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More stupid in America..

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  • Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭lcrcboy


    RichieC wrote: »
    Companies like Dell, Walmart, Lowes and Campbells have pulled their advertising from a TLC show called 'All American Muslims' - the show portrays a normal American family who are muslim..

    the reasons are just great, wait for this ****;



    That's right, the same company pulled ads from seventh heaven years back for daring to show a normal Christian family without highlighting the dangers of things like the KKK or the Timothy Mc Veighs... oh wait.. no they didnt.

    Truly the land of the free. :pac:

    Im getting sick of these threads to, I mean there seems to be one of these stupid anti-american threads nearly every second day now. Cant you just get over it and leave it be.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    FTGFOP wrote: »
    I don't get this comment. What would you have happen?

    It's a country where the religious fringes (mostly Christian supremacists) have an awful lot of power.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,462 ✭✭✭✭WoollyRedHat


    I don't actually agree with the title, but the topic of the thread is valid and worthy of discussion, if you don't like it you can scroll on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭lcrcboy


    Solnskaya wrote: »
    US of A " Syria has beaten and abused its own people and must be punished". Don't mention how the good old US of A battered its own "Occupy whatever" protesters off the streets though. "Land of the free"?? GTFO.

    the USA and its bad treatment of occupy wall street protesters does not come anywhere near the level of violence the Syrian government has committed against its people, nearly 4000 people so far have died.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,879 ✭✭✭Coriolanus


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    What would Jesus do?
    http://www.explosm.net/db/files/Comics/robmilleniumfix1.png

    There's a cyanide and happiness strip for every occassion.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    Dunno where I stand on this one. The concept sounds laudable enough in theory but in practice probably amounts to a muslim version of the cosby show <shudder>
    JohnathanM wrote: »
    Sharia law in England .

    :rolleyes:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 410 ✭✭JohnathanM


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    :rolleyes:

    Why the rolling eyes? If you doubt it's happening, well...

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/law/2010/jul/05/sharia-law-religious-courts

    You might also read the attached report, which should make clear to you its operation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,389 ✭✭✭FTGFOP


    RichieC wrote: »
    It's a country where the religious fringes (mostly Christian supremacists) have an awful lot of power.

    You missed my question, what would you have done about it?

    You sound like you're gloating with that comment in the OP.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    JohnathanM wrote: »
    Why the rolling eyes? If you doubt it's happening, well...

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/law/2010/jul/05/sharia-law-religious-courts

    You might also read the attached report, which should make clear to you its operation.

    afaik the so - called shariah courts in the UK are private and for civil matters, if I'm not mistaken the Jewish people living in England have had a pretty similar setup (beth din) for a long time.

    It is illegal for one of these courts to apply a punishment outside of the greater law of the UK.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    lcrcboy wrote: »
    the USA and its bad treatment of occupy wall street protesters does not come anywhere near the level of violence the Syrian government has committed against its people, nearly 4000 people so far have died.

    You're right - we need to put this incident in context.

    1947-49 - U.S. helps command extreme-right Greece party in Civil War.
    Death toll: about 70,000 contributed by US-backed forces

    1948-54 - CIA directs war against Huk Rebellion in Philippines.
    Death toll: about 11,000

    1950 - Independence movement crushed in Ponce, Puerto Rico
    Death toll: conservative historians estimated about 8,000 peasants

    1950-53 - Korean War
    Death toll: about 1,776,000

    1952 - CIA overthrows Democracy in Iran, installs Shah
    Death toll: about 20,000

    1954 - CIA directs invasion of Guatemala after new Democracy there nationalized U.S.-occupied lands
    Death toll: about 140,000 missing and dead

    1958 - In Lebanon, marine occupation against rebels
    Death toll: about 2,000

    1960-75+ - Vietnam War including Cambodia and Laos
    Death toll: about 4,502,000 including civilians and resulting famines (conservative estimates)

    1961 - Cuba's Bay of Pigs Invasion fails
    Death toll: about 4,000

    1963 - In Iraq, CIA organizes coup against President and agrees to back formerly exiled Saddam
    Death toll: about 7,000 including civilians

