Seanie Johnston Kildare Transfer?

Tom Joad

premierstone wrote: »

Fair points indeed Tom.

You say though you feel that Johnston should have put hes head down and worked hard and took on board what Andrews said to hime he could have worked hes way back, this I think is the crux of the problem, Andrews didnt tell him why he was no longer required a mere 10 secong phonecall, your not on the panel, personally I think Johnston deserved more than that after the years service he has given. I feel that it wouldnt have mattered what Johnston did the only way he was ever going to play for Cavan again was post Andrews.

Also when I said that Mcgeaney was a far better coach than Andrews I wasnt referring to the case in point it was a general statement, and I disagree that if Kildare were to go on and win the AI with Johnston staring that it wouldnt prove Andrews wrong, it is exactly what it would do imo.

I agree completely with your last paragraph and admire the support and that of your fellow Cavan supporters are affording the team management, the only slight issue I would take with it is referring to Johnston as a sideshow, I really am perplexed by how easily Johnston is been alienated after what 10 plus years serivce??

Fair point but we keep hearing about this ten second phonecall and I have heard some of the stories floating about in Cavan about the context of it but you can only have a ten second phonecall with me if I slam the phone on you after ten seconds.:)

I don't know much about Seanie Johnston personally but while accepting that on his day he is as good as any footballer in the country it did appear to me sitting in the stands that he wasn't always a team player. He was captain last year and didn't show any leadership in a very young team - he was dropped by his club, has let Cavan down before so Andrews has a right to drop him if its for the good of the team.

Johnston is now going to get to play county football with a county on the up and up and good luck to the lad but what we need to do in Cavan is get behind the team - I or anyone else is not going to change Andrews mind on this so we have to accept his decision and move on.

Lemlin

premierstone wrote: »

Johnston has said he wasnt given any reason only that he was no longer part of their plans, Andrews has not refuted this, I have no reason to believe that the conversation was anymore or less than this, I feel Johnston deserved more you dont fair enough we will have to agree to disagree on that.

9 years service to the seniors, I was referring to service to Cavan Footbasll, minor, u-21 etc.

I am reading the same thread as you but I dont have an agenda here I couldnt give two fcuks if Cavan never won a game again, or if they went on to win 5 AIs in a row, wont bother me either way, in that sense the word perplexed was perhaps not the best, suprised then. Are you implying from that last sentence that Johnston was responsible for the shambles the county team has been and the attitude of the players involved for the last few years??

I'd appreciate if you could back some of your posts up with some links or quotes. Whenever I have asked you for some, they haven't been forthcoming.

Andrews hasn't commented at all in the media. The right approach IMO. If Johnston feels he wasn't given adequate reasons, what's to stop him ringing the management or what stopped him asking in the call? He was available to reveal to the media the reason Lyng was given.

In no way was Johnston responsible. I'm not sure who could be blamed exactly. Things just went wrong at some point and haven't been corrected. If Andrews is the one to do it than more power to him.

I just find it strange that you keep questioning the dropping and seem to ignore what endless posters have said about the state of Cavan football.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

I'd appreciate if you could back some of your posts up with some links or quotes. Whenever I have asked you for some, they haven't been forthcoming.

Andrews hasn't commented at all in the media. The right approach IMO. If Johnston feels he wasn't given adequate reasons, what's to stop him ringing the management or what stopped him asking in the call? He was available to reveal to the media the reason Lyng was given.

In no way was Johnston responsible. I'm not sure who could be blamed exactly. Things just went wrong at some point and haven't been corrected. If Andrews is the one to do it than more power to him.

I just find it strange that you keep questioning the dropping and seem to ignore what endless posters have said about the state of Cavan football.

That is a very simplistic way to look at the situation. Maybe the manager IS a dictator who had his methods questioned and just decided to get rid of Sean Johnson to teach any other would be questioner a lesson. This could happen again.

Lord Trollington

Lemlin wrote: »

Andrews hasn't commented at all in the media. The right approach IMO. If Johnston feels he wasn't given adequate reasons, what's to stop him ringing the management or what stopped him asking in the call? He was available to reveal to the media the reason Lyng was given.

Johnston went to media for the very reason this entire thread exists I would imagine.

The amount of pure and utter shoite talk about Johnston in this thread other forums and media is way beyond shocking.

Maybe he wants to have his say on the matter while his name , character and personality is dragged through the gutter by internet hard men and rag journo's that don't even know the chap.

I don't know him either, but I would reckon I know about as much about Seanie than umpteen people that has posted on this thread does.

StupidLikeAFox

ColHol wrote: »

Kildare looked sharp and did well against dublin the other day even though none of the big players were playing, so if Seanie is good enough to make the team more power to him

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

That's bull none of the big players for Dublin were playing?? Did you watch the game?? Or at the game??

What you just posted said to me well done Kildare but you didn't beat the AI champions. Insulting to the effort from the Kildare lads

I know this was a few pages back (just checked back on the thread now) but I just want to say that when I said "none of the big players were playing" I was referring to Kildares big players, not Dublins - ie our second string outplayed the Dubs half strength team Sorry for any confusion!

Lemlin

Lord Trollington wrote: »

Johnston went to media for the very reason this entire thread exists I would imagine.

The amount of pure and utter shoite talk about Johnston in this thread other forums and media is way beyond shocking.

Maybe he wants to have his say on the matter while his name , character and personality is dragged through the gutter by internet hard men and rag journo's that don't even know the chap.

I don't know him either, but I would reckon I know about as much about Seanie than umpteen people that has posted on this thread does.

When you replied, you quoted me so I feel compelled to reply.

As I've stated above, I've said nothing about Johnston directly - I've just said that I'm happy with the necessary work that is being done with culling certain individuals from the panel.

blackbelt

ColHol wrote: »

I know this was a few pages back (just checked back on the thread now) but I just want to say that when I said "none of the big players were playing" I was referring to Kildares big players, not Dublins - ie our second string outplayed the Dubs half strength team Sorry for any confusion!

