Cycling/Walking around the city

Iwannahurl

So you can fall off/over/on the hazards safely...;)

Mr_A

If only someone had thought of that before.

at1withmyself

what_traffic wrote: »

Is this the kind of paving you are talking about?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=65483221&postcount=146

Recently installed along the N6 as per: http://www.galwaycity.ie/N6/

In my opinion the one pictured is fine and are located around the city, they are 'squared' and wide like in the picture and no problem for bikes. However on the Bridge and a few other locations it seems they were short of these type of slates and used an alternative which is rounded and the spacing much closer, not much more then an inch I'd say, its these ones that are deadly and often catch my wheels.

I contacted the council after they were installed to express my concern, got a reply as follows:

Thanks you for your email.

The slates that you refer to are the cordoury paving, that are used to distinguish the cycle lane from the pesestrian footway for the visually impaired. These are in accordance with national design guidance.

I asked our resident engineer to examine these furter to your email, and he stated that they have been correctly installed and are the same on both sides of the road. Can I ask if you were cycling on the concrete section or the tarmac section? (The ridges go in different directions on both). Also, what type of bike were you cycling on i.e thin or wide tyres? If you were on the cycle path and the paving caused difficulties we may need to revisit their use.

Regards,


I replied but never got a response so now I cycle on the road going over the bridge which is not ideal.

Seaneh

newkie wrote: »

Get a helmet.

Because helmets keep you upright now?

crusher000

I've had a few scares on these as well. cycled to work ofr 3 monts of our so called summer and when wt the back of my bike used to slide of them. Clinched buttocks as i approached an day the were wet. I have a road bike. Options are A cycle path and have a near slip. Option B cycle on road and be squezed in by motorists. I go for A all the time.

_Puma_

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I've heard rumours of someone commuting to the University by boat from Annaghdown!

Would have been common before the Curraghline was built, there used to be a ferry, just like the Corrib Princess that would travel daily to Woodquay. I have a boat at Annaghdown and went to college in the University and it always was tempting to try it out. Would probably taken at least an hour, depending on the time of year and water levels on the lake and a decent outboard. I have Kayaked to Woodquay before, took the good part of a day and things got pretty dicey the bottom of the lake as its so exposed.

Staying on topic I used to cycle over the QB daily and those ridged pavement things alway made me hold on to the handle bars a little tighter going over them! There is a set of them between the start of the actual bridge and the entrance to the student estates with no pedestrian crossing in sight, they just appear out of no where and for no reason.

dastardly00

Sniipe wrote: »

I cycle daily on the Quincentenary bridge. Thankfully I've never had a puncture. I use a road bike with kevlar tyres. However I think cycling on it could be the death of me. On wet or icy days when I cycle over the "bumps" area I could easily fall off. Its the exact same width as my tyre and if I hit it at a slight angle or hit the top of the bump I slip a bit which puts me off balance.

Does anyone else have the same issue on a road bike? The bumps go in the direction of cycling and on the footpath side the are perpendicular. Its safer if I go on the footpath at these points, but with all the walking students its not always possible.

I cycle over the Quincentenary bridge daily as well. I have the exact same issues as you OP. Even when it's dry, I hate the 'cordoury paving'!

snubbleste

The 2011 Census has revealed that usually in Galway:
104 of 6,326 primary schoolchildren cycle to school
157 of 4,352 secondary school goers "
635 of 7,606 third level students cycle to college
1,435 of 30,967 workers cycle to work

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/census/documents/census2011profile10/Profile%2010%20Full%20Document.pdf

dastardly00

snubbleste wrote: »

The 2011 Census has revealed that usually in Galway:
104 of 6,326 primary schoolchildren cycle to school
157 of 4,352 secondary school goers "
635 of 7,606 third level students cycle to college
1,435 of 30,967 workers cycle to work

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/census/documents/census2011profile10/Profile%2010%20Full%20Document.pdf

I'm very surprised at how low the figures are for secondary school and third level students.

what_traffic

Are there really only 7,606 third level students in Galway? Seems very low - would imagine NUIG has more students than that figure alone?

snubbleste

Well the Census was taken on a weekend night in April 2011. Speculation has it that loadsa stoodents disappeared 'home' to boost population figures locally.
The figures I posted only refer to Galway City.

McTigs

snubbleste wrote: »

The 2011 Census has revealed that usually in Galway:
104 of 6,326 primary schoolchildren cycle to school
157 of 4,352 secondary school goers "
635 of 7,606 third level students cycle to college
1,435 of 30,967 workers cycle to work

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/census/documents/census2011profile10/Profile%2010%20Full%20Document.pdf

They are shocking statistics, especially the secondary school goers.

