Alternative Energy Suppliers

Cabaal

padocon wrote: »

BG expect to get 1million of the 1.8 million ESB Coustemers!!!!

Bord Gais are expecting 500 thousand customers within the next 5 years according to their spokes person on the last word at 4.40pm today.

mike65

I'm waiting for Gazprom to enter the market myself

Kotek Besar

Times are hard, and it's not nice being poor.

I'm trying to save 14% on my electricity units, but the online form linked to on this page is asking for a username and password.

I'm guessing that's just a temporary issue? Will keep trying..

mike65

go here

https://www.thebigswitch.ie/

Kotek Besar

Cheers Mike. Job's a good 'un. I've switched.

padocon

Cabaal wrote: »

Bord Gais are expecting 500 thousand customers within the next 5 years according to their spokes person on the last word at 4.40pm today.

Got the 1milion off teletext

dahamsta

bogman wrote: »

Am I right that in the event of an outage after I switch to Board Gais that ESB technicians will "promptly" sort out the problem, unlike Eircom taking their time if you have switched say to UTV?

That should be the case, as it's ESB Networks that would fix your supply if there was a technical problem with it (billing is another matter entirely), and they shouldn't know who your service provider is. However that should also have been the case with Eircom, and wasn't. This is down to the ability of the regulator to create a firewall between networks and retail more than anything. If they're twice as good as ComReg...

...well, they'd still be sh*te, because twice nuthin is nuthin.

adam

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

bogman wrote: »

Am I right that in the event of an outage after I switch to Board Gais that ESB technicians will "promptly" sort out the problem, unlike Eircom taking their time if you have switched say to UTV?

True. ESB Networks will respond to outages and won't know which Supply company you are with. This is why you have an account number for the Supply company and a MPRN (Meter Point Registration Number) when reporting faults. This MPRN does not indicate which company you are with. Indeed ESB Network have Service Level Agreemnets through the Regulator which ensure prompt and equal treatment of all customers.

beertons

I'll probably change myself, but can't help feeling that they (ESB) might do a job on them (BG), like eircom did to smart telecom. Repair faults slower, having power off for longer, and so on.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

beertons wrote: »

I'll probably change myself, but can't help feeling that they (ESB) might do a job on them (BG), like eircom did to smart telecom. Repair faults slower, having power off for longer, and so on.

Read what I posted above. They will not be, and can't be, aware of what Supply company you are with. Indeed they don't care, as ESB Networks gets the same returns irrespective of the generator or supplier. Losing Domestic Customers will have no measurable affect on the profits of the ESB Group so no need for conspiracy theories.:P

_Nuno_

Colby Stale Creek wrote: »

Read what I posted above. They will not be, and can't be, aware of what Supply company you are with. Indeed they don't care, as ESB Networks gets the same returns irrespective of the generator or supplier. Losing Domestic Customers will have no measurable affect on the profits of the ESB Group so no need for conspiracy theories.:P

So you are saying that bord gais will be paying ESB the full price consumers were previously paying ESB? That is the only way for it not to have a measurable effect on ESB.

Obviously the networks division won't be affected since they'll probably get the same from BG than they did from the ESB division that distributes to consumers, but ESB distribution (whatever its called) will lose a significant portion of their profits.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Nuno, I'm not going to quote a load of figures here and drag this off topic but get hold of a copy of the ESB Annual Report and you'll see that due to regulatory restrictions on new plant, the requirement to keep standby generation available etc. the Generation and Supply businesses are making very little profit. Keep in mind that the Domestic sector is the least profitable and look at the performance of ESB since the market was opened 6 years ago for Industrial/Commercial customers.

Cabaal

beertons wrote: »

I'll probably change myself, but can't help feeling that they (ESB) might do a job on them (BG), like eircom did to smart telecom. Repair faults slower, having power off for longer, and so on.

You clearly do not understand how Smart provided services, Smart Telecom is a LLU providers...they install their own kit in eircom exchanges to supply phone and Broadband...they used to be a reseller abit but in a very small scale.

Bord Gais are simply reselling the ESB service using ESB's equipment, they do not use any of their own equipment other then for billing.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Cabaal wrote: »

You clearly do not understand how Smart provided services, Smart Telecom is a LLU providers...they install their own kit in eircom exchanges to supply phone and Broadband...they used to be a reseller abit but in a very small scale.