I don't want to drag this off topic but Kildare were only missing John Doyle and maybe Hugh McGrillen.Apart from that, it was a full strength league/championship looking team.

keane2097

blackbelt wrote: »

I don't want to drag this off topic but Kildare were only missing John Doyle and maybe Hugh McGrillen.Apart from that, it was a full strength league/championship looking team.

lolwat?

They were missing two All Stars and a 2011 All Star nominee on top of those lads for a start.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

When you replied, you quoted me so I feel compelled to reply.

As I've stated above, I've said nothing about Johnston directly - I've just said that I'm happy with the necessary work that is being done with culling certain individuals from the panel.

Is Val Andrews a bit of a dictator by doing this by phone and not face to face. I thought good servants of Gaelic Football in Cavan deserved better than to be told in a 10 second phone call that their services were no longer required. Was Johnson not captain last year too ?

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Is Val Andrews a bit of a dictator by doing this by phone and not face to face. I thought good servants of Gaelic Football in Cavan deserved better than to be told in a 10 second phone call that their services were no longer required. Was Johnson not captain last year too ?

I don't see how he is a dictator. But, to be honest, a dictator is what Cavan football needs at this stage. I hoped we had it in Tommy Carr, him being an army man, a few years ago but it didn't materialise. Terry Hyland is very like a dictator and I think he is exactly what Cavan football needs. Someone to go in and tell the jumped up primamadonnas that were on the county panel where to go. Those lads have won nothing yet.

Last year, the county team performed so badly that each and every member of the panel got an official letter confirming that the panel was being disbanded and that players for the upcoming season would receive notification at a further date.

So, in effect, the entire panel was dropped. Val then decided to contact a number of players, including Johnston, directly. The reason given for doing this is that they had been in the panel a number of years consecutively and I'm sure he felt they should be given a reason.

What he told them on this call is up for discussion though. Some people are still arguing he told the players they wouldn't be in the initial squad but may work their way back into his plans. Some people are arguing he told them they wouldn't be required and wouldn't play for Cavan again under him. It's difficult to know to be honest because I'm sure some may have been shocked and didn't take the call in properly.

Seanie said he had a ten second phone call so it appears he wasn't told too much. However, he's been more than happy to tell the media Mickey Lyng was told he was "too old". The one thing I wonder is why he didn't question, or won't announce, the exact reason he was told he wasn't required.

Cavan have a very tough away fixture to Wexford this weekend and there could be alot of pressure on Val after it.

bruschi

Lemlin wrote: »

I don't see how he is a dictator. But, to be honest, a dictator is what Cavan football needs at this stage. I hoped we had it in Tommy Carr, him being an army man, a few years ago but it didn't materialise. Terry Hyland is very like a dictator and I think he is exactly what Cavan football needs. Someone to go in and tell the jumped up primamadonnas that were on the county panel where to go. Those lads have won nothing yet.

Last year, the county team performed so badly that each and every member of the panel got an official letter confirming that the panel was being disbanded and that players for the upcoming season would receive notification at a further date.

So, in effect, the entire panel was dropped. Val then decided to contact a number of players, including Johnston, directly. The reason given for doing this is that they had been in the panel a number of years consecutively and I'm sure he felt they should be given a reason.

What he told them on this call is up for discussion though. Some people are still arguing he told the players they wouldn't be in the initial squad but may work their way back into his plans. Some people are arguing he told them they wouldn't be required and wouldn't play for Cavan again under him. It's difficult to know to be honest because I'm sure some may have been shocked and didn't take the call in properly.

Seanie said he had a ten second phone call so it appears he wasn't told too much. However, he's been more than happy to tell the media Mickey Lyng was told he was "too old". The one thing I wonder is why he didn't question, or won't announce, the exact reason he was told he wasn't required.

Cavan have a very tough away fixture to Wexford this weekend and there could be alot of pressure on Val after it.

this ten second phone call is one thing that has been thrown around a lot on this thread. who hung up on who, why was it only ten seconds, are we to blieve Johsntons word on the whole matter? it just seems very odd to me to be honest. I know if I was being let go after so long involved, I wouldnt just say ok after ten seconds, hang up, and then try get a move to Kildare on the basis of that. I'd be asking why. I'd have a row there and then with the manager and find out why, and what I'd do to get back in. I just am not sure I really believe the whole facts that Johsnton is leaking out into the media over all this.

klairondavis

blackbelt wrote: »

I don't want to drag this off topic but Kildare were only missing John Doyle and maybe Hugh McGrillen.Apart from that, it was a full strength league/championship looking team.

That's nonsense. Mick Foley, Emmet Bolton, Aindriú MacLochlainn, Morgan O'Flaherty, Hugh Lynch and Dermot Earley also played no part. Éamonn Callaghan and Rob Kelly, both championship starters, only came off the bench.

Kildare were less experimental than Dublin but at least half that team will not start in the summer barring injuries. I'd say Fitzpatrick, Lyons, Flanagan, Sweeney, Moolick, both the O'Neill brothers and possibly Mikey Conway will be confined to a substitute's role come Offaly in Portlaoise. If this Johnston thing materialises (which I hope it doesn't) then he might force his way in ahead of either Smith or Kavanagh.

Lemlin

bruschi wrote: »

this ten second phone call is one thing that has been thrown around a lot on this thread. who hung up on who, why was it only ten seconds, are we to blieve Johsntons word on the whole matter? it just seems very odd to me to be honest. I know if I was being let go after so long involved, I wouldnt just say ok after ten seconds, hang up, and then try get a move to Kildare on the basis of that. I'd be asking why. I'd have a row there and then with the manager and find out why, and what I'd do to get back in. I just am not sure I really believe the whole facts that Johsnton is leaking out into the media over all this.

