Dole claimants may have to work in community

Chaotic_Forces

i_love_toast wrote: »

yeah thats right bite the hand that feeds you. You do know its the same government who increased your dole over the last 6 years to the massive 204e a week that it is now......

It's 196, it's meant to be going up every year but they happily took back down when we need it most.

billy the squid wrote: »

people who take up these positions will not be included in the monthly unemployment figure.

Of course, it's the plan for a new, better Ireland! Let's just say they're doing some sort of work, so the EU and other places think "GO IRELAND!".

What's that? You worked as a manager for 15 years? Oh right, welcome to Tesco; stack selves.

leshogan wrote: »

something needed to be done, at least its something, I see too many young ins on the dole who have no expenses, living with mam and daddy and spending €200 a week a sauce and fags, other whose friend,brother, sister or mother will go in and sign on when claimant is on 'holidays' in spain for the week or maybe just gone to Australia.

there is so much horsesh!t going on its about time they did something. Its easy pick the applicants, people who have limited PRSI contributions, indicating they have done fcuk all work upto know.

Dont show up, dont get paid - just like the rest of us

Um... you need to collect your money in person and in the last year or so they're really cracking down on people not signing on. I'd like to know what place you can get your friend to sign on for you; save me waiting in a line for about 2 hours.

starbelgrade wrote: »

Here's a comparison to highlight the idiocy & daft thinking behind this scheme;

Let's imagine that the Social Welfare is a shopping centre & that the dole frauds are shoplifters. Let's imagine that the shopping centre's owners are clueless f*ckwits.

Now, if they weren't totally incompetant dickheads, the obvious solution to cut down on shoplifting, would be to increase security & employ a professional security company to cut down on the amount of goods being nicked from their shops.

But these owners are buffoons remember, so they come up with a contrived plan that they think is genius - they decide to get a small percentage of their shoppers to work in their shopping centre. The theory behind it being, that if they are working in the shops, they'll be less likely to be stealing as they will have less time to do so.

But the owners have ignored the fact that there is still a larger number of customers who might be shoplifters, who aren't part of their scheme, so the chances are, a lot of stuff will still get nicked. They also don't counter in the fact that they actually have to pay the ones working in the shop & that they too could be nicking in their spare time, as they only have to do 2 days work.

So they really haven't saved any money or cut down on shoplifting.

Meanwhile, a large professional security company goes bust because they can't get contracts with any shopping centres.

Actually it would be more like asking the shoplifters to work for the store. The reasoning being that if "they work for me, they won't steal since I'm paying them money and we can all say I don't have shop lifters in my store".

Mister men

How i have lol'd all day long listening to the wingers on the radio give out about this idea. Why is it okay for the average Joe ex-factory worker to have to go out on the street sweeping or in the local park picking up rubbish but the former accountants, IT pro's etc... should get a free pass because it would be "degrading" for them. One guy was actually nearly in tears saying he could'nt face the idea of one of his neighbours seeing him cleaning up around his area as they drove by on their way to work.:pac:

-Trek-

I don't think it matters any more judging by the comments I heard this evening on the radio, where it seems the average Joe on the street is aaccepting this farce of a scheme with open arms regardless of the consequence's. So this seems to be a winner for the government as their winning the vote of the taxpayers and sugar coating the live register - the perfect plan.

chasm

starbelgrade wrote: »

Let's imagine that the Social Welfare is a shopping centre & that the dole frauds are shoplifters. Let's imagine that the shopping centre's owners are clueless f*ckwits.

They also don't counter in the fact that they actually have to pay the ones working in the shop & that they too could be nicking in their spare time, as they only have to do 2 days work.

The thing is that some people will most likely jump at the chance to do this because they can continue to work and sign, only it will be legitimate as,according to RTE,

Unlike those on Jobseeker's Allowance, participants will not be means tested, and they can work part-time outside of the scheme as well.

which seems to me that the Govt have given up trying to catch dole cheats and have decided it would be easier to get the fraudsters to work a few hours for their dole and continue in their "on-the-side" job lol

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

The thing is that some people will most likely jump at the chance to do this because they can continue to work and sign, only it will be legitimate as,according to RTE,

Unlike those on Jobseeker's Allowance, participants will not be means tested, and they can work part-time outside of the scheme as well.

Do you really think the government is going to say "oh you have a job at 10-5 today? Sure, we can just re-arrange your hours for you". They'll say "either take part of fu*k off.

chasm

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Do you really think the government is going to say "oh you have a job at 10-5 today? Sure, we can just re-arrange your hours for you". They'll say "either take part of fu*k off.