Bord Gais are simply reselling the ESB service using ESB's equipment, they do not use any of their own equipment other then for billing.

They are "reselling" nothing. Bord Gais will generate the electricity (or buy any over and above what it can produce itself from other IPPs) and pay ESB to distribute the electricity to your home. Does the Carpet Manufacturer or Retailer "resell" you the delivery man who transports the carpet to their shop and then to your home?
Pernickedey I know but let's get it right.

Cabaal

Colby Stale Creek wrote: »

They are "reselling" nothing. Bord Gais will generate the electricity (or buy any over and above what it can produce itself from other IPPs) and pay ESB to distribute the electricity to your home. Does the Carpet Manufacturer or Retailer "resell" you the delivery man who transports the carpet to their shop and then to your home?
Pernickedey I know but let's get it right.

So you believe that Bord Gais one powere station which does not even start to operate till November 2009 and won't be 100% operational till April 2010 will supply 100% of power they require or that they won't buy power from ESB Networks which they will resell?

This new power station is being used to help them off-set the cheaper prices but this is all, this was clearly expalined by their spokes person yesterday.

Bord Gais are going to be reselling a percentage of power produced by ESB Networks and are using ESB's existing meters, wiring and infrastructure etc,

This is nothing like Smart who installed their own LLU kit and used their own backhaul to provide ADSL to its customers, they only had to use eircom for the "last mile" from the exchange to the customers house....Bord Gais have to use basically all of the ESB's existing infrastructure to supply power once its generated.

Bord Gais are no different to Airtricity in supplying power to people in Ireland. As Bord Gais are using ESB Networks existing infrastructure then any faults or technical issues pertaining to the supply of power are dealt with by ESB Networks.

ESB Networks don't give a crap who you pay your bill to unless its a billing issue thats stopping you getting power.

An equal comparison between the ESB and Bord Gais would be between Eircom Wholesale and UTV, UTV supply Broadband by reselling Eircom's bit-stream service...it uses all the exisiting kit at the exchange so UTV don't pay for new equipment so Broadband can be routed to one of its customers.

My point isn't that Bord Gais is crap or anything like that, I'm just covering they are not like Smart, I think if they can supply a cheaper service then thats fantastic for the average Joe on the street...I for one will likely switch to them

Joeyjay

wow, seems like a great way to save money - for a change.
my question is, I'm in credit with ESB for about 100-200 quid, should I wait to 'use that up' before switching, or will I get a refund if I switch now???

Is there a post somewhere about swithching from Eircom????

kleefarr

Joeyjay wrote: »

wow, seems like a great way to save money - for a change.
my question is, I'm in credit with ESB for about 100-200 quid, should I wait to 'use that up' before switching, or will I get a refund if I switch now???

Is there a post somewhere about swithching from Eircom????

I would switch now. Either way it would be better. I doubt if they would refund you though so the 200 would get you more electricity.

mfox

Vegeta wrote: »

Anyone know of any T&C for this, minimum contracts, switching costs?

I have just tried to switch electricity from ESB to Bord Gais and they are trying to charge me a €200 deposit for the privilage of switching suppliers (€100 because I am a tenant and not already a Bord Gais Customer and €100 if I dont choose to pay by direct debit). Based on my current bill I would save about €100 in my first year by switching my bill, however if I pay this €200 deposit I will loose €100. Even if I choose to set up a direct debit there is no benifit to be made.

This is complete false advertising to say that you will save 10%, when you have to pay at least 10% for the privilage of becoming thier customer. I live in Donegal and this completly discriminates against me because we dont have piped gas in this county therefore it would have been completely impossible for me to have been previously a Bord Gais Customer.

Their website also fails to let you know about the switching deposit untill you are half way through the online switiching process. There is also no information relating to how you get this deposit back if you choose to switch again in the future.

whiskeyman

kleefarr wrote: »

I would switch now. Either way it would be better. I doubt if they would refund you though so the 200 would get you more electricity.

why do you doubt the refund?

Switch now, and if your final bill is in debit, you owe them.... if it's in credit, they owe you and a refund will be issued.

