Dublin Bus Network Review

thomasj

A2000 wrote: »

The fact that there is no all day service on 76a indicates that there was no demand for it as the old service carried few people after ballyfermot anyway.

The point is it wasn't planned that way, it was following the ballyfermot roadshow that the plans were changed. As lxflyer had said the changed 76 plans had its impact.

The report that Dublin bus got a private company to deliver indicated that an all day orbital service was needed between blanchardstown and tallaght.

Could you point me to any Dublin bus service that operates every 3 hours that gets demand. You cannot dictate demand for a service that is not there.

LXFlyer

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I got the number 4 at around 18.30 in Blackrock this evening. There were a few problems that were caused by the driver.

I was standing at bus stop no. 6334 (Opposite Frascati Shopping Centre), and to my amazement he made a needless mistake by stopping the bus at stop no. 3032 at the junction of Mount Merrion Avenue.

There was a 7 bus behind it and it's driver probably didn't have a clue why he was stopping there in front of him.

My 4 bus driver then pulled out onto the main road and struggled up the road stopping at 2 traffic signals before pulling up to my stop. That lasted for about for up to 1 minute. :mad::mad::mad:

He was then going very slowly to my drop off stop at Rowan Park. But then when he was approaching the stop, he nearly missed it. I had to remind him that I was getting off there, regardless of me pressing the bell before I got off.

The bus code on it was AV216. I think it was an 01 reg bus.

I was only waiting for a total of 15 minutes.

I have no issues from the majority of the drivers on the 4. But there can be a few bad eggs in the company that probably don't have a clue what they are doing.

Can I ask a question of you to which FOR ONCE you might answer. If You worked in a job that involved dealing with the public, and someone wasn't happy with your work, would you prefer them to clearly identify you on the Internet, or would you prefer them to write a letter of complaint to the company?

Tickityboo

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I got the number 4 at around 18.30 in Blackrock this evening. There were a few problems that were caused by the driver.

I was standing at bus stop no. 6334 (Opposite Frascati Shopping Centre), and to my amazement he made a needless mistake by stopping the bus at stop no. 3032 at the junction of Mount Merrion Avenue.

There was a 7 bus behind it and it's driver probably didn't have a clue why he was stopping there in front of him.

My 4 bus driver then pulled out onto the main road and struggled up the road stopping at 2 traffic signals before pulling up to my stop. That lasted for about for up to 1 minute. :mad::mad::mad:

He was then going very slowly to my drop off stop at Rowan Park. But then when he was approaching the stop, he nearly missed it. I had to remind him that I was getting off there, regardless of me pressing the bell before I got off.

The bus code on it was AV216. I think it was an 01 reg bus.

I was only waiting for a total of 15 minutes.

I have no issues from the majority of the drivers on the 4. But there can be a few bad eggs in the company that probably don't have a clue what they are doing.

Bad egg!!! (unbelieveable) because he mixed up a few stops.
He was probably most likely a driver who had not driven the 4 route before and was doing a bit of extra work because of short staffing issues.

Only for him having the balls to go out and drive an unfamiliar route you would have had a longer than 15 minute wait!!!

KD345

A2000 wrote: »

I also dont see why the 76 cant serve ballyfermot and continue to blanchardstown. There are a lot of students using this leg of the journey due to rtpi making it more reliable.

The fact that there is no all day service on 76a indicates that there was no demand for it as the old service carried few people after ballyfermot anyway.

There are simply not enough buses to have the 76 continue to Blanchardstown. The decision made by Dublin Bus was down to local and political pressure. It has nothing to do with lack of demand. We're talking about linking some of the most populated parts of the city. I don't think there was ever a worry that the proposed 76A wouldn't carry passengers. The routing would have seen buses leave Liffey Valley and getting onto the M50 in minutes, with a possible journey time of 15 minutes between Liffey Valley and Blanchardstown Centre.

The problem with the old 76A was it's hard to follow timetable, it's poor frequency, and the meandering routing though Ballyfermot. Expecting passengers coming from Blanchardstown to travel through the congested roads of Ballyfermot in order to get to Tallaght was never going to work.

KD345

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I got the number 4 at around 18.30 in Blackrock this evening. There were a few problems that were caused by the driver.

