UFC 143: Diaz V Condit Official Thread Discussion

Ush1

horsemeat wrote: »

Pat Miletich
Royce Gracie
Anderson Silva
Chuck Lidell
Joe Lauzon
Miguel Torres
Tim Kennedy
TJ Dillashaw
Mark Munoz
Rounda Rousey
Jake Ellenberger
Dan Henderson
Marloes Coenen
Jens Pulver
Josh Neer
Cody McKenzie
Yves Edwards
Matt Lindland
Cung Lee
Dan Hardy
Aaron Simpson
Mayhem Miller! and the list goes on.

Kenny Florian, GSP and Tito Ortiz has it a draw.

I hope a rematch is sorted for the summer. Judging system has become a joke.

Silva, Liddell and Torres are all counter punchers that often back away so I'd be suprised if they slated Condit for backing off.

Lyoto Machida is always backing up also and is an incredible fighter.

cowzerp

horsemeat wrote: »

Judging system has become a joke.

i was up for Diaz for the record

MMA is and always was hard to judge-fact remains he out struck Diaz and only thing Diaz done was walk forward like a mummy with no footwork, no power in the punches he landed,

Condit landed more and what he did land was with more power too-apart from the attemp at choke in the last round that was Diaz's only real attemp to finish the fight-his style of tip tap boxing is all about winning decisions or tiring his opponent out, add a bit of power and footwork and then his Boxing would be ok.

Mr. CooL ICE

p to the e wrote: »

It was amazing to hear people saying Diaz was robbed and I thought it was only key board warriors. Check out some of these tweets from some "professionals".
http://www.mmafighting.com/2012/2/5/2772168/ufc-143-twitter-nick-diaz-vs-carlos-condit-pros-score

@MiguelTorresMMA
I score this fight 50-45 in favor of GSP. @ufc

Logical Fallacy

jayteecork wrote: »

Thought Diaz was robbed. He controlled the fight.

How did he control the fight?

If he controlled the fight i imagine he would have landed a whole lot more on Condit, no?

Zero-Cool

LordChessington wrote: »

That link has me thinking bout joining twitter to just to follow mma fighters! Very true about the Lyoto Machida comment as well. He has no problem backing up countering and getting out of danger when needed.

Diaz spent 5 rounds shuffling forward, he didn't try to adapt to Condits gameplan at all and 1 takedown does not win a round. Diaz should have realised what was happening and gone for more takedowns.

cowzerp

Could have done more takedowns or clinch fighting-I think he fought really stupidly to be honest.

RoboRat

I cant see why Diaz is pissed off, he had a plan A and didn't bother to adapt to the fight when plan A wasn't working. If he was fighting GSP the same thing would have happened.

MrStuffins

Jaysus, there's some absolutely bolloxology going on in this thread!

Condit won the fight and deservedly so. Anyone who thinks he was "running" seriously needs to wake up! Are you seriously suggesting Carlos Condit should've stood in front of Diaz and taken punishment? Next you'll be criticizing fighters for keepig their guard up :rolleyes:

As far as the fight goes, Condit clearly won it. He executed his game plan beautifully! I heard Nate Diaz in the corner saying to Nick "You're 3-1 up here". What? There's no way they could've thought that!

I was hoping Diaz would win the fight but there's no way he did! I actually thought it was closer than a lot of people thought, I had it 48-47 to Condit, but Diaz did nothing to win that fight whereas Condit picked him apart all night. I'm actually gonna rewatch it now and see how i'd score it again. But honestly, Diaz did nothing to win that fight.

If you think moving forward and getting punched in the face is better than moving backwards and punching your opponent, you're off the head!

MrStuffins

Ok so I went back and rewatched the fight. If anyone has any interest in readin my thoughts and scoring read below:



Round 1: Diaz moved forward and Condit spent the whole round hitting him with leg kicks. He hit Diaz with about two-dozen unchecked kicks. Diaz hit Condit with a couple of punches, a couple more punches than Condit landed on Diaz, but I can't see how I can give Diaz the round.

