The 11 "beautiful" girls on The Saturday Night Show Last Night.

Lux23

How many women are naturally a size zero? As in they don't have to restrict their diet to be that size? I doubt many are at all.

Babooshka

Lux23 wrote: »

How many women are naturally a size zero? As in they don't have to restrict their diet to be that size? I doubt many are at all.

Lots, at age 19. Then metabolism and body changes kick in as they develop hips and asses, and that's how lots of girls start panicking thinking they're getting "fat" when in actual fact nature is just giving them the equipment they need for having babies. Oh...and ballet dancers / athletes out of hectic training schedules.

Dan_Solo

green_screen wrote: »

There's a difference between saying somebody has a boyish figure, and someone has the body of a boy.

There would be, if anybody really meant they thought a boyish shaped woman was a boy, which they aren't.

DoYouEvenLift

Lux23 wrote: »

How many women are naturally a size zero? As in they don't have to restrict their diet to be that size? I doubt many are at all.

Explain that?

Generic Dreadhead

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

Explain that?

They Lift

One eyed Jack

Lux23 wrote: »

I don't get why people are so offended by other people's bodies. So you don't fancy fat girls? Fair enough, nobody is forcing you to. And what is so wrong with a fat person being happy with the way they look? As someone who struggles with their weight every day of their life, I really wish I could be happy being fat. I really do.

It's not other people's bodies at all I find offensive. It's the crass marketing tactics used by modelling agency executives to profit from people's insecurities that I find offensive.

It's the idea of a modelling agency owner promoting the idea that everyone should be confident in themselves no matter what their size, when one of the conditions of employment of the models she used is that in order to continue their employment, they must maintain their size between a size 12-24. Otherwise, well, it was nice having you on the books, but now your gastric band surgery has worked, your services are no longer required.

What I wonder more about actually, is if that were a man on stage promoting these women - would he be seen as being interested in the health and welfare of these women in the same way as that woman claims she is, or would it be easier for people to see the whole thing for what it actually is?

Nothing more than exploiting people's insecurities for profit, disguised as making some nonsense social statement about society's "perception". Society isn't going to change it's attitude towards obesity when the people promoting the idea don't actually believe in it themselves.

Shenshen

denhaagenite wrote: »

I'm not offended by anyone's body, I'm offended when someone tells me they're happy with the way they look, then in the same breath tells me their decision to get a gastric band is a better health choice than my decision to maintain a healthy weight with a balanced diet and some exercise. I do understand that weight loss is a struggle, but having lost around 15 - 20 kilos over the last 2 years I can tell you that it's not impossible and I get a bigger kick out of the fact that I'm in control than I would about being fancied by more people.

Neither is a "better" choice.
Losing weight is not a "one size fits all" procedure. Some people can go on an extremely restrictive diet and lose 30 or 40 kilo within a year. And maintain that.
Some people will start exercising instead, and start losing weight a lot slower. Which is what is currently working for me, but I've still got years (and dozens of kilos) to go.
Others will be better off turning to the medical profession and getting help that way. By a gastric band or other means.

It's a bit like contraceptive that way. Some people are happy on the pill, some people are better off with an implant. Some will rely on condoms, and yet others might go down a surgical route.


I would not ever criticise anyone for the way they choose to approach it.
I've changed my diet some 10 years ago and became vegetarian. And I found that a hell of a lot easier than losing weight. Just to give some of the "all it takes is a bit of willpower" crowd a bit of comparison.

denhaagenite

Shenshen wrote: »

Neither is a "better" choice.

I don't agree. Losing weight slowly, maintaining a healthy weight and concentrating on myself as a whole vs having surgery to make my stomach smaller so that I can't consume whatever number of calories I feel like and will likely result in rapid fat loss and sagging skin.

Shenshen

denhaagenite wrote: »

I don't agree. Losing weight slowly, maintaining a healthy weight and concentrating on myself as a whole vs having surgery to make my stomach smaller so that I can't consume whatever number of calories I feel like and will likely result in rapid fat loss and sagging skin.

Some people don't have the choice. They have to lose the weight fast, because it is already affecting their health.
And I am not going to point a finger at them for choosing the surgery over relying on a possibly less than perfect amount of willpower.

Sagging skin is not a health issue, it's purely aesthetical - which kind of brings us round to people disliking fatties because they don't like the look of them rather than because they're unhealthy.