    1964 - In Panama, troops kill protesters against US-owned canal
    Death toll: about 1,000

    1965 - CIA assists Indonesian coup
    Death toll: about 900,000

    1966 - Troops and bombers threaten pro-communist parties in Dominican Republic
    Death toll: about 3,000

    1966-96 - Green berets in Guatemala against rebels, US backs pro-American forces in country until 1996
    Death toll: about 200,000

    1970 - Directs marine invasion of Oman
    Death toll: about 2,000

    1973 - CIA directs coup to oust elected Marxist president in Chile
    Death toll: 30,000... 3,000 later disappeared under US-installed dictator

    1976-92 - CIA assists South-African rebels in Angola
    Death toll: median estimate at 550,000

    1981-90 - CIA directs Contra invasions in Nicaragua
    Death toll: median estimate at 30,000

    1982-84 - Marines expel Lebanese rebels, aided by Israel
    Death toll: 40,000

    1987-88 - US intervenes for Iraq against Iran
    Death toll: about 150,000 during time-frame, 100,000 during Desert Storm, 350,000 from resulting famine

    1989 - US invades to oust CIA-installed Panamanian government gone rouge
    Death toll: 2,000

    1992-94 - US-led occupation of Somalia during civil war
    Death toll: 50,000 in combat, 300,000 by starvation

    2001+ - US Occupies Afghanistan
    Death toll: 120,000 including civilians and combatants and resulting Opium Wars

    2003+ - Iraqi War
    Death toll: 665,000 also by starvation, displacement


    TOTAL: 10,431,000

    But they were 'bad guys' so it's okay.



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,219 ✭✭✭woodoo


    America just doesn't want much to do with Muslims.. that's their business though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,021 ✭✭✭mickrock


    What do you call a Muslim who flies a plane?

    A pilot.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,646 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    woodoo wrote: »
    America just doesn't want much to do with Muslims.. that's their business though.
    Then maybe they should get rid of the following clause from their constitution:
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,327 ✭✭✭AhSureTisGrand


    I don't see why you care so much about this Muslim family Richie. They are "All American" after all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    FTGFOP wrote: »
    You missed my question, what would you have done about it?

    You sound like you're gloating with that comment in the OP.

    Done about what? the contents of the OP? pointed and laughed, I suppose..

    laugh or cry the choice is yours.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 410 ✭✭JohnathanM


    RichieC wrote: »
    afaik the so - called shariah courts in the UK are private and for civil matters, if I'm not mistaken the Jewish people living in England have had a pretty similar setup (beth din) for a long time.

    It is illegal for one of these courts to apply a punishment outside of the greater law of the UK.

    Correct, but there have been instances in the past of judgment in criminal cases - such as domestic violence - and the UK government had to step in to make clear that these "external courts" have no competence here. Jewish courts are outside of scope of this discussion, but in reality any arbitration can be binding outside of a "real" court when both parties freely agree. In my opinion though, no court based on religion should be allowed to exist in a modern state.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    woodoo wrote: »
    America just doesn't want much to do with Muslims.. that's their business though.

    With America being the global Mafia policeman it's kinda everyone's business.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    RichieC wrote: »
    afaik the so - called shariah courts in the UK are private and for civil matters, if I'm not mistaken the Jewish people living in England have had a pretty similar setup (beth din) for a long time.

    It is illegal for one of these courts to apply a punishment outside of the greater law of the UK.

    Indeed the only people compelled to abide by the decisions of these private arbitration tribunals are those willing to submit to their juristiction in the first place.

    Anyway this thread is supposed to be about the United States.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 554 ✭✭✭ThePower11


    Damn I loved seventh heaven


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 410 ✭✭JohnathanM


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    Indeed the only people compelled to abide by the decisions of these private arbitration tribunals are those willing to submit to their juristiction in the first place.

    This assumes that both parties in the dispute are equal, and that's when reality gets in the way of theory. The word of a woman is after all worth only half that of a man's.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    I don't see why you care so much about this Muslim family Richie. They are "All American" after all.