10-9 Condit


Round 2: Better round by Diaz, some effective punching and a nice flurry against the cage. Condit stays in it though with some strikes of his own and then takes control of the last minute of the round with nice kicks and body punches. Very very tough round to score. I can see why the judges were split on this one but:

10-9 Condit


Round 3: Much closer round than I thought initially. I'd score it a draw but for the purposes of this I won't because draw rounds are so rare as far as actual scoring goes.

Both men had some sweet combos, sweet single strikes and were very effective. But because i'm not gonna score it a draw and it's ben Nick's best round of the fight, I give him the slight edge and I give it to him.

10-9 Diaz


Round 4: This round is Carlos Condit all day. Lovely combos by Condit, effective kicks and punches. Diaz chases him around unable to put anything together and getting picked apart by Condit on the back foot.

10-9 Condit.


Round 5: Condit turns it on. Beats Diaz to the punch every time and hits hit with some very hard shots. Diaz goes after him but can't put anything together. Not much by way of effective striking from Diaz.

With over a minute to go, Nick takes Carlos down and holds the dominant position, stays busy by looking for armlocks and chokes, slaps on a body triangle. The first time anyone has looked dominant in the fight and has actually taken control. Time runs out but it could've been enough to take the round.

10-9 Diaz



So, I scored the fight 48-47 to Condit.

El Guapo!

sheehy83 wrote: »

That link has me thinking bout joining twitter to just to follow mma fighters!

That's the only reason I joined twitter. I never actually tweet anything myself but I follow 98 people and I'd say 99% of them are either fighters or are involved with mma in some way. It's a handy way to get news first and it's usually good for a few laughs!

El Guapo!

Here's the fighter salaries for Saturday night:

Carlos Condit ($55,000 + $55,000 = $110,000) def. Nick Diaz ($200,000)
Fabricio Werdum ($100,000 + no win bonus) def. Roy Nelson ($20,000)
Josh Koscheck ($73,000 + $73,000 = $146,000) def. Mike Pierce ($20,000)
Renan Barao ($11,000 + $11,000 = $22,000) def. Scott Jorgensen ($20,500)
Ed Herman ($31,000 + $31,000 = $62,000) def. Clifford Starks ($8,000)
Dustin Poirier ($12,000 + $12,000 = $24,000) def. Max Hollaway ($6,000)
Edwin Figueroa ($8,000 + $8,000 = $16,000) def. Alex Caceres ($8,000)
Matt Brown ($15,000+$15,000 = $30,000) def. Chris Cope ($8,000)
Matt Riddle ($15,000 + $15,000 = $30,000) def. Henry Martinez ($6,000)
Rafael Natal ($10,000 + $10,000 = $20,000) def. Michael Kuiper ($6,000)
Stephen Thompson ($6,000+$6,000 = $12,000) def. Dan Stittgen ($6,000)

Nice payday for Diaz even though he complains all the time about how he doesn't make enough money.
Werdum is on a nice wedge too. :eek:

O.P.H

Dean09 wrote: »

Here's the fighter salaries for Saturday night:




Nice payday for Diaz even though he complains all the time about how he doesn't make enough money.
Werdum is on a nice wedge too. :eek:

Didn't some of them get bonus money, like Thompson got KO of the night and he gets 65,000 for that, Dana said that in post press conference

Logical Fallacy

MrStuffins wrote: »

Condit won the fight and deservedly so. Anyone who thinks he was "running" seriously needs to wake up! Are you seriously suggesting Carlos Condit should've stood in front of Diaz and taken punishment? Next you'll be criticizing fighters for keepig their guard up :rolleyes:

Sometimes i get the impression their is a subset of fans who want to see two lads smashing their chins into each other until one of them falls over.

Shazbot

Logical fallacy wrote:

Sometimes i get the impression their is a subset of fans who want to see two lads smashing their chins into each other until one of them falls over.

This thread has highlighted that fact nicely. More than I thought which is upsetting.

darced

This post has been deleted.

MrStuffins

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Sometimes i get the impression their is a subset of fans who want to see two lads smashing their chins into each other until one of them falls over.

Indeed! Fighters who utilise takedowns are "pussies who should stand up and fight like a man" etc.