I was standing at bus stop no. 6334 (Opposite Frascati Shopping Centre), and to my amazement he made a needless mistake by stopping the bus at stop no. 3032 at the junction of Mount Merrion Avenue.

There was a 7 bus behind it and it's driver probably didn't have a clue why he was stopping there in front of him.

My 4 bus driver then pulled out onto the main road and struggled up the road stopping at 2 traffic signals before pulling up to my stop. That lasted for about for up to 1 minute. :mad::mad::mad:

He was then going very slowly to my drop off stop at Rowan Park. But then when he was approaching the stop, he nearly missed it. I had to remind him that I was getting off there, regardless of me pressing the bell before I got off.

The bus code on it was AV216. I think it was an 01 reg bus.

I was only waiting for a total of 15 minutes.

I have no issues from the majority of the drivers on the 4. But there can be a few bad eggs in the company that probably don't have a clue what they are doing.

What a ridiculous post. It sounds like this guy was possibly unfamiliar with the routing and was taking his time. With the disruption in Ballsbridge due to the horse show, he was probably providing an extra service on the 4 to cover for a delay etc. You would probably be on here complaining if there was a cancelled service.

This driver got you home safely and the service ran. The only fault you find of this driver was that he stopped at an extra stop and drove a bit slow, and somehow from this, you feel the need to come on here to post the reg of the bus and call him a "bad egg".

Seriously, if that's the worst thing which happened to you today you're a lucky person!

dublinman1990

lxflyer wrote: »

Can I ask a question of you to which FOR ONCE you might answer. If You worked in a job that involved dealing with the public, and someone wasn't happy with your work, would you prefer them to clearly identify you on the Internet, or would you prefer them to write a letter of complaint to the company?

Well, the no.4 driver was to me; a new driver, because I had never seen him before until yesterday evening. I am of the opinion that, if he was allocated on that route to do extra training, well than that is fine. I have no issue with it.

The route training is a good way IMO of finding out of were your their strong and weak points are when driving a bus. He had probably been a marked in driver on some other route out of Harristown been stuck on a different route for one day.

I know that about 90 to 95% of the DB drivers I see on their duties are regarded as "marked in". I do understand that is normal practice everyday within DB.

There is another few things worth mentioning to make the point.

The 4 was the only quickest option for me to get home today with a waiting time of 15 minutes. Even though it said a predicted time of 12 minutes on the RTPI via SMS.

I got off the DART from Dun Laoghaire to Blackrock at 18.10.

My first downfall that evening was the 114, I would waited an hour for that bus until 19.10 to Ticknock. So I said, forget that.

Next the 84 from Carysfort Road (Bus Stop No.3082) I texted in the next departure, the resulting text gave me a time of 19.00 for the 84 to Newcastle. That would given me a waiting time of 47 minutes for only going the 3 stops to Rowan Park.

Anyway, the majority of the drivers on any route are much quicker IMO once they are marked in.

Tickityboo

dublinman1990 wrote: »

lxflyer wrote: »

Can I ask a question of you to which FOR ONCE you might answer. If You worked in a job that involved dealing with the public, and someone wasn't happy with your work, would you prefer them to clearly identify you on the Internet, or would you prefer them to write a letter of complaint to the company?

Well, the no.4 driver was to me; a new driver, because I had never seen him before until yesterday evening. I am of the opinion that, if he was allocated on that route to do extra training, well than that is fine. I have no issue with it.

The route training is a good way IMO of finding out of were your their strong and weak points are when driving a bus. He had probably been a marked in driver on some other route out of Harristown been stuck on a different route for one day.

I know that about 90 to 95% of the DB drivers I see on their duties are regarded as "marked in". I do understand that is normal practice everyday within DB.

There is another few things worth mentioning to make the point.

The 4 was the only quickest option for me to get home today with a waiting time of 15 minutes. Even though it said a predicted time of 12 minutes on the RTPI via SMS.

I got off the DART from Dun Laoghaire to Blackrock at 18.10.

My first downfall that evening was the 114, I would waited an hour for that bus until 19.10 to Ticknock. So I said, forget that.

Next the 84 from Carysfort Road (Bus Stop No.3082) I texted in the next departure, the resulting text gave me a time of 19.00 for the 84 to Newcastle. That would given me a waiting time of 47 minutes for only going the 3 stops to Rowan Park.

