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  • 18-11-2015 12:33pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    After the Paris massacres this is our EU leaders solution to make us all safer from crazy religious head hackers armed with sucidie vests and full auto AKs.
    BAN more civillian owned guns.!!:mad::mad:
    http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-15-6110_en.htm



    European Commission - Press release
    European Commission strengthens control of firearms across the EU

    Brussels, 18 November 2015

    The European Commission today adopted a package of measures to make it more difficult to acquire firearms in the European Union,

    better track legally held firearms, strengthen cooperation between Member States, and ensure that deactivated firearms are rendered inoperable.
    The proposals presented today were foreseen in the European Security Agenda adopted in April 2015, but have been significantly accelerated in light of recent events. The Commission is hereby supporting Member States in their efforts to protect Europe's citizens and prevent criminals and terrorists from accessing weapons.
    President Juncker said: "The recent terrorist attacks on Europe's people and values were coordinated across borders, showing that we must work together to resist these threats. Today's proposal, prepared jointly by Commissioners Elżbieta Bieńkowska and Dimitris Avramopoulos, will help us tackle the threat of weapons falling into the hands of terrorists. We are proposing stricter controls on sale and registration of firearms, and stronger rules to irrevocably deactivate weapons. We will also come forward with an Action Plan in the near future to tackle illicit arms trafficking. Organised criminals accessing and trading military grade firearms in Europe cannot and will not be tolerated."
    Internal Market and Industry Commissioner Elżbieta Bieńkowska and Migration, Home Affairs and Citizenship Commissioner Dimitris Avramopoulos added: "The adoption of the firearms package today is proof of the Commission's determination to address the new reality we are confronted with. We need to remove regulatory divergences across the EU by imposing stricter, harmonised EU standards for firearms and ensuring efficient exchange of information between Member States."
    The package of measures on firearms adopted by the College of Commissioners today includes the following elements:
    A revision of the Firearms Directive, to tighten controls on the acquisition and possession of firearms
    The Commission has today tabled proposals to amend the EU Firearms Directive, which defines the rules under which private persons can acquire and possess weapons, as well as the transfer of firearms to another EU country. The main elements of the proposed revision are:
    Stricter rules to ban certain semi-automatic firearms, which will not, under any circumstance, be allowed to be held by private persons, even if they have been permanently deactivated;
    Tighter rules on the online acquisition of firearms, to avoid the acquisition of firearms, key parts or ammunition through the Internet;
    EU common rules on marking of firearms to improve the traceability of weapons;
    Better exchange of information between Member States, for example on any refusal of authorisation to own a firearm decided by another national authority, and obligation to interconnect national registers of weapons;
    Common criteria concerning alarm weapons (e.g. distress flares and starter pistols)in order to prevent their transformation into fully functioning firearms;
    Stricter conditions for the circulation of deactivated firearms;
    Stricter conditions for collectors to limit the risk of sale to criminals.
    The proposed amendments which the Commission has tabled today now need to be approved by the European Parliament and Council.
    An Implementing Regulation on common minimum standards for deactivation of firearms
    The Implementing Regulation sets out common and strict criteria on the way Member States must deactivate weapons so that they are rendered inoperable. The possession of the most dangerous firearms – even if they are deactivated – will no longer be allowed.
    The Implementing Regulation is based on the criteria for deactivation developed by the Permanent International Commission for the Proof of Small Arms (the CIP). Following a positive vote on the draft Regulation by Member States in a comitology committee earlier this morning, the College of Commissioners formally adopted the text. The Regulation will be published immediately in the Official Journal and will enter into force after 3 months.
    Today's package of measures to strengthen the control of firearms within the EU is based on a detailed evaluation of the implementation of the Firearms Directive carried out by the Commission last year in the context of its Regulatory Fitness programme (REFIT), which aims to ensure that existing EU regulation is fit for purpose. To ensure the best practical results on the deactivation of firearms, the Commission will regularly review and update the technical specifications laid down in this Regulation.
    An action plan against the illegal trafficking of weapons and explosives
    In addition to the adoption of these stricter rules and standards, the Commission also announced today that it is developing an action plan against the illegal trafficking of weapons and explosives. Issues to be tackled in this future action plan will include:
    The illegal purchase of weapons on the black market;
    The control of illegal weapons and explosives in the internal market (especially from the Balkan countries or ex-war zones);
    The fight against organised crime.