Now not standing in front of Diaz with your chin in the air means you lose the fight. Walking forward into punches and eating kicks for 5 rounds mean you win!

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Lol! Well the 3 guys who were employed to judge thought Condit won it. Using other peoples' opinions in this fashion is some weak stuff! "Well Pat Militich agrees with me so i must be right" :rolleyes:

Its all about opinions everyone has one.

Yup. And you'll find that some peoples' opinions aren't worth the same as other peoples' opinions!

If someone has an opinion, back it up. But some of the sh*te on this thread has been ridiculous and apart from that, there are some peopple just saying stuff and not backing themselves up. It's pointless!

Deus Ex Machina

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Sometimes i get the impression their is a subset of fans who want to see two lads smashing their chins into each other until one of them falls over.

For sure.

The weirdest thing about it is that there's K1, boxing and all that if they're only interested striking. If you're not into grappling etc then don't watch a sport which allows that in the rules. It's like watching GAA and complaining that they should only be using their feet.

kingcharles82

watched the fight again last night and watching it second time around condit did enough for me to win, diaz didnt do a whole lot even though he pressed forward for 5 rounds, condit had a better game plan and deserved the win in my opinion

Mellor

O.P.H wrote: »

Didn't some of them get bonus money, like Thompson got KO of the night and he gets 65,000 for that, Dana said that in post press conference

They give out bonuses at every event. They aren't aprt of the salary declared to the commision.
Neither are the other backstage bonus that Dana and the Fertittas give out. Decent bonus to fighters who put on a good show, promote well, good for the sport stuff etc.
Then of course theres sponsorship on top.

Hide the Rum

pauldoo wrote: »

kos v diaz would be intersting, plenty of smack talk. i wonder what happened at AKA

Just wanted to chime in on this
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2012/2/6/2775246/ufc-143-results-josh-koscheck-and-coach-dave-camarillo-leave-aka

It's funny Kos' said that, I remember seeing a Dana video blog (I think it was after Cain's loss to JDS) where Javier Mendez was saying stuff like "you didn't follow the gameplan, you should have done this and that..." Not normally what you hear from a cornerman after a loss. Not a Kos' fan but I feel he's right here.

Logical Fallacy

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I'm not so much talking about this fight as that odd vibe you get off one or two people on every forum that unless a fight is Griffin/Bonnar 1 then it wasn't "warriors leaving it all in the cage".

MrStuffins

Meanwhile back in Gotham City................ Roy Nelson is the toughest guy in all of sport!

empacher

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

One anyone with eyes is entitled to judge, Fighters can be as emotional as fans watching fights. Just look for chuck liddel in the crowd next big event.

My problem with you people arguing for diaz is ''I posed the question earlier why people though Diaz won?''

Two Majority single line answers gotten back were ''Diaz was the more aggressive pace pusher.'' and ''Diaz came to fight''

While the people who believe Condit won gave valid reasons in more then 5 words.

maybe for the next UFC we need two threads ''UFC xxx *spoilers* Impartial Discussion'' and ''UFC xxx *spoilers* Ridiculous Discussion''

p to the e

Some guy had the patience (or lack of friends) to write down the complete transcript from the corner of Nick Diaz during the fight. With friends like these.....
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2012/2/6/2776193/greasing-with-water-the-tragic-almost-complete-transcript-of-what-was#storyjump


A lot has been said and written about Nick Diaz’ fight with Carlos Condit. One point of discussion has been Diaz seeming inablility to adapt in a fight that was at least close or – in the opinion of many fans and more importantly the judges – he was losing. Personally I thought Diaz did win the fight, but this is definitely a case of "could’ve gone either way". More interesting to me is the question, what was going on with Nick, wether he was following a gameplan, if he really did get bad advice by his corner and so on. Luckily, the UFC provides an audio-stream straight from the corner of Nick Diaz. Even more luckily for you gentlemen I had the insane idea to make a transcript of the high-points for the poor suckers who do not get these streams for free like us germans. Obviously I did regret that decision by the time I tried to decipher the screaming of Nate Diaz and the Gracie-Team for the first minute. But well…gotta finish what you started and give back to the community and such. So I pulled through.

