Dublin Airport New Runway/Infrastructure.

LXFlyer

As I understand it, the main restriction will be on the northern runway - keeping to an absolute minimum landings towards the west and take offs to the east, thus avoiding overflying the main residential areas of Portmarnock.

trellheim

Yes, you are right. I was half wrong, its either runway for departures when its taking off towards the west, and its only 10R for departures when its taking off towards the east

See sec 3 of these planning conditions https://www.dublinairport.com/docs/default-source/North-Runway-Docs/planning-conditions.pdf?sfvrsn=0

Noxegon

Half the delay was waiting on landing aircraft, so the second runway should help a fair bit.

Idbatterim

New fuel farm opens
https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/dublin-airport's-new-fuel-farm-opens

markpb

Idbatterim wrote: »

New fuel farm opens
https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-news/detail/dublin-airport's-new-fuel-farm-opens

What was the reason for not using the T2 fuel hydrant system earlier?

Also, who came up with the terrible name: fuel "farm"?

Bussywussy

markpb wrote: »

What was the reason for not using the T2 fuel hydrant system earlier?

Also, who came up with the terrible name: fuel "farm"?

Probably because they haven't taken full delivery of the vehicles they've bought at 400K a pop...and they probably prioritise widebody aircraft at the moment, the fueller I was chatting to the other day gave me a good rundown,prefers it than going through the torture of the security gatepost constantly

Fuel 'farm' has being around years.

LiamaDelta

In industry, collections of tanks like that are commonly known as tank farms. So just a variation of it.

LiamaDelta

moloner4 wrote:

Interesting to see they'll be getting rid of the 3 fuel tanks when you enter the airport (2 converted to water and 1 to be knocked down). Is it all going to be underground?

I don't think the tanks are going underground just it's an underground piping and delivery system to the apron.

J6P

Anybody have any further updates on when the building of the new runway is due to begin?

Am i right in thinking its still held up in the courts?

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/rural-life/farming-under-dublin-airports-new-flight-path-the-buildings-vibrate-and-its-impossible-to-hear-anyone-talk-36713423.html

"Residents sought to appeal the court's dismissal of their case. Their arguments had included that the development was illegal and that Fingal Council failed to consider or address their concerns about its effect on their homes and lands.

The residents who are affected by the new airport have appealed the High Court decision and an outcome is due in the next couple of weeks."

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/shane-ross-accused-delaying-priority-14477272

Minister Shane Ross is delaying "priority" projects because he is meddling in other departments, according to the opposition.

"Deputy Robert Troy, the Fianna Fail spokesman on Transport, has attacked the Minister who he believes is delaying legislation to enable the second runway at Dublin Airport."

Donegal Storm

J6P wrote: »

Anybody have any further updates on when the building of the new runway is due to begin?

Am i right in thinking its still held up in the courts?

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/rural-life/farming-under-dublin-airports-new-flight-path-the-buildings-vibrate-and-its-impossible-to-hear-anyone-talk-36713423.html

"Residents sought to appeal the court's dismissal of their case. Their arguments had included that the development was illegal and that Fingal Council failed to consider or address their concerns about its effect on their homes and lands.

The residents who are affected by the new airport have appealed the High Court decision and an outcome is due in the next couple of weeks."

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/shane-ross-accused-delaying-priority-14477272

Minister Shane Ross is delaying "priority" projects because he is meddling in other departments, according to the opposition.

"Deputy Robert Troy, the Fianna Fail spokesman on Transport, has attacked the Minister who he believes is delaying legislation to enable the second runway at Dublin Airport."

The high court appeal was thrown out in February and the appellants were ordered to pay costs so I'd say thats the end of that.

The legislation is presumably for the noise regulator, Fingal Council were appointed but it seems they're still waiting on legislation. I don't see why that'd delay the start but maybe tender details can't be finalised until its all sorted..?

Last I heard, the main works tender is to go out before the summer with construction to start in Q4. That was a good 6 months ago though so I wouldn't be surprised if things have been delayed once again.


In other news, the privately operated Terminal 3 has gone in for planning...

The partnership behind plans to build a third terminal at Dublin airport has begun talks with An Bord Pleanala about pushing ahead with the multimillion-euro project, writes Philip Connolly.