Tayla

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

An example would be Courtney Cox and Jennifer Anniston. During their time in Friends they were the ultimate"dream girls" for men across the western world. Both of those women have admitted that their body weight was so low during their appearances on that show that their periods had completely stopped. Courtney Cox could not get pregnant and has said she was told that her low BMI may have permanently damaged her fertility and had to increase her weight immediately if she were ever to conceive. She did put on weight and subsequently her fertility problems cleared up.

I googled and couldn't find anything about them admitting their body weight was so low and that their periods stopped, Courtney actually said she got pregnant pretty easily but had multiple miscarriages and it is said that she suffers from an immune disorder.

DoYouEvenLift

denhaagenite wrote: »

I don't agree. Losing weight slowly, maintaining a healthy weight and concentrating on myself as a whole vs having surgery to make my stomach smaller so that I can't consume whatever number of calories I feel like and will likely result in rapid fat loss and sagging skin.

Well, past a certain size people will experience sagging, excess skin whether they lost the weight through surgery or hard work. Only way to get rid of excess loose skin is surgery also. I agree, though.

Barely There

Shenshen wrote: »

Sagging skin is not a health issue, it's purely aesthetical - which kind of brings us round to people disliking fatties because they don't like the look of them rather than because they're unhealthy.

Perhaps on some subconscious level we find fat people offensive because they're consuming more of our resources than necessary?

denhaagenite

Shenshen wrote: »

Some people don't have the choice. They have to lose the weight fast, because it is already affecting their health.
And I am not going to point a finger at them for choosing the surgery over relying on a possibly less than perfect amount of willpower.

Sagging skin is not a health issue, it's purely aesthetical - which kind of brings us round to people disliking fatties because they don't like the look of them rather than because their unhealthy.

I don't dislike fat people at all, let alone because of how they look.

Take, for example, Kelly Osbourne. Chubby teenager, lots were. Taking the p*ss out of Christina Aguilera out of nothing else except jealousy when she's fat and unhappy with herself, then losing loads of weight and laughing at Christina Aguilera when she puts on weight (having a baby, no less). Ugly people are ugly people, and I suspect that the reason Kelly has no understanding of the struggles that normal people have when trying to lose weight is probably because no willpower was required of her- dieticians and personal trainers, probably some surgery involved put paid to that.

People of all shapes and sizes who criticize or exploit other people because of the way that they look are wrong, simple as, and I am a balanced enough person to look beyond a person's appearance when forming an opinion of them. The only healthy method of losing weight is to know that it is not going to change your own opinion of yourself and if you have body/ self confidence/ willpower issues when you're overweight, you'll also have them when you're underweight.

H3llR4iser

beks101 wrote: »

You'll hear that kind of sentiment in the everyday language used among men too. 'Go to the gym you fat b@stard' among a group of friends and they'll all laugh and slag one another right back. And it's at best an affectionate thing, at worst a neutral thing - not nearly loaded with the same judgement and meaning as if the same is said to a woman. Maybe that's the difference. He's just being called fat and it's a fact that he is. He's a fat man, but his character and masculinity is not called into question.

Reverse the genders...and it's almost as if you've failed as a woman. Any woman will tell you the sense of shame and devaluation you feel at being called fat is acute. I've held onto comments like that for decades and I've never even been overweight. It's been used as a weapon against me, a way to degrade, one of the worst possible insults I could receive. Because it's a judgement call. 'FAT' is the opposite of 'feminine' as it has been defined by western culture, by society, by magazines, television, movie stars, barbie dolls, etc etc etc.

Good points, but I'm afraid you fell prey of the "men can just put a stern face, crack a joke and ignore everything" idea that is so prevalent in society.

The reason why overweight men appear to be less affected by their looks than women do is because quite simply they do not exist as men for most people, especially women, and most of them understand itat some point. Most ladies will scoff in horror at the thought of an overweight man approaching them; They'll make sniggering remarks, comments and just get over-the-top nasty - just like they do towards women carrying extra weight, but with the added attitude of "how dare that slob dream I'd ever go near him?". In the end the difference is minimal - he is indeed considered less of a man because of his weight; However, what happens next is that the overweight guy realizes he stands little to no chance at all and simply gives up any hope of ever being taken seriously, be it on the dating scene, work or anything else. Call it a defense mechanism, if you like, but it doesn't mean it's any less hurtful or demeaning than it is for women.