However: I was unable to identify any other speaker than Nate Diaz, so I just labled them "Red Corner". Most oft he time, it probably was Richard Perez, his boxing-coach. I left out the inconsequential stuff such as "you want water?" most of the time. Whenever you see [...] I couldn’t understand what was being said and that piece is missing. Whenever you don't see that I probably still left out a bit. All these are direct quotes however, as precise as was possible. The timecodes are from the clock in the round and not extremely acurate but they’ll give you an idea, what was said when and it's the only way to sync everybody regardless of the source.


Before Rd1:
Nate: **** this guy, be smart a’right?
Nate: Wake up, Dude! Wake up! There you go!
Red Corner (probably talking to the corner-team): Be calm in the corner. That’s where the cameras are, they’re tryin’ t make us look bad. The camera [...] is makin’ us look bad for freakin’ out so be calm on the camera’s
Nate: Watch that straight right left hook he’s gonna try, straight right – left hook. Red Corner: Let’s go Diaz! Be smart! Let’s do it!


Round 1:
Red Corner (right after the first leg kick): Check that kick
Nate: Watch that straight right – left hook!
Nate (4:43): Put that chin down!
Red Corner (4:05): Box him up, Nick!
Nate (4:07): Feints too! Feints! Make him throw!
Red Corner (3:45): Turn it up! He’s trying to run! He’s trying to run!
Nate (3:36, probably talking about Condit): Yeah, he gets hit. He gets hit with shots.
Nate (3:34): Feints too, make him throw!
Red Corner (3:30): Turn it up! Turn it up! Right there!
Nate (commenting as Condit slips away): Hit and run...
Nate (3:!4): Body! Body!
Red Corner (3:08): You got him against the cage!
Nate (3:04): Cut him off, don’t chase him!
Red Corner (3:02): Cut him off, don’t follow! (The command is repeated many (!) times from here on out till the end of the round)
Nate (answering to a question I can’t understand at 2:36): Trying to tag with a hard shot, that’s why. He’s probably tryin to win with a hard shot..
Red Corner (2:22): Cut him off, don’t let him get out!
Nate (2:20): Let’s get on that body too!
Nate (2:04): There you go! Set up the body!
Red Corner (2:01): You stand up tall!
Nate (after a spinning elbow by Carlos at 1:58): ****in’ dick!
Red Corner (1:45): Get in and get out! Don’t let him get off! Work that body [...]
Nate (after another leg-kick, 1:42): Check that ****!
Red Corner (1:31): He’s landet the better shots so far
Nate (1:30): Yah.
Nate (1:27): He’s tryin to pace for five rounds.
Nate (as Nick is pressing Carlos against the fence): Shorter! Shorter!
Red Corner (1:14): Flank him! Come on! Get him against the cage! Body!
Nate (0:56): Cut him off good!
Red Corner (0:55): Get that body again! Keep that pace Nick!
Red Corner (after Condit escapes again and a lot of "Cut him off!" previously): You let him get off again! Don’t let him get off!
Red Corner (0:26): Back him up! Take a step forward! Set it up! Step forward! Turn it up!

At this point I realized this would take forever and decided to drop most of the redundand stuff or sum it up!

Before Rd 2:
Nate: Sit down, sit down.
Richard Perez: Don’t let him circle, you hear? When you got him against the cage...
Nate (interrupting): Deep breaths, deep breaths.
Richard Perez: Deep breaths, out of your mouth! Now...when you back him up against the cage Nick, you gotta stay in his face hard, you understand? So what you’re gonna do is your gonna pump that jab...
Nick: (to Nate, interrupting) Gimme the bottle of water.
Richard Perez: And you go to the body and then back to the head. Head-Body, it’s wide open, you can get him.
Nate: He’s tryin to make you chase him too [him and Perez talking over each other] Cut him off real good.
Nate: He’s tryin to coast for five rounds. Cut him off good!

