The Leinster Championship is dead.

Scoundrel · 23-11-2020 11:35pm

DulchieLaois wrote: »

I think the best solution is to boycott Re Leinster championship and the GAA will take notice

I agree the time has come.

RoyalCelt · 23-11-2020 11:37pm

EICVD wrote: »

& Westmeath have taken Kildares mantle as being the biggest whingers

First it was kildare, then meath, then mayo, then kerry and now Westmeath? It's almost like there's a pattern emerging about some legitimate concerns.

jmayo · 23-11-2020 11:46pm

Username Exists. wrote: »

Sportsjoe :pac::pac::pac:

Again underage development funding being used in an adult football discussion.

As if work done in development squads for u14/u16 never makes any difference a few years down the road when players turn minor and u20/u21 and then senior.

Username Exists. wrote: »

Not tiny but they would be less that Mayo etc.
Maybe the tiny fugure you seen in the article below is for match expenses which is not travel expenses.

It must be great for the country lads to wrack up big mileage expenses payouts when the Dubs get paid nothing for sitting on the M50 going nowhere.

Yeah because they just love spending their evenings and nights traveling up and down the country. :rolleyes:
Shure fook me pink why would they want to be at home especially if they have young family or they are just married.

I heard one of the Brogans on radio one night on about the dedication and how it was hard on the family him getting home at 10pm from some training sessions.
When he uttered that I thought how the fook would he like it if he was like Tom Parsons or Chris Barrett who were getting home at 1am after training sessions.
But the gimp interviewing him is typical of the ones on the likes of Newstalk or RTE who can never ask the hard questions.

Yesterday on Radio 1 they had some Dublin one on and she was on how great it was to watch how clinical and hard working Dublin were on Saturday.
Not one mention from anyone of the fact it was a totally one side borefest for a neutral because there was zero competition.
There was more competition between the Dublin players for places than between them and the opposition.

Cavan and Tipperary saved the weekend and maybe even the season for most football fans and made it memorable.

The stats speak for themselves.
The last 10 Leinsters, 15 out of 16 Leinsters.
5 All Irelands in a row.
7 out of the last 9 All Irelands.

Not a lot is ever made of this, but just look at the competition within Dublin senior championship.
Now they have not won that many All Ireland clubs, but it isn't like other counties with one club dominating (e.g Cross in Armagh, Corofin in Galway, etc) they have had Ballyboden, Ballymun, Vincents, Kilmacud all in the final with 4 wins between them.
Since 2003 (16 years) Dublin teams have won the Leinster Club championship 11 times.

From 1970 to 2002 (32 years) Dublin won 11 Leinster club championships.

So please stop this shyte that nothing different or anyway unique has happened within the last 15 odd years.
With the shyte you guys are spinning you look like you are after a job with Rudy Guiliani.

Uncle Pierre · 24-11-2020 12:25am

Deleted User wrote: »

It depends on the source. As in your case, if someone wrote "292 cases" on a piece of paper, then took a photo of it and tweeted it, then yes, I would say it is worthless.

There's a world of difference between a press release from an official body and a tweet of a photo of a piece of paper with some words and numbers on it. But, you know this.

I'm not going to nit-pick with you any more over the figures quoted above. I've already explained more than once that I was simply responding to somebody else's request for figures in the first place.

You seem to doubt the accuracy of these figures based on little other than how the letter writer took a photo of his letter and tweeted it. I, on the other hand, would be sure the writer properly looked up these figures first and satisfied himself of their validity in the first place, before including them in a letter intended for such public and widespread consideration. I doubt very much that he just made them up.

Similar figures are available in a myriad of other places online. I also doubt that they're all just made up too.

Looking at the bigger picture, I've set out my stall in a rational and reasoned manner a few posts up. If you can do the same from the opposite side of the fence, then please do.

