...for President!

sdanseo

Bah, I'm preaching to the boards.ie/AH/FG coalition here. What's the point.

bryaner

sdonn wrote: »

Bah, I'm preaching to the boards.ie/AH/FG coalition here. What's the point.

You need help don't feel ashamed..

Biggins

Originally Posted by sdonn.
...but would anyone else have done any better?

Well Canada alone did.
During their "Celtic Tiger" period which was at the same time as us, they improved their tax laws, diversified their income source bases, increased watchdog banking and property regulations - with the teeth to be effective, they improved their communications systems be they broadband or transport, they for every Canadian Dollar, put a certain percentage of it they gained, away for a possible rainy day - and guess what? It came!

Canada now is more secure than America and Europe, has a bigger and better manufacturing industry than its neighbour across the border - and that includes car making!
NO - NOT ONE bank needed bailout and are very secure.
...And thats just the tip of the iceberg.

Yes, even if a modicum, better was possible - but FF and Ahern/Cowen failed to do anything considered long term effective.
Except in the meanwhile telling us go "spend, spend, spend..." and it was ok to do so!

LizT

I think it was Will Leahy who made a good point yesterday on 2fm. Bertie is just waiting for someone to say, "Yeah, you'd make a good president" and then he will say for sure that he is running.

So far no one has, because he is an idiot.

dan719

I think we should all link Bertie to this.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/0909/breaking32.html

For those on mobile, it explains that our banking system has been ranked the "least sound in the world".

I assume that's due to the global recession though, and not as a result of any of his personal and government failings. :rolleyes:

round tower huntsman

i hope he goes for it for two reasons, one- there's a chance he might knock on my door canvassing, and two- to see him totally rejected and humiliated by the irish people would be worth it.

Diddler1977

sdonn wrote: »

Bah, I'm preaching to the boards.ie/AH/FG coalition here. What's the point.

Hi Bertie!

dubes

I love bertie
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Einhard

sdonn wrote: »

But would the writer of the letter have, in their infinite fúcking wisdom, done anything differently? I reckon they were, like most of us, happy to suck up the good times - and now that things have gone pear-shaped they look for someone to blame.

I agree with you to a point that there has to be more self-responsibility on the behalf of the electorate,a nd an acknowledgement that most of us had roles in this crisis. However, I don't think it's unreasonable to criticise Ahern's administrations for their complete failure to put the state on a sustainable and sound economic footing. They were elected to lead the country,a nd instead spent their time with an eye to winning the next election. For that alone, they deserve unreserved condemnation.

Also, I'm no FGer, but they did oppose benchmarking, and pretty vociferously too.

We all knew the bubble was going to burst, and we all did nothing about it. Those sitting on 98pc mortgages have themselves to blame as well as the banks. People lived beyond their means. It's nothing short of arrogant to write complaining letters to government or ex-government ministers unless you were willing in 2005 to camp outside Leinster House demanding better financial legislation.

Yes, I am. And I voted FF in 2007. Specifically, I voted for Bertie's govt based on his track record because I didn't know the extent of the crisis that was to come, his government's lack of preparation for it

This is somewhat of a contradiction. We all knew the bubble was going to burst, yet you specifically voted for FF because you didn't anticipate it?

The causes of the current crisis are many and complex but the policies of the last two administrations played a major part. Even without Anglo and the bailouts, we would be living far beyond out means because of the twin policies of excessive current spending and low tax rates which FF (and the Pds) pursued.

Also, it's not unreasonable that a government with the apparatus of state at its proposal should have some idea of what was looming on the horizon, nor that it have a conherent plan to deal with it. All the more so as there were consistent and high profile warnings and indications that the storm clouds were looming ominously.

He simply pandered to the status quo and that's not going to make me ever vote for him again but my argument is that there are a lot more people to blame than he and there is no excuse for all the closed-minded idiot on here ganging up on him and suggesting that he be "wiped off the planet".

I agree to an extent here, but you seem to be going to the other extreme whereby legitimate criticism is dismissed out of hand.

Nobody knew how hard the recession would hit, NO country escaped it in the western world and we are no exception.

Yes, but many countries weathered the storm exceptionally well, and the majority better than us. Canada didn't even enter recession, Australia dipped her toes in the waters of negative growth for a brief moment, and many other countries are safely out of danger. And that's directly linked to the good governance in place before the clouds burst, something which Ireland did not have, and for which failing Bertie Ahern must take the lion's share of the blame.

kincsem

Christy Moore for President. A session in the park with gargle.

Kidchameleon

sdonn wrote: »

In other news, life isn't fair.

At the end of the day, he's a public figure who served his country (and himself, granted) for 11 years - he deserves some recognition for that. Anyone in the same position is entitled to the same allowances, and on a point of principle he shouldn't be victimised because of them.