Round 2
(I’ll leave out most of the constant screams of "cut him off" here. Know that they are there till the fight ends)

Red Corner (4:35): Here comes the headkick! (Actually there’s another leg kick)
Red Coner (4:10): Keep comin. You have it there, dog!
Nate (to a teammate, 4:03): He’s got nothin on him, dude. He’s just tryin to set stuff up. (right here, Condit throws a spinning elbow at around 3:58) See, that’s the kind of asshole-**** he’s got. But...he better land a good one if he wants to end it cause he can’t really do too much.
Red Corner (3:41): You gotta throw your punches down the middle!
Nate (3:32): Make him come to you!
*somebody applauds after Nick taunts and slaps Carlos* (3:21)
Red Corner (somebody else than the staff that could be heard so far 3:08): Condit you pussy!
Red Corner: You can run all day!
Nate (2:50): Make him chase you! Make him chase you a little bit! Let him chase you too he ain’t got ****!

*Lot’s of calls for cutting Carlos off, going to the body and some feints from here on out *

Red Corner (1:40): Make him miss! Make him miss! Let your hands go!
Nate (after the flurry on the fence around 1:20): Good job Nick
Red Corner (1:24): He’s tired now! He’s tired! He’s getting desperate right now, he’s getting tired! Down the middle!
Nate: Nicks gonna pick up the pace later in the thrid-fourth round and if [...]
Red Corner (0:37): Come on, Nick! You can’t win like that! You can’t win like that!
Red Corner (0:17): Throw! Throw!

Before Rd 3
Nate: Ok, sit down
Red Corner: You can’t finish him by follwoing him. Your doin good [...] and come back with the uppercut.
Nate: Keep doin’ what you’re doin.
Red Corner: You’re doing good. You got him runnin now. He’s gassin out from runnin. Nate: You ain’t gonna have to chase him so much, too. You can if you want but you don’t have to. He’s trying to make you chase him around some hard **** (?). You can wave him down like "Come to me mother****er!". [...]You won the last two rounds so keep doin what you’re doin. But you can make him come to you too. Or do what you want. You can do that too, he ain’t doin nothin.
-- Can’t understand what Richard Perez is saying here, unfortunately
Nate: Feints too, ok? Make him throw, make him throw. Good job brother, you’re doin good.

Round 3
Nate (no clock yet...right at the start oft he round): It’s lookin good
Red Corner: You think so?
Nate: Yah, two – zero.
Red Corner: Sometimes though, they...
Nate: Nah, two to zero. Everybody knows that. **** that! The guy ain’t doin nothin. He’s doin what he can though.
Red Corner: He’s running. He’s running the whole time.
Red Corner (4:25): Right now! Right now!
Red Corner (after Nick flurries on Carlos 4:23): Oh, nice! Nice left hand!
Red Corner (4:21): He’s hurt! He’s hurt Nick! He’s hurt!
Red Corner (4:12, as Carlos turns his back briefly and jogs to the middle of the cage): Get on top of him! You gotta be on top of him when he does that! He’s not set. Now down the middle! Come on!
Red Corner: (3:43) You got it dog! Keep going! Keep doing it! Keep doing it! He don’t know what to do no more! That’s it right there! He’s turning! He’s turning! Step over! Step over, down the middle! (This gets repeated a while with calls to let his hands go and go fort he body)
Nate (2:51): Heartrate, Nick!
Red Corner (2:30): Don’t let him bounce around!
Red Corner (2:07): Come on now, Nick! Don’t stand in front of him! Back him up, there you you go! Mix it up, Nick!

*Lots of "cut him off", "turn it up", "make him come to you" and all his corners favorites so far*

Red Corner (to Nate): He’s gotta get the punch-combos going
Nate: Yeah. It’s hard though when you’re chasing the ****er all over the place.
Nate (0:16): Don’t chase him, walk him down, Nick!
Nate (after Condit slipped): What happened? Did he fall?
Red Corner: Yeah, he fell.

