Stay and do something or get the hell away?!

RichardAnd

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Dream on. We're on our own and we can only try to solve our problems as a country. I don't see any American companies rushing to set up here, for instance. Nice to see Mr Obama having a good time here recently but I doubt his visit will lead to any long term benefits for the country

Perhaps you should research the facts before you start typing.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/pda/2010/dec/13/twitter-office-london-dublin

It's a bit out of date and I don't know the current status of this project but that would constitute a potential investor in my books.

JENNYWREN19

RichardAnd wrote: »

Perhaps you should research the facts before you start typing.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/pda/2010/dec/13/twitter-office-london-dublin

It's a bit out of date and I don't know the current status of this project but that would constitute a potential investor in my books.

Seriously? Have you any idea how few people organisations like twitter need in one office? About 10-20. How does that match up to all the job losses? Still, I'd love to know if they do set up here, my bet is they'll go some where like Amsterdam. You're right though, they are potential investors. I'll try and find out what's happening with Twitter, although when a project falls through it doesn't get the same amount of publicity as a potential employment opportunity

JENNYWREN19

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Seriously? Have you any idea how few people organisations like twitter need in one office? About 10-20. How does that match up to all the job losses? Still, I'd love to know if they do set up here, my bet is they'll go some where like Amsterdam. You're right though, they are potential investors. I'll try and find out what's happening with Twitter, although when a project falls through it doesn't get the same amount of publicity as a potential employment opportunity

I'm back. Take a look at http://randomirishnews.com/2011/04/19/has-twitter-the-jitters-over-dublin-for-european-hq/

Dannyboy83

HellFireClub wrote: »

Sorry, it's everyone for themselves now, you didn't see the people on the Titanic organising a protest when the sea water was up on the deck and swashing around their ankles.

I've spent the last 12 odd months in this country trying to start up a small business and trying to do the whole, "yes we can" thing, and I'm under no illusions whatsoever that if you are trying to improve your situation in this country whether you are unemployed or whatever, (and that's what my situation was until very recently), then you are on your own.

Once you accept that you are on your own and that you have to fight your way out of your situation, then you can move forward. If you start thinking that you can change this place, you will end up a broken person I think, this place is hoplessly backward and corrupt, and my advice to you is don't waste your time trying to fix this place, because you will most likely end up jumping into the river...

Completely agree with this.

The lesson I have learned is that you are a fool if you think paying taxes in this country is going to get you help when you need it.
Only suckers play by the rules in this country.

My partner was unemployed from September 2008 until the end of 2010.
2009 and 2010 for us were the worst years of our lives.
It was extremely tough going for a long time.

When my partner was unemployed, I was paying out nearly €1000 per month in various taxes.
We never got a single cent back.
They used every trick they could to deny her JSA.
She did a FAS course (ECDL) - they wouldn't pay her.
We simply couldn't get any assistance.
The HSE turned her away.
All of the lies they tell you about Social Insurance - pile of manure.
You are on your own - it's sink or swim.

During this time, I was hit with an extra tax liability.
I had sold shares in 2008 and declared them and paid tax at 20%.
But when my partner was out of work, I had to take on a second job doing doorwork, which pushed me over the earnings limit, meaning they came back and hit me with a tax liability for an extra €600.
This meant I effectively worked for several months for free and had to leave the 2nd job.

Personally, I will never again pay any taxes I can somehow rope my way out of.
I think it's worth taking the risk, because you get absolutely nothing back in return for paying taxes or for playing by the rules.

Only suckers play by the rules in Ireland.
I was extremely naive, but I have learned my lesson.
In future, I will try to figure out how to play the system.

HellFireClub

djpbarry wrote: »

So pretty much everyone will be in this queue, right?
But the country is already overrun with recruitment agencies? Why do we need one with a special arrangement with the Department of Social & Family Affairs?
Were do the small loans come from?
Who do you expect to see standing in this queue?
FYP.

If you ever go down to the dole queue on signing on day, the first thing that will hit you is that it is like some sort of asylum. You've a handful of characters down there who are full of the banter and couldn't give a shít but the vast majority of those in the queue are absolutely ashamed to be in that queue.