Fann Linn · 24-11-2020 12:34am

DulchieLaois wrote: »

I think the best solution is to boycott Re Leinster championship and the GAA will take notice

Or maybe get your county rep to bring the games out of Croker. After all its such a great advantage to Dublin and yet ye keep voting to play your games there.
I think it was O Rourke that said it the other day, 'they we're beaten before the ball was even thrown in' in relation to Meath.

Rolo2010 · 24-11-2020 12:37am

I honestly don't think this dominance will stop. The population growth in Dublin will continue. The population is projected to grow to 1.7 million. The growth of GAA in Dublin is great but I can't see how it is sustainable for the rest of the country. It's a damning indictment of sucessive governments. They've completely forgetten about the rest of the country.

GalwayMark · 24-11-2020 12:50am

Rolo2010 wrote: »

I honestly don't think this dominance will stop. The population growth in Dublin will continue. The population is projected to grow to 1.7 million. The growth of GAA in Dublin is great but I can't see how it is sustainable for the rest of the country. It's a damning indictment of sucessive governments. They've completely forgetten about the rest of the country.

Dubs dominance is simply a microcosm of what governments have done and that’s creating a monster which is out of control in all areas regardless of the harm caused most notably concentrating 50% of all economic activity which is ludicrous even for a small island.

EICVD · 24-11-2020 12:55am

RoyalCelt wrote: »

First it was kildare, then meath, then mayo, then kerry and now Westmeath? It's almost like there's a pattern emerging about some legitimate concerns.

No Kildare were always the top of that list until the last few days.

EICVD · 24-11-2020 12:57am

DulchieLaois wrote: »

I think the best solution is to boycott Re Leinster championship and the GAA will take notice

How childish. We don’t wanna play because your better than us....

Rolo2010 · 24-11-2020 1:01am

GalwayMark wrote: »

Dubs dominance is simply a microcosm of what governments have done and that’s creating a monster which is out of control in all areas regardless of the harm caused most notably concentrating 50% of all economic activity which is ludicrous even for a small island.

Yeah. And anyone from rural counties who questions it is told to sit down and stop complaining. Anyway, a conversation for a different forum.

ExMachina1000 · 24-11-2020 1:05am

This recent string of Dublin football teams are the best ever by a long way.

Like a team of professionals in a world of amateur sport.

Great for them but bad for leinster football. An all leinster team vs Dublin would end in a handy Dublin win.

Do I care? Not really because I prefer hurling.
Frustrating for football fans though

Dyr · 24-11-2020 1:52am

jmayo wrote: »

The stats speak for themselves.
The last 10 Leinsters, 15 out of 16 Leinsters.
5 All Irelands in a row.
7 out of the last 9 All Irelands.

Never seen anything like that in the GAA alright

11 out of 15 All Irelands
16 out of 18 Leinsters
4 All Irelands in a row

But that wasnt Dublin so the world didnt end and the sky didnt fall

highgiant1985 · 24-11-2020 2:00am

Scoundrel wrote: »

No county has a divine right to be strong so why is it ok for the GAA to fix it for Dublin to be strong?

I never said it was ok for the GAA to fix it for Dublin to be strong so please don't put words in my mouth. I specially called out that the Dublin dominance was killing the game and I agreed that something needs to be done for the good of the game.

That doesn't take away from my view that a competitive Dublin team is good for the competition (considering the large following and interest they bring) and that what ever is done shouldn't be at a cost of stopping kids of all ages from being able to play. Be they based in Dublin or where ever its important that the opportunity is there for kids of all ages to be involved.

24-11-2020 2:24am

highgiant1985 wrote: »

I never said it was ok for the GAA to fix it for Dublin to be strong so please don't put words in my mouth. I specially called out that the Dublin dominance was killing the game and I agreed that something needs to be done for the good of the game. They're not exclusive points, unfortunately one leads to the demise of the spectacle. At this point if its about participation levels than the administrative area needs to be broken up.

