Just 1 more trying to go sub 4

menoscemo

Beef wrote: »

I was going to rely on energy drinks and water / salt tablets



I didn't - I just had the one, I hate the things to be honest. They don't sit right in my stomach. Maybe I do need to practice more maybe.
Would this be normal if you don't keep guzzling them back?

It's very personal but I can only say it took me ages before I found a gel I could stomach.

Are you happy drinking energy drink from the course? Do you know what drink they give in Manchester and have you practised it?
Just the standard q's.....I personally can never stomach energy drinks mid run but everyone is different...

Gavlor

Beef wrote: »

I was going to rely on energy drinks and water / salt tablets



I didn't - I just had the one, I hate the things to be honest. They don't sit right in my stomach. Maybe I do need to practice more maybe.
Would this be normal if you don't keep guzzling them back?

Just avoid the stodgy gels.


I've recently changed to high5 isogel and have not had any issues yet

Beef

menoscemo wrote: »

It's very personal but I can only say it took me ages before I found a gel I could stomach.

Are you happy drinking energy drink from the course? Do you know what drink they give in Manchester and have you practised it?
Just the standard q's.....I personally can never stomach energy drinks mid run but everyone is different...

It's something I'm going to have to give more thought to. They are giving out 'shot bloks'. I might order some and try them...

Gavlor wrote: »

Just avoid the stodgy gels.


I've recently changed to high5 isogel and have not had any issues yet

That's the one I used today. To be fair I stomached it reasonably okay - maybe I just didn't take enough of them...

Thanks for the pointers - I need to get this nailed down in the next week or so...

Beef

Sunday 09/03
4 miles easy @ 9:40 mpm

This was a lovely easy amble in good weather. Slight touch of DOMS in the legs from yesterday, so this jog should help iron out the legs.


53 miles for the week. I would have snapped the arm off you for a total like that at the start of the week with the way I felt.

Big week coming up though!

Week Miles |Month Miles | Year Miles
53 | 57 | 411

Beef

Jaysis, what a couple of days in work! Started yesterday morning at 07:40, finished up at 21:00! :eek:

Managed to get out at 21:20 for a run and I badly needed it. Lovely crisp spring night, I was a new man after it. This is why we run.

Monday 10/03
4.85 miles @ 9:26 pace

Didn't look at the watch at all for this one, kept things nice and easy. Lovely evening for it.

Tuesday 11/03
5.25 miles @ 9:37 pace

Session tomorrow night. I reckon it will be one of very few sessions I've done in this training block that hasn't been done in torrential rain or howling winds. I'm almost looking forward to it. Almost.

Beef

I'm putting off the long run till Sunday so I decided to give it holly tonight for the session. And it felt great.

The plan was for 2 warm up followed by an alternating session for 10 miles (MP - 30 secs/MP + 30 secs) and 2 miles cool down.

2 miles warmup: 9:26,9:30
10 miles alternating: 7:59,8:29,7:54,8:31,7:41,8:44,7:56,8:27,7:33,8:35
2.35 miles cool down: 9:08,9:07,9:22

14.35 miles in total.

So I didn't really follow the plan but I felt great all the way through and I'll do a recovery tomorrow. Off to Kilkenny on Friday night with Mrs Beef.

Last weekend of beer before Manchester! Squeaky bum time!

Beef

So there I was eating my dinner when I realised I was chewing on a filling. :eek:
Part of the tooth subsequently snapped so I'm booked into my dentist for tomorrow. I hope its not a root canal! Feels like one thing after another at the moment.
3 mile recovery run tonight to ease out the legs. Tbh they felt grand and I had to slow myself down.

Beef

Friday 14/03
4.8 miles easy to steady 9mpm

Left knee felt a little dodgy at the start of this - but it was grand by the time I finished. One advantage of going to the dentist today is that I could work from home and spend my normal commute time running. Silver linings and all that.

Now a question for Meno or career_move (or any of the experienced guys really!). For my 22 mile long run on Sunday - I was hoping to mix it up a bit. I've gone for the 10 easy | 10 MP | 2 cool down format of the run - but I'd like to do it in the following way:

4 easy 4 MP
3 easy 3 MP
2 easy 2 MP
1 easy 1 MP
cool down/die

Would that give me the same benefit as doing 10 easy with 10 MP straight after?

Thanks in advance!

Gavlor

Beef wrote: »

Friday 14/03
4.8 miles easy to steady 9mpm

Left knee felt a little dodgy at the start of this - but it was grand by the time I finished. One advantage of going to the dentist today is that I could work from home and spend my normal commute time running. Silver linings and all that.

Now a question for Meno or career_move (or any of the experienced guys really!). For my 22 mile long run on Sunday - I was hoping to mix it up a bit. I've gone for the 10 easy | 10 MP | 2 cool down format of the run - but I'd like to do it in the following way:

4 easy 4 MP
3 easy 3 MP
2 easy 2 MP
1 easy 1 MP
cool down/die

Would that give me the same benefit as doing 10 easy with 10 MP straight after?

Thanks in advance!