Anyway, the majority of the drivers on any route are much quicker IMO once they are marked in.

Nobody said he was route training!!

He probably filled in at the last minute because Dublin Bus are streatched to the limits at the weekends at the moment.

But because the choice of route you made worked out slower than you tought it's the driver being a bad egg.

It's this type of cra*p that makes me hate having to deal with the public.

And you wonder why we come accross as being grumpy :-(

Cookie_Monster

dublinman1990 wrote: »

only going the 3 stops to Rowan Park.

why not simply walk then? Would have been quicker

AlekSmart

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I got the number 4 at around 18.30 in Blackrock this evening. There were a few problems that were caused by the driver.......

........My 4 bus driver then pulled out onto the main road and struggled up the road stopping at 2 traffic signals before pulling up to my stop. That lasted for about for up to 1 minute. :mad::mad::mad:

He was then going very slowly to my drop off stop at Rowan Park. But then when he was approaching the stop, he nearly missed it. I had to remind him that I was getting off there, regardless of me pressing the bell before I got off.

The bus code on it was AV216. I think it was an 01 reg bus.

I was only waiting for a total of 15 minutes.

I have no issues from the majority of the drivers on the 4. But there can be a few bad eggs in the company that probably don't have a clue what they are doing.

A somewhat odd post indeed.

From my reading,it appears that the poster had a Big Bad Busdriver notion fermenting in the afternoon heat and suddenly found themselves gifted with a set of circumstances which could be crafted into a really good attack.

Again,from my POV,this sounds far more like a defective vehicle scenario than any percieved Driver assault on this posters sensitivities.

A 01 AV would sit right smack bang in the middle of my list of buses which COULD suffer from overheating and subsequent power-reduction issues towards the end of a long hot day (As do some drivers !)

When this occurs the events happen almost to the letter of this post,with little obvious warning TO THE PASSENGER,save the coasting to a stop and the wait whilst the start-up procedure is activated....

MY point is,that in this scenario,none of the causes are down to THE DRIVER,as stated,but rather a combination of outside events beyond the drivers immediate control.

To take this occurrence and extrapolate some form of ill intent on the part of the Busdriver is,I feel stretching credibility just a tad,it may also indicate that just as with some Busdrivers,the odd poster equally "does not have a clue" either...?

KD345

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Well, the no.4 driver was to me; a new driver, because I had never seen him before until yesterday evening. I am of the opinion that, if he was allocated on that route to do extra training, well than that is fine. I have no issue with it.

There are over 2,000 Dublin Bus drivers in the city. Just because you didn't recognise him does not mean this driver wasn't trained. The fact is you don't know anything about this driver or the situation other than he drove a bit slower than usual and stopped at an extra bus stop before you boarded.

Would it not be better to find out the circumstances before deciding he's a bad egg, a bad driver and highlighting this IMO non-issue online? Perhaps the bus was a bit faulty, maybe he was running ahead of schedule and was asked to slow down, maybe an incident on the bus forced him to stop at stop 3032... the fact is you don't know, and you didn't think to ask him or phone the depot to find out. You just thought it was best to come on here with a dramatic story of a bus driving slow, report his reg plate and call him a bad egg.

dublinman1990 wrote: »

The route training is a good way IMO of finding out of were your their strong and weak points are when driving a bus. He had probably been a marked in driver on some other route out of Harristown been stuck on a different route for one day.

As mentioned already, this driver was not in training, just probably unfamiliar with that section of the route. Again, we don't know.

dublinman1990 wrote: »

There is another few things worth mentioning to make the point.

The 4 was the only quickest option for me to get home today with a waiting time of 15 minutes. Even though it said a predicted time of 12 minutes on the RTPI via SMS.

I got off the DART from Dun Laoghaire to Blackrock at 18.10.

My first downfall that evening was the 114, I would waited an hour for that bus until 19.10 to Ticknock. So I said, forget that.

Next the 84 from Carysfort Road (Bus Stop No.3082) I texted in the next departure, the resulting text gave me a time of 19.00 for the 84 to Newcastle. That would given me a waiting time of 47 minutes for only going the 3 stops to Rowan Park.

Anyway, the majority of the drivers on any route are much quicker IMO once they are marked in.