On top of that the media relentless portrayal of fat guys as immature, undesirable, unclean basement dwellers or (at best) as the not-too-bright involuntary funnyman is one of, if not the most offensive that there is - yet nobody bats an eyelid about it.

beks101 wrote: »

And it's true that weight discrimination works both ways - of course it does - who enjoys being called fat? Who enjoys being mocked and cajoled about their weight and missing out on romantic opportunities, work opportunities, LIFE opportunities because of their weight? Both men and women experience that. BUT. The culture at large allows for much less deviation from aesthetic ideals for women that it does for men. We're defined on this sh1t. Our value as women is sold on this 'thin ideal' as early as our formative years and right through adolescence and into our adult lives.

Agree with everything except the part in bold, which is not necessarily true. It can be as anecdotal as you wish, but I do know a lot of guys who like larger -often even morbidly obese- women and would never go for any "average" or "thin" girl; Yet not a single woman who would intentionally pick a fat bloke over an athletic one. Even the ones who say "I like stockier men" mean exactly that - a man who is either naturally built like a tank, or who exercises quite a bit. Not the pot-belly-fat-arse type.

On a more objective and measurable scale, you don't really see many "plus size" male models around; The very few actors that you see are often confined in the roles mentioned above spectacularly confirming the point (when Jonah Hill lost a lot of weight, people were worried he'd be less funny).In art, the male form has almost invariably been portrayed as that of a muscle bound, ripped athlete - from Greek art to current times; Whereas where women were depicted, we've seen everything from clinically obese to worryingly thin.

Last but not least, for a woman it is considered desirable to be thin or average, but not fat. For a man, being thin can be almost as much of a problem as being fat - many of the young guys you meet in a gym are actually there to try and build some mass.

beks101 wrote: »

It's more pronounced and it's less socially acceptable for us to be overweight, even by a couple of pounds, than it is for men. There's even studies done on this stuff, here's one by Yale - which found that women appear to be at risk for discrimination at far lower weights, relative to their size, than men.

Anecdotally this can be true too. I've heard fat men making fun of overweight women as if the men were just fine the way they were. Because they kind of were, they're just men who happen to be a bit fat.

The Yale study is made up of self reported data, and if self reporting objective things like height can go awfully wrong I can't imagine a survey about feelings to be too reliable either. Also, men lie when asked about feelings, as we are mostly worried about appearing weak and unmanly. It's idiotic, but it happens.

One eyed Jack wrote: »

You don't think the exact, and I mean, the exact same thing could be said with regard to women? I mean, what's the most common complaint among men when online dating -

"Damn photoshop, she was massive compared to her pictures!"

Women are an awful lot more forgiving I've found, if a man doesn't live up to her expectations. They'll get over the physical discrepancy a lot easier than a man will.

The problem here is the lie behind. If I like women with an athletic build, I would not go for a very thin or a very large one, as simple as that - and I expect the very same happening from a woman's perspective: if she finds "love handles" disgusting, she'd just skip over and pick a different guy.

Anybody man or woman has a point getting upset if they find out they were deceived by a strategically cropped or expertly photoshopped picture.

sozbox

This normalisation of obesity has to stop. If the same time and effort was put into educating people on proper diet we'd all be much better off as a society.

Real men like women who take care of themselves, and I'd hazard it's the same for women. It's not ok to be obese, it's not ok to take years off your life by choosing to eat poorly, it's not ok to not be able to play with your kids because you can't give up the crisps or to burden your family and the state with unnecessary health bills.

For the vast majority of people a change in diet and moderate exercise is enough to keep them fit and healthy. This is where the focus should be. And don't get me started on this 'oh chocolate is my vice' nonsense. If a food is making you unhealthy stop f**king eating it!

DoYouEvenLift

sozbox wrote: »

This normalisation of obesity has to stop. If the same time and effort was put into educating people on proper diet we'd all be much better off as a society.

Real men like women who take care of themselves, and I'd hazard it's the same for women. It's not ok to be obese, it's not ok to take years off your life by choosing to eat poorly, it's not ok to not be able to play with your kids because you can't give up the crisps or to burden your family and the state with unnecessary health bills.

For the vast majority of people a change in diet and moderate exercise is enough to keep them fit and healthy. This is where the focus should be. And don't get me started on this 'oh chocolate is my vice' nonsense. If a food is making you unhealthy stop f**king eating it!