Just think about the insanity of what is happening here. You can stand in that queue 24 times over 2 years, put your name on the card 24 times, and not once will anyone ask you have to tried to find work, is there any assistance you might need with regard to finding work, is there any way that you could possibly be taken off the dole by starting up your own small business???

The whole process is hopelessly stuck back in a 1920's tenement like mindset.

You asked how we would pay for small business loans.... Here's what happened in my case. I went up to my local "jobs faciliator" in my dole office some time ago, who was meant to have a small fund to get people who were long term on the dole, off it by getting them into either training or self employment where the person on the dole saw that as an option.

She said this fund had been completely cut for the year, (this was last October). So the smart money was on paying me: (188 * 52) = 9,776 Euro a year, not entertaining any discussion with me about getting myself off the dole, continue paying me 9,776 Euro a year on an entirely open ended and indefinite basis!

I approached the Minister for Social Protection last year, actually I approched three cabinet ministers in total and asked them would it not be smarter to look at this cost of 9,776 Euro a year, possibly examine the plan that I had to get myself off the dole by self employment, maybe LEND me (as opposed to giving me), 2K and cutting my dole by 50% or whatever so that the loan would be recovered back off me within a year with interest.

I got laughed at!!!

So, here we are six months into a new year, you can be sure that there are plenty of people like me up and down the country who are being kept down, because the dumb government policies that were in play last year and being continued by this government!

Make no mistake about it, you are treated like a 5 year old in this country when you want to create a bit of opportunity for yourself, and I'm not stating this as a barstool critic, I'm stating this as someone who has engaged with the absolute insanity of the system in this country and I'm speaking from direct experience. The whole mindset is, "you just stay on the dole there and keep signing your name on the dotted line once a month, don't try to do anything revolutionary there now sunshine, see you next month"...

It was only after I saw the madness of what is going on in relation to all of the above that I realised how catastrophically and fatally wounded that this country actually is. Then to add salt to the wounds, the same guys, (or a woman in this government) who are presiding over this sheer insanity, come out into the media and lie to the whole country that they are supporting job creation. What they are doing if you want to start a business is they are telling you, "shut up, keep signing on every month, take your 188 Euro and be grateful, keep your head down in the dole queue and we'll all wait for the next global upswing/recovery which is just around the corner, can you not see the little green shoots there?!?"...

All I'm saying is that this country will never recover as long as this is what passes for a jobs strategy.

Just to cap it all off, when I was looking for 2K last year to launch my business, (and couldn't get it anywhere), I put in a FOI, (Freedom of Information request), to the government asking how much three government ministers that I had been dealing with, had claimed in travel and subsistence expenses on one particular weekend.

It turned out that what I needed to get myself off the dole for life, had been claimed in expenses by two government ministers on a Friday afternoon/Saturday morning for a hotel visit, and these guys on 200K salaries or something of that order, go figure...

RichardAnd

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Seriously? Have you any idea how few people organisations like twitter need in one office? About 10-20. How does that match up to all the job losses? Still, I'd love to know if they do set up here, my bet is they'll go some where like Amsterdam. You're right though, they are potential investors. I'll try and find out what's happening with Twitter, although when a project falls through it doesn't get the same amount of publicity as a potential employment opportunity

We're not talking about an office here, we're talking an EU head-quarters, that's something more than 10-20 people.

HellFireClub

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Completely agree with this.

The lesson I have learned is that you are a fool if you think paying taxes in this country is going to get you help when you need it.
Only suckers play by the rules in this country.

My partner was unemployed from September 2008 until the end of 2010.
2009 and 2010 for us were the worst years of our lives.
It was extremely tough going for a long time.

When my partner was unemployed, I was paying out nearly €1000 per month in various taxes.
We never got a single cent back.
They used every trick they could to deny her JSA.
She did a FAS course (ECDL) - they wouldn't pay her.
We simply couldn't get any assistance.
The HSE turned her away.
All of the lies they tell you about Social Insurance - pile of manure.
You are on your own - it's sink or swim.