I don't see how any of that is relevant or worth mentioning. What does stand out for me is that you only traveled for 3 stops, so you were only on this bus for about 2 minutes? Do you honestly feel a bus driver driving a bit slower than usual for three stops is bad at his job?

doubletrouble?

now now guys give dublinman some slack. while he might think he knows a fair bit about bus drivers and the job involved it's obvious he doesn't.
just to give you a heads up on route training dublinman.
it's nearly impossible for a driver to get route training. in fact the only way a driver is going to get route training is if he/she( spare driver only that is) moves from one garage to another. all marked in drivers getting marked in on a different route must know the route they apply for even if it's in another garage. in other words they have to learn the route themselves when they're off duty.

A2000

thomasj wrote: »

A2000 wrote: »

The fact that there is no all day service on 76a indicates that there was no demand for it as the old service carried few people after ballyfermot anyway.

The point is it wasn't planned that way, it was following the ballyfermot roadshow that the plans were changed. As lxflyer had said the changed 76 plans had its impact.

The report that Dublin bus got a private company to deliver indicated that an all day orbital service was needed between blanchardstown and tallaght.

Could you point me to any Dublin bus service that operates every 3 hours that gets demand. You cannot dictate demand for a service that is not there.


Yes there is a demand for that link but it needed to incorporate ballyfermot due to the amount of students from dublin 15 in ballyfermot colleges. The 76a takes up to 90 mins off the journey tru town.

As stated the 40 could not be relied upon to make the connection from clondalkin in either direction. More people are using it from ballyfermot colleges now due to rtpi. So would not be much point to an all day service to blanchardstown bypassing ballyfermot when this is where most of its passengers join or leave the route.

Incidentally the 76 was changed to its original route not after the roadshow but as a result of people picketing the head office in oconnell st.



As an aside the flybus from tallaght to the airport via clondalkin was withdrawn abruptly at the begining of the month following the same fate as the 2411 which dualway cancelled years ago from tallaght to airport via ballyfermot finglas & ballymun.

richard2010

dublinman1990 wrote: »

The bus code on it was AV216. I think it was an 01 reg bus.

AV216 has in the past had a habit of over heating thus leading to slow driving.

In the past AV216 was religiously on the 41X. It used to be bus that would bring me into school. In my six years of getting it there was always an occasion where it would overheat and thus slow down particulary after the M1. It would be normal for it to stop at some stage between East Wall Road and Talbot Street.

I can remember on several occasions where it conked out at Annesley Bridge and Talbot Street.

Just out of interest OP, when the bus was moving was it "roaring"?

I would guess and say as have many others that the driver was probably unfamiliar with route and thus was taking its time.

dublinman1990

richard2010 wrote: »

AV216 has in the past had a habit of over heating thus leading to slow driving.

Just out of interest OP, when the bus was moving was it "roaring"?

I would guess and say as have many others that the driver was probably unfamiliar with route and thus was taking its time.

Yes, the bus was roaring. I do get roaring buses sometimes on some routes.

Conway635

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Yes, the bus was roaring. I do get roaring buses sometimes on some routes.

Can I ask what any of this has to do with a thread on Network Direct?

If the above poster wishes to discuss his belief in "bad egg" drivers and "roaring buses" I'd imagine a new thread would be in order, at least this would allow me to read opinions on the network redesign without having to wade through this stuff.

C635

patrickbrophy18

Conway635 wrote: »

Can I ask what any of this has to do with a thread on Network Direct?

If the above poster wishes to discuss his belief in "bad egg" drivers and "roaring buses" I'd imagine a new thread would be in order, at least this would allow me to read opinions on the network redesign without having to wade through this stuff.

C635

Too right! The last 10 or so pages seem to have been dominated with technical or trivial details about buses, RTPI and driver schedules. Each time I get a notification, I'm expecting some update from the Network Direct project, not some trivial, irrelevant or insignificant information.

Cookie_Monster

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

Too right! The last 10 or so pages seem to have been dominated with technical or trivial details about buses, RTPI and driver schedules. Each time I get a notification, I'm expecting some update from the Network Direct project, not some trivial, irrelevant or insignificant information.

true enough but that said ND seems to have completely stalled with little happening these days anyway

dfx-

Conway635 wrote: »

Can I ask what any of this has to do with a thread on Network Direct?

