Red Luas line should be closed

KD345

ShaneScouse wrote: »

Now you mention buses Im just waiting for some smart fellow to create a thread about how theres more problems on the buses used in some west and northside suburbs that take 20k a day compared to one in dalkey that takes 475 daily and goes past less schools.

Not trying to be that smart fellow , but what you've posted above is true. For example, buses on routes like the 13 and 40 suffer greater vandalism than those on the 16 or 145. All of which have a similar frequency and carry similar passenger numbers.

To be fair, nobody is really pinpointing any particular area as being the problem here. I'd like to think I'm a decent person living in one of the places mentioned in this thread, but I accept that there are serious anti social issues affecting passengers. When you read that three quarters of the incidents reported occur on the red line, the figures speak for themselves.

n97 mini

ShaneScouse wrote: »

I didn't say it did take 3 times more, I said thousands more, which is true something like 10k a day more then green iirc?

10k, which is 28%, with 300% more anti social behaviour.

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

As I've said it before, proper transport police which are an arm of the Gardaí, is the only solution.

The normal police although can't handle these troublemakers on the streets and the courts are not dealing with the issue(which is of course political) so what makes people think that pouring money the counry does not have into a dedicated transport police will be any use at all when all signs are pointing to them being about as ineffective against anti-social behaviour as the current force?

The only way to stop this is to bar the troublemakers from using or even entering buses trams and trains, The bye-laws are in place for this but all the operators seem to be ignoring this option. Why is that?

When a barred person gets on a tram/bus/train everything must stop and an announcement made identifying the troublemaker and stating that the vehicle WILL NOT MOVE while this person is on board and let the other passengers make life very uncomfortable for the scumbags!

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

When a barred person gets on a tram/bus/train everything must stop and an announcement made identifying the troublemaker and stating that the vehicle WILL NOT MOVE while this person is on board and let the other passengers make life very uncomfortable for the scumbags![/B]

Yeah, and you can imagine all the fun they've have with holding up trams just for giggles. Not gonna work.

ShaneScouse

Rub a dub dub, cat in my tub

n97 mini

300% more, as it has 3 times more. Your maths aint great!

n97 mini

n97 mini wrote: »

300% more, as it has 3 times more. Your maths aint great!

3 times as many = 200% more. Just to be clear.

ShaneScouse

Well now, it would appear i half arsed read your post and was thinking whats this lad on about 300%, 75% of the problems were on the red line.
Ill just slink away slowly now..

(and ye its 200%, if john has kicked 2 kittens, but bill has kicked 6 kittens. he has kicked 3 times as many as john, 4 more, 2 being the original so 200% as its 2x100%)

Delancey

Had to reluctantly travel on the Red Line last week - junkies all over it selling drugs , thats right the LUAS is now the equivalent of the boardwalk. Shame the way a handful of scumbags are allowed destroy it.

dermo88

Aside from transport, I think its been a long time since I had one of my nice neo-nazi right wing rants. If its offensive, I'll edit it. But this is how I see it, agree to disagree.

---

OBSERVATION:

The problem starts from childhood. All too often their parents placated their litle ba$tard with a concoction of Yop Yoghurt, Tayto and Coke, while they proceeded to watch Man United and get pissed in the pub while their 'high spirited' 'free spirited' little ba$tard surrounded by Wayne and Waynetta's other little ba$tards proceeded to be 'free spirited' and annoy everyone in the process. I'm pretty sure we are on Generation 3 of social welfare dependent ba$tards, if we consider the first one who created it were thrown on the economic scrapheap by the 1974 oil crisis, when their kids were around 10 or so, and the current batch of breeders have been thoroughly shafted by economic circumstances since 2008. We all know one thing. The devil makes work for idle hands.

Now we have a whole industry of Lawyers and clinical psychologists dedicated to creating excuses for them. Of course, you know I can be quite rude and vindictive, to give an example, it was my last day working as a barman in 1995. Finally, after 3 years, someone was going to get told a few home truths. And I was going to enjoy every minute for being described as 'posh boy' and 'fag%ot'

---

EXPERIENCE; Sept 1995, Dublin.

Overhearing a conversation complaining about Thatcher.....as I dropped off their order of copious amounts of 'Bud", Volka...Red Bull and Ritz"....Classy huh.

