XtraVision refuse to Sell to Xbox Ones without purchase of an additional game

Absolam

BloodBath wrote: »

Any company that deals in physical copies of games or movies will be gone within 5 years. There is no money in it.

I remember that being said when 56k modems came out. I think most of the big publishers acknowledge that physical copies will be around for the foreseeable future; the market is becoming more diverse, and new channels will become more ubiquitous but I don't think physical games will go the way of betamax, or even vhs, just yet...

COYVB

Media size is continuing to increase beyond average manageable speed and bandwidth capabilities making physical copies remain desirable. Some next gen games are equal to the monthly bandwidth of some users, or their speeds are such that it'd take days to download. Until that's no longer the case, retailers will be fine

photofinish

COYVB wrote: »

Media size is continuing to increase beyond average manageable speed and bandwidth capabilities making physical copies remain desirable. Some next gen games are equal to the monthly bandwidth of some users, or their speeds are such that it'd take days to download. Until that's no longer the case, retailers will be fine

Sky and UPC have no downloads limits and the speed I have even 40 Gig files are not a big problem.

Mickeroo

photofinish wrote: »

Sky and UPC have no downloads limits and the speed I have even 40 Gig files are not a big problem.

Well bully for you. Try living in an area where the fastest Internet available is 3mb.

photofinish

Mickeroo wrote: »

Well bully for you. Try living in an area where the fastest Internet available is 3mb.

That can not go on forever even a 4G wireless connection can reach speeds of up to 40mb.

photofinish

Lastly people need to name and shame providers selling 3mb capped connections in this day and age they are only doing if because of lack of competition in particular areas.

UPC can make a profit of this uncapped connection with a phone pack thrown in too.


Anything below 50mb is no longer fit for purpose even without going for digital downloads of games updates are also very big.

Myrddin

photofinish wrote: »

Sky and UPC have no downloads limits and the speed I have even 40 Gig files are not a big problem.

Therefore it's not an issue for many other people?

photofinish

Myrddin wrote: »

Therefore it's not an issue for many other people?

Sky was the first to introduce the uncapped service UPC responded.

Nobody is using dial up anymore and I would guess in 5 years 50mb uncapped will be the minimum.

28064212

photofinish wrote: »

Lastly people need to name and shame providers selling 3mb capped connections in this day and age they are only doing if because of lack of competition in particular areas.

Do you know why UPC aren't competing in these areas? Do you know how the infrastructure of internet connections are provided?

photofinish

The Xbox One day one came with either fifa or Forza and all that was in the box was a download code.

I got Forza which was 38Gig with another 1 Gig update.

If I had a capped service I would have been unable to redeem my free game.

Instead of being angry with people who can avail of a proper internet service people should be getting angry with their ISPs milking customers for a rubbish service in rural areas.

photofinish

28064212 wrote: »

Do you know why UPC aren't competing in these areas? Do you know how the infrastructure of internet connections are provided?

Yes in rural areas there is not the density of population and to run infrastructure out that far is not worth their while.

4G has shown us what is possible on a wireless connection.
Instead of crappy copper ISPs should be forced to provide a decent fast wireless solution uncapped to these areas.

200mb may not be possible but 20 to 30mb is very realistic.

johnny_ultimate

photofinish wrote: »

The Xbox One day one came with either fifa or Forza and all that was in the box was a download code.

I got Forza which was 38Gig with another 1 Gig update.

If I had a capped service I would have been unable to redeem my free game.

Instead of being angry with people who can avail of a proper internet service people should be getting angry with their ISPs milking customers for a rubbish service in rural areas.

Who's being angry with people lucky enough to have good connections It's extremely naive to think a few complaints are going to fix the major infrastructure challenges facing the majority of the country - and it's not just rural areas, it can often be individual houses and areas within large cities and towns. Developing it further involves huge costs and practical challenges that are beyond the capabilities of the service providers in what is a very small country which already offers only a handful of profitable markets. Hell, just look at how poorly the 4G roll out has been handled even in the major cities. I live in Bray, and if I drive a mere five minutes away suddenly I can't even get 3G on my phone.

I'm lucky enough to have a UPC connection, but I wouldn't for a second deny download sizes and speeds are going to be a significant issue for many Irish players as the next-gen kicks off. I'm not for a second saying there shouldn't be more investment in broadband, but it's far from a problem that can be easily solved in a couple of months or even years.