My point exactly. Johnston is being very patchy about what exact details were given and, if he's speaking out, surely he should be willing to give all the facts.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

My point exactly. Johnston is being very patchy about what exact details were given and, if he's speaking out, surely he should be willing to give all the facts.

Why does Andrews not call his bluff then and tell the media the truth so as to end the matter once and for all ? Maybe there is two sides to the story.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Why does Andrews not call his bluff then and tell the media the truth so as to end the matter once and for all ? Maybe there is two sides to the story.

Lifted from Hogan Stand but what a Cavan sports reporter alleges the call was about:

1. Cavan county board had written to every panelist from the 2011 campaign in August-September thanking them for their efforts and advising them that the panel had been disbanded.
This gave the manager a clean sheet to work with for the coming season.

2. The manager whilst putting together his preliminary panel obviously phoned players he wanted to invite in but despite the panel already been disbanded out of courtesy, he also rang individuals not being looked for at that juncture. The reporter went on to say these players included former captain Martin Cahill, Micheal Lyng, Dermot Sheridan, Cian Mackey, Gareth Smith and Sean Johnston.

3. It was said that Cavan operated an open door policy and that this group are training with their clubs and depending on their progress may or may not feature with Cavan later in the season.

4. The reporter stated clearly that no player was told he would never play for the manager or Cavan again.

Frank Spencer

hoganstand.com wrote:

Cavan won't sign Johnston transfer form

The transfer of Seanie Johnston to Kildare has hit a stumbling block after Cavan county board decided they could not sign the transfer application as in their opinion it might break GAA rules.

The Breffni County have cited Rule 6.9 of the GAA's official guide which relates to the 'permanent residence' of the player seeking the transfer, with Cavan questioning whether Johnston is in fact living in Kildare.

The statement released after Monday's Cavan board meeting reads:

"During the January meeting of Cavan county board's management committee, the issue of an inter-county transfer request was discussed. The committee have decided that they will be unable to assist this particular process as they believe there is a doubt about compliance with rial 6.9 T.O. 2011."

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=161190

premierstone

Frank Spencer wrote: »

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=161190

I would surely have thought it was up to Kildare ie the recepient county to ensure such logistics are in place and not Cavan?

Gophur

Lord Trollington wrote: »

..........
The amount of pure and utter shoite talk about Johnston in this thread other forums and media is way beyond shocking.
...........

I think you need to get a sense of perspective about things.

munchkin_utd

just some additional background info from county PRO Declan Woods via Colm Keys in the indo today

Cavan PRO Declan Woods said that the executive had effectively cast doubt on the residency issue and it would now be a matter for the CCCC to deal with it.

"We're not the body who decides whether Seanie Johnston can transfer or not. That's for the CCCC to determine and eradicate that doubt we have cast about his private principal residence," said Woods.

"We respect his right to seek a transfer and we'd be very disappointed to see him go if the transfer request is approved.

"But what we are saying is that we have concerns about where the player is living. As far as we know, he is living in Cavan town and we have no knowledge to say that is not the case. We haven't asked for any and we wouldn't need to know, but we felt it wouldn't be right to approve something when we clearly have a concern about it," added Woods.

"This is nothing personal against Seanie Johnston, who has been a wonderful player for Cavan.

"But our belief is that he is still living in Cavan and until it can be proved otherwise, we wouldn't be satisfied with this transfer being approved."

Colm Keys himself adds : "Proof of residency could come in the form of utility bills, registration with the Private Residential Tenancies Board (PRTB), a rental agreement with a landlord, electoral registration or sequence of correspondence over a period of time to a particular address."

so basically claiming to live somewhere is different from being permanently moved!!!

mossyc123

munchkin_utd wrote: »

just some additional background info from county PRO Declan Woods via Colm Keys in the indo today

Colm Keys himself adds : "Proof of residency could come in the form of utility bills, registration with the Private Residential Tenancies Board (PRTB), a rental agreement with a landlord, electoral registration or sequence of correspondence over a period of time to a particular address."

so basically claiming to live somewhere is different from being permanently moved!!!

Was listening to Off the Ball last night.

Couldn't believe the Cavan PRO was given such a hard time by the lads!

They started bringing in stuff like Cavan allegedly breaking other rules such as the winter training ban and payments to managers and suggesting that why wouldn't they just break this rule and agree that SJ had moved to Kildare...

Why would they?!

Val Andrews could be gone by the year end, a new manager could take SJ back into the squad and Cavan have there best player in a generation back.

Suggesting that they just roll over and bow to the all-powerful pull of Kildare under McGeeney instead of standing up for themselves is ludicrous IMO.

Starie1975

mossyc123 wrote: »

Was listening to Off the Ball last night.

Couldn't believe the Cavan PRO was given such a hard time by the lads!

They started bringing in stuff like Cavan allegedly breaking other rules such as the winter training ban and payments to managers and suggesting that why wouldn't they just break this rule and agree that SJ had moved to Kildare...

Why would they?!

Val Andrews could be gone by the year end, a new manager could take SJ back into the squad and Cavan have there best player in a generation back.

Suggesting that they just roll over and bow to the all-powerful pull of Kildare under McGeeney instead of standing up for themselves is ludicrous IMO.

I though the Cavan PRO got a bit of a hard time too but he spoke very well.

I also agree with the stance taken by the Cavan board. Why should they sign a form without knowing if the player is living in that county? The GAA should have a stronger stance on all these transfers. In fairness it's very easy to write down an address and not live in that area.

Tom Joad

Sounds like the county board is hedging their bets - if Cavan have a poor year and they decide to get rid of Andrews then at least they can bring Johnston back.

I assume if Johnston does get a transfer to Kildare that he could never go back to Cavan?

Lemlin

Starie1975 wrote: »

I though the Cavan PRO got a bit of a hard time too but he spoke very well.

