Speed camera mega-thread ***Read first post before posting***

tanko

In my local court it seems that all speeding cases by go safe vans are being thrown out. Is this not happening everywhere?

ironclaw

@tanko, can you elaborate with the court in question? Its possible for a certain number of fines to be thrown out on technicalities e.g. Speed limit bye law not correct, GoSafe van in wrong section, incorrect speed limit applied. That's not uncommon. Other challenges would require higher court proceedings.

tanko

Last weeks local rag. This seems to happen regularly in the local courts.

Fred Swanson

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ironclaw

tanko wrote: »

Last weeks local rag. This seems to happen regularly in the local courts.

That's fairly standard, another example was the Blanchardstown ByPass during road works. Not a hard and fast defence unless you found stretches of road with non-enacted bye laws or temporary limits that GoSafe was operating on.

tanko

ironclaw wrote: »

That's fairly standard, another example was the Blanchardstown ByPass during road works. Not a hard and fast defence unless you found stretches of road with non-enacted bye laws or temporary limits that GoSafe was operating on.

I happened to be in a local court last year and as soon as the judge sat down he threw out all the go safe speeding cases on that day because he said he wasn't happy with the way the law was set up. He said until the law was changed he wasn't going to convict anyone for speeding under the go safe legislation. (I'm paraphrasing here).
As far as I can see anyone who challenges any potential fine and penalty points from go safe in court will win their case.

ironclaw

@tanko, a judge cannot decide they don't like a law. If they do, the case is referred to a high court for clarity. I think you mean the Bye Law that the local council enacted in a particular zone didn't stand up to the legal test. This is reasonably common and what happens in the article you posted. Irish Statue is actually pretty solid when it comes to these vans and measures as they legally allow a lot of suspect practises e.g. No calibration etc.

Marty McFly

Hi sorry if this question has been asked before but I got a penalty points notice yesterday.

Is there any way of finding out were exactly the van was located? Also I know they can catch you even if you are driving away from the van but does that still count if there are two oncoming lanes then a grass divide and then you driving away from it?

I ask because on the road in question I know we're they are always located and given the date and time I know we're I was going and in what direction.

ironclaw

@Marty McFly, its impossible to say unless you post the road in question.

Speaking in wide generalities, if the van can see your license plate then you can be caught. Two lanes, then a grass divide, then your lane however does seem like a stretch. But without seeing it, impossible to say for certain.

Marty McFly

ironclaw wrote: »

@Marty McFly, its impossible to say unless you post the road in question.

Speaking in wide generalities, if the van can see your license plate then you can be caught. Two lanes, then a grass divide, then your lane however does seem like a stretch. But without seeing it, impossible to say for certain.

It was on the Belgard road in Tallaght they're always in the same spot just past burger king heading in the direction of Clondalkin.

But given the date and time I know I would have been heading in the opposite direction going to work.

That's what has me wondering or if there is a way to find out exactly were the van was located.

Marty McFly

Not the best quality video but found this online.

If the van was in its usual spot as seen in the video I would have been heading in the opposite direction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyLaKgm7btY

ironclaw

@Marty, near here: https://www.google.ie/maps/place/Burger+King/@53.2890357,-6.3701702,703a,20y,41.52t/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x486774b32f09702b:0xa0f75df3c4a72dc4

Yeah, its a legitimate reading. If I was feeling adventurous however, you could argue that traffic on the other side of the road (Closer to and coming towards the camera) could have interfered with the reading. You would need to see the footage from the system, so its a massive outlay in terms of defense.

I note that both sides of the Belgard Rd are two lane, were you in lane 2, closest the van?

Marty McFly

ironclaw wrote: »

@Marty, near here: https://www.google.ie/maps/place/Burger+King/@53.2890357,-6.3701702,703a,20y,41.52t/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x486774b32f09702b:0xa0f75df3c4a72dc4

Yeah, its a legitimate reading. If I was feeling adventurous however, you could argue that traffic on the other side of the road (Closer to and coming towards the camera) could have interfered with the reading. You would need to see the footage from the system, so its a massive outlay in terms of defense.

I note that both sides of the Belgard Rd are two lane, were you in lane 2, closest the van?

Yes its near there.

I can't say for certain if I was in lane 1 or 2 but I'd imagine I was in lane 1 because I take next left off the Belgard Rd onto the Airton Rd just at Burger King there.

If I was caught head on I'd understand but across 3 or 4 lanes and a grass divide seems a bit of a stretch imo.

I'm almost penalty point free to in a couple of months

ironclaw

I'd discuss with a solicitor, as speaking as someone who deals with this as from a technical (But I must stress not professional) standpoint, its grey in my opinion.

