**ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER RELATED** Part 2 - MOD WARNING IN OP

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

donvito99 wrote: »

He was arrested by all accounts. Have you actually watched the fúcking video?

Two teenagers were arrested.
Was he one of those?

donvito99

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Two teenagers were arrested.
Was he one of those?

I think it's more than likely.

Indo wrote:

One arrest, a 17 year old male, is in relation to criminal damage to a garda vehicle.

JRant

Smidge wrote: »

Going to have to pin you down to an answer on this.
Please provide a link for this claim.

The IW workers were committing trespass as they and their property were clearly on that mans property. Under law, they were committing trespass as the law states that "trespass to land is to enter someone else's private property without the owners permission"
They may have a lawful right to install meters.
They broke the law when they trespassed on that man's property and actually under the Non-Fatal Offences Against the Person Act, 1997, that man was within his rights to eject them using reasonable means(which he did, he didn't use a baseball bat or gun etc)
Although he may have gotten away with stronger force as he could have claimed any of the below under that particular act.

18.—(1) The use of force by a person for any of the following purposes, if only such as is reasonable in the circumstances as he or she believes them to be, does not constitute an offence—

(a) to protect himself or herself or a member of the family of that person or another from injury, assault or detention caused by a criminal act; or

(b) to protect himself or herself or (with the authority of that other) another from trespass to the person; or

(c) to protect his or her property from appropriation, destruction or damage caused by a criminal act or from trespass or infringement; or

(d) to protect property belonging to another from appropriation, destruction or damage caused by a criminal act or (with the authority of that other) from trespass or infringement; or

(e) to prevent crime or a breach of the peace.

Also, have no idea why you keep throwing civil tort at this. It has no pull in this instance and also being wrongly cited by you to allow some justification to what the IW workers did.

From my limited understanding I presume they mean that a Tort is a civil matter rather than a criminal one.

This gives a brief synopsis.

http://lawinireland.wordpress.com/tort-law/

I can't find anything relating to IW workers have the right to enter private property, unlike say the ESB. So in its absence it would be a clear case of trespass.

It's also very clear from the incident that a case of battery could be taken against the person wielding the hose. That kind of force (around 15 meter head) could cause server damge to one's gentleman bits.

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

donvito99 wrote: »

I think it's more than likely.

Throw the book at him.
He certainly doesn't represent the people who are anti water tax.

Stargate

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Phoebas wrote: »

I didn't mislead anyone - deliberately or otherwise. There is now a corroborating video published by a rival newspaper. #eggonface

That is what i said Phoebas , come on , play fair .

FREETV

I do not want to pay for water in any way

omega man wrote: »

What the fcuk is a pro water taxer exactly? No one I know likes paying taxes but accept that it's part of how our society works.

This is all getting ridiculous now on both "sides". Personally I think people should be more outraged over USC but it seems water rates are more contentious. By the way I've no problem with the principle of paying for water but do agree the whole thing has been a major PR fcuk up.

It's also worth pointing out that the country seems to be turning a corner economically and things are most definitely improving, admittedly not for all yet. Whether that's down to the government is a different argument but some posts in here would have you think we live in N Korea ffs.

Fiat currency, debt based economy con, a cyclical system engineered to boom and then collapse, all the Government did is sell out the Country and took bribes for it and two of them event went to nefarious secretive Bilderberg Group meetings.
The Government is absolutely and completely corrupt.

http://www.thejournal.ie/bilderberg-2012-agenda-conference-michael-noonan-557543-Aug2012/

http://www.thejournal.ie/simon-coveney-bilderberg-conference-1490010-May2014/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7bAfjKy5Z4
This is why the Country is the way it is with characters like these and the "An Taoiseach" offshore account leaked recently on Facebook by a journalist.

Peaceful protests aren't working and it will go up a notch or two soon if they dare to defy the public next week and it will be their own fault.
Nobody wants a water charge and a quango to pay off bondholders, provide jobs for the boys, nothing will be done with the money for the water infrastructure or for treatment plants.