I also agree with the stance taken by the Cavan board. Why should they sign a form without knowing if the player is living in that county? The GAA should have a stronger stance on all these transfers. In fairness it's very easy to write down an address and not live in that area.

In fairness to Cavan board, they are correct in what they are doing. Allowing Johnston to move could potentially open the floodgates for transfers like this all over the GAA intercounty scene.

It's plain to a dog in the street that Johnston isn't living in Kildare.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

In fairness to Cavan board, they are correct in what they are doing. Allowing Johnston to move could potentially open the floodgates for transfers like this all over the GAA intercounty scene.

It's plain to a dog in the street that Johnston isn't living in Kildare.

Its a pity the same county board couldn't sit down with both manager and player and get both to see sense for the good of their county. I'm sure Cavan supporters cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave. The county board seem to be content to allow that to happen while sitting on their backsides. Is their function not to see that things are running smoothly in the county ?

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Its a pity the same county board couldn't sit down with both manager and player and get both to see sense for the good of their county. I'm sure Cavan supporters cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave. The county board seem to be content to allow that to happen while sitting on their backsides. Is their function not to see that things are running smoothly in the county ?

Who said things are not running smoothly? TBH I'm getting sick to death of opinions like yours above at this stage. Plenty of players have been dropped from the Cavan panel. Do you see them all trying to transfer to other counties?

The county board have selected a manager and have left it to him to deal with the panel. That's what he's doing. He's picked who he thinks are the 30 best players in the county to repersent Cavan.

They mightn't be the 30 best players in terms of actual quality, but the GAA is a team game. It's about an entire panel. Not about one man.

From the Cavan posters on this thread, its fairly clear that many do understand why their "best footballer for so long" wants to up and leave so I also don't get your point re " I'm sure Cavan supporters cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave".

To give you an idea of how Cavan supporters are feeling, the latest text going around the county is about Seanie going out with the most wonderful girl in the world but not being sure where he lives! Doesn't look like there's much support for him to me so.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

Who said things are not running smoothly? TBH I'm getting sick to death of opinions like yours above at this stage. Plenty of players have been dropped from the Cavan panel. Do you see them all trying to transfer to other counties?

The county board have selected a manager and have left it to him to deal with the panel. That's what he's doing. He's picked who he thinks are the 30 best players in the county to repersent Cavan.

They mightn't be the 30 best players in terms of actual quality, but the GAA is a team game. It's about an entire panel. Not about one man.

From the Cavan posters on this thread, its fairly clear that many do understand why their "best footballer for so long" wants to up and leave so I also don't get your point re " I'm sure Cavan supporters cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave".

To give you an idea of how Cavan supporters are feeling, the latest text going around the county is about Seanie going out with the most wonderful girl in the world but not being sure where he lives! Doesn't look like there's much support for him to me so.

You seem to be as easily riled as your manager clearly was when someone gave a different view to his. I'm sure many Cavan supporters would rather Seanie in the blue jersey instead of the white and my point stands in that your county board seem willing to let it carry on rather than be proactive in sorting it out. No county can afford to lose its best forward for years especially a county lacking success like Cavan.

dcr22B

tayto lover wrote: »

No county can afford to lose its best forward for years especially a county lacking success like Cavan.

If the guy's presence or attitiude towards the cause isn't right then the manager has to do what's best for the panel not for some so called superstar :rolleyes:

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

You seem to be as easily riled as your manager clearly was when someone gave a different view to his. I'm sure many Cavan supporters would rather Seanie in the blue jersey instead of the white and my point stands in that your county board seem willing to let it carry on rather than be proactive in sorting it out. No county can afford to lose its best forward for years especially a county lacking success like Cavan.

To be honest, there's been post after post on this thread which is now over 20 pages long of people not being able to understand how Cavan can drop Johnston. Every Cavan poster on here has supported Andrews and stated that something needed to be done with the county setup. Most have then dropped their points at that stage but you continue.

So my problem is not someone having a different view, it's someone reading this thread and stating that Cavan supporters "cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave". They clearly can from reading this thread so, as I've asked, what's your point?

If this thread is indicative of Cavan people's thinking, not many give two fiddlers fooks that Johnston is gone. Of course they would prefer him in blue to white but he's been dropped for whatever reasons and people in Cavan, having seen the panel over the past few years, realise this. So you're entirely wrong to make a statement like that above and its statements like that constantly being made in media etc. which annoy me at this stage. Cavan supporters DO understand what is happening and they are supporting Andrews and the county board, not Johnston.

I also have problems with your labelling of him as the "best foward for years" in Cavan. Have you heard of Jason or Larry Reilly? Jason only quit playing county football in 2009 and Larry was only the year before. So Johnston has not been Cavan's best forward for years.

Also, have you ever seen Johnston play? If you go over to Hogan Stand and have a look at posts over the years, you'll find Seanie had plenty of critics, as well as fans. He can kick a score from anywhere once the ball is delivered to him. Ask him to win the ball or fight to get it though and you're in trouble. Hence the reason he has never scored a Championship goal.

premierstone

Reading this thread I have come to the conclusion that Cavan and Andrews deserve each other and Im actually going to kind of enjoy the inevitable debacle that will ensue

tayto lover

dcr22B wrote: »

If the guy's presence or attitiude towards the cause isn't right then the manager has to do what's best for the panel not for some so called superstar :rolleyes:

Nobody in the management set-up seems to have come out and said that. That is part of my point, nothing has been explained. Some are saying that Johnston is a bad influence in the dressing room and with young players and others are saying that Andrews hasn't got a clue and can't take criticism. Many are saying that Johnston was last years captain and must have said something following their two championship hammerings to upset Andrews.
If Gooch or Brogan were to be dropped would supporters of those counties not be entitled to ask questions ? We were the same in Louth when the O'Hanlons were dropped years ago, we asked questions and got answers.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

To be honest, there's been post after post on this thread which is now over 20 pages long of people not being able to understand how Cavan can drop Johnston. Every Cavan poster on here has supported Andrews and stated that something needed to be done with the county setup. Most have then dropped their points at that stage but you continue.