_Redzer_

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Who's being angry with people lucky enough to have good connections It's extremely naive to think a few complaints are going to fix the major infrastructure challenges facing the majority of the country - and it's not just rural areas, it can often be individual houses and areas within large cities and towns. Developing it further involves huge costs and practical challenges that are beyond the capabilities of the service providers in what is a very small country which already offers only a handful of profitable markets. Hell, just look at how poorly the 4G roll out has been handled even in the major cities. I live in Bray, and if I drive a mere five minutes away suddenly I can't even get 3G on my phone.

I'm lucky enough to have a UPC connection, but I wouldn't for a second deny download sizes and speeds are going to be a significant issue for many Irish players as the next-gen kicks off.

I never understood why our infrastructure here was always so piss poor compared to other countries, even of similar population. Who's our minister for communications again? Some clueless 85 year old farmer I'd imagine.

photofinish

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Who's being angry with people lucky enough to have good connections It's extremely naive to think a few complaints are going to fix the major infrastructure challenges facing the majority of the country - and it's not just rural areas, it can often be individual houses and areas within large cities and towns. Developing it further involves huge costs and practical challenges. Hell, just look at how poorly the 4G roll out has been handled even in the major cities. I live in Bray, and if I drive a mere five minutes away suddenly I can't even get 3G on my phone.

I'm lucky enough to have a UPC connection, but I wouldn't for a second deny download sizes and speeds are going to be a significant issue for many Irish players as the next-gen kicks off.

The Xbox One is bandwidth hungry to say the very least.

Xbox One also does a lot of it's updates in the background without the user being aware of it.

The next generation and bandwidth caps are not going to mix.

Bad internet connections at this stage will not be suitable for next gen consoles Netflix Sky On Demand and so on.

28064212

photofinish wrote: »

Yes in rural areas there is not the density of population and to run infrastructure out that far is not worth their while.

4G has shown us what is possible on a wireless connection.
Instead of crappy copper ISPs should be forced to provide a decent fast wireless solution uncapped to these areas.

200mb may not be possible but 20 to 30mb is very realistic.

How much does it cost to roll out a full nationwide 4G network that can handle that large a number of users?

Myrddin

photofinish wrote: »

The Xbox One is bandwidth hungry to say the very least.

Xbox One also does a lot of it's updates in the background without the user being aware of it.

The next generation and bandwidth caps are not going to mix.

Bad internet connections at this stage will not be suitable for next gen consoles Netflix Sky On Demand and so on.

That doesn't change the reality of the situation for many, many people though.

photofinish

28064212 wrote: »

How much does it cost to roll out a full nationwide 4G network that can handle that large a number of users?

Connections are not just for home users business needs an ever increasing amount of bandwidth too.

How much did it cost to bring Electrical power to the whole country or running water or phone lines or roads?

This is something that will have to be done at some point.

Myrddin

photofinish wrote: »

Yes in rural areas there is not the density of population and to run infrastructure out that far is not worth their while

Rural areas... anyway, back in reality:

Taoiseach Enda Kenny declared Ireland the new capital of the digital world today during a massive internet summit in Dublin where thousands of visitors struggled to get online.
Innovators, investors and inventors from around the globe were left unable to showcase their businesses during the event at the RDS after the system apparently collapsed under the weight of internet traffic.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/thousands-gather-ideas-festival-024844285.html#Ib9KSac

No water running that night either

28064212

photofinish wrote: »

Connections are not just for home users business needs an ever increasing amount of bandwidth too.

How much did it cost to bring Electrical power to the whole country or running water or phone lines or roads?

This is something that will have to be done at some point.

So how much is too much? If it would cost €20 billion, should it be done anyway? €50 billion? €100 billion?

Saying it "must" be done is nonsense without considering what that realistically means

photofinish

28064212 wrote: »

So how much is too much? If it would cost €20 billion, should it be done anyway? €50 billion? €100 billion?

Saying it "must" be done is nonsense without considering what that realistically means

In all honesty I have no idea how much it would cost but we are in for a dire future without it.

Thought this thread was about Xtravision

COYVB

photofinish wrote: »

Sky and UPC have no downloads limits and the speed I have even 40 Gig files are not a big problem.