I doubt if there is anything wrong with that, it's a good session and will stand to you.

Personally speaking I'd rather get in the mp miles consecutively. But then again I currently have the hip of an 87 yr old as a result

menoscemo

Beef wrote: »

Friday 14/03
4.8 miles easy to steady 9mpm

Left knee felt a little dodgy at the start of this - but it was grand by the time I finished. One advantage of going to the dentist today is that I could work from home and spend my normal commute time running. Silver linings and all that.

Now a question for Meno or career_move (or any of the experienced guys really!). For my 22 mile long run on Sunday - I was hoping to mix it up a bit. I've gone for the 10 easy | 10 MP | 2 cool down format of the run - but I'd like to do it in the following way:

4 easy 4 MP
3 easy 3 MP
2 easy 2 MP
1 easy 1 MP
cool down/die

Would that give me the same benefit as doing 10 easy with 10 MP straight after?

Thanks in advance!

That looks like a fine workout. Good luck with it!! In some ways that is harder than 10 straight at MP 9with all the change of pace), will give you a great traiing stimulus.

Beef

Excellent - thanks lads. I think the change in pace will be tough alright but it should break the monotony of 2 'pace blocks' if you know what I mean. That's what I enjoyed about the sessions in this plan - there was lots of variety in them to keep things fresh.

Thanks again!

RedRunner

good luck with that run Beef.

Beef

RedRunner wrote: »

good luck with that run Beef.

Thanks RR, I'll need every bit of it!

Back from the dentist - he just refilled the tooth, and filled another one while he was there.

No anesthetic or anything though so happy days!

AuldManKing

menoscemo wrote: »

That looks like a fine workout. Good luck with it!! In some ways that is harder than 10 straight at MP 9with all the change of pace), will give you a great traiing stimulus.

+1 - its difficult to get going again after easing off. But doing it 4/3/2/1 as opposed to 1/2/3/4 will help that mentally.

Best of luck with it.

Beef

Delighted to report that the run went great. Tired at the end but that's to be expected after 22 I suppose! Hit all the MP miles and had some Steady miles there too. On the phone now so will put up the mile times tomo maybe.

Also, Liverpool have done the business, Ireland did the business last nite and I'm going for a few pints at 5. Not a bad weekend so far!

Edit - mile times:

4 + 4: 9:43,10:00,9:59,9:27 ---- 8:32,8:24,8:24,8:26
3 + 3: 9:09,9:13,9:19 ---- 8:35,8:15,8:23
2 + 2: 9:11,9:03 ---- 8:26,8:29
1 + 1: 8:52 ---- 8:24

2 steadyish miles to finish
9:07,8:53

Beef

Tuesday 18/03
5.25 miles easy @ 9:12 mpm

Left hamstring feels a bit tight today so I'm booked in to get it looked at on Saturday morning. I'll do 4 miles easy tonight and then the 14 at MP tomorrow night. Was going to do it tonight but I think another easy night might do no harm after the long run on Sunday last.

The doubts are already starting to surface about going for 3:45 and I'm not even in taper properly yet!
The training this year has gone great so far other than the step back week that I was sick for. Am I just getting the pre-race jitters a little early? The run tomorrow night will hopefully put my mind at ease.

menoscemo

You've done loads of MP miles so far. The final 14 will just be the icing on the cake. Basically don't be afraid to stop if you feel any tightness tomorrow. The last thing you need now is a torn hamstring. Be ultra conservative from here on.

AuldManKing

menoscemo wrote: »

You've done loads of MP miles so far. The final 14 will just be the icing on the cake. Basically don't be afraid to stop if you feel any tightness tomorrow. The last thing you need now is a torn hamstring. Be ultra conservative from here on.

+1
Being honest, I'm surprised your doing 14 MP miles 2.5 weeks out from a key marathon.
The 4/3/2/1 session should be a good enough confidence build for you.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think you'll get the physiological benefits within the 2.5 weeks - but the psychological benefits may outweigh that??

Just my opinion.Meno or CM may be able to advise differently.

career_move

AuldManKing wrote: »

+1
Being honest, I'm surprised your doing 14 MP miles 2.5 weeks out from a key marathon.
The 4/3/2/1 session should be a good enough confidence build for you.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think you'll get the physiological benefits within the 2.5 weeks - but the psychological benefits may outweigh that??

Just my opinion.Meno or CM may be able to advise differently.

I did 12m @ MP 2 weeks before Limerick and then 8m @ MP the week before. I was in good form though and I can't remember having any niggles at the time. I don't think it's essential - as Meno says you've plenty of MP miles in the bag and that last long run was super. The main thing now is getting to the start line feeling 100%

menoscemo

AuldManKing wrote: »

+1
Being honest, I'm surprised your doing 14 MP miles 2.5 weeks out from a key marathon.
The 4/3/2/1 session should be a good enough confidence build for you.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont think you'll get the physiological benefits within the 2.5 weeks - but the psychological benefits may outweigh that??

Just my opinion.Meno or CM may be able to advise differently.