    While arms trafficking is mainly a national competence, given the clear cross-border dimension there is a need for stronger police and intelligence service coordination and stronger import checks. The Commission will propose actions to support Member States' activities, building on the Action Plan on illicit trafficking in firearms between the EU and the Western Balkans. The EU-Western Balkans summit of Ministers of Justice and Home Affairs on 7 December will be a further opportunity to take stock of progress on the Action Plan.
    Background
    The responsibility for ensuring internal security is first and foremost with the Member States, but cross-border challenges defy the capacity of individual countries to act alone and require EU support to build trust and facilitate cooperation, exchange of information and joint action.
    President Juncker's Political Guidelines identified the security agenda as a priority for this Commission, and the 2015 Commission Work Programme committed to the delivery of the European Agenda on Security.
    On 28 April 2015, the European Commission set out a European Agenda on Security for the period 2015-2020 to support Member States' cooperation in tackling security threats and step up our common efforts in the fight against terrorism, organised crime and cybercrime. The Agenda sets out the concrete tools and measures which will be used in this joint work to ensure security and tackle these three most pressing threats more effectively.
    In the Agenda and in the Work Programme for 2016, the Commission promised to review the existing legislation on firearms in 2016 to improve the sharing of information, to reinforce traceability, to standardise marking, and to establish common standards for neutralising firearms. In light of recent events we have decided to significantly accelerate this work. Since then, significant progress has been made in implementing the elements of the agenda.
    Today's initiatives complement ongoing work to tackle the illegal trafficking of firearms, including notably the operational action plan between the EU and the Western Balkans and joint investigations and police cooperation which have been in place since 2013.

    For more information
    Directive: http://ec.europa.eu/DocsRoom/documents/13965/attachments/1/translations/en/renditions/native
    Report: http://ec.europa.eu/DocsRoom/documents/13965/attachments/2/translations/en/renditions/native
    Implementing Regulation (deactivation): http://ec.europa.eu/DocsRoom/documents/13965/attachments/3/translations/en/renditions/native
    Annexes to Implementing Regulation: http://ec.europa.eu/DocsRoom/documents/13965/attachments/4/translations/en/renditions/native
    Memo/15/6111
    European Agenda on Security – Press release
    The European Agenda on Security: State of Play
    Firearms Directive

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 9,204 ✭✭✭ dodderangler


    Ban legally owned firearms? So does that mean that the guns that were used by these terrorists were legally owned?
    So the solution is to ban legally owned guns?
    How bout crack down on illegally held firearms and find who is selling them or find the gangs that are dealing them out or groups.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Hope the EU is going to be ready to pay out to the gunowners of Europe big time on compo for those banned semi autos under their own laws.

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,204 ✭✭✭ dodderangler


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Hope the EU is going to be ready to pay out to the gunowners of Europe big time on compo for those banned semi autos under their own laws.

    It won't make a lick of difference. People will still be killed by illegally held firearms. There's gangs out there that are basically a small army that have piles of guns but no let's ban legal guns instead. We'll worry about the illegal ones when some more people are killed. That'll sort the problem out


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Allah be praised!!!...The bomb vest will not require a permit or liscense from the infidels police or liscenseing forces.We would have been truely at a disadvantage then!
    H.Eadhacker:rolleyes:

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    Well, they're still proposals rather than law, so that's a small blessing. But a major headdesk moment. You'd think the EU didn't learn anything from 1972 here or something.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,493 ✭✭✭ long range shooter


    In what country in Europe can you legally obtain a kalashnikov AK47 anyway?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    The netherlands under a collector's licence (but you can't ever fire it legally). I think there are some grandfathered in in the eastern european member states, but I could be completely wrong. 91/ECC/477 didn't ban them utterly, but it was worded as strongly as they could at the time to make them effectively illegal to have in as much of the EU as was possible.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,493 ✭✭✭ long range shooter


    I think they should focus on stricter border controls instead of firearmslaws.

    http://nypost.com/2015/11/15/man-stopped-in-germany-may-be-linked-to-paris-attacks-police/


    It seems quite obvious that terrorist wont be going for a single shot/semi auto target rifle,they will choose assualt rifles with high capasity magazines.
    And you wont find many memberstates in the EU that allows for that anymore.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    I only said to the Father the other day after watching Terresa May give a speech in the house of Parliament about tightening gun control that something stupid would come out of this.

    She [May] said that they need to tighten the movement of guns, limit the availability of assault weapons, etc, etc. Seeing as how there are laws governing this already i thought it was a silly comment. What is needed is more money to enforce the existing laws.

    As for "assault weapons". Well they're illegal anyway. In Ireland they are Category A, prohibited firearms. So cannot be gotten, licensed, etc. The same holds true for most if not all EU countries. So how do you ban them further.