If the above poster wishes to discuss his belief in "bad egg" drivers and "roaring buses" I'd imagine a new thread would be in order, at least this would allow me to read opinions on the network redesign without having to wade through this stuff.

C635

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

Too right! The last 10 or so pages seem to have been dominated with technical or trivial details about buses, RTPI and driver schedules. Each time I get a notification, I'm expecting some update from the Network Direct project, not some trivial, irrelevant or insignificant information.

Well I'd argue that a whole lot of things with Dublin Bus has everything to do with Network Direct in some form. Like A2000's posts on the ridiculousness of the 40.

The 40 brought in by Network Direct. Or the familiarity of drivers with routes chopped and changed by Network Direct. Or the GTs and retirement of RVs enabled by route or service chops by Network Direct. Rosters. Punctuality. Holidays. Maintenance. Customers. Timetables. Subsidies. New orders. It's such a blister on the surface that you'd have a shorter list of things that hasn't to do with Network Direct.

Bazzer2

lxflyer wrote: »

Phase 1 is long finished - that was the implementation of the changes on the Stillorgan, Blanchardstown and Lucan corridors.

All that is left to be implemented as a result of the network review are the changes to:

Howth Road/Malahide, Swords/North County Dublin, and some orbital/outer city local suburban routes.

The Lucan corridor is long finished? What happened to the re-routing of the 66 by Parson Street and the extension of the 67 to Moyglare?

donspeekinglesh

Dublin Bus said they can't afford to extend the routes.

Ben D Bus

So is the change to the 79 off the agenda now or what?

Conway635

Ben D Bus wrote: »

So is the change to the 79 off the agenda now or what?

That should still be on the agenda, as it will merge two routes and give an overall saving in vehicles/staff.

What is delaying it is an issue around the safety of the proposed terminal - a pull-in is needed.

C635

Joshycat

donspeekinglesh wrote: »

Dublin Bus said they can't afford to extend the routes.

Does this mean route 29 to Baldoyle is cancelled :eek:

end of the road

Conway635 wrote: »

That should still be on the agenda, as it will merge two routes and give an overall saving in vehicles/staff.

and will become another unrelyable cross city route. fantastic. the longer the implementation is delayed the better as far as i'm concerned.

Bazzer2

donspeekinglesh wrote: »

Dublin Bus said they can't afford to extend the routes.

Where have they said this?

donspeekinglesh

Joshycat wrote: »

Does this mean route 29 to Baldoyle is cancelled :eek:

I just mean that was the reason for not extending the 67 route. No idea about other routes.

Actually looks like the changes to the 66 will happen.

LXFlyer

What DB have said is that due to a combination of reduced demand and lack of funding, they are not implementing new routes such as the 166 and 175 (ref their FB/twitter some months back).

You can extend that to any changes that require additional buses - that does not mean that changes such as the 66 and 67 extensions will not happen as they ought not to require additional buses (the original changes left sufficient running time for the extensions). To be fair these are minor changes in the overall context of the corridor.

Similarly the Howth Road changes ought to be a net saving in vehicles - why it hasn't happened I don't know.

The 79/27b merger is on hold pending the construction of a bus terminus on Oscsr Traynor Road

KD345

Joshycat wrote: »

Does this mean route 29 to Baldoyle is cancelled :eek:

The 29 extension is still very much happening, it's just taking a bit longer than expected.

Carawaystick

I think the bus drivers are being unnnecessarily harsh on the no.4 passenger, who is maybe being unreasonable in their expectations also.

I think the vast majority of passengers who see a normal Dublin Bus ( not green, not red, not beige, Door at the front etc) would expect the bus to work and any issues in performance due to the driver.

Now interested users and drivers know that busses are unreliable and liable to malfunction/breakages. However if the bus breaks down, without cutting out the passenger is not going to know without the Driver telling the customers. I'm fairly sure DB management are sure as shure not gonna tell customers why. And leave the implication Drivers are to blame.
Communication is cheap, flexible and easy to do. but it's not done well on average

dublinman1990

I've discovered according to the DublinBus Stuff site, that both orbital routes 17 and 17a were planned to be extended to Heuston Station.

Is this has not happened yet as there limited funding to extend them to Heuston?

I also found out that the 76A, 166 & 175 routes were not going to be all day routes.

Can anyone explain why would that be the case?