I didn't say that. I didnt realise every person ripping off the dole was working full day shifts!:rolleyes:

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

I didn't say that. I didnt realise every person ripping off the dole was working full day shifts!:rolleyes:

No you're not getting it. You're allowed to work for 3 days outta six (Sunday not included). Most employess that give part time are generally giving shift work. The dole isn't going to be so kind as to say "oh you're going to need to work so you don't get fired and can feed your children and give them an education? Sure, you can work that day and work for us another time." They're just going to laugh and say "you want money, do what we say".

So basically you have families that are barely making ends meet even if they working 3 days a week for just under 20 hours and still trying to make ends meet even with the so called "bonuses" of rent allowance and whatnot.

So next time you go on about people "ripping off the dole", check what people are entitled to first.

chasm

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

No you're not getting it. You're allowed to work for 3 days outta six (Sunday not included). Most employess that give part time are generally giving shift work. The dole isn't going to be so kind as to say "oh you're going to need to work so you don't get fired and can feed your children and give them an education? Sure, you can work that day and work for us another time." They're just going to laugh and say "you want money, do what we say".

So basically you have families that are barely making ends meet even if they working 3 days a week for just under 20 hours and still trying to make ends meet even with the so called "bonuses" of rent allowance and whatnot.

So next time you go on about people "ripping off the dole", check what people are entitled to first.

Get off your tall pony mate, I know People's circumstances are different, i also know people who are actually "ripping off the dole", so peddle that poor crap elsewhere, ive been on SW and i know it can be a struggle, but not all people who are working and signing are entitled to do so and not all are classed as employees either.

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

Get off your tall pony mate, I know People's circumstances are different, i also know people who are actually "ripping off the dole", so peddle that poor crap elsewhere, ive been on SW and i know it can be a struggle, but not all people who are working and signing are entitled to do so and not all are classed as employees either.

If you have a problem with people working when they're entitled to it then ask the social welfare scheme to be changed...

Speaking of getting off the tall pony, why don't you stop looking at everyone that works part-time (which they're allowed to do) as full people ripping of the dole.

chasm

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

If you have a problem with people working when they're entitled to it then ask the social welfare scheme to be changed...

Speaking of getting off the tall pony, why don't you stop looking at everyone that works part-time (which they're allowed to do) as full people ripping of the dole.

Wtf are you wittering on about? People on SW payments cannot just go out and work when they feel like it, it has to be declared to your SW office, you obviously think they can, but hey it's not my job to educate you on the rules of SW.

I personally don't care whether a person works and signs, If that's the risk they wish to take so be it, it's their problem. SW is made up of lots of different benefits and allowances and i can assure you that at present you cannot work on them all.

If you had bothered to read my first post properly you would see that it was actually a dig at the Govt, because although i do think this could be a good thing if it is organised properly, i'm not overly convinced, because instead of doing what they claim, ie "people who are not genuinely unemployed ceasing to claim because of the new requirements.", those who are not genuinely seeking employment because they are working on the side, will be able to claim the dole and do their few hours on the QT knowing full well they can't be touched.

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

Wtf are you wittering on about? People on SW payments cannot just go out and work when they feel like it, it has to be declared to your SW office, you obviously think they can, but hey it's not my job to educate you on the rules of SW.

I personally don't care whether a person works and signs, If that's the risk they wish to take so be it, it's their problem. SW is made up of lots of different benefits and allowances and i can assure you that at present you cannot work on them all.

If you had bothered to read my first post properly you would see that it was actually a dig at the Govt, because although i do think this could be a good thing if it is organised properly, i'm not overly convinced, because instead of doing what they claim, ie "people who are not genuinely unemployed ceasing to claim because of the new requirements.", those who are not genuinely seeking employment because they are working on the side, will be able to claim the dole and do their few hours on the QT knowing full well they can't be touched.

You really have no clue about what you're allowed do...

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/Schemes/JobseekerSupports/JobseekersAllowance/Pages/ja.aspx#Rules2

Read that, come back when you're educated on the basics and then try to hop back on the high horse of assuming "if you work, it's fruad"...

chasm

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

You really have no clue about what you're allowed do...

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/Schemes/JobseekerSupports/JobseekersAllowance/Pages/ja.aspx#Rules2

Read that, come back when you're educated on the basics and then try to hop back on the high horse of assuming "if you work, it's fruad"...

Don't need to read it, because i know what it says, nothing new on that!
I'm sure the SW and the Govt will be very impressed to know that every single person who works and signs is entitled to because you assume that from what you read on the welfare site about one of their payments:rolleyes:


I must phone SW tomorrow because i never realised that the whole welfare system has now been reduced to a single payment....