    I love a lot of things about the USA, their military industrial complex is not one of them. This as I see it part of the greater war on the american psyche. We can see a clear example in the cold war. People manipulated into so much fear and loathing that a man like McCarthy could rise to prominence.

    I think people are reading into my thread title too much. I was aware that there was 2 other current threads about ridiculousness in the USA. the thread title does not say "stupid America", it says more stupid - in America. I should have gone with Florida...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    JohnathanM wrote: »
    This assumes that both parties in the dispute are equal, and that's when reality gets in the way of theory. The word of a woman is after all worth only half that of a man's.

    Sexism and male dominance is a problem everywhere and in every religion*.


    *Except some mountain people where the wifey is boss and she has like 5 or 6 husbands.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    Pathetic.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    JohnathanM wrote: »
    This assumes that both parties in the dispute are equal, and that's when reality gets in the way of theory. The word of a woman is after all worth only half that of a man's.

    Only an issue if she agrees to submit to juristiction of tribunal in the first place (as opposed to a regular court of law) which would be pretty unwise of her really. Anyway there are 47,253 other threads more relevent to the subject than this one.
    1987-88 - US intervenes for Iraq against Iran
    Death toll: about 150,000 during time-frame, 100,000 during Desert Storm, 350,000 from resulting famine

    Think youve your Gulf wars mixed up there (easy mistake though)

    1980-88 Original Gulf War -Iraq (+US) versus Iran (+ various Iraqi minority group at different stages) US supplied chemical weapons used on South Kurdistan etc (nobody really gave a shyte at the time but became an awfully big deal later)
    1990/91 "First" (really the second) Gulf War -Iraq (with mumblings of approval from Syria) v's Kuwait (initially) and border skirmishes with Saudai prior to US (and ~30 other countries) invasion(/"liberation") of Kuwait and Southern Iraq (various Iraqi minority groups encouraged to rise up and subsequently shafted) rockets fired at Israel (and US bases in Saudai) few hit their targets. Fears of chemical attacks never realised (but unconfirmed theories RE: "Gulf war syndrome")
    1991-2003 "Ceasefire" (occasional localised air attacks) Sanctions/embargos (Including on parts of Iraq under opposition/seperatist control) weapons inspections, "oil for food" etc Kuwait dictatorship restored.
    2003-20?? "Second" (really the third or possibly a continuation of the second) Gulf War US/UK/"the willing" V's Iraq preceeded by sexed up dossiers, "45 minute" claims and some really stupid fukwittery between the US and France (which some people are still fixated on). WMD never found, Years of distraction from actual threats in Afghanistan/Pakistan and Iran, Oh and a lot of dead people mostly killed AFTER decleration of victory by US (confederate rebel) "president".


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    So good you posted it twice.

    This is sooooooooo dum somebody will post an article saying it's stupid nonsense and the masses misrepresented it?

    Somebody surely will.

    Then the masses will just ignore aforementioned logical stuff.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,953 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Den_M wrote: »
    Even though Megaman strictly has nothing to do with the thread, I think he can impart his awesomeness, Am i right?
    http://www.dan-dare.org/Dan%20Megaman/MegamanBig.jpg
    You rang?


  • Registered Users Posts: 81,953 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    RichieC wrote: »
    Companies like Dell, Walmart, Lowes and Campbells have pulled their advertising from a TLC show called 'All American Muslims' - the show portrays a normal American family who are muslim..

    the reasons are just great, wait for this ****;



    That's right, the same company pulled ads from seventh heaven years back for daring to show a normal Christian family without highlighting the dangers of things like the KKK or the Timothy Mc Veighs... oh wait.. no they didnt.

    Truly the land of the free. :pac:
    While I agree it's patently ridiculous there is no need to misattribute those quotes to the advertising companies: those insane quotes/reasons to pull the show come from the Florida Family Association.
    This decision came after a conservative group, the Florida Family Association, released a statement urging companies to drop their scheduled advertisements because the show threatens the group's beliefs.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2072499/All-American-Muslim-Advertisers-away-TLCs-new-reality-show.html#ixzz1gCH1u2ci

    'All-American Muslim is propaganda clearly designed to counter legitimate and present-day concerns about many Muslims who are advancing Islamic fundamentalism and Sharia law,' the Florida Family Association statement read.
    'The show profiles only Muslims that appear to be ordinary folks while excluding many Islamic believers whose agenda poses a clear and present danger to the liberties and traditional values that the majority of Americans cherish.'
    The show is based in Dearborn, Michigan, follows the lives of a number of Muslim families. One of the stars is a police officer, another a football coach, and the show chronicles their family's daily lives.