That doesn't take away from my view that a competitive Dublin team is good for the competition (considering the large following and interest they bring) and that what ever is done shouldn't be at a cost of stopping kids of all ages from being able to play. Be they based in Dublin or where ever its important that the opportunity is there for kids of all ages to be involved.

Theres a bit of a difference between giving kids a chance to play the game through increased participation and how large numbers corresponds into the top level, the ones people enjoy as hobbies, being decimated.

And I dont disagree with you by the way, I wouldn't rather see the game neglected in Dublin to avoid a surge, but in terms of county it's too big and it should be divided into at least two areas to dimish those top level disadvantages while the kids also get to play through increased participation levels.

Dont worry anyway, the country boys still dont see the woods for the trees, another 10 years of uncompetitive LFC and AI's, the money boys will start to come around.

The only thing that will stop Dublin being split now will be a collapse in talent, and rise of other counties.
If the current trend continues the other 31 will just take the power and split them up.
But we're a bit away from that.

RoyalCelt · 24-11-2020 5:53am

Bambi wrote: »

Never seen anything like that in the GAA alright

11 out of 15 All Irelands
16 out of 18 Leinsters
4 All Irelands in a row

But that wasnt Dublin so the world didnt end and the sky didnt fall

If killkeny had 1/3rd of the countries population, 20 times the funding of others along with many other benefits like not having to spend money upgrading their stadium and huge sponsorships I'm sure they'd be dominating even more then dublin are now.

Hurling took a while to recover after their dominance and Offally still hasn't. What dublin has done to leinster is now beyond repair and won't organically heal itself like the hurling did.

24-11-2020 10:46am

corny wrote: »

There's no equivalence though, unless Meath and Kildare have huge non playing GAA centres i'm unaware of. I'm sure they can get some more kids playing but there's no Castleknock or a huge Southside club in waiting.

The development money was used to get children playing GAA in Dublin. [...]

The standard pushed by the Dublin club scene now and then on into a well funded county team virtually assures Dublin a good team. They have a huge pool to choose from. As someone remarked, a player drops his standard even 1% and his place is taken by a quality player eager to make a mark. From their starting point (now) that is difficult with a capital D for Meath and Kildare to compete with. Development money or these templates you're talking about won't make a difference.

Kayroo (sorry Kayroo) is a champion because he takes the moderate line as a Dub.:rolleyes: That doesn't make him right.

No, being moderate doesn't make me right. Nor does it make me wrong.

Your entire post was an argument for ceasing most or all of the funding to Dublin from the GAA. Keeping the money tap on at a time when we are drowning in money makes no sense. It bakes in an advantage that Dublin do not need.

In your entire post you do not actually defend the funding Dublin get. You just remark about how great the Dublin system is now (as a result of the funding, which is brilliant and shows it worked).

So answer me this. Why should we KEEP getting disproportionate funding? Where is the existential threat to GAA now? Is it in Dalkey or is it in Athlone/Carrick-on-Shannon/Carlingford? The threat is to clubs and particularly county teams who no longer see the point. The County game pays for a huge amount of the GAA, it has to remain healthy to keep the association thriving and right now Dublin are choking it to death.

24-11-2020 10:52am

corny wrote: »

From their starting point (now) that is difficult with a capital D for Meath and Kildare to compete with. Development money or these templates you're talking about won't make a difference.

This argument is also, on its face, utter nonsense.

We know development money and coaching structures work because they have always worked whenever they've been deployed. And the best example of that by MILES is Dublin.

Increase the number of full time coaches and games development officers and what happens? You increase the level of coaching and game development. What a shocker.

Tombo2001 · 24-11-2020 11:05am

GalwayMark wrote: »

Dubs dominance is simply a microcosm of what governments have done and that’s creating a monster which is out of control in all areas regardless of the harm caused most notably concentrating 50% of all economic activity which is ludicrous even for a small island.

This is why the discussion falls down.

Because 'Dublin doing well' is always equated to "The Dubs are trying to do country people out of it".