Before Round 4
Nate: Here, sit down, brother
Nick: Did I get hit?
Nate: Nah, you’re not even cut.
Richard Perez: He’s got nothin no more, dog. You hear me? He got nothin no more. All you gotta do is go down the middle, get that body-shot. Don’t stand in front of him though cause you may get hit [...]
Nate: You can make him come to you as well cause he’s just running from you. Don’t chase him. Wave "Come to me, mother****er", you know what I mean? [..] You can keep doin what you do the whole fight. You gotta cut him off really good, ok?
Round 4
Red Corner: [...]man, they’re trying to cool him off. That was a lot of water.
Red Corner: His heatrate seems still alright
Nate (4:49): That’s what they do, they make him all wet so the punches slip off and ****.
Red Corner (4:44): Ist that allowed here?
Nate (Yelling over to the other corner): Ey, y’all put too much water on that mother****er, man!
Nate (4:32): Ref! Dry him off, ref! Dry him off!
Nate (4:23): He’s slippin all over the place cause they put water all over him! That’s weak.
Nate (3:48): Okay let’s go and pick your shots right now, let’s not go for the fence right now! Quicker shots that land, Nick! They don’t got to be hard now, just make’em land!
Red Corner (3:25): He’s gonna run in a circle all night. Let’s get some hooks, make him stay in there!
Red Corner (3:19): That body shot hurt him, do it again!
Red Corner (3:12): He’s trying to run again. He always runs out to the same side. Right hook as soon as he turns out!
Red Corner (3:05): Right hook, left hook, keep him in there!
Red Corner (3:02): Body lock!
Nate (3:01): He all wet!
Red Corner (2:59): It’s aweful. Yeah, referee’s gotta [...]
Nate (2:50): He’s wet, dude! He’s all wet.
Red Corner (2:48): Let your hands go! Don’t stand in front of him!
Nate (still about Condit being all wet): That’s weak dog. That’s weak.

Nicks corner is clearly frustrated that he let’s Condit escape from the cage so often, exclaiming "aw man!" and calling for him to stay on Condit.

Nate (1:50, as Condit sprints away again): Call for a yellow-card!
Red Corner: He’s running all day
Nate: That’s the best he can do man. He’s just surviving the fight!
Nate (1:15): Step on the outside!
Red Corner (1:13): Take the center! Make him come to you!
Red Coner (0:50): Put him in a war, Nick! Make him waste his...let’s get his heartrate up!

*again, there’s a lot of "let your hands go", "cut him off" and "Let him come to you" all throughout this round*

Red Corner (0:07): Takedown!

Before the 5th round
Nate: Hey ref! Ref! Ref! Ref! Ey, they keep wetting him! He’s all slippery because they keep pouring water all over him.
Referee: Alright, alright!
Nate: There’s water...
Somebody says: What do you think. Maybe Nick
Nate: No. No, no, no, no, **** that, you got every round.
Somebody, maybe Nick (Although it doesn’t sound like him) says: "Don’t lie to me"
Nate: He might have got that last round but that’s it. You got the rest. You’re up three to one, okay? Rinse it out, take a drink. Let’s get a couple of ten second intervals in this one, ok? Whenever you want, whenever you’re ready.

5th round
Nate: This is the last round, right?
Red Corner Is this the fifth round?
Nate: Yah. Fifth round.
Nate (4:14 after the usual calls): Be smart Nick, make him miss!
Nate (4:02): Quick punches that land, alright?
Red Corner (3:38) You just stand in front of him! Come on Nick, come on!
Red Corner (3:26): Don’t stand on the outside!
Red Corner (3:12): Take him down when he stands like that!
Red Corner (2:32 as Nick gets a body-lock): There it is! V-lock! (?)

Lots of calls to "set that hook up", plus the usual stuff. Nate informs Nick oft he time at the 2 and 1:30 mark.

Nate: Yeah! (as Nick takes it tot he ground, 1:20)
Nate (1:10): He’s gonna finish somethin, dude.
Red Corner: Relax! You got a minute! You got a minute!
Nate: One minute!
Nate (0:50): Yeah, he’s trying to get that armbar.
Red Corner (0:40): Grab the chin!
Red Corner (0:30): Break his nose!
Nate: 30 seconds, go on top! Now, Nick, now!
Nate (0:17): Ey, let’s get some elbows, get some punches! 15 seconds!
Red Corner (0:09): Set that choke up!

After the fight:
Official: Nobody goes in until I say. Stay right here, please
Red Corner: Yes, Sir.
Nate: **** yeah!
Red Corner: Get his shirt!
Nate: Ey, gimme his shirt! Gimme his shirt!
Nate: You won that ****!


