Dole claimants may have to work in community

the_dark_side

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0829/welfare.html

Personally, I think this not a bad idea. I am not on the dole myself (not eligable) but if I was, I wouldnt mind giving a hand in the community in exchange for dole... considering I am able bodied and healthy, I already do volunteer work whenever I can.

storm2811

Yeah I'd agree that it's a good idea,if they're able to do it then why not?

I'd say a good few people on the dole wouldn't mind getting out and doing something anyway.
What kind of work could they do though? The county councils do pretty much everything like fixing up the town and cleaning up etc.

Collie D

This idea gets bandied about every once in a while. Ignoring the ethical question of whether or not it's a form of slave labour how does this affect the people that actually are employed doing this type of work? Will they be let go because employers know they can get someone from the dole queue to do the job for just above minimum wage?

Snowie

I think its a great idea. should of been in two years ago

thankfully i'm back on college

But its going to do things for them give thems omethign to keep them busy give them some much needed satisfaction... Can't say any less about it brillaint idea

Leeg17

Good idea IMO. 19.5 hours for €210 as proposed is €10.76 an hour. A part time job with above minimum wages.

I wonder how many people will be unable to do the work because they're too "busy"

It's also a nice way to keep people occupied, they may even find a new interest (ie gardening) and may want to pursue a career in it or start a new business.

Klingon Hamlet

It's great cos it'll catch all the many many welfare cheats, plus it'll get the genuine claimants out of the house and gain them some experience and skills for future fulltime employment.

Gannicus

Oh my favorite. community service. make them work for it. Everyone on the dole goes out 2 or 3 days a week sweeps their local streets or park at about 8 in the morn when the rest of us tax payers are going to work, paints the local businesses to remove graffiti or help out by portering in hospitals teaching people to read. if you don't show up for one of the days you only get half your dole. you miss both you don't get anything the next week. not like they have much else to do. and no more double weeks come Christmas.

galwayrush

I can't see any problem with it.

The willing to work won't either, but the won't work will.

the_dark_side

Leeg17 wrote: »

Good idea IMO. 19.5 hours for €210 as proposed is €10.76 an hour. A part time job with above minimum wages.

I wonder how many people will be unable to do the work because they're too "busy"

It's also a nice way to keep people occupied, they may even find a new interest (ie gardening) and may want to pursue a career in it or start a new business.

very good point.... it may show up people who may already be working, or who might be appearing once a month to claim.
A local school needed a garden allotment built, and they got some guys who were given community service to put it together, they did a great job and they call back once in a while to maintain it etc

PAULWATSON

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

drunkmonkey

Why are they saying only 10,000 will be in the scheme, why not everybody on the dole, tbh i think they should have to tidy tax payers houses, iron clothes, cut the lawn etc for anyone working, it's only fair.

Mister men

Fantastic news. At last the government get the fibger out. This will slash the dole numbers drastically if carried out properly.
Edit: Only 10,000. ffs typical

JONJO THE MISER

People will be able to get out of it very easily if they want, I can imagine now people showing up smelling like **** and doing the bear min and fighting with the other workers just so they will be left out of the scheme:D.

Collie D

Klingon Hamlet wrote: »

It's great cos it'll catch all the many many welfare cheats, plus it'll get the genuine claimants out of the house and gain them some experience and skills for future fulltime employment.

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

Mister men

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

Why not. It will be doing a service to the community as well as giving him some self worth. Win win

overhand_right

I wonder will every claimant be made work or will pavee points members be exempt

whippet

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

degraded? What are you on about .. he should be proud to be doing something to help out his country in this time of need.

Are you implying that he feels that he is above working for a living? This attitude sickens me .... because you feel some types of work is beneath you it is a reason to take the money from everyone else instead.

Since the recession sponsorship for local sports clubs all over the country has dried up ... imagine the benefit of having a resource for 19 hours aweek to give a dig out with maintenance and the like .... rather than boosting the ratings of day time tv.

galwayrush

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

They would earn their dole by doing the work, should some qualifications earn the right to get the dole free gratias while lesser mortals work for it?:rolleyes:

galwayrush

overhand_right wrote: »

I wonder will every claimant be made work or will pavee points members be exempt

haha, difficult one to answer, in an ideal world, they would have to work as well. I won't hold my breath though..............

Elessar

I actually wouldn't mind having to do this, but it would get on my t*ts after a while.