When i was in the jes (20 years ago) every wall of the school was two deep with bikes.

If i was in charge of this country i would make it compulsory for every secondary school goer living within a three miles of their school to make their own way there. Bus, cycle, walk, jog, skateboard, canoe, whatever.... they'd probably learn more getting there and back than they would all day after being dropped off and collected.

Sponge Bob

McTigs wrote: »

If i was in charge of this country i would make it compulsory for every secondary school goer living within a three miles of their school to make their own way there.

20 years ago nobody in Galway knew what a Paedophile was, never mind how to SPELL it. The Brendan Smyth court case was about to break but clerical abuse was confined to bonking bishops and their mistresses back then.

That genie is well out of the bottle since. It ain't going back in either.

I'd look at extra road tax for parents within a mile of their school AND who could not clearly show how their child made it to school absent a car perhaps and then look at extending to 1.5 miles etc in 1km chunks.

As for the census, if 3rd level students in Clifden are claiming they cycle to college then that explains where the sample set has gone to.

Iwannahurl

Sponge Bob wrote: »

20 years ago nobody in Galway knew what a Paedophile was, never mind how to SPELL it. The Brendan Smyth court case was about to break but clerical abuse was confined to bonking bishops and their mistresses back then.

That genie is well out of the bottle since. It ain't going back in either.

I'd look at extra road tax for parents within a mile of their school AND who could not clearly show how their child made it to school absent a car perhaps and then look at extending to 1.5 miles etc in 1km chunks.

As for the census, if 3rd level students in Clifden are claiming they cycle to college then that explains where the sample set has gone to.

Fr Brendan Smyth and his ilk have nothing to do with it, except in the most febrile imaginations, IMO.

The genie that can't be put back into the bottle is private transportation and all its works and pomps.

The school run that I do once or twice every day is a car-clogged obstacle course for pedestrians and cyclists largely because of "planners" of various types, not because of men in macs.

Sponge Bob

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Fr Brendan Smyth and his ilk have nothing to

Yes they do. Most parents are far more careful where they let young children go ....compared to 20 years ago.

Iwannahurl

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Yes they do. Most parents are far more careful where they let young children go ....compared to 20 years ago.

Stranger danger is a perceived factor, but it is exaggerated.

I don't have the stats to hand, but I would venture to suggest that the biggest safety risk to children outside the home, in the present context, is on the road.

Where abuse of children does occur, it is most often perpetrated by someone known to the child or their parents and often in the home (because that is where most children spend a lot of their time).

Most children are abused by someone they know and trust (US stats, American Psychological Association). An estimated 60% of perpetrators of sexual abuse are known to the child but are not family members, e.g., family friends, babysitters, childcare providers, neighbors. About 30% of perpetrators are family members, e.g., fathers, brothers, uncles, cousins. Just 10% of perpetrators are strangers to the child.

Six children, four of them pedestrians, were killed on Irish roads in 2010. I'm not sure about other years.

I cycled from 4th class up til I finished college.

From my expierence in speaking with people in work etc, the stranger danger aspect is right up there with fear about road safety so.

I don't agree there is a risk, I blame the media and the likes of Criminal Minds etc for making ti seem like there are nutjobs around every corner but you can't deny that it is a major concern of a huge number of parents

Sponge Bob

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Stranger danger is a perceived factor, but it is exaggerated.

It is exaggerated. Correct. It exists as a fear, however exaggerated.

Six children, four of them pedestrians, were killed on Irish roads in 2010. I'm not sure about other years.

Road deaths were much higher in the 1970s and the 1980s than they are now.

More children are killed on the road at the weekend, averaged, than during the week.

More children are killed in rural areas than in cities every year.

Schools are not open at the weekend and therefore cannot be blamed for road deaths involving children and occuring at the weekend.

Between 1997 and 2004 Child fatalities per 1m pop in Road accidents dropped dramatically. This corresponds to the period of greatest increase in cars on our roads.

The peak years for new car sales in Ireland were 1999-2001 and especially 2000.

By 2004 Ireland had the LOWEST rate of Child Fatalities per 1m Population in the ENTIRE EU 15 including Holland Denmark Germany etc etc.

These are all very interesting facts.

Now can we get back to the discussion at hand.

Iwannahurl

Sponge Bob wrote: »

It is exaggerated. Correct. It exists as a fear, however exaggerated.

Road deaths were much higher in the 1970s and the 1980s than they are now.

More children are killed on the road at the weekend, averaged, than during the week.

More children are killed in rural areas than in cities every year.