    How about you just tackle the illegal guns that are out there?


    Really is a head-desk issue as said above.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - RFDs - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads


    If you see a problem post use the report post function, "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Just shows how divorced from reality people become when they become politicans at that level.Either that or thefe are some really nasty grey people with agendas surrounding them.
    Was talking to one politican on this point in Germany.He said some of these proposals they get handed are the size of a phone book and maybe a half dozen a day in some cases.No one can read and comprehend that much per day let alone find fault.So they get it condensed in bullet points trysting someone else has read it and given you the right info.......How easy is it then to slip in an agenda as a policy then?

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭ tac foley


    Cass wrote: »
    I only said to the Father the other day after watching Terresa May give a speech in the house of Parliament about tightening gun control that something stupid would come out of this.

    She [May] said that they need to tighten the movement of guns, limit the availability of assault weapons, etc, etc. Seeing as how there are laws governing this already i thought it was a silly comment. What is needed is more money to enforce the existing laws.

    As for "assault weapons". Well they're illegal anyway. In Ireland they are Category A, prohibited firearms. So cannot be gotten, licensed, etc. The same holds true for most if not all EU countries. So how do you ban them further.

    How about you just tackle the illegal guns that are out there?


    Really is a head-desk issue as said above.

    The woman is a total spoonheaded mong. As if any criminal intent on wholesale slaughter is going to take any notice of ANY law. That is why they are called criminals.

    tac


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Just after watching an interesting interview between a SKY news correspondent and Dr Julian Richards. Now i don't Dr. Richards, have never heard of him before and don't know his background but he made some very salient points.

    His remarks about the tightening of gun laws were very important. He said, and i'm paraphrasing here, that the problem is not so much the movement of arms around the EU (although he did say that some member states could do with examining the processes they use to allow this), but moreso a case of the outlying countries within the Schengen area tightening their borders and stopping the influx of FULLY AUTOMATIC arms which once in can move more freely.

    He went on to say that England, due it's geographical location, does not suffer with this nearly as much as the other countries within the EU. By default Ireland would be less so or at the very least the same. He finished by saying that there should NOT be a kneejerk reaction to the events of Paris in relation to arms.

    I must stress the interview was not solely about firearms. It touched on multiple topics, and i'm by no means seeking to diminish the tragedies that have occurred, but just relaying the points he made on firearms because of the topic of the thread and nature of the forum.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - RFDs - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads


    If you see a problem post use the report post function, "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭ Snakezilla


    Personally I don't think its anything to do with the terrorists arsenal of weapons.. Lets face it , if they want guns - they'll do ANYTHING to get them. I think the idea of banning of legally owned firearms is due to the fear of vigilante groups and civilians taking matters into their own hands etc. It's the only reason it would make sense.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    e
    netherlands under a collector's licence (but you can't ever fire it legally). I think there are some grandfathered in in the eastern european member states, but I could be completely wrong. 91/ECC/477 didn't ban them utterly, but it was worded as strongly as they could at the time to make them effectively illegal to have in as much of the EU as was possible.

    Think the Czech republic more like?You can get[from Wikipedia]
    Restricted firearms and accessories
    Includes full automatic firearms, military firearms and ammunition not inspected and marked for civilian use, some types of ammunition such as armor piercing and incendiary ammunition, night vision scopes, suppressors and gun mounted laser pointers. The use of hollow point ammunition in pistols is also restricted, however, hollow points are legal to purchase for rifles and pistol carbines.

    To obtain a gun from the A category (typically a full-automatic or select-fire firearm), the person must ask for a may-issue "exemption" from the police and demonstrate a specific reason why they want such a weapon.
    For private physical persons, the only acceptable reason is collecting;[66]
    for physical or legal persons having an armament license (this is a completely different certificate than the gun license) for professional purposes the acceptable reasons include providing security for dangerous or valuable shipments or VIP objects, manufacturing or testing of firearms, providing training in use of A category firearms, or filming in case that the firearm is adjusted for use of dummy rounds.[66]

    [Sounds like their version of fights with our Cheif Super:pBut at least their law is much easier to read and understand.]

    Holland.[They read as pukey as ours,almost]
    From Vegan Peace website]

    The Netherlands' gun laws are based on the following acts:

    Wet wapens en munitie (Arms and Ammunition Act) (22)
    Council Directive of 18 June 1991 (9) (see European Union)
    The Netherlands has strict gun laws. Citizens can only obtain a firearm for hunting or sport shooting or when they are able to provide a special reason for needing one. Self-defense is not considered a valid reason.

