User wrote: »

Hamill, McCormack, Kenny. Hamill and McCormack have started 4 of the 5 games

I think you are being a bit harsh on Ryan and the three lads. Hamill is a bit green but certainly did not look too far out of place. He lacks a little in pace and positional sense but if he works on positioning I think he is a definite option at full back in the future. Kenny also showed some potential. This year looked too early for McCormack and he was a little out of his depth but I don't see the harm in giving a lad a try in an area of the field where we need more options. No-one else who has played in the half forward line has suggested they are the answer either.

I like what Ryan has done in the league so far, he has tried out a lot of players in the areas we are weakest in. He seems to want to build a strong panel which I think was one of O'Shea's minor flaws, too much loyalty to the incumbents.

dirtyden

dirtyden wrote: »

I think you are being a bit harsh on Ryan and the three lads. Hamill is a bit green but certainly did not look too far out of place. He lacks a little in pace and positional sense but if he works on positioning I think he is a definite option at full back in the future. Kenny also showed some potential. This year looked too early for McCormack and he was a little out of his depth but I don't see the harm in giving a lad a try in an area of the field where we need more options. No-one else who has played in the half forward line has suggested they are the answer either.

I like what Ryan has done in the league so far, he has tried out a lot of players in the areas we are weakest in. He seems to want to build a strong panel which I think was one of O'Shea's minor flaws, too much loyalty to the incumbents.

I've no issue with him trying out lads but he is seeing things in players that aren't there. Kenny took a rookie Dublin full back to school but done nothing since, McCormack has done absolutely nothing so far full stop and a lack of pace is a serious flaw in modern day hurling especially when you go wandering out the field like Hamill does

I agree with you on what ryan is doing in comparison to EOS and I also agree that players should at least get two appearances but I can't fathom why he is persistent with the players he has tried. 4 games was way too much for McCormack and Hamill

Clonmel1000

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Tipp have excellent players with unbelievable pace also. Although you'd have them cast aside after a couple of games. Curran and Bennett are completely unproven at this level. Not sure how you think Waterford tore us apart either. They won by 1 not 10 points and when its mattered we have had their measure. Your basing a hell of a lot on one league game played in March. Dunford is pacey but headless more often than not. Anyway enough about Waterford we'll see come the end of the year where we are at in relation to them.

Hold on now, Bennett was excellent in the championship last year and he is only a boy.

By referring to Waterfords pace my point was that we need quick backs ALL OVER to counteract this. Your reply is that Tipp have pacey players? Hamill ain't one, fact he isn't even adequate. Kenny not much better at the other end.

How would they cope in the summer if they are like this in the winter? You completely missed my point

Rasputin11

Rasputin11 wrote: »

Kieran Morris is miles off the standard required for county hurling, it's actually worrying that Ryan thinks he's worthy of playing in an important game.

He's worth a go at least. I've no issue with trying players once or twice but this blind loyalty is madness.

buggy beag

Grand day in thurles.mon da premier

evolving tipperary

I think Hamill has had a very good campaign - Not sure how he was at fault for the Galway goals as some have pointed out - I need examples how he was at fault - what happened - where he was...
I do remember for the first goal - it beginning out on the wing and a long run where Heffernan was left for dust... - that said Heffernan had a fine game.
Fitzelle came on and scored a point against a Dublin Team that had been ripped ope - and, in my estimation, didn't look look like a natural hurler in the process - but he it was a very fine strike. I would like to see more of him... - I'd imagine though that McCormack's fitness and aptitude leaves Fitzelle in the shadows in training - McCormack is well off the pace so far but has got a nice taste of it and up to him respond to what he has learned - needs to bulk up and get stronger under the ball.

For me, so far - Hamill's performances and experience gained is a nice development.
Ronan Maher has looked slick at center back - fantastic distribution and covers the wings. However, Galway (joe in particular) ran through the spine of the field several times last sunday. He didn't get one belt for it - disastrously soft belly there. If teams can do that against you - you'll win nothing.

Breen has brought a hard edge and welcome to see - aggressive in his running and attitude. But, we still need an enforcer who not let anyone run through our midfield and past our half back line - - I would like to see Breen and Bonnar in midfield - i think it should be tried - it won't happen though.

John McGrath has been playing very well - let the galway crowd get on top of him for a few frees and missed - but he'll learn from that. Looks to have excellent potential...
Barry Heffernan looks very promising.
We need to see more from B Maher and Bonnar - confidence and play is not where it should be.... - but, hopefully it will come when championship starts...

Bergin had good movement - dropped which i think is harsh - but his touch is not there yet - it's certainly not forward sharp - games wil only solve that

Adrian Ryan will be interesting to see again - needs to find his confidence at this level

Kenny has improved at league level - got scores against Dublin and KK - suffered embarrassment against Galway - up to him to get build again.

Can we say we've found the players we needed to find for the half forward line? No. - no outstanding center forward or wing forward who can mix it and win their ball.

Breen for midfield, yes. Have we found the right partnership for midfield for championship - remains to be seen...
I think Ryan did the right thing by taking Hamill out - BARRY ON Hardney - that's quite a challenge considering the form he is in

Let's see how O'Meara - teh obvious candidate - goes at center forward today - would have liked to have seen him there all league - injury and university hurling forbid that

evolving tipperary

Seamus Kennedy on the bench instead of Meagher

evolving tipperary

Seamus Harnedy has been ruled out

evolving tipperary

Lorcan Mc Loughlin are replaced by Alan Cadogan

evolving tipperary

[font=Arial, sans-serif] Michael Breen with four points from play[/font]

evolving tipperary

2 changes at HT - Callanan and McCormack replace A.Ryan & Morris