Schools are not open at the weekend and therefore cannot be blamed for road deaths involving children and occuring at the weekend.

Between 1997 and 2004 Child fatalities per 1m pop in Road accidents dropped dramatically. This corresponds to the period of greatest increase in cars on our roads.

The peak years for new car sales in Ireland were 1999-2001 and especially 2000.

By 2004 Ireland had the LOWEST rate of Child Fatalities per 1m Population in the ENTIRE EU 15 including Holland Denmark Germany etc etc.

These are all very interesting facts.

Now can we get back to the discussion at hand.

It is you who say it: "It is exaggerated. Correct. It exists as a fear, however exaggerated."

Road risk is far greater than 'stranger danger' yet people attach major weight to the latter, as if the dangers were comparable.

The absolute risk of cycling or walking to school is small, but people still feel anxious about it, for some obvious reasons. Road safety has improved, but active travel to school has greatly decreased over recent decades.




EDIT: Incidentally, the RSA says that the vast amount of [?pedestrian] deaths and injuries (83%) and 85% of cyclist injuries happen inside built-up areas. I'd be reasonably confident that the pedestrians are not just tripping over and the cyclists not merely falling off their bikes...

Sponge Bob

I think you are trying to paraphrase me for some reason. I thought I made myself clear without having someone paraphrase me.

Back to the discussion in hand. Lets start with solutions for 1km and less and work out shall we.

Iwannahurl

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Back to the discussion in hand. Lets start with solutions for 1km and less and work out shall we.

Ban on parking within 200 metres of every school?

30 km/h the default speed limit around every school.

Walkability/bikeability audit on every route to every school.

Speed/safety cameras in the vicinity of every school.

Traffic law enforcement in the vicinity of every school, randomly rotated.

Just a few quick thoughts...

Sponge Bob

Audit first.

Iwannahurl

Enforcement first.

Sponge Bob

Grand, I'm out of this one so.

Unrealistic

Sponge Bob wrote: »

20 years ago nobody in Galway knew what a Paedophile was, never mind how to SPELL it. The Brendan Smyth court case was about to break but clerical abuse was confined to bonking bishops and their mistresses back then.

I was cycling to school in that era and I believe the opposite is in fact the case. Philip Cairns was fresh in everyone's minds but we were still allowed to cycle to (secondary) school. I was allowed out on our road when I was four but only when it had been drummed into me about staying on the pavement and about 'stranger danger'. So it was on people's radar even back then (70s).

My own reason for walking/driving with my children to (primary) school today, whereas I was allowed to walk on my own to the same school at the same age, is that there are many more cars on the road.

Iwannahurl

I walked, cycled or was occasionally driven to both primary and secondary school.

Abduction was never mentioned, and there wasn't a scrap of awareness raising about stranger danger that I can recall.

My mother used to attach a miraculous medal to my bike though.

Some things don't change in this country. I love this little gem: the blessing of the roads in Mayo. You couldn't make it up.

Iwannahurl

From City Tribune, 21st December 2012

“All over my district, boys and girls attending secondary and vocational schools — what are commonly called teenagers — are committing this offence.

“If there were ten of them they would be riding abreast, and the extraordinary thing is that when they were attending national schools they were an example of good manners, even to walking on the margins.

“When they get to this age apparently they are too smart. My usual fine for this offence is ten shillings, but having regard to their being five abreast here, I will increase the fines to twenty shillings each, to be paid by the parent in each case because I believe that if the parents added their voices to that of the Gardaí, they would be heeded, but the parents never do raise their voices,” said District Justice Loftus at Glenamaddy Court, when five teenagers were summoned for cycling more than two abreast on 24th November last.

snubbleste

Galway Bike Festival 2013 http://www.galwaycity.ie/GeneralNews/040413_01.html

As part of Galway Bike Festival 2013, organisations are invited to host a cycling related event on a not for profit basis in Galway City during Galway Bike Festival, which takes place over the period June 15 to June 23. Funding up to a maximum of €500 will be awarded to organisations in support of such an event/initiative.
Eligible expenses include for example: refreshments, bike maintenance workshops, bike hire, cycle training workshops, event prizes, fliers etc. Deadline Friday April 26, 2013.

Gambas

A 'slow' cycle lane down the middle of Shop St to Spanish Arch would work. Mixed use pedestrian places are common elsewhere, and will work so long as they are marked appropriately.

As for the one ways, well, I'm not sure I fancy a single cycle lane facing into the traffic on Mechants Road, unless it was incorporated into a widened footpath.

Iwannahurl

Just guessing here, but I suspect there's plenty of room on Merchant's Road for a contra-flow cycle lane. Political will may be lacking, however.