So my problem is not someone having a different view, it's someone reading this thread and stating that Cavan supporters "cannot understand why their best footballer for so long wants to up-tent and leave". They clearly can from reading this thread so, as I've asked, what's your point?

If this thread is indicative of Cavan people's thinking, not many give two fiddlers fooks that Johnston is gone. Of course they would prefer him in blue to white but he's been dropped for whatever reasons and people in Cavan, having seen the panel over the past few years, realise this. So you're entirely wrong to make a statement like that above and its statements like that constantly being made in media etc. which annoy me at this stage. Cavan supporters DO understand what is happening and they are supporting Andrews and the county board, not Johnston.

I also have problems with your labelling of him as the "best foward for years" in Cavan. Have you heard of Jason or Larry Reilly? Jason only quit playing county football in 2009 and Larry was only the year before. So Johnston has not been Cavan's best forward for years.

Also, have you ever seen Johnston play? If you go over to Hogan Stand and have a look at posts over the years, you'll find Seanie had plenty of critics, as well as fans. He can kick a score from anywhere once the ball is delivered to him. Ask him to win the ball or fight to get it though and you're in trouble. Hence the reason he has never scored a Championship goal.

Saw him play a few times and he was excellent. Was he not their top scorer for the last few years too ? Saw the other two play too and Jason had a great eye for goal. Thought Larry was a headless chicken who kicked terrible wides and took bad options on the two occasions that I saw him, but that has little to do with this anyway.

Tom Joad

premierstone wrote: »

Reading this thread I have come to the conclusion that Cavan and Andrews deserve each other and Im actually going to kind of enjoy the inevitable debacle that will ensue

Don't know what you mean by this but I can't understand what the issue with the way the management have handled this is. For far too long there has been too much player power in Cavan, too many disruptive influences around the county set-up etc which has led us to the dark days we are in at the minute. Manager comes in and says - I pick the team, I want players who are willing to commit to the jersey not matter who you are - and people have a problem with this. I'm delighted that for once people are standing behing the manager. Why should he come out and explain himself to all and sundry? From what I can see it has been Johnston that has been talking to the media and leaking things about 10 second phonecalls etc.. what's to be gained by Andrews coming out with his side off the story - nothing!!!

His job is to work with the players he has for the League and Championship not have a media frenzy around a player who wants to play for another county.

As for Johnston being our best forward in the last few years - yes on his day and when he was in the mood he was virtually unplayable, but when the going got tough he disappeared - what we need in Cavan is hungry, committed players, all pulling together. If that's what Andrews gets out of this that will be the best thing that happened Cavan GAA in a long, long time. That is why Cavan supporters here are backing the manager.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Saw him play a few times and he was excellent. Was he not their top scorer for the last few years too ? Saw the other two play too and Jason had a great eye for goal. Thought Larry was a headless chicken who kicked terrible wides and took bad options on the two occasions that I saw him, but that has little to do with this anyway.

He certainly wasn't top scorer last year. He may have been the year before but are free takers not generally top point scorers? I'm not questioning Johnston's ability. He has great ability to kick scores. As I said though, ask him to do the dirty work and win a tough 50/50 ball, and he'll stand back. He is a player who can turn a game and there's no disputing that. I saw him do it two years ago against Wicklow.

It has alot to do with it tbh because I've repeatedly watched you on this thread refer, first to Johnston as Cavan's "best player in years". Then when I pointed out Dermot McCabe, you changed it to "best forward in years".

The Irish Aussie Rules management must of missed Larry Reilly kicking terrible wides when they called him up to the panel on 2 or 3 occasions. A feat never accomplished by Johnston might I add.

Jason Reilly also scored the winning goal in the '97 Ulster final and played for Cavan right up to 2008. He also played for the Juniors in recent times and still regularly plays for Belturbet. He was a top forward and better than Johnston IMO.

In 2001 in the League, he scored a goal in every game (when Cavan were in Division 1 might I add) and Cavan made the final where they lost against Tyrone.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Nobody in the management set-up seems to have come out and said that. That is part of my point, nothing has been explained. Some are saying that Johnston is a bad influence in the dressing room and with young players and others are saying that Andrews hasn't got a clue and can't take criticism. Many are saying that Johnston was last years captain and must have said something following their two championship hammerings to upset Andrews.
If Gooch or Brogan were to be dropped would supporters of those counties not be entitled to ask questions ? We were the same in Louth when the O'Hanlons were dropped years ago, we asked questions and got answers.

I haven't seen a single poster on here (and I've just read back through every post) say that Johnston must have said something to upset Andrews except you. You were even the one which came out with that story originally on here. You've also repeatedly referred to Andrews as a "dictator". In fact, your postings on the GAA forum appear to be limited to this thread so have you some sort of personal interest in it?

I also don't see too many on here saying that Andrews hasn't a clue and can't take criticism. I certainly haven't heard it from too many in Cavan either.

Seanie Johnston is a long way from Gooch or Brogan. Top players have been dropped by counties before. They haven't looked for transfers away and haven't asked for it to be spelt out in the media. As people have repeatedly said (but you don't seem to be able to get into your thick skull), why does Andrews need to speak out? He's getting plenty of support in the county, as evident in this thread.

Seanie meanwhile is having texts sent around about how he can't remember where he lives. Kieran McGeeney has his own County Board saying he spoke too early about the move. It appears from the opinion of alot of Kildare supporters, including some on here, they don't want Johnston.