Last week the planning body said that Denis Mullane, a director of Tri-Aviation Project Co, the holding company behind the development, had submitted a pre-application consultation to discuss the “third terminal and associated infrastructure” at the proposed new Western Campus.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/plans-for-third-airport-terminal-set-to-fly-again-wzsbdd58b?t=ie

jamo2oo9

Donegal Storm wrote: »

The high court appeal was thrown out in February and the appellants were ordered to pay costs so I'd say thats the end of that.

The legislation is presumably for the noise regulator, Fingal Council were appointed but it seems they're still waiting on legislation. I don't see why that'd delay the start but maybe tender details can't be finalised until its all sorted..?

Last I heard, the main works tender is to go out before the summer with construction to start in Q4. That was a good 6 months ago though so I wouldn't be surprised if things have been delayed once again.


In other news, the privately operated Terminal 3 has gone in for planning...



https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/plans-for-third-airport-terminal-set-to-fly-again-wzsbdd58b?t=ie

Can you post the full article as paywall is blocking me

G_R

jamo2oo9 wrote: »

Can you post the full article as paywall is blocking me

MENU
friday april 20 2018
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BUSINESS
Plans for third airport terminal set to fly again
Philip Connolly
April 8 2018, 12:01am, The Sunday Times

Tricap Investments have committed €35m to the proposed Terminal Three project

The partnership behind plans to build a third terminal at Dublin airport has begun talks with An Bord Pleanala about pushing ahead with the multimillion-euro project, writes Philip Connolly.

Last week the planning body said that Denis Mullane, a director of Tri-Aviation Project Co, the holding company behind the development, had submitted a pre-application consultation to discuss the “third terminal and associated infrastructure” at the proposed new Western Campus.

Tricap Investments, a Dubai finance group, has committed to advancing up to €35m to resurrect Ulick and Des McEvaddy’s proposed Terminal Three project at the airport.

Tri-Aviation owns land comprising a total of 128 acres at Huntstown and Dunbro Lane around Ireland’s largest airport. It wants approval to push ahead with the project despite opposition from DAA, which has previously played down the need for a new terminal.

The McEvaddys, who set up Omega Aviation in the early 1980s, have long sought to develop the site and said it is the best option to expand the airport amid growing passenger numbers.


In 2016 a report compiled for the Department of Transport recommended the state should promote more competition by facilitating competing terminals or even a competing airport.

faoiarvok

G_R wrote: »

Tri-Aviation owns land comprising a total of 128 acres at Huntstown and Dunbro Lane around Ireland’s largest airport. It wants approval to push ahead with the project despite opposition from DAA, which has previously played down the need for a new terminal.

I find it really hard to understand how this would work in practice. It sounds like me owning land next to McDonalds, deciding to build and open a building with extra seating, and then somehow forcing McDonalds to serve food in my building as well as theirs.

I guess that airlines could decide they want to use the new building instead of DAA’s, but that would still rely on DAA incorporating the new building into their airfield, wouldn’t it?

I’m not trying to advance any agenda here, just really struggling to understand how a third party can build a third terminal that the company that owns the airport doesn’t wish to exist?

IRLConor

faoiarvok wrote: »

I’m not trying to advance any agenda here, just really struggling to understand how a third party can build a third terminal that the company that owns the airport doesn’t wish to exist?

I presume that they have some current or planned leverage against DAA. Maybe they think they can get the government to pressure DAA to open up?

Stephen Strange

IRLConor wrote: »

I presume that they have some current or planned leverage against DAA. Maybe they think they can get the government to pressure DAA to open up?

Or are trying to up the price of their own land for future sale.

Jamie2k9

IRLConor wrote: »

I presume that they have some current or planned leverage against DAA. Maybe they think they can get the government to pressure DAA to open up?

Goverment wouldn't force it (well if any TD wants to keep their seat), the only support would be from Shane Ross. I really cannot see how they think they have a chance.

Or are trying to up the price of their own land for future sale.

CPU would sort it out.
____
One possible scenario could be they build and lease to daa to run/operate it.

Its just very hard to see them getting very far with the way things stand now but they do appear rather serious about it.

medoc

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

CPU would sort it out.
____
One possible scenario could be they build and lease to daa to run/operate it.

Seems like the most sensible option would be some sort of long term lease of the completed terminal if they couldn’t buy the land and develop it themselves. The DAA would probably need to be involved in the design anyway or at least have some input on the airside design if it was to be independently operated.