As i said before SW have to be informed of work you do. Whether you like it or not there are people in this country who claim a SW payment and they are NOT entitled to work whilst in payment of it. There are people who do not notify SW of their work so that they can claim full rate payments on top of their cash in hand wages. I never claimed all signer/workers were doing it illegally so i think i will leave you up there on your high horse mate thanks all the same;)

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

Don't need to read it, because i know what it says, nothing new on that!
I'm sure the SW and the Govt will be very impressed to know that every single person who works and signs is entitled to because you assume that from what you read on the welfare site about one of their payments:rolleyes:


I must phone SW tomorrow because i never realised that the whole welfare system has now been reduced to a single payment....

As i said before SW have to be informed of work you do. Whether you like it or not there are people in this country who claim a SW payment and they are NOT entitled to work whilst in payment of it. There are people who do not notify SW of their work so that they can claim full rate payments on top of their cash in hand wages. I never claimed all signer/workers were doing it illegally so i think i will leave you up there on your high horse mate thanks all the same;)

Sorry, so sorry. I forgot that you can just backtrack and change what you meant. Really so damn sorry that I didn't remember that. :rolleyes:

Like it or not pal, I get the dole, I can work 19.5 hours a week for 3 days out of six and work 23 hours on sunday if I like and STILL get the dole, but of course, I'm wrong, right? Clearly I can't work at all. But wait, I can if I inform the dole. But wait once more! That's ripping of the dole according to you if I work...
Or is it only if I don't inform the dole... Yeah that was your point. But then you also said I can't work on the dole...
Stop getting caught in your own web.:D

Next time you want to say anyone who works is a ripping of the dole, get yer damn facts straight as to what people are allowed to do.

chasm

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Sorry, so sorry. I forgot that you can just backtrack and change what you meant. Really so damn sorry that I didn't remember that. :rolleyes:

Like it or not pal, I get the dole, I can work 19.5 hours a week for 3 days out of six and work 23 hours on sunday if I like and STILL get the dole, but of course, I'm wrong, right? Clearly I can't work at all. But wait, I can if I inform the dole. But wait once more! That's ripping of the dole according to you if I work...
Or is it only if I don't inform the dole... Yeah that was your point. But then you also said I can't work on the dole...
Stop getting caught in your own web.:D

Next time you want to say anyone who works is a ripping of the dole, get yer damn facts straight as to what people are allowed to do.

Er i didnt backtrack anywhere, you seemed to have a problem with understanding what i wrote in my posts so i tried to break it down for you.....unfortunately that didnt work judging by that post.

I didnt say half the things you claimed i said in that post either, but then getting your facts right doesnt seem to be an issue in your posts.

I don't care whether you work or not, your wages have no affect on me personally so i don't care what you earn. You on the other hand seem to think it does, so i'm sorry to disappoint but go find someone who gives a damn.

It's not me getting caught up in anything and i'm sure anyone reading this can see that it's you who seems to be trying to twist stuff ive said, because your argument is wrong. If you intend to debate an issue with someone on here, at least read their opinion and then comment.

F*ckin trolls

fonecrusher1

Feckin hell lads bickering about the dole?

Doesn't get much more depressing than that.:pac:

Chaotic_Forces

chasm wrote: »

Er i didnt backtrack anywhere, you seemed to have a problem with understanding what i wrote in my posts so i tried to break it down for you.....unfortunately that didnt work judging by that post.

I didnt say half the things you claimed i said in that post either, but then getting your facts right doesnt seem to be an issue in your posts.

I don't care whether you work or not, your wages have no affect on me personally so i don't care what you earn. You on the other hand seem to think it does, so i'm sorry to disappoint but go find someone who gives a damn.

It's not me getting caught up in anything and i'm sure anyone reading this can see that it's you who seems to be trying to twist stuff ive said, because your argument is wrong. If you intend to debate an issue with someone on here, at least read their opinion and then comment.

F*ckin trolls

Trolls? Oh right, you mean the fact that I didn't take kindly to you sainyg if you work, it's ripping off the dole...

Now then you might remember this nice post:

chasm wrote: »

The thing is that some people will most likely jump at the chance to do this because they can continue to work and sign, only it will be legitimate as,according to RTE,

Unlike those on Jobseeker's Allowance, participants will not be means tested, and they can work part-time outside of the scheme as well.

which seems to me that the Govt have given up trying to catch dole cheats and have decided it would be easier to get the fraudsters to work a few hours for their dole and continue in their "on-the-side" job lol

Continue to work and sign you say... yeah we can do that if it's part-time and the dole know about it.

As for "on-the-side-job", it's called part time and believe it or not, the dole isn't a job, like you high horse people seem to think...

But you'll probably just edit that post again

zenno

jesusinaglanza wrote: »

This is a great idea, we all know an area local to us that needs tidying, graffiti removed, place swept, grass cut etc, weeds pulled put. Plus all work would be helping their town look nicer, that can only be a good thing.