    'Clearly this program is attempting to manipulate Americans into ignoring the threat of jihad and to influence them to believe that being concerned about the jihad threat would somehow victimize these nice people in this show,' the Florida Family Association said on its website.

    The group emailed companies that advertised during the first episode of the series on November 13, and claims that 65 of those companies did not run further advertisements during later episodes. They list those companies on the group's website and they include McDonalds, Ikea, and General Motors.
    As for Lowe's, a company representative emailed the family group saying that they would not be advertising on the program because of the subject matter.

    'While we continue to advertise on various cable networks, including TLC, there are certain programs that do not meet Lowe's advertising guidelines, including the show you brought to our attention. Lowe's will no longer be advertising on that program,' the email read.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2072499/All-American-Muslim-Advertisers-away-TLCs-new-reality-show.html#ixzz1gCHU9x6x


    Either way, it's just as well: stir up a bit of controversy, make a media circus out of it, and that show will really take off.

    Here's one example article of what I mean by that, prior to the FFA's involvement:
    Network news anchor Katie Couric once declared that “bigotry expressed against Muslims in this country was one of the most disturbing stories to surface” in the last few years. At the time, Couric was referring to the proposed Park51 Islamic Center in lower Manhattan (sinisterly referred to as the ‘Ground Zero Mosque’ by right-wing opponents), which generated national media attention around the country. “Maybe we need a Muslim version of ‘The Cosby Show,’” Couric continued to say. “I know that sounds crazy, but ‘The Cosby Show’ did so much to change attitudes about African Americans in this country, and I think sometimes people are afraid of what they do not understand.”

    Anti-Muslim sentiment in this country has continued to rise since Couric’s comments. A 2010 Washington Post-ABC News public opinion poll found that “roughly half the country (49 percent) holds an unfavorable view of Islam, compared with 37 percent who have a favorable view.” That is a 10% rise from a similar poll taken in October 2002, just a little more than a year removed from the attacks of 9/11. Just this September, a CBS News Poll found that one-in-three think American Muslims are more sympathetic to terrorists than other Americans.

    So when TLC’s new reality series “All-American Muslim” recently premiered to over 1.7 million viewers this month, many cultural observers saw it as a positive paradigm shift in our post-9/11 America. Highlighting the diverse lives of several Arab-American families in Dearborn, Michigan (a city with the highest concentration of Arab Muslims in the US), the reality series exposes and humanizes the lives of one small cross-section of the Muslim community to an American public that is largely unfamiliar with Islam. In fact, it is no exaggeration to say that the majority of TLC viewers have likely never met a single Muslim in their entire life.

    A recent episode featured high school football coach Fouad Zaban’s trip to the White House for a Muslim holiday dinner hosted by President Obama; as well as the birth of a child to Nader and Nawal Aoude- a Muslim couple with a modern approach to gender roles and parenting- and on Nina Bazzy, a blonde-haired fashionista trying to open a local nightclub.

    Earlier episodes revolved around the wedding preparations of Shadia Amen, a single mom of Lebanese descent who is a self-proclaimed tattooed ‘rebel,’ and her fiancé, Jeff McDermott, a nice Irish Catholic guy from the south side of Chicago. Jeff converts to Islam in order to marry Shadia and the series follows his sometimes bumpy path as a recent Muslim convert.

    Obviously one reality show cannot depict the diversity of the entire Muslim community; a Gallup poll found that only about 18 percent of Muslims are of Arab descent, while 35 percent are African-Americans and 18 percent are South Asian (in any case, the majority of Arab Americans are Christian). What’s more, filming a reality show about Muslims in Dearborn is the cultural equivalent of filming a show about Chinese-Americans in San Francisco’s Chinatown. All of this is to say that there is an obvious and necessary gap between the on-the-ground ‘reality’ of the American Muslim landscape and the TLC show’s portrayal of the Muslim community. That has frustrated many Muslim Americans around the country, some of whom have posted their criticisms of the show on social networking sites like Facebook and Twitter.