Donegal Storm

DAA mentioned recently that they were looking at a new terminal where the Dublin Aerospace hanger is at the moment, assuming that its feasible there wouldn't even be a need for a mid field terminal in the medium term. It'd also be far more favourable in linking with the proposed metro station which is to be located around the zone 16 bus area afaik.

Jamie2k9

Donegal Storm wrote: »

DAA mentioned recently that they were looking at a new terminal where the Dublin Aerospace hanger is at the moment, assuming that its feasible there wouldn't even be a need for a mid field terminal in the medium term. It'd also be far more favourable in linking with the proposed metro station which is to be located around the zone 16 bus area afaik.

Not T3 but rather expanding of Pier 1 gates (approx 20) stands (narrow body). Hanger 5 & 6 to be relocated (building between them staying). Long term project and possibly in two phases.

billie1b

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Not T3 but rather expanding of Pier 1 gates (approx 20) stands (narrow body). Hanger 5 & 6 to be relocated (building between them staying). Long term project and possibly in two phases.

They way I read it was that Hangar 6 was staying and the new extension would be up as far as Hangar 5 and Hangars 1-5 sould be demolished and moved to an an area over by the land around the area of the new runway

Bussywussy

billie1b wrote: »

They way I read it was that Hangar 6 was staying and the new extension would be up as far as Hangar 5 and Hangars 1-5 sould be demolished and moved to an an area over by the land around the area of the new runway

That's what I heard too

Jamie2k9

billie1b wrote: »

They way I read it was that Hangar 6 was staying and the new extension would be up as far as Hangar 5 and Hangars 1-5 sould be demolished and moved to an an area over by the land around the area of the new runway

I didn't pay much attention to detail but it would make sense to keep it.

6 is to stay. New apron is called 5H and will look similar to 5G. The plan is to extend a similar pier to pier 1 around towards the hangars to service these stands. Lap B to move to an expanded west apron and extra stands for GA and overnighted that used to use 11/29 on west apron.

Donegal Storm

How many stands would that add? T1 won't be far off 20m pax this year so surely another pier would put a lot of strain on the terminal?

I know improvements have been made but we all remember what a congested mess 20m+ was like 10 years ago

Jamie2k9

Donegal Storm wrote: »

How many stands would that add? T1 won't be far off 20m pax this year so surely another pier would put a lot of strain on the terminal?

I know improvements have been made but we all remember what a congested mess 20m+ was like 10 years ago

Remember check in has capacity, new security as previously discussed. Expanded immigration on the way. The big issue is stands/gates.

Ryanair say the current T1 hourly capacity as agreed by all stakeholders can and should be higher because the capacity is there.

roadmaster

Donegal Storm wrote: »

DAA mentioned recently that they were looking at a new terminal where the Dublin Aerospace hanger is at the moment, assuming that its feasible there wouldn't even be a need for a mid field terminal in the medium term. It'd also be far more favourable in linking with the proposed metro station which is to be located around the zone 16 bus area afaik.

I wonder is that going to happen sooner than taught as the DAA are currently hiring project managers for piers and terminals. The jobs could be just for upgrade works to the existing infastructure but.

Jamie2k9

roadmaster wrote: »

I wonder is that going to happen sooner than taught as the DAA are currently hiring project managers for piers and terminals. The jobs could be just for upgrade works to the existing infastructure but.

5H will happen without the pier anyway as part of runway works. I would agree I could see boarding area 5-6 years however I suspect time will depend on leases and negotiations which will take time.

The next round o capital spend/charges will be decided over the next 18 months so it may be included or provisions made for it on meeting certain conditions.

plodder

How would you link a third terminal on the western side to the proposed metro station (and the other terminals obviously)? Regardless of who owns/runs/builds it, you would have to solve that problem before it's a runner I'd have thought. Would it need a tunnel (for buses) under 16/34?

Chris_5339762

By the looks of it they're shoving the metro station (on current plans anyway) underneath the T2 surface carparks, so don't hold out hope of them doing anything sensible.

plodder

I suppose if you were building T2 now, then the plan would include the metro station inside/under the terminal. But, you can't do that after it's built. It has to go somewhere you can dig a big trench without disturbing airport operations too much and I'd say that's why that car park is where it has to go.