Cabaal

mfox wrote: »

I have just tried to switch electricity from ESB to Bord Gais and they are trying to charge me a €200 deposit for the privilage of switching suppliers (€100 because I am a tenant and not already a Bord Gais Customer and €100 if I dont choose to pay by direct debit). Based on my current bill I would save about €100 in my first year by switching my bill, however if I pay this €200 deposit I will loose €100. Even if I choose to set up a direct debit there is no benifit to be made.

This is complete false advertising to say that you will save 10%, when you have to pay at least 10% for the privilage of becoming thier customer. I live in Donegal and this completly discriminates against me because we dont have piped gas in this county therefore it would have been completely impossible for me to have been previously a Bord Gais Customer.

Their website also fails to let you know about the switching deposit untill you are half way through the online switiching process. There is also no information relating to how you get this deposit back if you choose to switch again in the future.

How is it a con?, the ESB do the EXACT SAME thing for new accounts
(if your not a home owner and are not in the property for over 14 months)
- Pay them a deposit
or
- Don't pay a deposit but pay by direct debit

If Bord Gais still want a deposit of some sort even if you pay by DD thats upto them...I'm sure in these hard times alot of people don't always pay bills and thats a risk Bord Gais take so they want to cover themselfs.

The T&C's service cover the security deposit

7. Security

If we decide it is required at any time, you must provide us with security cover (the form of this to be decided by us). This is for the payment of any monies which become due by you under the Contract. Any security cover provided to us which is in the form of a cash deposit will be repaid to you when you close your account provided all sums due have been paid or within a certain period provided you have satisfied our payment terms on a continuous basis.

You should have read them first before beginning sign-up...this is good practice with any contracted service, if you don't do this when you signup for mobile phones, broadband, loans, landlines etc you are nuts imho

They are not discriminating against you just because you can't get gas, thats like saying Eircom do call bundles with Broadband and phone and you can't get Broadband so you can't make the same saving....discrimination!!! :rolleyes:
Stop kidding yourself

If you don't read T&C's before signing up and understand basic reasons why companys sometimes request security deposits then thats not Bord Gais fault and neither is it false advertising as Bord Gais outline the charge and ways to not have to pay the charge very clearly.....which you appear to have missed.

If you still feel so strongly about Bord Gais and its apparent "false advertising" then bring it up with the asai.ie.....they'll likely laugh though

whiskeyman

mfox wrote: »

Based on my current bill I would save about €100 in my first year by switching my bill, however if I pay this €200 deposit I will loose €100. Even if I choose to set up a direct debit there is no benifit to be made.

I don't understand the reasoning on why you will 'lose' your deposit? Have you contacted to clarify this or are you just assuming it?

mfox wrote: »

I live in Donegal and this completly discriminates against me because we dont have piped gas in this county therefore it would have been completely impossible for me to have been previously a Bord Gais Customer.

It's not really discrimination. It's a loyalty scheme. If the service wasn't available in the area, that's company policy, and their well within their right to exercise it.

kleefarr

whiskeyman wrote: »

why do you doubt the refund?

Switch now, and if your final bill is in debit, you owe them.... if it's in credit, they owe you and a refund will be issued.

:rolleyes: Silly me I forgot that he was changing to Bord Gais from ESB and not the other way round. I'm full of the flu.

As he was leaving ESB he would intitled to a refund of course. Hope he would get it no problem. A quick phone call would probably find something out.

Saint_Mel

Switched today, about 5 minutes on the phone and it was all done and dusted.

whiskeyman

Any chance we can have Airtricity added to this poll too?
I know BGE and getting all the coverage, but Airtricity are nearly as cheaper (possibly cheaper in long run after 1st year?) and some people might prefer supporting renewable energy.

mfox

Cabaal wrote: »

How is it a con?, the ESB do the EXACT SAME thing for new accounts
(if your not a home owner and are not in the property for over 14 months)
- Pay them a deposit
or
- Don't pay a deposit but pay by direct debit

If Bord Gais still want a deposit of some sort even if you pay by DD thats upto them...I'm sure in these hard times alot of people don't always pay bills and thats a risk Bord Gais take so they want to cover themselfs.