"Its okay Jacinteh. What would you know about the working class, beyond spreading your legs to drop another useless ba$tard from your fanny who'll end up with a needle stuck in his arm. But thats fine, because de 'real working class' like my mates and I will be paying for it. Which is more than you know how to do. As for calling me ******, West Brit, snob, as soon as I get my degree, Ill be out of this effing dump, and I will go somewhere else. Somewhere where I will never ever have to put up with dirt like you. I may as well say it now Jacinteh, you love living in ignorance, and take pride in it. You love your little ba$tards by three different men who rode you, but they are always right, they got all they wanted, and now where are they. The Joy.....one. Wheatfield...two. Three....I had to chuck out because he was underage, and you did'nt listen.....13 and hes tried to come into a pub for a drink.....where is that money coming from? Another coke deal? A burglary? The other three.....are'nt they lovely.....free spirited. Give em Yop, coke and crisps. It will be fine. We'll pay you, you pay Ladbrokes, then you pay the Bar, which pays me. Good..... Jesus Christ, in a sane world you'd be sterlised after Conor (the eldest). 6 kids......6 effing kids.....you scare me". Don't even think I don't know what goes on, I've watched, and you've insulted me. I'd make it my aim, I'd swear on my Grandmothers grave to destroy you, but I pity you more than I hate you, because you are not intelligent, you're just a stupid waste of space. A vacuum fanny. Nothing else"

In front of all her mates. She starts bawling crying. All her mates started laughing. The wagon deserved it, because brat number three was in 'hostipal' after not paying his dealer (I did'nt know that, but talk about an oddly sadistic holding in laughter moment when I did find out and had to be diplomatic about the violent thug). "OOh......How sad.....". Pity he did'nt finish the job. She complained to the pub manager. The pub manager (Jesus Dermo, I still have to live with these people, their money is the only thing that keeps me sane) came down to me. I went to apologise.

Which I did.....before explaining my rationale. And yes.....its my last day. Freedom. I'll never ever ever have to deal with such horrible, backward, knuckle dragging mongs again in my life. Apart from the odd Saudi who I'll accidentally deliberately over-invoice for obnoxious-4uckerism, and pocket the difference for the sheer displeasure of ever dealing with them. The good thing is they have so much they don't notice.

A few weeks later I was met by some of her decent acquaintances who were there. The ones who don't sound like an Angry Bird flying towards pigs.

"Jeez D, that was classic, the night of the Man U game. You said what we all wanted to say for years, but were afraid to tell the silly wagon"

My revenge on here was better than that. Vacuum fanny became her nickname. I am proud to say I coined it.....
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

SOLUTION:

A few belts of hurleys and baseball bats from vigilantes is the only thing these people understand. They are animals, nothing less, and the only place they have on rails is in a cattle truck (Those who know me long enough know which defunct European Railway company I recommend for the job).

These people are the reason why Dubliners were denied decent public transport for decades. It was all about respect. If the people don't have respect, then they won't have it. But until Dubliners realise that these scummers caused it, and need to be eliminated, by fair means or foul, the problem will remain. The sad thing is, only 2% of the population ruined it for the decent honest ones out there. That 2% created a pack herd mentality and influenced another 15%, and in the no-hope ghettoes of West Tallaght, Clondalkin, Blanchardstown, Coolock, Ballymun. I nearly became one of those 15%, and 3 hours in a jail cell at 15 soon stopped that nonsense. I dread to even think, how many more lived in fear of them. The Gardai, sadly know who they are, but cannot do anything about it, being....after all....bound by legal procedure and human rights considerations.

God, I am such a right wing fascist.......and its my experience thats caused it. My friends turned out decent, as for myself.....being a racist keyboard right wing fascist is not brave or anything to be proud of. But don't worry, one day I'll stand, hold hands with de Jacinteh's of de wurld, sing Kumbayah, and say love, peace and equality. But thats also the same day that Jacinteh's little Waynetta's actually conduct themselves in a dignified manner (Hang on its 2012, 1995 is 17 years ago), so Jacinteh should be.....

62

Probably a Great Grandmother.....

(VOMITS)

Kumbaya, my Lord, Kumbaya......Kumbaya, my Lord, Kumbaya....................

ShaneScouse

Delancey wrote: »

Had to reluctantly travel on the Red Line last week - junkies all over it selling drugs

Oh come now, I don't doubt you maybe have had a unpleasent ride or saw 'scumbagy' stuff. But that type of talk is whats wrong in this thread :P

gugleguy

Dublinbus - wise route 56A roughly follows the Red Line in many places?