The only people I feel sorry are the kids born into obese families who are taught and pickup the bad habits the parents practice so they grow up and continue the same cycle unless they decided to change it themselves but when you're taught something from a young age it can be engrained into you and makes it that extra bit harder to change.


Ads like this are pretty good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUmp67YDlHY

One eyed Jack

sozbox wrote: »

This normalisation of obesity has to stop. If the same time and effort was put into educating people on proper diet we'd all be much better off as a society.

Real men like women who take care of themselves, and I'd hazard it's the same for women. It's not ok to be obese, it's not ok to take years off your life by choosing to eat poorly, it's not ok to not be able to play with your kids because you can't give up the crisps or to burden your family and the state with unnecessary health bills.

For the vast majority of people a change in diet and moderate exercise is enough to keep them fit and healthy. This is where the focus should be. And don't get me started on this 'oh chocolate is my vice' nonsense. If a food is making you unhealthy stop f**king eating it!

Who?

The simple use of that phrase put me right off your whole point tbh. I can only speak for myself, and I'm as real a man as you are. We just happen to have different opinions on who we find attractive, but I wouldn't ever assume the authority to preach such simplistic nonsense to anyone, regardless of their gender.

Warper

If people are overweight, so what? what right do other people have to tell them what to do

People should worry about their own lives and stop moaning about other people's choices in life i.e. get a fcuking life of your own

kjl

Warper wrote: »

If people are overweight, so what? what right do other people have to tell them what to do

People should worry about their own lives and stop moaning about other people's choices in life i.e. get a fcuking life of your own

I think if you put yourself in the public eye claiming how beautiful you are despite being unhealthily overweight you are asking for criticism.

jimgoose

sozbox wrote: »

This normalisation of obesity has to stop. If the same time and effort was put into educating people on proper diet we'd all be much better off as a society.

Real men like women who take care of themselves, and I'd hazard it's the same for women. It's not ok to be obese, it's not ok to take years off your life by choosing to eat poorly, it's not ok to not be able to play with your kids because you can't give up the crisps or to burden your family and the state with unnecessary health bills.

For the vast majority of people a change in diet and moderate exercise is enough to keep them fit and healthy. This is where the focus should be. And don't get me started on this 'oh chocolate is my vice' nonsense. If a food is making you unhealthy stop f**king eating it!

This real man likes women with a little bit of topography going on, and likes people who mind their own beeswax and live and let-live even more.

OldNotWIse

Warper wrote: »

If people are overweight, so what? what right do other people have to tell them what to do

People should worry about their own lives and stop moaning about other people's choices in life i.e. get a fcuking life of your own

It's hard to ignore when it's on our televisions.....

Warper

kjl wrote: »

I think if you put yourself in the public eye claiming how beautiful you are despite being unhealthily overweight you are asking for criticism.

Why?

jimgoose

kjl wrote: »

I think if you put yourself in the public eye claiming how beautiful you are despite being unhealthily overweight you are asking for criticism.

Is it not more correct to say that anyone putting themselves in the public eye claiming how beautiful they are is asking for criticism?

jimgoose

OldNotWIse wrote: »

It's hard to ignore when it's on our televisions.....

Unbelievable tripe, and getting worse. Meet my new Universal Remote:

http://www.coltautos.com/images/1911_Navy_109967i.jpg

Shenshen

OldNotWIse wrote: »

It's hard to ignore when it's on our televisions.....

Well, as my mom used to say "That thing has an "off" switch".

OldNotWIse

Shenshen wrote: »

Well, as my mom used to say "That thing has an "off" switch".

I dont actually watch tv, I'm just making the point that you can't put yourelf out there on tv and then expect people not to form an opinion on what you put forward and the messages you try to convey.

your elf hehe heeeeee

miltonkrest

i would !

Generic Dreadhead

miltonkrest wrote: »

i would !

Good to see your 1 post per month put to good use for October

sozbox

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Who?

The simple use of that phrase put me right off your whole point tbh. I can only speak for myself, and I'm as real a man as you are. We just happen to have different opinions on who we find attractive, but I wouldn't ever assume the authority to preach such simplistic nonsense to anyone, regardless of their gender.

That's not my phrase but a reference to the common "real men like curves" meme.

AndreaCollins

Fat women parading themselves as attractive and being lauded for it is still mindboggling to me. I think the point has been reached where a lot of people seem to think that women have more intrinsic value than men generally, which is very sad indeed.