The town where i live in, Balbriggan could do with a project like this, There should be a criteria of course, It should only be for long term unemployed, i.e pre 2007 dole claimants that have not done a tap.

chain gans FTW :pac:


Alan

community service is for criminals as an alternative to prison.

Darlughda

storm2811 wrote: »

I'd say a good few people on the dole wouldn't mind getting out and doing something anyway.
What kind of work could they do though? The county councils do pretty much everything like fixing up the town and cleaning up etc.

danger mouse wrote: »

Think it's a great idea..I'm on the dole at the moment and would love to do something like this during the day, when I'm not looking for work.Most days i'm bored to tears and would be happy to help out in my local community.

Dean820 wrote: »

They should only make people who have been on the dole say, 1+ years on it to take part. That would be fair enough I think.

Wagon wrote: »

Good idea. I wouldn't have minded doing something when i was on the dole. Would have been nice to feel like i was earning.

For ffs, for anybody out there still using the tired argument that this bs scheme will give people on the dole 'something to do' why don't they check out www.volunteer.ie. Its just madness to assume that there isn't tons of opportunities out there, albeit it non salary paying, for people with 'nothing to do'.

Mister men

It's a ploy from the government to force people to emigrate. And they will in their droves.

zenno

the social welfare might be able to force you to turn up for this but they can't force you to work. once you're there thats the main thing, you are logged in and turned up. discription of slavery...forcing a person to do something they don't want to do. and such would be a bad idea to bring this idiotic thing into force. as someone said to me slavery never left, it has always been here. time to rebel and bring in a ghetto blaster and play music and dance all day. my ass am i going to do community service like a criminal. if they put more effort into creating jobs with a decent wage well i will be the first in the que as i have being in these ques for months with no success yet. this government will be out soon anyway so no big deal.

Cheeky_gal

I think it's a fantastic idea. The amount of scumbags on the dole just sitting at home wasting their life away, spending it on drugs, committing crime etc.

They should be made to earn it then whatever way they choose to spend it I couldn't give a toss. But it's unreal the amount of wasters you see hanging around the dole office and you know damn well what they're most likely gonna spend it on. Anyways that's neither here nor there but a bit of community work would do them good.

Having said that, I wouldn't expect my dad/mom to clean up people's litter etc having worked their as**es off all their life. However, the scumbags and wasters should, considering it was most likely them that littered in the first place. How to define who's a scumbag and who's not a scumbag could be tricky though, I'd say we look out for adidas/puma tracksuits and take it from there.

starbelgrade

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

How to define who's a scumbag and who's not a scumbag could be tricky though, I'd say we look out for adidas/puma tracksuits and take it from there.

If you're going to pick arbitrary ways of deciding who has to do this slave work scheme, I suggest that we pick anyone with the name Brian. It's as good a criteria as any.

monkeypants

If we add this to the WPP1 and WPP2 programmes, that's a lot of free labour. IBEC and ISME must be delighted and is that a round of applause that I hear from Bill Cullen? One question, Bill; who's going to be buying your French motors if everyone's working for free? Ass.

bryaner

starbelgrade wrote: »

If you're going to pick arbitrary ways of deciding who has to do this slave work scheme, I suggest that we pick anyone with the name Brian. It's as good a criteria as any.

Why is it always Brian :pac:

TwoShedsJackson

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

If its the longterm dole hogs to be targeted for the 'work' im all for it.

Imagine the people you're talking about here; lazy scumbags in 99% of cases, people who have never had or wanted a job.

And they want to put those types in looking after kids and the elderly? Think about that for five seconds and you will realise A) what a stupid idea it is and why it is NEVER going to happen.

professore

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

Why is that degrading ? Anyway he would be on unemployment benefit, not unemployment assistance (or whatever PC term they're calling it nowadays) for 12 months so wouldn't be eligible. Eastern European graduates have no problems coming here and taking on 'degrading' work that us Irish are too posh to do.

professore

Mister men wrote: »

It's a ploy from the government to force people to emigrate. And they will in their droves.

Great - will save the country a load of money. BTW I disagree with you anyway - the ones who have the get up and go to emigrate are either employed or have gone already. Personally if I was in that situation I would emigrate - this country is f**ked.

Red Alert

How can someone be actively seeking work (i.e. be available at short notice for interviews, put in the legwork with CVs) if they're assigned to be working already?

zenno

well after reading all comments i can say that the majority of people that commented here are just uneducated children too young to even understand the question that was put to them. most if not all comments are the same and seem very childish in behaviour. typical really.

fonecrusher1

zenno wrote: »

well after reading all comments i can say that the majority of people that commented here are just uneducated children too young to even understand the question that was put to them. most if not all comments are the same and seem very childish in behaviour. typical really.

Hug?