ShaneScouse

gugleguy wrote: »

Dublinbus - wise route 56A roughly follows the Red Line in many places?

It kinda does I guess, iirc it goes past 1 or 2 same places In tallaght, crumlin and town the luas does but it aint exactly the same, and ofc they cut it down massive amounts due to the luas and I think like 90% of them are 56s not 56As now and come very rarely, and ofc daftly late. It heads into the stephens green end of town and through ballymount industrial aswell, which ofc luas goes nowhere near

Irish and Proud

dermo88 wrote: »

Aside from transport, I think its been a long time since I had one of my nice neo-nazi right wing rants. If its offensive, I'll edit it. But this is how I see it, agree to disagree.<snip>

I'd certainly agree to point in what you're saying, even if it is a bit extreme. There's no doubt that something needs to be done with unruly teenagers, parenting and the social welfare system. I will reiterate that I would have good confidence in a boot camp system that is properly run. Teenagers need to be held to account and the defiant "What will you do if I don't?" mentality would gradually dissolve as the word gets around about the experience of friends being incarcerated in such institutions (possibly run by the army).

Parents who repeatedly bring children into the world in an irresponsible manner should possibly be sterilized IMO (male and female that is - although I'm male, the man needn't think he'd escape my wrath!) - who has the right to create a life and then abuse and/or neglect it - and as a result, also create social problems for other people and especially other children. Parenting laws need a lot of tightening IMO.

Children Allowance should be phased out and replaced with benefits in kind such as a comprehensive school meals programme, significant measures to reduce costs in education (uniforms, books etc) as well as maintaining/improving the health system for children - the new children's hospital would be a start. We also need to make Ireland a bit more family friendly rather than the current 'every man for himself' mentality. Then there's the issue of bad urban planning (with lack of proper roads and transport being frequently the case) but also importantly the lack of community.

We really need to rethink how this country is run IMO.

PS. Sorry Mods for going a bit OT...

popebenny16

dermo88 wrote: »

rant

yes, nothing anti-social there whatsoever. you are exactly the same as the ones causing the trouble on the luas, you just dont have the balls to do it.

Del2005

ShaneScouse wrote: »

Oh come now, I don't doubt you maybe have had a unpleasent ride or saw 'scumbagy' stuff. But that type of talk is whats wrong in this thread :P

I know someone who drives the Luas and the stuff on this thread isn't even the tip of the iceberg on what's happening on the red line.

Do you not think it's a bit strange that loads of people are posting about major issues and you are one of the few lucky ones who doesn't see major antisocial issues on the Luas so you think everyone else is exaggerating.

frag420

Del2005 wrote: »

I know someone who drives the Luas and the stuff on this thread isn't even the tip of the iceberg on what's happening on the red line.

Do you not think it's a bit strange that loads of people are posting about major issues and you are one of the few lucky ones who doesn't see major antisocial issues on the Luas so you think everyone else is exaggerating.

Care to share some of his stories with us or are you just a tease??:D

Del2005

frag420 wrote: »

Care to share some of his stories with us or are you just a tease??:D

It's more the back round to the stories on here and company policy stuff, can't really post online.

AlekSmart

Del2005 wrote: »

It's more the back round to the stories on here and company policy stuff, can't really post online.

I suspect that much of the reluctance may be connected with legal issues in relation to both ongoing cases and liability going forward.

Suffice to say there are several different agencies interacting here,each one keen to limit THEIR own exposure to liability (OR Bad Press :eek: )

Loafing Oaf

I use the red line a fair bit and generally don't find it too bad. However, the begging/harassment at the Heuston Station stop is pretty aggravating. Apologies if this has been addressed upthread, but do the Luas operators have the same responsibility for stuff going on at the stops as they do on the carriages?

dfx-

ShaneScouse wrote: »

It kinda does I guess, iirc it goes past 1 or 2 same places In tallaght, crumlin and town the luas does but it aint exactly the same, and ofc they cut it down massive amounts due to the luas and I think like 90% of them are 56s not 56As now and come very rarely, and ofc daftly late. It heads into the stephens green end of town and through ballymount industrial aswell, which ofc luas goes nowhere near

Cookstown, Belgard, Fettercairn/Springfield, Square, Kingswood, 5 minutes to the Red Cow, 2 minutes to Kylemore. They're all 56As now, every 75 minutes and generally quiet and peaceful. Brand new GTs as well lately.