The T&C's service cover the security deposit



You should have read them first before beginning sign-up...this is good practice with any contracted service, if you don't do this when you signup for mobile phones, broadband, loans, landlines etc you are nuts imho

They are not discriminating against you just because you can't get gas, thats like saying your with the ESB and they have you on a rural plan so you pay more then a Urban plan....discrimination!! :rolleyes:

If you don't read T&C's before signing up and understand basic reasons why companys sometimes request security deposits then thats not Bord Gais fault and neither is it false advertising as Bord Gais outline the charge and ways to not have to pay the charge very clearly.....which you appear to have missed.

If you still feel so strongly about Bord Gais and its apparent "false advertising" then bring it up with the asai.ie.....they'll likely laugh though

Thanks for your reply.

First of all we did not have to pay a deposit to ESB when setting up a new account this is not true. Also in the case of Bord Gais you stilll pay a €100 deposit even if you choose direct debit, you cant avoid this payment.

Also I made it clear from my previous posts that I have not yet signed up. I phoned them first before going online and it is the fact that I read the terms and conditions that I got clarification on this point and decided not to go through with the switch.

In terms of your point about discrimination, that is true that the ESB charge different rates too. However only a certain percentage of the population have had the opportunity to be a Bord Gais customer before.

In relation to the false advertising yes you are correct in that the deposit is mentioned in the terms and conditions however thier advertising in relation to the 10% saving and the examples of the annual saving you can make do not state that this excludes the cost of the deposit or that the terms and conditions apply.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Joeyjay wrote: »

my question is, I'm in credit with ESB for about 100-200 quid, should I wait to 'use that up' before switching, or will I get a refund if I switch now???

You'll get a Final or "Closing Account" from ESB Customer Supply. If it is in Credit there is absolutely no problem in getting a cheque refund. Indeed if they take more than 10 days after the request to issue the refund they'll give you €35 under their Customer Charter.

Cabaal

mfox wrote: »

Thanks for your reply.

First of all we did not have to pay a deposit to ESB when setting up a new account this is not true.

Really?
The ESB.ie website and my recent signup as a new account with the ESB must be completely wrong and a mistake of the ESB signup process

ESB.ie states:

New customers are required to pay their account by Direct Debit.
Remember, if you do not choose Direct Debit, a €300 deposit
must be paid within 10 working days of moving into your new
home. A letter will be issued with payment options.

You sure you don';t have to pay the ESB a security deposit if you don't pay by DD?
The fact that Bord Gais want an extra 100e if you pay by DD is upto them...not as good a deal as the ESB have deposit wise

Also in the case of Bord Gais you stilll pay a €100 deposit even if you choose direct debit, you cant avoid this payment.

and?
Bord Gais can do this if they wish, taking on customers who potentially won't pay bills is a risky business.

Also I made it clear from my previous posts that I have not yet signed up. I phoned them first before going online and it is the fact that I read the terms and conditions that I got clarification on this point and decided not to go through with the switch.

Just complained that you are not told about any charge before you goto signup, for the 2min it takes you to get to the signup page that gives info about the charge and the fact its outlined in T&C's I hardly see this as a big issue...but continue complaining about something that won't change if you must...

.its worth noting that the ESB.ie new customer signup is the exact same when it comes to giving info on any security deposit...after you've filled out two other pages

In terms of your point about discrimination, that is true that the ESB charge different rates too. However only a certain percentage of the population have had the opportunity to be a Bord Gais customer before.

You realise alot of the country is not covered by Bord Gais for piped gas, its generally bigger towns and citys....its still not discrimination. Its simply an offer exisiting customers can take up

In relation to the false advertising yes you are correct in that the deposit is mentioned in the terms and conditions however thier advertising in relation to the 10% saving and the examples of the annual saving you can make do not state that this excludes the cost of the deposit or that the terms and conditions apply.

and?
Its still not false advertising
It upto you to work out if its going to save you money before signing up

bogman

Already switched

philcsl

Just Switched online myself, took 5 mins, 14% discount on my ESB is around €170 per year, no brainer as far as I can see!

EKRIUQ

I've switched 2 accounts today and with the 10 % should save about €600 over the year. I read all the Bord Gais website and the thread here and it seems like a no brainer and it's done in 2 minutes on the website plus Bord Gais have a good record of billing.