So what exactly does Andrews need to clarify? A number of players were given the first year of his tenure and he's decided they weren't for him so he has moved on.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

I haven't seen a single poster on here (and I've just read back through every post) say that Johnston must have said something to upset Andrews except you. You were even the one which came out with that story originally on here. You've also repeatedly referred to Andrews as a "dictator". In fact, your postings on the GAA forum appear to be limited to this thread so have you some sort of personal interest in it?

I also don't see too many on here saying that Andrews hasn't a clue and can't take criticism. I certainly haven't heard it from too many in Cavan either.

Seanie Johnston is a long way from Gooch or Brogan. Top players have been dropped by counties before. They haven't looked for transfers away and haven't asked for it to be spelt out in the media. As people have repeatedly said (but you don't seem to be able to get into your thick skull), why does Andrews need to speak out? He's getting plenty of support in the county, as evident in this thread.

Seanie meanwhile is having texts sent around about how he can't remember where he lives. Kieran McGeeney has his own County Board saying he spoke too early about the move. It appears from the opinion of alot of Kildare supporters, including some on here, they don't want Johnston.

So what exactly does Andrews need to clarify? A number of players were given the first year of his tenure and he's decided they weren't for him so he has moved on.

Maybe you should ask the Louth supporters what they think of Andrews and I have posted some of their views on here which you must not have read. I also checked your Cavan Board on Hogan Stand and there are as many posters on it for Johnston as there are against him. So I think you are posting porkies with that one. To make the matter plain for all to see then I believe (just me) that the manager has to clarify what the real story is.

PS
No need to upset yourself over it all.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

He certainly wasn't top scorer last year. He may have been the year before but are free takers not generally top point scorers? I'm not questioning Johnston's ability. He has great ability to kick scores. As I said though, ask him to do the dirty work and win a tough 50/50 ball, and he'll stand back. He is a player who can turn a game and there's no disputing that. I saw him do it two years ago against Wicklow.

It has alot to do with it tbh because I've repeatedly watched you on this thread refer, first to Johnston as Cavan's "best player in years". Then when I pointed out Dermot McCabe, you changed it to "best forward in years".

The Irish Aussie Rules management must of missed Larry Reilly kicking terrible wides when they called him up to the panel on 2 or 3 occasions. A feat never accomplished by Johnston might I add.

Jason Reilly also scored the winning goal in the '97 Ulster final and played for Cavan right up to 2008. He also played for the Juniors in recent times and still regularly plays for Belturbet. He was a top forward and better than Johnston IMO.

In 2001 in the League, he scored a goal in every game (when Cavan were in Division 1 might I add) and Cavan made the final where they lost against Tyrone.

I would have classed Dermot as a midfielder myself even though he did play in the forwards from time to time and usuallyt moved in from midfield. I also think from memory that Jason did not score that goal in the Ulster Final of 1997. I was at that match and thought it was Damien O'Reilly but maybe I am wrong again. There is no denying that Jason was a great footballer but I believe Seanie is better, but my opinion again of course.
As regards Aussie Rules, I never had any time for it and think that many good players had no time for it either. I am with Mickey Harte on this one. The best players avoided that shambles of a game.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

I would have classed Dermot as a midfielder myself even though he did play in the forwards from time to time and usuallyt moved in from midfield. I also think from memory that Jason did not score that goal in the Ulster Final of 1997. I was at that match and thought it was Damien O'Reilly but maybe I am wrong again. There is no denying that Jason was a great footballer but I believe Seanie is better, but my opinion again of course.
As regards Aussie Rules, I never had any time for it and think that many good players had no time for it either. I am with Mickey Harte on this one. The best players avoided that shambles of a game.

Now I know you just haven't a clue. Peter Canavan? Stephen McDonnell? Graham Geraghty? Dara O'Se? Padraig Joyce? Anthony Tohill? Sean Og de Paor? Sean Cavanagh? All of the above are some of the best GAA players over the past decade and they didn't avoid "that shambles of a game". Can you give examples of the best players who did avoid it?

My point re Dermot is that when I mentioned him you changed best player to forward because Dermot did usually play in midfield. Read my post and I never said I did class Dermot as a forward. Are you ready to admit you were wrong over Johnston being Cavan's best player for years now?

Jason O'Reilly scored the goal. Damien O'Reilly is a back. Jason was a super sub back then and came on to score it. Again, your knowledge appears poor so I'll be taking your opinion with a pinch of salt.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Maybe you should ask the Louth supporters what they think of Andrews and I have posted some of their views on here which you must not have read. I also checked your Cavan Board on Hogan Stand and there are as many posters on it for Johnston as there are against him. So I think you are posting porkies with that one. To make the matter plain for all to see then I believe (just me) that the manager has to clarify what the real story is.

PS
No need to upset yourself over it all.

The only thing getting me upset is that countless posters from cavan like myself and Tom Joad have continually posted why we have no problem with what management are doing but an incessant cretin keeps asking "why" like a 3 year old child.

That's fine so. We may get on the phone and demand an answer from Val because a fella called Tayto Lover on Boards is demanding answers!

As I asked previously, what's the personal agenda here? Because for a fella who doesn't post in the GAA forum, you've a big interest in this topic.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

Now I know you just haven't a clue. Peter Canavan? Stephen McDonnell? Graham Geraghty? Dara O'Se? Padraig Joyce? Anthony Tohill? Sean Og de Paor? Sean Cavanagh? All of the above are some of the best GAA players over the past decade and they didn't avoid "that shambles of a game". Can you give examples of the best players who did avoid it?

My point re Dermot is that when I mentioned him you changed best player to forward because Dermot did usually play in midfield. Read my post and I never said I did class Dermot as a forward. Are you ready to admit you were wrong over Johnston being Cavan's best player for years now?

Jason O'Reilly scored the goal. Damien O'Reilly is a back. Jason was a super sub back then and came on to score it. Again, your knowledge appears poor so I'll be taking your opinion with a pinch of salt.