That's great. There's more than Ireland to consider

_Redzer_ wrote: »

I never understood why our infrastructure here was always so piss poor compared to other countries, even of similar population. Who's our minister for communications again? Some clueless 85 year old farmer I'd imagine.

here's the thing, and this surprises a lot of irish people... the internet infrastructure in ireland is actually pretty good compared to some countries. I live in Canada where the major players are charging people 50 quid for 12mb speeds and 50GB bandwidth caps monthly, for example

Internet speeds are all well and good but for the current generation of consoles disc based gaming is the future. The size of the hard drive simply isn't big enough who you realise that most PS4 games will be 40-50 gigs in size. Not only will it take ages to download but who wants a console that they can only have 10 games at any one time.

photofinish

Deleted User wrote: »

Internet speeds are all well and good but for the current generation of consoles disc based gaming is the future. The size of the hard drive simply isn't big enough who you realise that most PS4 games will be 40-50 gigs in size. Not only will it take ages to download but who wants a console that they can only have 10 games at any one time.

On the Xbox One even a disc based game must be fully installed on the Hard Drive anyway.

Being able to switch games and not have to get up to fiddle around with discs is nice.

Also 40Gig on a 200mb connection does not really take that long and you can start playing the game before the full download is complete.

Lastly I don't think it will be long before there are new versions of the PS4 and Xbox One with much larger Hard Drives.

photofinish

gilberto_eire wrote: »

Thought this thread was about Xtravision

It is Xtravision was forcing people to buy a disc based game with their preorder even to people who have fully paid off the console.

They were using the feeble excuse people would need a game to play when all Xbox One games can be downloaded straight to the console.

Many consider a 40Gig download to be way too big but on UPC and Sky which many gamers have files like this are not a big deal.

NTMK

photofinish wrote: »

Many consider a 40Gig download to be way too big but on UPC and Sky which many gamers have files like this are not a big deal.

UPC and sky are exceptions though compared to the most isps (remember Ireland is largely irrelevant for games companies)

downloading 40-60gb of data on a congested 8mb line (usually with a cap too) is painful and the infrastructure in EU/NA is nowhere near up to scratch or ireland for that matter

200mb connections are not common enough to figure into the digital only debate

photofinish

photofinish wrote: »

It is Xtravision was forcing people to buy a disc based game with their preorder even to people who have fully paid off the console.

They were using the feeble excuse people would need a game to play when all Xbox One games can be downloaded straight to the console.

Many consider a 40Gig download to be way too big but on UPC and Sky which many gamers have files like this are not a big deal.

They are still quite the big deal. We have the fastest UPC line and its not all that great. Sure youll have days when stuff flys down but more often than not you'd spend all day waiting for a 40g file to download. Personally I much prefer my games on disc. It's easier, it's cheaper and I know that it's mine to keep and play forever. Digital is all well and good but you can lose your game at any time, if your console gets banned for any reason you're screwed and you can lend it to a friend

MadYaker

Surely this debate belongs in the PS4 vs Xbox One thread?

lertsnim

photofinish wrote: »

Lastly people need to name and shame providers selling 3mb capped connections in this day and age

Providers are not to blame. It is the infrastructure that's to blame for people stuck on extremely slow speeds.

TheDoc

gavmcg92 wrote: »

I'm not suggesting that they price their consoles in such a way that it's not in their interest, nor in such a way that they don't make a profit. I just find it hard to be sympathetic to a retailer because they can't put a 20% 25% etc mark up on something that is quite unprofitable for manufactures to make. Just like Sony and Microsoft making their money on subscription services, retailers have an opportunity to make their profits on physical copies of games.

My view, judging by the comments is a minority one, but I still stand by it.

I'd agree with the sense of trying to be sympathetic, especially in Ireland to retailers. I worked for a sole trader in a niche industry and he played the pity card,a long with all his competitors, and all the other retailers in the country. When justifying his higher prices it was this that the other. When he finally matched prices abroad things started to go well for him and we were making money hand over fist.

The arugement about running a business in Ireland simply isn't valid anymore. The sooner Irish retailers realise they are now dealing and competing with a world/global economy the better. The excuses of old don't wash anymore, you need to get creative with your business to offer competitive pricing while making your profits, or get out of dodge, simple.

There are people that will always support irish commerce, there are those that will alwyas support good customer service and that is fine. However there is just a large portion who care about neither, and care about how they spend their hard earned cash. With such a big price difference with electronics here and abroad, and the ease now at which we can access them, Irish retailers need to shape up, or find themselves going down the line of the rest.

The ****e about blaming everyone else for a retailers high prices, is aboslute bollox to be frank.