At the end of the day, he hasn't been convicted of anything and while I think it's very unlikely he had no involvement in taking political back-handers I think that people continuing to blame him for the state the country is in now is totally unfair and a complete overreaction. Yeah it seems he did wrong, but the label of him as the crook who stole Ireland's future is undeserved, that blame lies equally with the ministers and the Financial Regulator who didn't plan, didn't regulate and who basically continued the Irish status quo of "ah it'll be grand". The blame lies with successive generations who failed to make us into a progressive, well-planned out society and Bertie was only one of thousands who just wasn't arsed planning ahead.

On a personal level, he's a friendly fella, charismatic and good at large aspects of his job - you never heard of him slacking off on holidays to inchydoney like CJ, he seemed to work hard at the very least - and given that Uachtarán na hÉireann does basically no legislating at all other than as a figurehead, I'm gonna stick my neck out and say I think he'd be a very GOOD president.

I'll also stick my neck out further and say it'll never happen. On a political level, the voters of Ireland would have zero integrity if they elected someone who was known to be dodgy. Maybe I'm contradicting what I said above, but that's how politics work. It's be the ultimate epitome of the "it'll be grand attitude" and I hope it doesn't happen for that reason only. If all the scandal had been kept under wraps, I think Bertie would possibly have been the most popular President ever.

Joe?

JerryHandbag

Has Albert Reynolds thrown his hat in the ring yet? He seems to do it every 7 years.

Ulysses Gaze

No

^^^^

Albert is 'too ill' to do anything. Can't give testimony in court so surely can't stand for the Presidency?

Biggins

dubes wrote: »

I love bertie Bassett
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

You forgot the last name so I put it in for you.

Sonnenblumen

Suckers prefer hardboilers.

Biggins

Jelly Babies man here.

Ulysses Gaze

No

sdonn wrote: »

Bah, I'm preaching to the boards.ie/AH/FG coalition here. What's the point.

No, I think you're preaching to a bunch of people who don't fall for Ahern's 'Man of de Peeple' shtick anymore.

Like it or not, people outside of the still bafflingly high 25% who support FF, are pretty p!ssed of with Ahern, the lies he told and the lies he's still telling. And even some of them, the 25%, probably despise the lying prick for what he's gotten them into.

I'm not affiliated with any party - I'll vote for a party whose policies I think will work rather than vote for a political party like I'd support a soccer team.

I also don't vote for politicians like Ahern who try and build a Cult of Personality rather than any actual, meaningful policies.

Biggins

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

No, I think you're preaching to a bunch of people who don't fall for Ahern's 'Man of de Peeple' shtick anymore.

Like it or not, people outside of the still bafflingly high 25% who support FF, are pretty p!ssed of with Ahern, the lies he told and the lies he's still telling. And even some of them probably despise the lying prick for what he's gotten them into.

I'm not affiliated with any party - I'll vote for a party whose policies I think will work rather than vote for a political party like I'd support a soccer team.

I also don't vote for politicians like Ahern who try and build a Cult of Personality rather than any actual, meaningful policies.

Well put!

catthinkin

seriously with leave the country if that odious laughing knome gets in

Mike 1972

Deleted User wrote: »

Well, TBH I can't join the torch&pitchfork crowd on tony & bertie purely because of the Good Friday Agreement.

What you mean the f€cker had some sneaky secret clause written in on the decommissioning of torches and pitchforks ?

mickydoomsux

catthinkin wrote: »

seriously with leave the country if that odious laughing knome gets in

No you won't.

ejmaztec

mickydoomsux wrote: »

No you won't.

How do you know?

Einhard

ejmaztec wrote: »

How do you know?

Because at least 40 people a day say something similar on some thread on boards, and it's a tad difficult to believe that someone will pack their bags and leave the country just because FF gets re-elected/Bertie becomes president/RTE don't cancel Fair City.

starbelgrade

You've got to be f*cking kidding me. I swear, if there's any chance that he becomes our head of state, I'm renouncing my citizenship.

Sykk

So what exactly does the president of this country do anyway? Besides live off of our taxes?

starbelgrade

Sykk wrote: »

So what exactly does the president of this country do anyway? Besides live off of our taxes?

They wave a lot.

sligopark

Ah sure who else?

Ahern?

Norris?

Gorman?

Bono?

All self serving pricks - time for a different way of choosing a president?

kraggy

starbelgrade wrote: »

You've got to be f*cking kidding me. I swear, if there's any chance that he becomes our head of state, I'm renouncing my citizenship.

Why? He's just about the most honest politician in the whole country. Well spoken, outspoken on human rights and would be very good at meeting/hosting other heads of state thus maybe gaining trade contracts as McAleese did last week.

He's educated, cultural and has never done a dodgy thing in his life.

Why not?

starbelgrade

I hope Dustin runs for it again.

epgc3fyqirnbsx

But he could right an epic poem about it