You are still allowing yourself to get angry and offended.
Those opinions are mine and I do indeed say that Johnson was Cavan's best footballer for the last few years. You might be right about the goal scorer BUT you should be as you are a Cavan man. I wonder what your knowledge of |Louth football is like ?
You can take my opinions anyway you like especially as you seem to have an agenda of backing up the manager of your county no matter what. I just cannot see why people are so quick to turn on one of their own and back an outsider buyt sure that's how the Normans arrived here.

dcr22B

Supple rejected Kildare

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/supple-rejected-kildare-182574.html

Unbelievable, piss off and get your own players instead of trying to poach from other counties. Someone in HQ needs to do something about this, it's making an absolute mockery of the intercounty system!

Surely the current incumbents on the Kildare panel must be feeling uneasy reading all this stuff.

Hammer Archer

dcr22B wrote: »

Supple rejected Kildare

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/supple-rejected-kildare-182574.html

Unbelievable, piss off and get your own players instead of trying to poach from other counties. Someone in HQ needs to do something about this, it's making an absolute mockery of the intercounty system!

Surely the current incumbents on the Kildare panel must be feeling uneasy reading all this stuff.

If true, that is very very bad form by McGeeney and Kildare. What does that say to Shane Connolly that his manager obviously doesn't have confidence in him as he was trying to find a replacement.
I would not be happy with this sort of carry on if I was a Kildare fan. Agree that Croke Park should do something about this because it's taking the piss at this stage.

largepants

dcr22B wrote: »

Supple rejected Kildare

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/supple-rejected-kildare-182574.html

Unbelievable, piss off and get your own players instead of trying to poach from other counties. Someone in HQ needs to do something about this, it's making an absolute mockery of the intercounty system!

Surely the current incumbents on the Kildare panel must be feeling uneasy reading all this stuff.

Hold your horses there for a minute. Just because you read it in a paper doesn't mean its true. Or just because Supple said it doesn't mean its true either.

I suggest Supple might be stirring it a bit.

dcr22B

John Fogarty does not have bullsh1t stories published.

Kildare GAA won't comment on it as it's getting embarassing at this stage.

Alaska1

largepants wrote: »

Hold your horses there for a minute. Just because you read it in a paper doesn't mean its true. Or just because Supple said it doesn't mean its true either.

I suggest Supple might be stirring it a bit.

It is 100% true I am afraid.

In anyways what possible gain could Supple get by making something like that up ?

Red Crow

Hammer Archer wrote: »

dcr22B wrote: »

Supple rejected Kildare

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/supple-rejected-kildare-182574.html

Unbelievable, piss off and get your own players instead of trying to poach from other counties. Someone in HQ needs to do something about this, it's making an absolute mockery of the intercounty system!

Surely the current incumbents on the Kildare panel must be feeling uneasy reading all this stuff.

If true, that is very very bad form by McGeeney and Kildare. What does that say to Shane Connolly that his manager obviously doesn't have confidence in him as he was trying to find a replacement.
I would not be happy with this sort of carry on if I was a Kildare fan. Agree that Croke Park should do something about this because it's taking the piss at this stage.

Where does that say Geezer approached him. Kildare aren't short on decent keepers and if it was true how do you know it's not someone who just cracked the question to him who was not asked to by Geezer?

The Seanie transfer is just stupid. I think Val Andrews must of told Johnstone that he hasn't a hope of getting back on the panel. I didn't agree with Ryan O Dwyer either from my own county but there was different circumstances there but I don't think any player should be allowed play for another county.

I understand why Geezer is trying to pull this off. Kildare need another forward. This transfer will go through though. Regardless of what anyone thinks. The fact that it's an amateur sport the GAA can't bind any player to any club and county.

Hammer Archer

Eli Manning wrote: »

Where does that say Geezer approached him. Kildare aren't short on decent keepers and if it was true how do you know it's not someone who just cracked the question to him who was not asked to by Geezer?

Well if he didn't approach him, he most likely organised it. If he didn't even do that then he'd want to find the person who's going behind his back and approaching other county's players without his permission.

Eli Manning wrote: »

I understand why Geezer is trying to pull this off. Kildare need another forward. This transfer will go through though. Regardless of what anyone thinks. The fact that it's an amateur sport the GAA can't bind any player to any club and county.

It's the GAA! If you're short of a player, you scour your own county for any talent. You don't poach players from other counties.
And what makes you so sure the Johnston transfer will go through? I don't think you're familiar with the GAA's intercounty transfer rules. One of the requirements for an intercounty transfer is for the player in question being permanently resident in the county he wants to move to. And Johnston certainly isn't permanently resident in Kildare. In fact, it's debateable whether he's living there at all.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

You are still allowing yourself to get angry and offended.
Those opinions are mine and I do indeed say that Johnson was Cavan's best footballer for the last few years. You might be right about the goal scorer BUT you should be as you are a Cavan man. I wonder what your knowledge of |Louth football is like ?
You can take my opinions anyway you like especially as you seem to have an agenda of backing up the manager of your county no matter what. I just cannot see why people are so quick to turn on one of their own and back an outsider buyt sure that's how the Normans arrived here.

I wouldn't say I'm angry. I am annoyed at your constant stupidity.

I have absolutely no knowledge of Louth football and I've no wish to either.

I have no agenda. I've stated my reasons for backing the manager on here constantly but, as I said above, you seem to be too much of a cretin to read them. I've also said I'd prefer Terry Hyland was sole manager. Someone needs to try and tackle the mess that is Cavan football rather than burying their head in the sand.

So, can I ask again, because you've ignored the question, what is your reason for incessantly backing Seanie up and using negative terms like "dictator" for Val? Also, another unanswered question, why so much interest in this thread when you aren't a regular poster on the GAA forum? It seems a bit strange to me.