Guy:Incognito

I would like Irish Water as a company to remain in it's current form

darkpagandeath wrote: »

nope and they don't pay VRT

You might want to tell the Dutch that, they might disagree.

JRant

Not sure if already posted but the protesters here are far more subdued than our European counter parts.

Imaging the outcry is this happened here.

http://m.liveleak.com/view?i=24c_1415350376

Personally I'd call that giving them a good dose of there own.

The Dial could do with a bit of that treatment, if only to clear out the stench from all the verbal diarrhoea that goes on in there.

Guy:Incognito

I would like Irish Water as a company to remain in it's current form

I was playing football today while all this rubbish was going on.

If i was against paying for water, I'd still have been playing football during it. If i decided I wasn't going to pay my bill I just wouldn't. Ive no interest in going out on the street and shouting at people about my opinions and I certainly have no interest in stopping them doing whatever it is they decide to do of a Saturday. In return they can kindly **** off and keep their opinions on what I do to themselves and hate me if they want, I don't need to hear about it.


This system has served me well for decades now. I'm happy with my life.

Phoebas

Stargate wrote: »

That is what i said Phoebas , come on , play fair .

<playing fair>
No - you said that I didn't deliberately mislead - the clear implication being that I did mislead, but not deliberately.

I didn't mislead anyone. Period.
</playing fair>

Stargate wrote: »

Not saying you deliberately mislead anyone , not saying that . I think you posted the foto in good faith.

FREETV

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I was playing football today while all this rubbish was going on.

If i was against paying for water, I'd still have been playing football during it. If i decided I wasn't going to pay my bill I just wouldn't. Ive no interest in going out on the street and shouting at people about my opinions and I certainly have no interest in stopping them doing whatever it is they decide to do of a Saturday. In return they can kindly **** off and keep their opinions on what I do to themselves and hate me if they want, I don't need to hear about it.


This system has served me well for decades now. I'm happy with my life.

Good for you, I'm glad that you're happy.

FREETV

I do not want to pay for water in any way

All farmers are welcome to the protests on December 6 and 10.
The more the merrier, bring your tractors please.

JRant

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I was playing football today while all this rubbish was going on.

If i was against paying for water, I'd still have been playing football during it. If i decided I wasn't going to pay my bill I just wouldn't. Ive no interest in going out on the street and shouting at people about my opinions and I certainly have no interest in stopping them doing whatever it is they decide to do of a Saturday. In return they can kindly **** off and keep their opinions on what I do to themselves and hate me if they want, I don't need to hear about it.


This system has served me well for decades now. I'm happy with my life.

Lucky you. Our match was called off again this week. By the looks of the weather it'll be the new year before we get a game in 😞

masculinist

I do not want to pay for water in any way

FREETV wrote: »

All farmers are welcome to the protests on December 6 and 10.
The more the merrier, bring your tractors please.

If theres anything I learned its that the government and media love to pit citizens against each other over petty differences. They love to start pointless arguments between farmers and city dwellers etc etc over small change. This is because they fear our growing awareness of the real divide which we have been waking up to which is: Citizens versus incompetent and corrupt Government over the big money.
I do not believe it is too much to ask to be governed with some competence and integrity. This issue should unite all citizens regardless of background.

Guy:Incognito

I would like Irish Water as a company to remain in it's current form

JRant wrote: »

Lucky you. Our match was called off again this week. By the looks of the weather it'll be the new year before we get a game in 😞

Twas only astro. My rugby match fell foul of the weather alright. Well yesterday's weather. The pitch was grand by today.

Stargate

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Phoebas wrote: »

playing fair

Phoebas do you not agree the very 1st pic you posted looks shopped no ?
It doesn't have a natural look to it . I wasn't the only one who questioned it authenticity tbf .

Also can i make the point to you , my remarks re the first photo were made before the other pics and video were posted.