During this time, I was hit with an extra tax liability.
I had sold shares in 2008 and declared them and paid tax at 20%.
But when my partner was out of work, I had to take on a second job doing doorwork, which pushed me over the earnings limit, meaning they came back and hit me with a tax liability for an extra €600.
This meant I effectively worked for several months for free and had to leave the 2nd job.

Personally, I will never again pay any taxes I can somehow rope my way out of.
I think it's worth taking the risk, because you get absolutely nothing back in return for playing by the rules.

Only suckers play by the rules in Ireland.
I was extremely naive, but I have learned my lesson.
In future, I will try to figure out how to play the system.

I couldn't agree more. You have to experience the utter madness and sheer insanity of how things are undertaken in this country to fully appreciate how utterly backward the place is. If this place was a hotel it would put Fawlty Towers to shame.

I am now self employed and every day my priority is to contribute as little as I possibly can economically to this country. I plan to be living abroad within the next year or two but between now and then I will (legally), pay as little as I can to this place, because this country is simply incapable of recovery and any money that is taken from you is wasted though insane self defeatist public policies.

I tried to play by the rules as DannyBoy above has said, you get laughed at, I tried to be positive creative Paddy but I found that I was up against a system and a mindset that was so immersed in and pre-occupied with it's own self preservation that I at one stage remembered asing myself was it me that was going off my head/going mad???

As I said before, you'd get more thanks and respect in this country for staying on the dole and keeping your mouth shut.

JENNYWREN19

RichardAnd wrote: »

We're not talking about an office here, we're talking an EU head-quarters, that's something more than 10-20 people.

Did you read the article I sent you?

Dannyboy83

HellFireClub wrote: »

The whole process is hopelessly stuck back in a 1920's tenement like mindset.

Perfect description imo.

I went down with my partner a few times to try and get things resolved.
I was treated with contempt - even tho I've never been unemployed in my life!!

The incompetence of the people working there boggles the mind.
I wrote a thread about it on boards.ie in the state benefits forum some time ago. My partner's application have never even been checked and one of the inspectors let it slip.

Actually, the last time we tried to follow it up was 12 months ago. Still never received a reply.:rolleyes:

The thing that makes me sick is that there are many people in the same situation who don't have a partner to fall back on.
Little wonder there are so many homeless people nowadays.

RichardAnd

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Did you read the article I sent you?

I have now. Fair enough, not great news. But still, it does show that there are companies out there still willing to at least think about investing here. Potential investors.

HellFireClub

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Perfect description imo.

I went down with my partner a few times to try and get things resolved.
I was treated with contempt - even tho I've never been unemployed in my life!!

The incompetence of the people working there boggles the mind.
I wrote a thread about it on boards.ie in the state benefits forum some time ago. My partner's application have never even been checked and one of the inspectors let it slip.

Actually, the last time we tried to follow it up was 12 months ago. Still never received a reply.:rolleyes:

The thing that makes me sick is that there are many people in the same situation who don't have a partner to fall back on.
Little wonder there are so many homeless people nowadays.

There is a seige mentality going on in the Dept. of Social Protection, they stopped answering the phones sometime last year in retaliation for their pay being cut!

When I queried this last Christmas, (after having to walk for miles through the heavy snow, trying to second guess if the dole office would even be open for signing on with such heavy snow on the ground), I was told, "ah yeah, well our headcount and terms have been cut so we just don't have the staff to answer the phones anymore"

But somehow the Gardai and the nurses can still answer the phones, yet they have to do more with less...

Like myself and DannyBoy have said, this hopelessly defeatist mindset that is straight out of 1920's tenament Ireland, is always there just under the surface, obstructing everything, running beaurocratic rings around you, frustrating you, opposing you. You just have to run into it to see it in action, and then it hits you like the 2 O' Clock Cork train out of Heuston.

careca11

HellFireClub wrote: »

I couldn't agree more. You have to experience the utter madness and sheer insanity of how things are undertaken in this country to fully appreciate how utterly backward the place is. If this place was a hotel it would put Fawlty Towers to shame.

here's one that fits perfectly well in the fawlty towers economy.
my brother worked 12 years a painter , lost job in 2010.................his social welfare cut to just €80 a week because wife earns more than €306 a week , struggling to pay mortgage/bills , (done a fas course , only for the course to be deemed obslete at the end so no certifcates where offered to the class ),

my youngest Sister just finished a college course ......went to the dole €109 entitlment no questions ask, no overheads whatsoever , falls out of bed everyday at 2/3pm

its all wrong, the whole system etc is totally wrong

dan_d

I'll just jump on the bandwagon here and say that I've been on the dole for the last 10 months (with a brief stint of work in the middle) and my experiences have been the same as those recounted here. I'm not going to repeat them, but suffice to say, the kind of s&*e you hear in there would leave you speechless.