Thankfully I'm starting work in a few weeks

the_dark_side

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

Nope... heres a couple of groups that i have done volunteer work with over the last 2 years.... Irish wheelchair associaton (computer classes), Care of the Elderly group (bus driver). The litter issue should be tackled at the source ie. kids should be taught not to throw litter... but thats a different argument

Klingon Hamlet

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

I guarantee theyll be targeting those on long term benefits first. The ones who've been queueing for benefits but not jobhunting. Not people whove just lost their jobs.

carbsy

galwayrush wrote: »

They would earn their dole by doing the work, should some qualifications earn the right to get the dole free gratias while lesser mortals work for it?:rolleyes:

You didn't answer the question but went off on your own rant.

Collie D

galwayrush wrote: »

They would earn their dole by doing the work, should some qualifications earn the right to get the dole free gratias while lesser mortals work for it?:rolleyes:

And people who have been working for twenty years haven't earned their dole by paying taxes and social insurance contributions?

mikom

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

Yeah, much better to let them sit at home watching Judge Judy.

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

“If a man is called to be a street sweeper, he should sweep streets even as Michelangelo painted, or Beethoven composed music, or Shakespeare wrote poetry. He should sweep streets so well that all the hosts of heaven and earth will pause to say, here lived a great street sweeper who did his job well.”

PAULWATSON wrote: »

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

Have a smell of my squirty flower.

johnmcdnl

Collie D wrote: »

This idea gets bandied about every once in a while. Ignoring the ethical question of whether or not it's a form of slave labour how does this affect the people that actually are employed doing this type of work? Will they be let go because employers know they can get someone from the dole queue to do the job for just above minimum wage?

this may be an issue in some towns where people are actually employed to clean towns and stuff - but you point out 1 town in the country that doesn't need any cleaning up at all - surely having all the people on the dole having to do something to get their money is a far better idea than just handing them money to sit at home all day watching day time tv...

and if they can clean up the towns for us to get their dole money it's going to help everyone by providing a service for their government payout

might also stop some of the giving out about the amount of dole money handed out to people for doing nothing... if their doing something then they deserve their allowance

if their scumbags who try to work the system and work second jobs they'll be exposed or will actually have to leave the house to do work.. poor scumbags :rolleyes:

if any politician suggests this for the next election I'll vote for them

galwayrush

carbsy wrote: »

You didn't answer the question.They would get f**k all experience.

All work is experience.:p
Seriously,for eg... imagine how much an accountant could earn on the side advising his non qualified co workers on their entitlements.........

the_dark_side

its funny how people assume that working for the dole = sweeping the streets... there are thousands of things that could be done other than sweep the streets... I think people should be allowed to create their own job description

o1s1n

PAULWATSON wrote: »

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

How nice of you to put down every single street sweep who keeps our cities/towns clean.

Nodin

Does this mean they drop the means test.....?

Mr Cawley

It won't go far enough.

If all unemployed did a few hours a week everyone in society would benefit.

The corpo's staff will be up in arms though!

For childcare and care for the elderly you require Fetac training, you can't throw unemployed in without the existing training requirements.

Anyone think it's just the government appeasing tax payers?

Collie D

Klingon Hamlet wrote: »

I guarantee theyll be targeting those on long term benefits first. The ones who've been queueing for benefits but not jobhunting. Not people whove just lost their jobs.

It doesn't actually mention that in the article though. Fair enough if they're targetting scroungers but it just smells like some half-thought out idea by somebody who's following Tory policies too closely.

mikom wrote: »

Yeah, much better to let them sit at home watching Judge Judy.
.

I knew I shouldn't have mentioned the graduates

Ideo

Klingon Hamlet wrote: »

I guarantee theyll be targeting those on long term benefits first. The ones who've been queueing for benefits but not jobhunting. Not people whove just lost their jobs.

I really hope they do! 100% support this

danger mouse

Think it's a great idea..I'm on the dole at the moment and would love to do something like this during the day, when I'm not looking for work.Most days i'm bored to tears and would be happy to help out in my local community.

steve9859

I always get them the wrong way round, but you are entitled to a year of payments based on what you have paid in PRSI in the preceding year, right? I cant remember whether that is jobseekers allowance or jobseekers benefit. People shouldnt be made to work during this time - they are entitled to their money and should spend the time trying to find a job.

Anyway, when you are past a year you switch to the other one, right? I have never understood why at this stage people are not made to do something for their dole money. Voluntary work seems like a great idea.