People aren't being quick to turn their back on anyone. They are giving their support to a manager because they have seen the work he is doing in the county. People in Cavan know their club football and they see the dedicated players Val is calling in. They also know the reputations of some of the other players he has dropped.

Perhaps some know of Seanie's own reputation. I'd also state again that his own club stripped him of the captaincy last year and didn't start him in some matches. You choose to ignore points like that which don't suit your agenda. So Johnston has more than just problems with his county and Val.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

I wouldn't say I'm angry. I am annoyed at your constant stupidity.

I have absolutely no knowledge of Louth football and I've no wish to either.

I have no agenda. I've stated my reasons for backing the manager on here constantly but, as I said above, you seem to be too much of a cretin to read them. I've also said I'd prefer Terry Hyland was sole manager. Someone needs to try and tackle the mess that is Cavan football rather than burying their head in the sand.

So, can I ask again, because you've ignored the question, what is your reason for incessantly backing Seanie up and using negative terms like "dictator" for Val? Also, another unanswered question, why so much interest in this thread when you aren't a regular poster on the GAA forum? It seems a bit strange to me.

People aren't being quick to turn their back on anyone. They are giving their support to a manager because they have seen the work he is doing in the county. People in Cavan know their club football and they see the dedicated players Val is calling in. They also know the reputations of some of the other players he has dropped.

Perhaps some know of Seanie's own reputation. I'd also state again that his own club stripped him of the captaincy last year and didn't start him in some matches. You choose to ignore points like that which don't suit your agenda. So Johnston has more than just problems with his county and Val.

You are not upset and yet you continue to call me stupid and a cretin for taking a different view to yours ?? What a sorrowful post then from you again. Attacking the poster instead of the post is stupid but maybe you don't get that with your arrogance. I have repeatedly told you that Andrews is a poor manager and that it is my opinion. He has not had any county success anywhere and nearly ruined Louth football when he was here. I even posted views from other Louth supporters but you ignored that because you were too interested in backing up YOUR man.
PS
Why shouldn't I back up a great footballer like Seanie Johnson who many Cavan supporters have told me got a raw deal, despite you saying that everyone was on Andrew's side. Very untruthful and attempting to mislead indeed. You could have done with him today it seems. But sure you probably didn't even go and just stayed on here backing up your chancer.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

You are not upset and yet you continue to call me stupid and a cretin for taking a different view to yours ?? What a sorrowful post then from you again. Attacking the poster instead of the post is stupid but maybe you don't get that with your arrogance. I have repeatedly told you that Andrews is a poor manager and that it is my opinion. He has not had any county success anywhere and nearly ruined Louth football when he was here. I even posted views from other Louth supporters but you ignored that because you were too interested in backing up YOUR man.
PS
Why shouldn't I back up a great footballer like Seanie Johnson who many Cavan supporters have told me got a raw deal, despite you saying that everyone was on Andrew's side. Very untruthful and attempting to mislead indeed. You could have done with him today it seems. But sure you probably didn't even go and just stayed on here backing up your chancer.

As I said, I'm not upset, I'm annoyed. Several people on this thread have told you why they aren't unhappy about Seanie being dropped yet you continue throwing out the same question but changing the wording e.g. "how are Cavan people happy with their best player being dropped", "how are Cavan fans accepting their best player in years not playing?", "how are Cavan fans accepting an outside manager ahead of one of their own". The same question you've asked about ten different times now in different guises has been answered repeatedly. That you keep asking it and can't move on leads me to believe that you are extremely stupid or you have an agenda. That's where I've drawn my assertion from. I don't have any problem with someone having a different opinion to mine but why keep posting the same question in different guises when it has been repeatedly answered.

As for my arrogance, I've answered every query you've thrown at me. As per the above, you haven't answered a number of mine. You say you're a GAA supporter yet you expect a county manager to put up with a player who's club, a club he has played for for twenty years now, couldn't control last year. Now how does that work out?

Andrews has only managed Louth and Cavan. I can't speak about Louth because I know nothing about Louth football but, as with Cavan, I don't think there was much pedigree there to work with when he arrived. Cavan were knocked out in 2003, after all, by a Cavan team managed by Mattie Kerrigan who were one of the worst Cavan teams I'd ever seen. They were disorganised and all over the place. From looking at the 2004 Championship, Louth beat Antrim in the qualifiers and then lost to Galway, a team they never had a chance of beating, no matter who the manager was. In 2005, they beat Waterford and Roscommon before losing by 3 points to Monaghan, again a team they wouldn't be expecting to beat. So, to say he ruined Louth football appears to be incorrect. Perhaps you could post a few paragraphs on how he ruined it exactly. I've spoken at lengths as to why I think he is working well in cavan so perhaps you could explain in detail the problems in Louth. It might enable us to understand your point and making personal comments about him being a "dictator" a bit more.

Post up the views from Louth again then and I have no problem responding to them.

We are both addressing this board. I don't see too many on here saying that Johnston got a raw deal so forgive me if I don't believe a point you're making which conveniently backs up your view but that you have absolutely no proof of. I could post up the stories I've been told both about Johnston in terms of both the Gaels and county camps but I have chosen not to. Why? Because I don't know which are true and which are not and I've absolutely nothing to back them up as more than hearsay. I'm a Cavan supporter living in Cavan and, as I said, the texts going round the county are about Johnston, not about Andrews. If this Board is indicative of the general Cavan supporter, which I think it is, Johnston isn't receiving much support. Would you not agree?

And how exactly could we have done with Johnston today? Again, another stupid point. The Cavan fowards scored 1-13 yesterday. The problem was in the backline where 4-9 was conceded and James Reilly made a bad mistake for one of the goals.

AGC

I mentioned earlier in the thread about players getting 'poached' by Kildare and was shot down. Supple is the player I was referring to. So to DARK KNIGHT before you come on abusing others try get your facts right.