    To obtain a sport shooting license, applicants have to join a shooting club. They will be able to use pistols that are property of the club, but will never be allowed to own them outside of the club.

    It is allowed to hunt in the Netherlands with semi-automatic and pump action shotguns and hunting rifles with a two round limit. Hunting with pistols is also allowed. All privately owned firearms must be locked in a gun safe, when not in use. (22),(38)

    What they dont say is being a hunter over there is about the social equivilent of being a Muslim having a bacon sanger at Friday prayers.:eek:

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    No grizz, definitely netherlands. It's not a normal firearms permit, it'd be illegal to fire a firearm you had on a collectors permit even if you had normal permits for other firearms. It's a weird edge case, I'd not even heard of it until a few months back. Haven't been able to find the reference though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Folks, this is not just about semi auto rifles, if you read this proposal in detail it will also affect EVERYONE who owns a gun.You think it is difficult to get something from the USA now?If this kicks in you proably wont get a freakin WOODSCREW for the buttplate on your gun from the US and it will require a ton of paperwork to get somthing within the EU as well.If you have a deactivated firearm that can have the mag removed or the cylinder swung out cocked and "fired" ,it will have to be re deactivated to the UK/EU style deact of being a welded up lump of metal suitable only as a high tech [ and awkward] club.
    Please sign ,circulate to your friends and clubs and shooting organisations.Also it wouldnt hurt to give your TDs/MEP a call on this either.
    We fought long and hard last year to stop our sport from being wrecked by our local powers that be..Why now should a bunch of Eurocrats and politicans over there in literally "fortress Brussells" say what they think we should be shooting in a ligit sport,when fundamentalist terrorists are running amuck on the streets of Europe?



    https://www.change.org/p/council-of-the-european-union-eu-you-cannot-stop-terrorism-by-restricting-legal-gun-ownership

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭ Zxthinger


    Do they really think that the people will see this as action to stop terrorists.
    FFS. ��I knew some bullshi7 would be flowing downhill as soon as the saga unfolded.
    Maybe they should ban passports and hotel rooms too or just outlaw public gatherings.

    Knee jerk reactions formed on energetic emotional highs and deep anger..
    Punitive measures like these would be the first step in IS winning ground by destroying our society.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43 ✭✭✭ Big Bangstick


    People thought the Ministers latest announcement was good news. What's the betting she knew this document * was coming and the new authority will be implementing all this eu claptrap. Once again looks like some were sold a pup.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    So... you're saying the Minister for Justice knew ISIS were going to murder over a hundred people in Paris and stayed quiet so she could bring in more restrictive firearms legislation using the EU as a tool to do so.

    Honestly, don't know what to say to that one...


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Well if you belive in conspircy theories and that the Paris attacks were some sort of NWO "false flags" fantasy...How would they have known this would happen.Go and read up exactly what the emergency meeting was said and by whom.You had that daft cow Thresa May advocating a UK style system all over Europe,and that Swedish red Malstrom getting her panties in a twist that all her rubbish socialist gun banning ideas could be implimented almost at once due to this tragedy...
    What is more important now for us here,is simply to quit with this inter bitching and parish pump politics and see where the real threat is coming from,its not Dublin its Brussells!!And I would be intrested to see if our repersentation here in the form of NASRPC,Sports Colation,NARGC,WADI,etc etc.Will go away and get in contact with their respective bodies and allies on the continent and issue some statements to Europe on this?
    OH and BTW Hello AIrsofters...You are included in this one.They want to ban airsoft in the EU too.But dont expect any sympathy from the shooting community.Your silence and indifference to any petition signing last year has been well noted by us.

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43 ✭✭✭ Big Bangstick


    Sparks wrote: »
    So... you're saying the Minister for Justice knew ISIS were going to murder over a hundred people in Paris and stayed quiet so she could bring in more restrictive firearms legislation using the EU as a tool to do so.

    Honestly, don't know what to say to that one...

    I don't know sometimes how ye see what ye see in posts. Vivid imaginations to say the least.

    So this document was prepared since Friday last week? Ya right !