    But these views are short-sighted. With anti-Muslim sentiment at all-time highs in this country, any effort to humanize Muslims, no matter how narrow the scope, should be supported by the general public.

    Let us not forget that ‘The Cosby Show’ was not the first television show to bring African-American life into the mainstream in the 1980s. It was James and Florida Evans from ‘Good Times,’ and George and Weezy from ‘The Jeffersons’ who first introduced into our cultural zeitgeist the African American experience (or at least one layer of it) in the 1970s, eventually paving the way for Claire and Heathcliff Huxtable to grace our television airwaves.

    Similarly, TLC’s ‘All-American Muslim’ may not be representative of the lives of all American Muslims (it would be impossible to do so), but it can be a societal stepping stone to advancing our national conversation about Islam in America today. By depicting the lives of ‘regular’ Muslim families, their struggles, their successes, and their unique paths toward the American Dream, the show not only dispels certain misconceptions about Muslims, it bridges the gap of ignorance that has been exacerbated by unfair portrayals of Muslims in the media for the last ten years. More importantly, as the first network television show to ever focus an entire series on our American Muslim community – one that does not simply revolve around terrorism – it will help advance our national conversation in a positive direction.
    That is something that all Americans should be able to get behind.

    Arsalan Iftikhar is an international human rights lawyer and author of the book Islamic Pacifism: Global Muslims in the Post-Osama Era.
    http://www.patheos.com/blogs/allamericanmuslim/2011/12/tlcs-all-american-muslim-a-step-in-the-right-direction/

    FWIW though RichieC you do spend a lot of time occupied with American Domestic issues and seem to get a pretty visceral sense of gratification out of people getting upset with you about it.

    As for the rest of this thread the History forum is that way ->
    JohnathanM wrote: »
    Made the whole thread worth it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 364 ✭✭dilbert2


    RichieC wrote: »
    Companies like Dell, Walmart, Lowes and Campbells have pulled their advertising from a TLC show called 'All American Muslims' - the show portrays a normal American family who are muslim..

    the reasons are just great, wait for this ****;



    That's right, the same company pulled ads from seventh heaven years back for daring to show a normal Christian family without highlighting the dangers of things like the KKK or the Timothy Mc Veighs... oh wait.. no they didnt.

    Truly the land of the free. :pac:

    The only people who are looking for trouble in my opinion is the Americans and in particular the Evangelical, pro-Israel lobby within the Republican Party which is actively trying it’s best to not only destabilise the Middle East, but rile up the 1.5 billion Muslims around the planet. Yes, of course there are some people who resort to terror in Islam, but what religion doesn’t have this element within it, it’s simply that the Western and in particular American media focuses on the Muslim variety.

    The US has also been behind overthrowing governments around the Islamic world (and not to mention other parts of the world too), and replacing them with more US government friendly regimes. This carry on just further proves to me that Americans have lost the plot since 911. Only 3000 people were killed in this event and yet its been used to not only declare war on half the Middle East, but will be the result of most likely millions of innocent deaths. Again, US hypocrisy at its finest. As for wal-mart, given that it’s usually attended by fat yanks with no knowledge of geography outside of the US, to pick up their weekly twinkies and donuts, it probably wouldn’t have sold too well anyway.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    Overheal wrote: »
    While I agree it's patently ridiculous there is no need to misattribute those quotes to the advertising companies: those insane quotes/reasons to pull the show come from the Florida Family Association. .

    that had been established.

    They are not the words of the corporations but the words of the people who they let tell them what to do.
    FWIW though RichieC you do spend a lot of time occupied with American Domestic issues and seem to get a pretty visceral sense of gratification out of people getting upset with you about it.

    I state my case online just as vigorously as you defend your nation online.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 65 ✭✭BeefyS


    americans are lovely.


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