You're wrong because it's my plan
I am not one for 3 week tapers. 2.5 weeks is plenty IMO

Seriously though It is only one run in the grand scheme all the same so only do it if fit. I think you have done 95%+ of the training which is absolutely loads. I think with any training programme if you can do more than 80% you are flying. I am generally lucky to get 50 % of my training done . Yourself and RedRunner are putting me to shame.

AuldManKing

menoscemo wrote: »

You're wrong because it's my plan
I am not one for 3 week tapers. 2.5 weeks is plenty IMO

Seriously though It is only one run in the grand scheme all the same so only do it if fit. I think you have done 95%+ of the training which is absolutely loads. I think with any training programme if you can do more than 80% you are flying. I am generally lucky to get 50 % of my training done . Yourself and RedRunner are putting me to shame.

If its in the plan then it should be fine - I took it for an off plan thing in response to missing other training.
In Meno we trust! (just not with his own training)

Beef

The world is going to eat itself. RunningAuldManKing is dispensing advice to steer clear of running MP miles and Meno and career_move are saying the opposite. :pac:

Wednesday 19/03
4 miles easy w/strides

I had a couple of miles done and the leg felt grand so I threw in a few controlled strides to see if there was any reaction from the leg. None - so I took it as a good sign and jogged home. I think I'll chance at least some MP miles tonight - but I won't start off at MP like the plan says. I'd feel more comfortable doing a mile or so warmup and then throwing in a few. I'll see where I am then after the physio on Saturday.

Thanks for the advice folks.

Beef

Thursday 20/03
12 miles w/ 11 @ MP
8:38,8:34,8:25,8:17,8:19,8:19,8:24,8:34,8:32,8:20,8:17 + 9:19 back home.

I was going grand but the hamstring got a little tight towards the end so I cut this short. Will rest completely tomorrow and see how I am after a rub on Saturday morning. I stretched it out after my shower also.
I don't think it's too bad but at this stage I don't want to take any chances.

overpronator

Nice job, look after yourself from here and it's in the bag, well done with your training.

Beef

Back from a good oul rub down and he didn't hold back! I was advised not to run today so I'll take another enforced rest day. A bit of a knot in the left hamstring that took some slightly more 'heavy duty' work - but other than that just a bit on the uncomfortable side and the legs feel good. I booked in for a loosener next Saturday also - so hopefully the legs will be in fine fettle. Now - I just need to get the zip fixed in my isolation chamber.

RedRunner

Great stuff Beef. Good sense to cut it short on Thursday. The rub down will have that hammer sorted no bother. All easy stuff for you now. Looking forward to seeing how you get on in Manchester as we have such similar goals. I'm confident you'll do the biz there and will be very drunk celebrating with AMK at the end of the night!:)

Beef

So after 2 days off I managed to get a run in yesterday.

Sunday 23/03
13.5 miles @ 10:17 mpm

I decided to be extra sensible and met my sister for her final long run so it was run at a very easy pace of 10:30 ish for the first 10 miles. She wasn't feeling the best (taper cold) so I did another 3 and a half on my own slightly quicker (9:31,9:51,8:23,8:47). Hamstring felt a little bit tender - but that is surface tenderness as much as anything I think. I'll stretch it out again this evening after an easy run.

Sorry to annoy you again Meno - I had planned to do a 10k yesterday but decided not to, with the niggle. Could I replace this weeks session with a bit of a blow out or am I looking for trouble? I wouldn't mind doing a long tempo getting up to 10 K pace or something. Maybe I'm being silly though, so near the race?

Gavlor

Beef wrote: »

So after 2 days off I managed to get a run in yesterday.

Sunday 23/03
13.5 miles @ 10:17 mpm

I decided to be extra sensible and met my sister for her final long run so it was run at a very easy pace of 10:30 ish for the first 10 miles. She wasn't feeling the best (taper cold) so I did another 3 and a half on my own slightly quicker (9:31,9:51,8:23,8:47). Hamstring felt a little bit tender - but that is surface tenderness as much as anything I think. I'll stretch it out again this evening after an easy run.

Sorry to annoy you again Meno - I had planned to do a 10k yesterday but decided not to, with the niggle. Could I replace this weeks session with a bit of a blow out or am I looking for trouble? I wouldn't mind doing a long tempo getting up to 10 K pace or something. Maybe I'm being silly though, so near the race?

If you're looking for a bit of an injection of pace the why not throw in a few 3 or 400's @ slightly slower than 10k pace? Easy miles before and after. I'd wait till later in the week though.

menoscemo

I think there is no need for such work whenever you have a tight hamstring. I know it's boring but be sensible maybe do a few strides (which you should be regularly doing anyway ).
If you want you could do what gavlor suggests or maybe a set or two of Pyramid Strides (20 seconds, 40 seconds, 1 minute, 90 seconds, 1 minute, 40 seconds, 20 seconds with equal jog recovery). You should do the pyramid strides around 5k pace, no faster.

overpronator

Good advice from Gavlor I reckon, listen to that hammer carefully though, they can go from tender to shredded in seconds as I've experienced more than once