Official: Now get in there. You know what to do?
Red Corner: Yes, Sir!
Nate: Gimme that shirt!
Dana White: Good job, dude!
Nate: Ey! For sure four to one, a’right?
Nick: I got that? I got that homie?
Nate: Yeah **** yeah, you got that.
Nick: I pushe him back the whole time
Red Corner: Yeah, yeah, he ran.
Nate: All we got is the sweatshirt. Ey yo, put this on. I tell you [...] four to one for sure. No problem.
Red Corner: He ran too much.
Nick (probably looking at the replay): They’re showin only (?)his ****.
Nate: Yeah, that was the last round. But you got four to one for sure. There’s no way...
Nick (interrupting): I almost finished that armlock.
Nate: Yeah, yeah, I know. He knew he was biding (?) his time too. Hey look, Nick, you guaranteed no matter what won that fight.
Nate (shaking Greg Jacksons hand): Good fight!
Nate (shaking Carlos’ hand): Good fight, Carlos
Nick (after a few steps): Ran too much
Nate: Yeah
Nick (talking to Lorenzo Fertitta. Unfortunately, this is very hard to understand) : [...]You asked me to fight, I came here to fight. I’m not gonna[...]I came in a little heavy. It was either I could cut the calories or cut the sparring [...]

Nate pulls him away as the scores are ready to be read.
Nate: "Hey, listen. Listen: He did what he had to do, alright? That’s what. So he’d get through that fight"

And that was how Nick went into these last seconds before the decision was read. Listening to that was really kinda tragic. Unfortunately no further conversations were recorded although you can clearly see Nate and Nick talking in the background during the Condit-interview.

horsemeat

What's the saline point?
Seemed like Nick thought it was close, but Nate clearly thought it was 4 1.
I had Nick 1,2 and 5 for what it's worth. I know a lot of people gave him 3, I'd need to rewatch the fight though. 4 was clearly carlos.

The Bored One

horsemeat wrote: »

What's the saline point?
Seemed like Nick thought it was close, but Nate clearly thought it was 4 1.
I had Nick 1,2 and 5 for what it's worth. I know a lot of people gave him 3, I'd need to rewatch the fight though. 4 was clearly carlos.

I'd say the big issue is that his corner were absolutely convinced he was winning and advised him that way. Given that they genuinely seemed to believe that, you can't fault them too much for that.
But since there was no one there who was interpreting what was going on the way the judges did, they never advised him to do anything differently. They couldn't even imagine that the ship was sinking, so just told him to keep sailing on.
To his credit, it appears Nick may have been worried that something was up, and in the last round he did try to change tactics to find a finish.

MrStuffins

With debate still raging on Condit's title win, fighters weigh in on UFC 143 result

Although a small cross section within the army of current UFC fighters, those reached by MMAjunkie.com (www.mmajunkie.com) supported Carlos Condit's controversial decision over Nick Diaz at this past Saturday's UFC 143.

That support ultimately boiled down what they saw was more effective aggression and a superior gameplan.

"It's not a bar fight, dude," said two-time lightweight challenger Gray Maynard.

UFC 143 took place this past Saturday at the Mandalay Bay Events Center in Las Vegas. Its main card aired live on pay-per-view while preliminary-card fights aired on FX and streamed on Facebook.

Such a statement was repeated in various forms by several that spoke about the fight, which crowned Condit the new UFC interim welterweight title after judges ruled him the winner by scores of 48-47 and 49-46 twice.

"This isn't a street fight," said heavyweight Travis Browne. "If Diaz would have used his wrestling and taken Carlos down, held him down, and got him in those bad positions and made Carlos panic like he did in the fifth round, it would have been a totally different fight. I think it would have been a 50-45; he would have won every single round."

Indeed, grappling came into play just once during the five-round fight. Although Diaz attempted to take Condit down on several occasions, he was only successful getting the fight down during the final frame, where he threatened the former WEC champ with a rear naked choke.