They got away with it until a few years ago because all they were dealing with were the so-called "dregs", long term dole claimers who couldn't be bothered getting a job. Now though, there are educated people on the dole, people who have worked in private businesses, people who are used to the day-to-day systems of corporate companies, who are trained to think outside the box, be analytical, organised, flexible, approachable, people who deal with problems and solve them, every day, who know that to keep their job they have to perform well. These are the unemployed now, and what they are dealing with in those SW offices in terms of service is completely shocking, to be honest.

The entire system is backward, set up to supposedly protect the most vulnerable in society - instead all it does is encourage those who have no qualifications, education or interest to take advantage of it because it "protects" them so well, and treats those who have paid into the system like crap. There is no innovation, little forward thinking and zero flexibility.

And as I said before, I still haven't decided which side to come down on - emigrating or staying.

HellFireClub

dan_d wrote: »

I'll just jump on the bandwagon here and say that I've been on the dole for the last 10 months (with a brief stint of work in the middle) and my experiences have been the same as those recounted here. I'm not going to repeat them, but suffice to say, the kind of s&*e you hear in there would leave you speechless.

They got away with it until a few years ago because all they were dealing with were the so-called "dregs", long term dole claimers who couldn't be bothered getting a job. Now though, there are educated people on the dole, people who have worked in private businesses, people who are used to the day-to-day systems of corporate companies, who are trained to think outside the box, be analytical, organised, flexible, approachable, people who deal with problems and solve them, every day, who know that to keep their job they have to perform well. These are the unemployed now, and what they are dealing with in those SW offices in terms of service is completely shocking, to be honest.

The entire system is backward, set up to supposedly protect the most vulnerable in society - instead all it does is encourage those who have no qualifications, education or interest to take advantage of it because it "protects" them so well, and treats those who have paid into the system like crap. There is no innovation, little forward thinking and zero flexibility.

And as I said before, I still haven't decided which side to come down on - emigrating or staying.

One thing I'd love to see happen in this country would to see a political party or movement or a political force of some sort emerging and formed by people you have described above, the people on the dole who were working hard for years until very recently, the people who are very uniquely positioned through their previous work and life experiences, to call out this sorry and disgusting bullshít for exactly what it is, this completely circular situation with unemployment, the policies that are being pursused that are policies of sheer and utter hopelessness, the gombeen way people are treated in this country, the endless lying to people, misleading them as to the opportunities for hope, the contempt that you will find yourself being held in if you are dealing with the Dept. of Social Welfare, the "yes we can but oh no you fúcking can't", attitude in relation to absolutely everything when you are unemployed...

Dannyboy83

dan_d wrote: »

And as I said before, I still haven't decided which side to come down on - emigrating or staying.

I was speaking to my partner at lunchtime, briefly mentioned that I was writing about our experiences, in this thread.

She briefly said this (I'm paraphrasing, not quoting)
"For me, the greatest thing about being back at work is not the money,
it's not being able to actually go places and do things again,
it's not escaping the endless boredom of the four walls at home,
it's none of that;
For me, the greatest thing by far, is having absolutely nothing to do with the people in the Irish Department of Social Welfare, who couldn't meet even the lowest expectations of a woman who immigrated from a country the very same people look down their noses at."

HellFireClub

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I was speaking to my partner at lunchtime, briefly mentioned that I was writing about our experiences, in this thread.

She briefly said this (I'm paraphrasing, not quoting)
"For me, the greatest thing about being back at work is not the money,
it's not being able to actually go places and do things again,
it's not escaping the endless boredom of the four walls at home,
it's none of that;
For me, the greatest thing by far, is having absolutely nothing to do with the people in the Irish Department of Social Welfare, who couldn't meet even the lowest expectations of a woman who immigrated from a country the very same people look down their noses at."