This bull**** notion that companies are somehow told where to locate. That Facebook would come into Ireland, and they look at Dublin with its 1 million people and they look at Tuam with its 8000 people, and they say "hmmm...I cant decide where to put the office, its hard to say where would be be best....where do you think Irish government".

Come on......

To get back to the gaa.

Its a fact that the vast majority of money that has gone into Dublin gaa has actually gone to Kids. That is a fact.

And it is also a fact that the same amount proportionately is invested in a child in Mullingar as invested in a child in Ballyfermot.

If you think thats unfair......well I'd like to know why.

Personally, to be honest - to only way for me to resolve this is lesser importance on the county championship and more importance on the club championship.

No Dublin player will want to play for North Dublin against South Dublin in an all- Ireland. But they do want to play for Ballyboden against Ballymun.

I dont see any way to resolve the ridiculous situation in Leinster without taking Dublin out of the championship altogether, and giving Dublin a bye to the Super 8s, or whatever that structure is.

LuasSimon · 24-11-2020 11:14am

In the 70s and 80s GAA in Dublin was played in pockets of Dublin largely though traditional GAA families and a share of country people.
Now its everywhere in Dublin across all demographics and areas , Ballymun , Templeogue , Clontarf, even Terenure College field GAA teams . The GAA investment has been a runaway success but its created a monster that cant be beaten its so good. Even ladies football is going that way and Dublin mens team are in under 20 football final as well.
Its like a London Soccer team playing Devon or Cornwall.

PS The GAA should concentrate their monies on other large centres now particulary Belfast, Drogheda & Sligo.

24-11-2020 11:20am

Tombo2001 wrote: »

And it is also a fact that the same amount proportionately is invested in a child in Mullingar as invested in a child in Ballyfermot.

If you think thats unfair......well I'd like to know why.

Pretty sure this isn't true...

In 2015 (can't find more recent numbers) there were 39,197 registered players in Dublin of all ages.

Investment per player in Dublin was €274.70 per player. In Fermanagh, the 2nd highest per player figure in the country, it was €68.17.

Your entire premise for this is just nonsense. Dublin get WAY more per player in investment than any other county.

Dyr · 24-11-2020 11:24am

RoyalCelt wrote: »

If killkeny had 1/3rd of the countries population, 20 times the funding of others along with many other benefits like not having to spend money upgrading their stadium and huge sponsorships I'm sure they'd be dominating even more then dublin are now.

Hurling took a while to recover after their dominance and Offally still hasn't. What dublin has done to leinster is now beyond repair and won't organically heal itself like the hurling did.

Dublins dominence is unprecedented. but it was different when Kilkenny was doing it. Get off the stage

Don't worry, this great Dublin team will fade just like that great Kilkenny team did. When they do , Leinster will still be full of no hoper countys in hurling and football and you'll stop pretending that you could give a sh**t about them once Meath arent being bet out the gate in Leinster finals.

gourcuff · 24-11-2020 11:36am

Bambi wrote: »

Dublins dominence is unprecedented. but it was different when Kilkenny was doing it. Get off the stage

Don't worry, this great Dublin team will fade just like that great Kilkenny team did. When they do , Leinster will still be full of no hoper countys in hurling and football and you'll stop pretending that you could give a sh**t about them once Meath arent being bet out the gate in Leinster finals.

hasn't the kilkenny argument been thoroughly dismissed numerous times?

the level of sponsorship income, the huge disproportionate funding per registered player from the GAA, the million extra people, the huge net migration of irish people to dublin, croke park provided to them (mayo stadium development putting it into huge debt), playing every game at home, the list is endless - did kilkenny have all those advantages over their competitors?