    It's been flagged for a long time that elements in EU want to clamp down on legal firearms ownership. A politician with an agenda will use anything to get what they want


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    I don't know sometimes how ye see what ye see in posts. Vivid imaginations to say the least.
    I don't know sometimes how ye don't know when we're being sarcastic because what you say isn't worth much more of an answer.
    So this document was prepared since Friday last week? Ya right !
    No, it was prepared after Charlie Hebdo was attacked and was rushed since the attacks this weekend. That's been stated openly. Were you maybe not listening?
    It's been flagged for a long time that elements in EU want to clamp down on legal firearms ownership. A politician with an agenda will use anything to get what they want
    And the sky's blue and water's wet. If you're done trying to look insightful, could you maybe actually think of something more original?

    'Cos otherwise, you're just adding to noise while some stuff you should be paying attention to is going on. And we've got this long, long, long history of doing that in shooting in Ireland and then spending the next decade bitching and moaning about how things aren't right instead of actually paying attention and saying something when there was a chance to change things.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43 ✭✭✭ Big Bangstick


    You're right. There's way too much noise here. Sorry for posting at all. In future I'll simply await your insightful posts and be grateful that we as a community have people like you making sure we know what to think.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 40,053 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sparks


    You're right. There's way too much noise here. Sorry for posting at all. In future I'll simply await your insightful posts and be grateful that we as a community have people like you making sure we know what to think.
    That's what I love about you BB - someone tells you to think at all and you hear them telling you what to think instead.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43 ✭✭✭ Big Bangstick


    Could be worse I could be trying to convince everyone I'm right and they're wrong.

    I'll give you the last word now as we both know you'll have it one way or another ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    This is a German /European website and it explains the proposals alot better than some FB sites. Read this and then start asking your organisations have they read it and what is their response to this ulterior threat,when they can manage to do so between the parish pump politics and infighting.:rolleyes:



    https://www.all4shooters.com/en/Shooting/law/2015-articles/EU-new-proposal-restrictions-firearms/

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,301 yubabill1


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Folks, this is not just about semi auto rifles, if you read this proposal in detail it will also affect EVERYONE who owns a gun.You think it is difficult to get something from the USA now?If this kicks in you proably wont get a freakin WOODSCREW for the buttplate on your gun from the US and it will require a ton of paperwork to get somthing within the EU as well.If you have a deactivated firearm that can have the mag removed or the cylinder swung out cocked and "fired" ,it will have to be re deactivated to the UK/EU style deact of being a welded up lump of metal suitable only as a high tech [ and awkward] club.
    Please sign ,circulate to your friends and clubs and shooting organisations.Also it wouldnt hurt to give your TDs/MEP a call on this either.
    We fought long and hard last year to stop our sport from being wrecked by our local powers that be..Why now should a bunch of Eurocrats and politicans over there in literally "fortress Brussells" say what they think we should be shooting in a ligit sport,when fundamentalist terrorists are running amuck on the streets of Europe?



    https://www.change.org/p/council-of-the-european-union-eu-you-cannot-stop-terrorism-by-restricting-legal-gun-ownership

    21000 - odd signatures now.

    These proposals are not new, as we all know - we even commented on the EU report they're based on when talking to the Justice Committee a few months ago. They've simply been frontloaded so politicians can be seen to be doing something, no matter how damaging to a minority.

    Ultimately, this is all coming from the UN small arms policy: Like as if paramilitaries in Somalia, Nigeria, Afghanistan or any other bullet-ridden country where a policy is desperately needed are going to take heed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 928 ✭✭✭ Steve012


    Zxthinger wrote: »
    Do they really think that the people will see this as action to stop terrorists.
    FFS. ��I knew some bullshi7 would be flowing downhill as soon as the saga unfolded.
    Maybe they should ban passports and hotel rooms too or just outlaw public gatherings.

    Knee jerk reactions formed on energetic emotional highs and deep anger..
    Punitive measures like these would be the first step in IS winning ground by destroying our society.

    Same here, It was one of the first things that came to mind!

    "We must take all firearms off the street including law abiding citizens who legally own firearms for sporting and pleasure use"....

    A blind flying horse can see this might cause some stir down the road!
    "Oh We must do it if our larger European neighbors are, "mentality"

    Just more **** to expect down the line IMO..

    Ban knifes, ban pastry rollers, ban cars! they could all fall under a dangerous weapon category..:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,147 JPNelsforearm


    The NRA in the US have the right approach, dig in heels and dont give an inch, surely a pan european lobbying group could be set up, the likes of Steyr, H&K etc funding it?


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Thats great when you're in a country where you have a constitutional right to guns. That is not the case in Ireland, England, Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, and i'm sure the majority of other European countries.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - RFDs - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads


    If you see a problem post use the report post function, "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.


    Your Shooting Forum Moderators - Cass, Cookimonster, Vegeta, Sparks, It wasn't me!



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