I felt the exact same last time I signed on. There is nothing on this earth I think quite as debilitating as finding yourself being set up for sheer failure...

Dealing with the Dept. of Social Protection, it reminded me of years ago (back in the 1830's) in a prison when a prisoner would be ordered out of his cell and into the prison yard at dawn, and ordered to spend the day moving a huge pile of heavy rocks from one corner of the yard to the other. He would spend the day doing this, only the following day to be taken out into the same yard and ordered to spend that day moving all the heavy rocks back to where they had been the previous day, and then the next day, the same routine...

This is what it is like dealing with the Dept. of Social Protection, only instead of rocks, it's paper, no matter what you say to them, "we need more paperwork for the file, can you get more paperwork"...

Furthest from the mind of these stoogies is the fact that you are a human being, that you might actually want to work if the opportunities were there or if the opportunities are not there as I found that they were not, that you could maybe be a part of the solution and create a job for yourself and maybe in a few months you might be able to take on a few folks, if you were supported in even the smallest possible way...

dan_d

You can tell your partner I wholeheartedly agree! I signed off in Jan and honestly it was the best feeling ever. I wanted to sing and dance and scream with pure delight while shaking the dust of that SW office off my feet, as I walked out. It's a feeling I cannot wait to experience again.

Unfortunately, I was signing back on a month later. When I found out I was redundant again, I honestly cried for hours. And it wasn't just the fact that I'd have to go back job hunting again. It was the fact that I had to go back to that office, deal with those people, be in that soul-crushing, confidence destroying and completely uncaring system...the thought of it alone made me cry even more.

It wasn't a good time.

Anyway, we've totally dragged the thread off course here.

I did consider going into politics recently, actually around the time when the gender quota thing was being discussed. (I'm a woman). I'm still considering it....I just have to work up the guts to actually do it I suppose. I don't think people would want to hear what I have to say though...I don't beat around the bush....

RichardAnd

dan_d wrote: »

You can tell your partner I wholeheartedly agree! I signed off in Jan and honestly it was the best feeling ever. I wanted to sing and dance and scream with pure delight while shaking the dust of that SW office off my feet, as I walked out. It's a feeling I cannot wait to experience again.

Unfortunately, I was signing back on a month later. When I found out I was redundant again, I honestly cried for hours. And it wasn't just the fact that I'd have to go back job hunting again. It was the fact that I had to go back to that office, deal with those people, be in that soul-crushing, confidence destroying and completely uncaring system...the thought of it alone made me cry even more.

It wasn't a good time.

Anyway, we've totally dragged the thread off course here.

I did consider going into politics recently, actually around the time when the gender quota thing was being discussed. (I'm a woman). I'm still considering it....I just have to work up the guts to actually do it I suppose. I don't think people would want to hear what I have to say though...I don't beat around the bush....

Never mind the gender quota nonsense Dan. If you're a woman with ability and the will to use it, you don't need some misandrist legislation to get ahead.

It's kind of taking the thread off balance here but I'll say this much, we don't need more women in politics; we need less idiots and more competence. IF someone can offer me that, I don't give a dam what their gender is.

HellFireClub

dan_d wrote: »

You can tell your partner I wholeheartedly agree! I signed off in Jan and honestly it was the best feeling ever. I wanted to sing and dance and scream with pure delight while shaking the dust of that SW office off my feet, as I walked out. It's a feeling I cannot wait to experience again.

Unfortunately, I was signing back on a month later. When I found out I was redundant again, I honestly cried for hours. And it wasn't just the fact that I'd have to go back job hunting again. It was the fact that I had to go back to that office, deal with those people, be in that soul-crushing, confidence destroying and completely uncaring system...the thought of it alone made me cry even more.

It wasn't a good time.

Anyway, we've totally dragged the thread off course here.

I did consider going into politics recently, actually around the time when the gender quota thing was being discussed. (I'm a woman). I'm still considering it....I just have to work up the guts to actually do it I suppose. I don't think people would want to hear what I have to say though...I don't beat around the bush....