Hence my remark at fairness , which i was trying to be with you cant you see that?

Guy:Incognito

I would like Irish Water as a company to remain in it's current form

masculinist wrote: »

If theres anything I learned its that the government and media love to pit citizens against each other over petty differences. They love to start pointless arguments between farmers and city dwellers etc etc over small change. This is because they fear our growing awareness of the real divide which we have been waking up to which is: Citizens versus incompetent and corrupt Government over the big money.
I do not believe it is too much to ask to be governed with some competence and integrity. This issue should unite all citizens regardless of background.

Surely the incompetence is on the side of the electorate? Vote for a party that has water charges as part of its manifesto then complain 3 years later when water charges come in.

Smidge

moxin wrote: »

D O'Brien(exiled tax billionaire) is a majority shareholder in the Indo and owns under dubious circumstances(that Anglos debt write-off) Siteserv who own GMC the water meter installers. Conflict of interest indeed.

Oh, he owns Newstalk, the Herald, Today FM, FM104 and 50% of the Daily Star and of course Topaz. (he appointed Cowen on their board)

And he is buying up hospitals.
Anyone smell a very Americanised health care system(even more so than it is now)in the workings??

This guy is playing real life Monopoly with OUR country.

JRant

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Twas only astro. My rugby match fell foul of the weather alright. Well yesterday's weather. The pitch was grand by today.

I avoid the astro like the plague. Terrible for the shin splints.

JRant

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Surely the incompetence is on the side of the electorate? Vote for a party that has water charges as part of its manifesto then complain 3 years later when water charges come in.

In fairness lots of people voted Labour and water metering was most definitely not on their manifesto.

Phoebas

Stargate wrote: »

Phoebas do you not agree the very 1st pic you posted looks shopped no ?
It doesn't have a natural look to it . I wasn't the only one who questioned it authenticity tbf .

Also can i make the point to you , my remarks re the first photo were made before the other pics and video were posted.

Hence my remark at fairness , which i was trying to be with you cant you see that?

Your sneering remarks.

Stargate wrote: »

I am so so glad you pointed that out to me in a retort to my post

The INDO , are you serious Phoebas !

BIG BIG LOL

TNX

The thing is that the point I was attempting to make earlier is that the protest wasn't entirely peaceful, and the photo was an illustration of that.
People decided that they didn't like the look of the photo (and btw, I could understand why people thought it was photoshopped) so they could brush the underlying truth aside.

(Some people are still trying to invent the most weird and wonderful alternative explanations for the pictures - there are now multiple pictures - and the video).

AlekSmart

I do not want to pay for water in any way

My name is URL wrote: »

Just putting it out there, but according to this the image is real

http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=2672c334c3c3e173339e56ceda1ece44c7102d81.36309

Though that program can be fooled with a bit of effort

Perhaps it would be worth contacting the Photographer ?

Tony Gavin is no fly by night cameraphone merchant,and I would imagine he would not want to be associated with any manipulation of his work ?

http://www.ppai.ie/photo/1327/Daylight-Robbery?p

The Garda helicopter burnt a LOT of aviation fuel over several hours above the Jobstown incident,with I would imagine a hell of a lot of heli-teli footage to trawl through as a result.

A very interesting day,for sure,and one which may yet prove to be a game changer in this entire situation...the very fine line was almost crossed today

Smidge

JRant wrote: »

From my limited understanding I presume they mean that a Tort is a civil matter rather than a criminal one.

This gives a brief synopsis.

http://lawinireland.wordpress.com/tort-law/

I can't find anything relating to IW workers have the right to enter private property, unlike say the ESB. So in its absence it would be a clear case of trespass.

It's also very clear from the incident that a case of battery could be taken against the person wielding the hose. That kind of force (around 15 meter head) could cause server damge to one's gentleman bits.