AIG is the main partner of Dublin GAA who already boast 12 additional sponsors including:

O'Neills – official kit partner

Lifestyle Sports – official clothing partner

Ballygowan – official hydration partner

Energise Sport – part of the official hydration partnership

Aer Lingus – official airline partner

Linwoods – official health food provider

Skins – official performance baselayer product

The Gibson Hotel – official sleeping partner

ROS Nutrition – official supplement supplier

Jack & Jones - official menswear provider

Gourmet Food Parlour – restaurant provider

Subaru – official car partner

By comparison, Leitrim, have a deal with Bush Hotels that was believed to be worth around €20,000.

Dyr · 24-11-2020 11:46am

LuasSimon wrote: »

In the 70s and 80s GAA in Dublin was played in pockets of Dublin largely though traditional GAA families and a share of country people.
Now its everywhere in Dublin across all demographics and areas , Ballymun , Templeogue , Clontarf, even Terenure College field GAA teams . The GAA investment has been a runaway success but its created a monster that cant be beaten its so good. Even ladies football is going that way and Dublin mens team are in under 20 football final as well.
Its like a London Soccer team playing Devon or Cornwall.

PS The GAA should concentrate their monies on other large centres now particulary Belfast, Drogheda & Sligo.

Ballymuns had a GAA team since the 60s or the 1890s if you count Kickhams as a Ballymun team back then, Clontarf since the 60s, Templogue (Now TSS) founded in the 60s or 70s. Whats interesting is theres swathes of "New Dublin" without GAA clubs while some traditional GAA areas have aging populations and no space for pitches so room for improvement in uptake

bennyl10 · 24-11-2020 11:52am

Bambi wrote: »

Never seen anything like that in the GAA alright

11 out of 15 All Irelands
16 out of 18 Leinsters
4 All Irelands in a row

But that wasnt Dublin so the world didnt end and the sky didnt fall

No other country has ever been lumped with so much central funding it would be difficult for them not to win

It’s systematic financial doping.

jmayo · 24-11-2020 12:11pm

Bambi wrote: »

Never seen anything like that in the GAA alright

11 out of 15 All Irelands
16 out of 18 Leinsters
4 All Irelands in a row

But that wasnt Dublin so the world didnt end and the sky didnt fall

Ah yes Whatboutery 101 = Kilkenny.
Whataboutery 102 = kerry

But for Munster hurling in those years hurling interest would have died.
As it is hurling in Leinster was severily affected by Kilkenny and Galway had to be introduced to give some semblance of competition.

BTW here are Kerry's sponsors.

Kerry Group
O'Neills
Kerry Eye - local paper
The Kerryman - local paper
ivertec Broadband - local broadband
The Breton - hotel in Killarney
Meadownlands - hotel in Tralee
The Rose Hotel - hotel in Tralee
Horans Healthstores - Munster based health stores
Rypt - Gym software company
Atlantic Oil - local oil company
Geaney oils - local oil company
Kerry Pretroleum - local oil company
Credit Union

And here are Mayo's
Intersport Elverys - sports shops
Smyths Toys - academy sponsors
O'Neills
Connacht Gold - primarily Connacht based Aurivo Co-Op creamery
Homeland Retail - agri retail linked to Aurivo
Egan Jewellers - Castlebar
Travellers Friend Hotel - Castlebar

No Airlines, no car companies.
No international drinks companies.
But they can get a deal on butter and wellies.

Did you smash it · 24-11-2020 12:15pm

Really feel the Dubs here are beginning to see that their advantages are unfair. I think they are ready to crack any minute now after so many years of deadlock.

corny · 24-11-2020 12:30pm

Deleted User wrote: »

No, being moderate doesn't make me right. Nor does it make me wrong.

Your entire post was an argument for ceasing most or all of the funding to Dublin from the GAA. Keeping the money tap on at a time when we are drowning in money makes no sense. It bakes in an advantage that Dublin do not need.

In your entire post you do not actually defend the funding Dublin get. You just remark about how great the Dublin system is now (as a result of the funding, which is brilliant and shows it worked).