I always thought by your username you were a farmer auld fella down the back of Offaly somewhere haha!

What we are saying though in terms of our own particular recent experiences is very relevant though... The thing is, if you put your head above the parapet in this country at the moment, you are immediately at risk of infecting yourself with the gombeen policies that are already out there, and you will just be labelled a PS bashing nutter if you try to draw attention down into what it is like to be unemployed. Only last week on this forum I think I was called a "jealous begrudger" after I spoke of what it was like queuing up at Hatch 45, I was told that I was jealous of those behind the counter because they had a job and I didn't at the time?!?!?

I'd rather wake up in the morning and find that I'd turned into Larry Murphy overnight than find myself working in behind the counter in a dole office in this country.

JENNYWREN19

HellFireClub wrote: »

I always thought by your username you were a farmer auld fella down the back of Offaly somewhere haha!

What we are saying though in terms of our own particular recent experiences is very relevant though... The thing is, if you put your head above the parapet in this country at the moment, you are immediately at risk of infecting yourself with the gombeen policies that are already out there, and you will just be labelled a PS bashing nutter if you try to draw attention down into what it is like to be unemployed. Only last week on this forum I think I was called a "jealous begrudger" after I spoke of what it was like queuing up at Hatch 45, I was told that I was jealous of those behind the counter because they had a job and I didn't at the time?!?!?

I'd rather wake up in the morning and find that I'd turned into Larry Murphy overnight than find myself working in behind the counter in a dole office in this country.

Re Larry Murphy - shocking but true!! I worked for four years as a civil servant thankfully not in Social Welfare, but never again

mlumley

djpbarry wrote: »

No, the government are our representatives.

Sorry but you are wrong there. T'D's are our representitives. Collectivly they make up the Goverment. Which means they are to represent US, not the party machine.

I thin k anyone who falls for the "unpaid con" is just being used, but that is to be expected in a country where overtime is routinely not paid, or paid at a lower rate than normal time.

djpbarry

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

My point is, if we have to bite the bullet and accept wages cuts reduced pensions and new taxes the policy should apply across the board, not to the poorest members of society.

Specifically, what policy are you referring to?

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

I know some politicians have taken wage cuts, which is a step in the right direction but why have the bankers been allowed to walk off with millions in payoffs while the rest of the country struggles?

Because that’s what bankers do. Always have, always will. Meanwhile, there’s still a gaping hole in Ireland’s current account.

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

One way of cutting the social welfare bill would be to create a few jobs...

It’s not the government’s job to create employment. What it can do is foster an environment amenable to enterprise and job creation, which brings me back to my point about potential investors.

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Private companies are getting away with murder, implementing work placement schemes - that used to be known as gainful employment when it was paid for.

If someone is happy to work as an unpaid intern or embark on a work placement programme, that’s their decision. Personally, I think working for free is nuts, but it’s none of my business really.

JENNYWREN19 wrote: »

Dream on. We're on our own and we can only try to solve our problems as a country.

Potential investors don’t have to be non-Irish. And investors do exist. Take this project for example.

djpbarry

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

When my partner was unemployed, I was paying out nearly €1000 per month in various taxes.
We never got a single cent back.
They used every trick they could to deny her JSA.

Hang on – if you’re paying of the order of €1,000 per month in tax, that means you’re earning of the order of €50-55k. You would have been earning even more to being that level of tax from 2008-2010. Why would a means-tested claim for jobseekers allowance be approved with that kind of income coming into your household?

djpbarry

HellFireClub wrote: »

If you ever go down to the dole queue on signing on day, the first thing that will hit you is that it is like some sort of asylum. You've a handful of characters down there who are full of the banter and couldn't give a shít but the vast majority of those in the queue are absolutely ashamed to be in that queue.

Well I can only speak for myself, but the office in Cabra wasn’t all that bad last year. I only had to go a couple of times, but I certainly wasn’t ashamed of anything.

HellFireClub wrote: »

Just think about the insanity of what is happening here. You can stand in that queue 24 times over 2 years, put your name on the card 24 times, and not once will anyone ask you have to tried to find work, is there any assistance you might need with regard to finding work, is there any way that you could possibly be taken off the dole by starting up your own small business???