Tort is indeed a civil matter and irrelevant in this case. Trespass is a criminal one and was clearly done in that video.
IW are not protected in the same way as ESB to access to a property(although ESB still have to give notice of works on your property)to carry out works.
The mind boggles at people who find no wrong in the actions by the IW workers. So, under their take of things, anyone can come onto your property(and this is just bringing it down to the brass tacks)and do what they please and you as the property owner have no say?
The law can be interpreted, but at the end of the day..the law is the law.
You CANNOT enter a private property for ANY reason without permission form the owner.
If you do you are breaking the law.
Is the law only to be laid on some and not others?
This clearly seems to be the case yet again

Smidge

Also, just wanted to add to my above post......
I have had the same money come into my home over the past number of years.
No pay increases for me or mine. But every single damn year, I have less to spend. Why is that? I CANT be only me. I look at the finances and think WTF???
"Why is there no damn money?"
Because contrary to consumer indexing and all sorts of other bull, everything has gone up. Taxes, charges, ESB, food(I love when they come on RTE and say it has gone down according to so and so. Really??? I know how much milk and bread and shopping cost me a year ago, because I HAVE to KNOW how much it costs as I only have my own money to spend so when my shopping goes up, believe me I know )
People are sick to the back teeth of those who have more and dont know the price of a 2 litre of milk telling us to keep on coughing up.
Thats all very well and good when you have it.
When you dont?
Well thats when people say no more

JRant

Smidge wrote: »

Tort is indeed a civil matter and irrelevant in this case. Trespass is a criminal one and was clearly done in that video.
IW are not protected in the same way as ESB to access to a property(although ESB still have to give notice of works on your property)to carry out works.
The mind boggles at people who find no wrong in the actions by the IW workers. So, under their take of things, anyone can come onto your property(and this is just bringing it down to the brass tacks)and do what they please and you as the property owner have no say?
The law can be interpreted, but at the end of the day..the law is the law.
You CANNOT enter a private property for ANY reason without permission form the owner.
If you do you are breaking the law.
Is the law only to be laid on some and not others?
This clearly seems to be the case yet again

Indeed and seeing as these workers are subcontractors to IW the mater becomes even muddier.

I'm not sure the legisaltion afforded to the ESB would be applicable to subcontractors. Although I could be wrong.

Smidge

JRant wrote: »

Indeed and seeing as these workers are subcontractors to IW the mater becomes even muddier.

I'm not sure the legisaltion afforded to the ESB would be applicable to subcontractors. Although I could be wrong.

I haven't seen anything to say that they are afforded the same rights to entrance as ESB workers anywhere. And if there was, I'm sure someone would have posted it by now

Nodin

Evidently a great deal has happened without me noticing it

"The week that shook Republic to its core

Chilling threats sent to Taoiseach's phone as anarchy hits the streets"
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/the-week-that-shook-republic-to-its-core-30748154.html

I thought it was just heavy rain meself. Does anybody know if Cork has decided to declare itself a republic yet? And is there a las vegas being built in the hills of Donegal?

darkpagandeath

So a few hundred people protesting and 1 guy chucking a brick is anarchy....

Yesterday's protest in Tallaght, which developed into a near riot, has sparked real concern in Government circles that legitimate protests have been exploited to destabilise the State.

Galwayguy35

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Cuttlefish wrote: »

Who drove us there in the first place?

FF

Next question?

garhjw

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Smidge wrote: »

Tort is indeed a civil matter and irrelevant in this case. Trespass is a criminal one and was clearly done in that video.
IW are not protected in the same way as ESB to access to a property(although ESB still have to give notice of works on your property)to carry out works.
The mind boggles at people who find no wrong in the actions by the IW workers. So, under their take of things, anyone can come onto your property(and this is just bringing it down to the brass tacks)and do what they please and you as the property owner have no say?
The law can be interpreted, but at the end of the day..the law is the law.
You CANNOT enter a private property for ANY reason without permission form the owner.
If you do you are breaking the law.
Is the law only to be laid on some and not others?
This clearly seems to be the case yet again

Your wrong. But continue with your immature rant. It's entertaining