So the recently laid off worker gets a year to find a job, which is plenty. Then after that people should be forced to get off their ass and do something productive, surely??

mikom

Collie D wrote: »

I knew I shouldn't have mentioned the graduates

That's the late night movie....... Judge Judy is on earlier.

iPlop

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

A shi!te experience!! but for the people that are on the dole and doing nothing except drinking and being bums in general ,it might make them think of a new career path;)

Jesus Wept

I have no idea how it has not been mentioned yet but here is the problem with it:

It is envisaged that the new participants will be involved in areas like after school services, childcare, services for older people and environmental projects, as well as in the improvement of sports and tourist facilities.

After school service, childcare, services for old people - these are jobs that should catered to by fully qualified and fully vetted personal only.

Children and old people - two of the most vulnerable groups in society.

Miss Ogyne

Personally I think the question should be asked that if these 10,000 jobs exist to place people on the dole into for minimum wage then why aren't they being advertised so that said people on the dole can apply for them and maybe get paid a fair wage? I mean I'm pretty sure that if these "jobs" exist and were advertised in the normal manner they'd be snapped up straight away which would take 10,000 people off the live register anyway. This will go in the same was as Fas's WPP fiasco, employers get free employees, everyone works for nothing and people coming new into the jobs markert will end up on the dole (because no one will hire for a wage when they can get employees for free) and will then be forced to go out and be that free employee. It kinda makes an education pointless if all you have to look forward to at the end is sweeping the streets/ cleaning grafitti.

PAULWATSON

danger mouse wrote: »

Thank it's a great idea..I'm on the dole at the moment and would love to do something like this during the day, when I'm not looking for work.Most days i'm bored to tears and would be happy to help out in my local community.

You are on the dole and bored, oh a heart breaking story, how about you get off your lazy ass and act off your own bat.

Or are you one of these people who wants to drag the rest with you?

mikom

The-Rigger wrote: »

Children and old people - two of the most vulnerable groups in society.

Oh yeah.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DVolJxxMyU

drunkmonkey

After the first year the dole should start being cut down to where it is no more than 100 euro a week after 3 years. The dole is a career in this country and disability is as good as a degree, it's all wrong.

mikom

PAULWATSON wrote: »

You are on the dole and bored, oh a heart breaking story, how about you get off your lazy ass and act off your own bat.

Or are you one of these people who wants to drag the rest with you?

Rovert currently banned........... I smell an alt account

LevelSpirit

Good idea. As long as businesses are not allowed to have these people. They must only do community work or work that wont take an otherwise paying job out of the economy.
It better not be like the WPP scheme, which employers are now taking people on at the tax payers expense where they would normally have had to pay their staff themselves.

foxshooter243

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Why are they saying only 10,000 will be in the scheme, why not everybody on the dole, tbh i think they should have to tidy tax payers houses, iron clothes, cut the lawn etc for anyone working, it's only fair.

your post reflects your user name :rolleyes:

Gannicus

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

Sorry for the late response I was looking for my really small violin to play a really sad song.

Yeah so what. clean the streets. If Council workers can do it and collect bins I don't see why people on the dole are too good to do it. If anything it'll make the younger dole hounds too embarrassed to not look for a job. The whole stigma of being a scrubber to their mates will force them to look for a job. I was on the dole before and I managed to do charity work and look for a job. I now have a job and still whenever possible donate time to doing charity work. So why can't someone who does pretty much nothing all day not do anything like that.

carbsy

foxshooter243 wrote: »

your post reflects your user name :rolleyes:

This is after hours! :rolleyes:

Miss Ogyne

PAULWATSON wrote: »

You are on the dole and bored, oh a heart breaking story, how about you get off your lazy ass and act off your own bat.

Or are you one of these people who wants to drag the rest with you?

In his defence

when I'm not looking for work

sounds to me like he is getting off his lazy ass and acting off his own bat. I fail to see the reason for your attack of what he said

mikemac

Childcare is already known for being a poor paying job.
Work in a creche and you'll be doing well to get over minimum wage.

And now childcare is going to included in this scheme.
This is going to end up like the WPP, new vacancies go to staff on welfare instead of hiring somebody on a proper wage.

And most county councils are laying off temporary staff.
If there are temporary council staff still working they better be concerned for their jobs

Gannicus

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

People will be able to get out of it very easily if they want, I can imagine now people showing up smelling like **** and doing the bear min and fighting with the other workers just so they will be left out of the scheme:D.

If you start any of that you lose your dole. there has to be stringent rules to stop it being a total p!ss take

Stinicker

Slavery ended in America after the Civil war, it looks as if it is about to be introduced to Ireland. Either every single person on the dole is put out to work or no-one is simple as that. This cannot and will not work and should be on a voluntary basis only. Wage subvention is a far better idea than this crock of sh1te at least this way the economy would benefit.