Again, I can only speak for myself, but I had to produce an array of paperwork showing that I was out of work and actively seeking employment when I was submitting my claim. With regard to your latter two points, an overhaul of FÁS is required to address these.

HellFireClub wrote: »

I approached the Minister for Social Protection last year, actually I approched three cabinet ministers in total and asked them would it not be smarter to look at this cost of 9,776 Euro a year, possibly examine the plan that I had to get myself off the dole by self employment, maybe LEND me (as opposed to giving me), 2K and cutting my dole by 50% or whatever so that the loan would be recovered back off me within a year with interest.

I’m not sure I understand the problem - why you can’t get to work on your business idea regardless?

HellFireClub wrote: »

I got laughed at!!!

I find that hard to believe.

HellFireClub wrote: »

So, here we are six months into a new year, you can be sure that there are plenty of people like me up and down the country who are being kept down...

You are being supported with EUR188 per week – how is that keeping you down exactly?

Sleepy

Joe Steve Ó Neachtain is a native Irish speaker, writer and actor from Conamara, has played the part of Peadar in Ros na Rún, has written many novels in Irish and has more than done his bit for the language and the country in general.

So, essentially, he's indulged his passions whilst being paying little or no taxes (artists exemption) to the funds that he's been paid out of (TV license paying for commercially inviable TG4, Udaraás grants for writing novels that will be read by next no-one.

What a hero :rolleyes:

mlumley

HellFireClub wrote: »

, 40-50K salaries, lovely cosy pensions, QUOTE]



My wife is a PS worker. She doesn't get 40-50k. She is on under 25k. Her pension is a contributable one and pays the pension levy for which she gets F**K ALL. A wage cut by another name. So please, stop reading what the papers say and think they tell the truth.

Sleepy

mlumley, facts are, a PS worker earning under 25k would typically earn under 20k in the private sector and have no pension whatsoever at the end of it.

HellFireClub

djpbarry wrote: »

You are being supported with EUR188 per week – how is that keeping you down exactly?

As I said already, there is no winner here in keeping someone on 188 Euro a week on an open ended and completely indefinite basis. I'd have had no beef with this if I wasn't enduring a situation where my head was being filled with absolute rubbish on a daily basis via the spinning from those in public office about how there were state agencies there to help you if you took the initiative to start up a business, in the knowledge that jobs were so scarce, that: "we all need to stay positive and that of course the banks are lending, sure isn't that why we are bailing them out, to keep the economy going, and of course the Enterprise Boards are also there to help you"...

You can't start a business without seed capital and this government and the last shower have been blatantly lying to people and misleading people, filling their heads with rubbish about supports being there for those who want to get off the dole when the supports are not and never were there.

I made the case before where it is a rediculous policy position to stand over to just leave someone on an open ended basis on 188 Euro a week, without having any kind of plan in place for getting that person off state dependancy and to allow this situation to prevail for a year or two or three.

If someone is knocking on your door saying that they do not want to be costing you 9,776 Euro a year, possibly for 2, 3 or 4 years, it makes sense to work with them to discuss the possibilities that might exist out there for that person to create a position or an opportunity for themselves and at same time, release you from an obligation to pay that person 9,776 Euro a year on an open ended and indefinite basis.

You seem to be saying, or rather implying that I'm not grateful for 188 Euro in state support a week, but at the same time if I said I was prepared to stay on that support for an indefinite basis into the future, I'm sure you'd be the first person on thread to have an issue with that position as well...

mlumley

Sleepy wrote: »

mlumley, facts are, a PS worker earning under 25k would typically earn under 20k in the private sector and have no pension whatsoever at the end of it.

The private sector worker can pay into a company pension is they so wish. They will get a state pension at the end of it.
My wife pays into a pension fund, so she is entitled to a pension, but when she retires, her state pension will be cut by the amount from her PS pesion.
Dont see how that is gold plated.

atila

The unemployment rate ticked up to 9.1% in the United States during May...When discussing emmigration i've found a lot of people just assume that conditions are a lot better elsewhere. An emmigrants life is a hard one..think long and hard about such a decision and do your research.