The Red Line is covered almost all stops by some bus route, be it the 123, 69, 27, 56A, 13, 40

Onthe3rdDay

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I use the red line a fair bit and generally don't find it too bad. However, the begging/harassment at the Heuston Station stop is pretty aggravating. Apologies if this has been addressed upthread, but do the Luas operators have the same responsibility for stuff going on at the stops as they do on the carriages?

I get the bus to Cork from Dublin Airport now rather than go into the city centre for the Train. It adds about half an hour to the trip but I don't have to go near Heuston, Busaras and the Luas Red line. I don't think there's any real danger for me in any of these areas but they're highly unpleasant and there's always a sense of something just about to kick of on the Luas. Don't need the stress. I'm regularly in various cities here and the UK and Dublin is the only one were there's this level of hassle around public transport.

Loafing Oaf

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

I get the bus to Cork from Dublin Airport now rather than go into the city centre for the Train. It adds about half an hour to the trip but I don't have to go near Heuston, Busaras and the Luas Red line. I don't think there's any real danger for me in any of these areas but they're highly unpleasant and there's always a sense of something just about to kick of on the Luas. Don't need the stress. I'm regularly in various cities here and the UK and Dublin is the only one were there's this level of hassle around public transport.

Wow that's a pretty extreme reaction: I couldn't bear taking that length of a bus journey on a regular basis.:eek: I'm a non-driver who was thinking about buying an apartment in Kilmainham/Islandbridge area but I may have to reconsider now...

What prompted my post was witnessing two beggars having a stand-up row for about five minutes at Heuston Luas one Sunday night recently. Didn't feel like it was gonna get violent or anything, but there was no sign of anyone in authority coming to sort it out. Is there noone monitoring these stops by CCTV or anything?

kerry4sam

darkman2 wrote: »

I think I am in a majority that calls for the line to be dismantled. Anti social behaviour and far worse is the norm on this tram line. Dubliners are intimidated and what of tourists? It goes through the city centre - it is embarrassing and disgraceful. Of course it ferries scum (for free) from Tallaght to the Children's court (great planning that eh?) and no matter what security is on it it will not make any difference. The scumbags have the run of it. When the judge let's the feral children out after 10 convictions they simply hop on the tram and go home (not paying of course and intimidating passengers). I think the line should be closed because it is a free ride for scum in and out of our capital city and addicts looking for the clinic behind Clearys. Until the council use their heads I don't think this line should remain open. I think the line is dangerous and represents an appalling image of this city to tourists who are also at risk of harm.

Only a matter of time before someone is killed within a tram on that line. Mark my words that will happen. Anyone that cannot see the security implications with this line is a complete idiot and clearly has never used the tram.

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

... I'm a non-driver who was thinking about buying an apartment in Kilmainham/Islandbridge area but I may have to reconsider now...

What prompted my post was witnessing two beggars having a stand-up row for about five minutes at Heuston Luas one Sunday night recently. Didn't feel like it was gonna get violent or anything, but there was no sign of anyone in authority coming to sort it out. Is there noone monitoring these stops by CCTV or anything?

I've never felt intimidated in Dublin any time I am up there. Maybe I must spend a week or so there to try and see what people are referring to in the Dublin City forum and on this thread also even.

~ The worse I've seen was a professional photo-shoot on the Luas line outside Heustson; area was being monitored as security made 4announcements for them to cease; luas pulled up ding-a-ling-a-ling; photo-shoot wraps up before Luas departs again
~ Seen people begging but no-one has ever bothered me.
~ Seen a few scuffles, but nothing to be clasping at my handbag in fright about
~ Took Luas out to Tallaght not too long ago and never seen an ounce of bother or hassle. Saw some un-savoury sorts I would not care to have follow me on a night out, but no-one affected me in any ways
~ Overheard some family stories on the red luas-line from people in person and in conversations over the phone that just make my shoulders drop particularly on court-days
however,
~ I only ever seem to get asked for directions or restaurant tips by tourists wandering around the City.

I cannot relate to the opening post in this thread at all in any way & I always get bus from airport to Heuston for train to Kerry and never once encountered any grief.