The bulk of the fight played out on its feet, where Condit (28-5 MMA, 5-1 UFC) kept a stalking Diaz (27-8 MMA, 7-5 UFC) off balance with kicks and evaded when cornered against the cage.

That prompted several fighters under the Zuffa banner to blast both the decision and Condit on Twitter after the fight. However, most that spoke today agreed that Diaz was aggressive, but far from successful in doing the kind of damage done in previous fights.

"If Diaz would have been landing, then I would say that it would go to the aggressor," said featherweight Cub Swanson. "In a sense, it did look like Condit was running at times, but he was trying to get away from the cage. But he landed the majority. I would say on damage, I would weigh that heavier."

Maynard applauded Condit's deft use of the octagon in staying away from Diaz's flurries.

"Obviously, if you check out the tapes, Nick Diaz is good in the pocket because he's long and a lefty, so you've got to stay out of the pocket," he said. "It's not the best thing to watch, but it's a sport. There are some boring NFL games, but it happens. Carlos scored more points. Everything landed flush. Nick had a couple flurries, but nothing big, so you've got to add the points. The FightMetric (statistics) prove it.

"Looking at Nick, I think the past two years, he really hasn't fought anyone who's had a plan. It's like, well, I'm just going to go out there and fight, and [the Diaz brothers] are good at that. GSP is going to have a plan for Nick, too: Hit a couple of times, move off, he comes in, take him down, work position. Nick Diaz is tough and he fights hard, but when there's that much at stake, why would you do that?

"It's easy for people from their couches to say, 'Carlos, what the [expletive].' But it's a title fight."

Maynard attended the fight and said the consensus among fighters there was that Condit had pulled it off.

"If you look at the fight overall, it's easy to say Diaz won the fight," said lightweight Sam Stout. "But that's not how an MMA fight is scored. It's scored on a round-to-round basis, and if you look at the points, Diaz won the first two and Condit won the last three. I don't know how the judges scored it 49-46."

Stout said he scored it 48-47 for Condit for winning rounds 3, 4 and 5. Maynard gave Condit rounds 1, 3 and 4. Browne, meanwhile, had Condit winning rounds 2 through 4.

Not everyone was impressed by the new interim champ's plan, however.

"Carlos was passive," said lightweight Kamal Shalorus. "He didn't fight. He would throw something and run away, and those punches were not really hard. Diaz was pushing the pace all the time. The judges were 100 percent wrong. I don't know why they did that.

"Of course, Carlos threw some punches, but not like Diaz's. I believe Diaz won."

Rematch was the word in the minds of many after the fight, and UFC president Dana White said he was open to the possibility before the return of undisputed welterweight champ Georges St-Pierre, who is currently recovering from a torn ACL. St-Pierre has said he'll be ready by November, but that's far from guaranteed.

The fighters were lukewarm on that question.

"If people want that fight, then yeah," Maynard said. "But if they don't, I don't really care. He won, that's what the judges said, so what are you going to do?"

"I think it's a good candidate for a rematch," Stout said. "I don't think it necessarily needs to happen immediately. I just came off a very close loss, and I'm not demanding a rematch right away.

"It's part of the game. I've been on both sides of a lot of close decisions, and if you don't want to get put into those situations, then finish the fight. Dana tells us every time, 'Don't leave it in the hands of the judges.'"

Of course, there was no guarantee history wouldn't repeat itself. The first meeting wasn't exactly a barnburner.

For those angered by the decision, the solution was to put Diaz to the front of the line again.

"I think they're going to be a boring fight," Shalorus said of a Condit/Diaz rematch. "I think they should put Diaz with GSP. Diaz is going to be a better fight."

And in that, the debate over what's exciting and what's effective continues.

MrStuffins

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

For sure.

The weirdest thing about it is that there's K1, boxing and all that if they're only interested striking. If you're not into grappling etc then don't watch a sport which allows that in the rules. It's like watching GAA and complaining that they should only be using their feet.

Those kinda lads think of MMA and expect this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeaBtzeyU9k

cian68

MrStuffins wrote: »

Those kinda lads think of MMA and expect this

That looks amazing

MrStuffins

cian68 wrote: »

That looks amazing

It really doesn't!