So answer me this. Why should we KEEP getting disproportionate funding? Where is the existential threat to GAA now? Is it in Dalkey or is it in Athlone/Carrick-on-Shannon/Carlingford? The threat is to clubs and particularly county teams who no longer see the point. The County game pays for a huge amount of the GAA, it has to remain healthy to keep the association thriving and right now Dublin are choking it to death.

You need to read the thread again. I'm not going to go in circles here. My first post to Dobman remarked that the point of this thread is not the redistribution of the development money...its reinvigorating the Leinster Championship. My opinion is that the talk of development money is irrelevant. Do you what you like with it. Won't make a blind bit of difference to the inter county game now. Dublin are too strong and the effect the money would have elsewhere wouldn't be the same. I've explained this.

If you want to talk about solutions that will make Leinster competitive again (split Dublin up/amalgamate counties, equalise inter county spends, removing Dublin from Leinster etc) i'm all ears.

Dyr · 24-11-2020 12:39pm

jmayo wrote: »

Ah yes Whatboutery 101 = Kilkenny.
Whataboutery 102 = kerry

But for Munster hurling in those years hurling interest would have died.
As it is hurling in Leinster was severily affected by Kilkenny and Galway had to be introduced to give some semblance of competition.

BTW here are Kerry's sponsors.

Kerry Group
O'Neills
Kerry Eye - local paper
The Kerryman - local paper
ivertec Broadband - local broadband
The Breton - hotel in Killarney
Meadownlands - hotel in Tralee
The Rose Hotel - hotel in Tralee
Horans Healthstores - Munster based health stores
Rypt - Gym software company
Atlantic Oil - local oil company
Geaney oils - local oil company
Kerry Pretroleum - local oil company
Credit Union

Kerry Group a major international business with 7 billion in revenue, thats some level of yerra to give it the beal bocht.

dobman88 · 24-11-2020 12:45pm

jmayo wrote: »

Ah yes Whatboutery 101 = Kilkenny.
Whataboutery 102 = kerry

But for Munster hurling in those years hurling interest would have died.
As it is hurling in Leinster was severily affected by Kilkenny and Galway had to be introduced to give some semblance of competition.

BTW here are Kerry's sponsors.

Kerry Group
O'Neills
Kerry Eye - local paper
The Kerryman - local paper
ivertec Broadband - local broadband
The Breton - hotel in Killarney
Meadownlands - hotel in Tralee
The Rose Hotel - hotel in Tralee
Horans Healthstores - Munster based health stores
Rypt - Gym software company
Atlantic Oil - local oil company
Geaney oils - local oil company
Kerry Pretroleum - local oil company
Credit Union

And here are Mayo's
Intersport Elverys - sports shops
Smyths Toys - academy sponsors
O'Neills
Connacht Gold - primarily Connacht based Aurivo Co-Op creamery
Homeland Retail - agri retail linked to Aurivo
Egan Jewellers - Castlebar
Travellers Friend Hotel - Castlebar

No Airlines, no car companies.
No international drinks companies.
But they can get a deal on butter and wellies.

Kerry group have given absolute fortunes to Kerry over the years and still do. I wouldnt exactly call it a small local business either.

And a lot of Kerry lads get cars from local dealers, Audi, Hyundai, Toyota, youd see them all with the branding on the side. One that's local to me that I know of is Reens Rathmore who are a Peugeot dealership have sponsored Paul Murphy for the last few years.

I'd assume some Mayo lads have car deals as do the Dubs and other top sides. It comes with being a county player.

But my main point was about Kerry group. Nothing small about em, they're a major international company

Rosita · 24-11-2020 12:45pm

RoyalCelt wrote: »

Hurling took a while to recover after their dominance and Offally still hasn't. .

The fact that Offaly cannot beat Kerry, Antrim or Down at hurling has nothing to with anyone's "dominance". That was determined by matters inside the county. The blaming of counties for the failure of others makes no sense.

The Leinster Championship is dead.

Comments