I just don't know what to make of negative threads like this about our Capital,

Must admit to always see the Bright Side of Life; and try my Best to see some Good in Everyone,
Maybe that has something to do with it,
I don't know,
kerry4sam

Infini

No need to close the line just bring in new transport laws against scummers. Bring in transport police NOT just security and lock them up for 5 years or so in some island prison if they carry on for any reason. Also none of this carryon with kids and that if they act up they get locked up no BS no excuses no mercy etc

conorhal

Well this thread has been going for a while, and the most depressing thing about it is the fact that the same gripes still keep repeating. The sad truth is that nobody in this country ever seems to have the drive or determination to fix a problem that might require tough choices.

The busses started to go downhill almost as soon as the conductor dissapeared. My grandad was a CIE bus conductor, 6ft 3in and a former boxer, unsurprisingy there wasn't any pissing aobut on his route, and this was the 60's, so if there was there was any messing there a good chance you'd leave the bus ...while it was still moving. Bring them back

If you don't enfore the rules, you can't be surprised if nobody obeys them. There needs to be a dedicated transport police, and forget court dates, on the spot fines should be the order of the day.

Transport police need to be able to effectively enforce the rules, if you're done for antisocial behaviour you loose your free social welfare pass. Gone. That would be an effective deterrent.

The childrens court and drugs clinics need to go, out of the city center. In their wisdom Focus Ireland opened a soup kitchen in the heart of Temple Bar, the epi-center of tourism in Dublin attracting dozens of homeless into the area, it may seem heartless to those hearts that bleed, but close it, it makes absolutely no sense.

Begging needs to be banned in tourist areas, tourism contributes hundreds of millions to the economy of the city, beggers at every luas stop do not.

And finally, you, yes you!

Stand the feck up for Gods sake. A while back I had to challenge a group of four or five kids throwing stuff and threatening an elderly couple on the Luas. The abuse I took from them left me only marginally more angry then the fact that there must have been 20-30 grown men on that Luas that suddenly found something facinating to stare at out the window. It's your Luas, if you can't take it back from a 12yr old it serves you right if your journey is miserable.

alphabeat

its not the red line ,

its the ' COMEEEAAHHHHHHRRRR ' LINE

Aard

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Wow that's a pretty extreme reaction: I couldn't bear taking that length of a bus journey on a regular basis.:eek: I'm a non-driver who was thinking about buying an apartment in Kilmainham/Islandbridge area but I may have to reconsider now...

I get the Luas at Heuston a lot and honestly there is very little trouble. Yes, there is usually at least one dodgy-looking person around, but there are also Luas staff in high-vis, Luas security, and Houston security. Not to mention consistent streams of commuters on and off the train. I've never found the Heuston area to be rough, which is unusual as train stations go. It's not particularly useful to junkies/troublemakers as nobody really lives in the immediate area.

The red line in from Heuston is grand 9/10 times, and when there is an incident it's between the junkies/drunks. The most irritating thing about the red line is groups of knackery 14 year old girls shouting their heads off, singing in your ear, or slagging people off. And they know nobody can do anything about it.

ezra_pound

foggy_lad wrote: »

That public money is already ensuring the survival of Irish Rail and Bus Eireann and Dublin Bus. Remove the Free travel and you would also have to remove Subvention and none of the CIE companies would survive losing so many customers overnight! lose all the free pass people and they would have to get rid of half their staff as well as about half their vehicles and services would have to be seriously curtailed.

Absolute rubbish. do you mean the subvention based on 1974 prices? what customers are you suggesting they'd lose? The one's who don't pay. This post makes no sense.

Onthe3rdDay

Aard wrote: »

I get the Luas at Heuston a lot and honestly there is very little trouble. Yes, there is usually at least one dodgy-looking person around, but there are also Luas staff in high-vis, Luas security, and Houston security. Not to mention consistent streams of commuters on and off the train. I've never found the Heuston area to be rough, which is unusual as train stations go. It's not particularly useful to junkies/troublemakers as nobody really lives in the immediate area.

The red line in from Heuston is grand 9/10 times, and when there is an incident it's between the junkies/drunks. The most irritating thing about the red line is groups of knackery 14 year old girls shouting their heads off, singing in your ear, or slagging people off. And they know nobody can do anything about it.

The Heuston stop wouldn't be the biggest problem as such but I was on the red line about once a week and there was always some kind of minor hassle. You couldn't relax you have be on your guard. Now in all cities that's the case but it's only in Dublin that there seems to be no clamp down, As you say it's grand 9/10 times, but it's that one in ten that a pain. Plus as you say there's always one dodgy person around. I've gotten used to not dealing with it elsewhere. So taking the Bus from the Airport rather than the train from the city centre I can avoid the hassle.