Buffman

Marty McFly wrote: »

I can't say for certain if I was in lane 1 or 2

Request the full size photograph which should help you establish vehicle positions.

From here:

Photograph Requests
This facility is only available for camera speeding detections (i.e. Fixed Charge Notice where reference number begins S00….). The applicable notices are identified by a cropped photograph of the registration number of the vehicle on the top right of the FCN, just below the reference number of the notice. If you want to get an enlarged copy of the photograph, the request must be made in writing, by fax to 353 504 59844, by post to the Fixed Charge Processing Office, Thurles, Co. Tipperary or by e-mail to npo@garda.ie. The photograph will then be issued by post. Such requests can only be processed for the registered owner or the nominated driver.
The primary purpose of photographs is to identify the offending vehicle, and not the driver. The identification of the driver is the responsibility and legal requirement placed on the registered owner of the vehicle. These photographs are not used to identify drivers, but in some cases, this may be possible. Care must be taken to nominate the correct driver in each instance.

Marty McFly

Cheers for all the help.

I've sent an email requesting the full size photograph so see what happens from there I guess.

the 12 th man

At the top of the photograph there will be an arrow indicating which direction the car that was speeding was going which might help,I got a speeding ticket revoked because the photograph they sent me was the front of my car and the photo arrow was pointing away from the speed van.

the 12 th man

Marty McFly wrote: »

Cheers for all the help.

I've sent an email requesting the full size photograph so see what happens from there I guess.

Check at the top of the photo when you get it and there will be an arrow indicating which direction the speeding car was going,I got a speed fine revoked as the photo they sent me was the front of my car and the arrow was pointing away from the speed van (I was 100% sure I wasn't speeding so stuck it out)

Marty McFly

So the photo of my car arrived today woeful picture only reason I can make out my car is the rear lights.

But as I thought I'm in the furthest outbound lane so that's a divide off two oncoming lanes a divide and two outgoing lanes.

Falcon L

Which car is yours? I'm not sure about this, but there is something rattling around in my brain about two cars in the picture makes it unsuitable for use as proof. Could be bar room bluffers talk though.

Fred Swanson

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Marty McFly

Falcon L wrote: »

Which car is yours? I'm not sure about this, but there is something rattling around in my brain about two cars in the picture makes it unsuitable for use as proof. Could be bar room bluffers talk though.

My car is the car further back in the picture.

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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They got an incredibly hazy zoom in of my reg. I just find it hard to believe ithat it was able to read my speed correctly given the circumstances and even more so now I've seen the quality of the picture.

ironclaw

The camera system operates in a very wide spectrum. Although you can't see it in the photo, the actual system itself can see wide into the UV and IR range, hence while the 'human spectrum' photo itself isn't very clear, the system can read the plate quite well.

Personally, I'd contest there are two vehicles in that photo. They cannot say for sure which is which, let alone differentiate the speed of either relative to one another. In my, and must stress unprofessional opinion, you have a good chance of that being thrown out. Others have been thrown out in similar circumstances.

Marty McFly

Does anyone know of a good solicitor for this? Or how much a solicitor costs for it?

I'm assuming going on my own would be a bad idea when I do receive the summons.

Fred Swanson

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kirving

The camera that they use will almost certainly see in the IR spectrum, so the image *may* have more detail than is shown to you there. However, what they've sent you is clearly complete rubbish if you compare it to the likes of an IR police helicopter camera you see on TV.

In terms of evidence, the picture that they've shown you is a joke.

Buffman

ironclaw wrote: »

Personally, I'd contest there are two vehicles in that photo. They cannot say for sure which is which, let alone differentiate the speed of either relative to one another. In my, and must stress unprofessional opinion, you have a good chance of that being thrown out. Others have been thrown out in similar circumstances.

Marty McFly, I'd recommend the above, I always believed that any photo showing more than one car was discarded, I'd appeal. Sounds to me like it fails into this category from here.

Category A
Cancellation requests falling within this category include –

1. Where there is a detection issue / material error in relation to the alleged offence as outlined on the FCN e.g. incorrect speed limit.

Let us know how you get on.

eringobragh

Busy b*stids this weather

Aston martin

eringobragh wrote: »

more then 1 car in the pic it may be null and void

I was done and there are two other vehicles in the picture , can you help

Aston martin

paddy147 wrote: »

Can I ask about the Legal placement of a garda speed detection camera van and it being parked "up and in on a grass verge" by a dual carriageway??

Red arrow where theres a grass verge and a solid yellow line.

Would that be classed as illegal parking??

if its a go safe he needs to parked correctly