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Households To Produce Receipts For Waste Or Face Fines

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    #92
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Graces7 wrote: »
    Kassidy Delicious Dishcloth wrote: »
    No amount of waste saving is worth the torture that would be proper nappies, it will thankfully never happen. I still hear the older generations of my family talk about the absolute hardship of it to this day.

    What torture? hardship? With modern machines and driers? Even back then no hardship

    Other countries do it fine.

    Given the alternative is burying Ireland in a mass of non biodegradable filthy stinky nappies!

    Get up to date please...

    https://www.earthmother.ie/cloth-nappies.html
    All I can think is that they mustn’t have been taking the sh!t out of the nappy before putting it in the wash.

    We are seriously looking at cloth nappies when the sprig cometh.


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    #93
    Joshua J
    Registered Users Posts: 1,305 ✭✭✭Joshua J


    Businesses have to grow profit year on year and the easiest way to do this is screw the customer. This is not about fly tipping.


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    #94
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    dclifford wrote: »
    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    What if you don't dump anything and have no requirement for those services? Do you think its acceptable to punish people based on the assumption that it's impossible to do and they must be dumping illegally?

    If you can prove you dont need a waste service and don't dump anything, then yes, I am sure there could be exceptions made.
    I thought our legal system was based on the premise that one must prove guilt, not defend innocence?


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    #95
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kylith wrote: »
    All I can think is that they mustn’t have been taking the sh!t out of the nappy before putting it in the wash.

    We are seriously looking at cloth nappies when the sprig cometh.

    Why would you do that to yourself, nappies are disgusting enough having to look at other people changing them and throw them in the bin never mind having to wash them. It’s serious regression of society that this is being thought off, even my parents didn’t have to use cloth nappies they are so long forgotten.

    I hear much older relatives taking about them though and how disposable nappies were such a fantastic invention that would have made their lives far far easier. I honestly would reconsider having a child if disposable nappies were not an option, it’s already on the border line for me because of the amount of work, lack of sleep, less social life etc that it results in but something like having to wash nappies would be the last straw.


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    #96
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Kassidy Delicious Dishcloth wrote: »
    Why would you do that to yourself, nappies are disgusting enough having to look at other people changing them and throw them in the bin never mind having to wash them. It’s serious regression of society that this is being thought off, even my parents didn’t have to use cloth nappies they are so long forgotten.

    I hear much older relatives taking about them though and how disposable nappies were such a fantastic invention that would have made their lives far far easier. I honestly would reconsider having a child if disposable nappies were not an option, it’s already on the border line for me because of the amount of work, lack of sleep, less social life etc that it results in but something like having to wash nappies would be the last straw.

    But, but, but, we NEED more children to pay our pensions.


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    #97
    BattleCorp
    Registered Users Posts: 11,758 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Anyone see you pics of the beaches and the state they were left in.

    This country needs a kick up the whole when it comes to litter and waste.

    Some horrible selfish people out there who don’t give a **** about anything or anyone else.

    Having a bin at home won't stop ar5eholes from littering a beach.


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    #98
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Kassidy Delicious Dishcloth wrote: »
    kylith wrote: »
    All I can think is that they mustn’t have been taking the sh!t out of the nappy before putting it in the wash.

    We are seriously looking at cloth nappies when the sprog cometh.

    Why would you do that to yourself, nappies are disgusting enough having to look at other people changing them and throw them in the bin never mind having to wash them. It’s serious regression of society that this is being thought off, even my parents didn’t have to use cloth nappies they are so long forgotten.

    I hear much older relatives taking about them though and how disposable nappies were such a fantastic invention that would have made their lives far far easier. I honestly would reconsider having a child if disposable nappies were not an option, it’s already on the border line for me because of the amount of work, lack of sleep, less social life etc that it results in but something like having to wash nappies would be the last straw.
    Because it’s a fuk sight cheaper, better for the environment both in production and disposal and, hold on to your vom bucket, Nox, you can use them for more than one child!


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    #99
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    What if you don't dump anything and have no requirement for those services? Do you think its acceptable to punish people based on the assumption that it's impossible to do and they must be dumping illegally?
    A household with no requirement for a household waste service is an absolute exception.

    It's a reasonable assumption to make that if you have a house which is being lived in, then you have waste which needs to be disposed of.

    Therefore it is fair to require proof that it's being disposed of in a legal manner.

    There will be the odd exception, but they're few and far between and will be able to prove they have no need for waste collection.


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    #100
    talking_walnut
    Registered Users Posts: 725 ✭✭✭talking_walnut


    Kassidy Delicious Dishcloth wrote: »
    Why would you do that to yourself, nappies are disgusting enough having to look at other people changing them and throw them in the bin never mind having to wash them. It’s serious regression of society that this is being thought off, even my parents didn’t have to use cloth nappies they are so long forgotten.

    I hear much older relatives taking about them though and how disposable nappies were such a fantastic invention that would have made their lives far far easier. I honestly would reconsider having a child if disposable nappies were not an option, it’s already on the border line for me because of the amount of work, lack of sleep, less social life etc that it results in but something like having to wash nappies would be the last straw.

    If a sh1ty nappy is going to put you off having kids you might want to do a bit more research on just how gross they can be. I think you're also overestimating what a nappy will do for you. They ain't black holes!


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    #101
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    seamus wrote: »
    A household with no requirement for a household waste service is an absolute exception.

    It's a reasonable assumption to make that if you have a house which is being lived in, then you have waste which needs to be disposed of.

    Therefore it is fair to require proof that it's being disposed of in a legal manner.

    There will be the odd exception, but they're few and far between and will be able to prove they have no need for waste collection.


    They can't be that odd because I know several. Is it too much trouble to just catch the fellas out dumping? I have never heard of it being fair to prove that you're not doing something wrong. This is a complete reversal of the normal situation


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    #102
    TomOnBoard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,109 ✭✭✭TomOnBoard


    dclifford wrote: »
    If you can prove you dont need a waste service and don't dump anything, then yes, I am sure there could be exceptions made.

    So, I'd need to prove that I didn't do any illegal dumping, rather than the Council having to prove I did??

    That sound very like Guilty until proven Innocent to me..


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    #103
    fineso.mom
    Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭fineso.mom


    Graces7 wrote: »
    . Informally...every time I go to the mainland i take bags of jars and tins etc We have no bins or collections. And no tipping either.

    But the stuff that you cant take to the recycling banks -plastic wrapping,cartons,foil containers etc. I imagine you have little or no food waste but with the amount of packaging that comes with groceries even someone on their own generates waste. What hapoens to that stuff?


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    #104
    waffleman
    Registered Users Posts: 580 ✭✭✭waffleman


    Waste companies arent getting enough saps to sign up. A year ago in my area they promised prices wouldnt go up when they barcoded bins. Plenty didnt sign up because they knew it was bollox. Low and behold the bin weight at which extra charges kick in is comin down all the time now. They were doing this safe in the knowledge that these bylaws were in the post.

    Its one thing to say produce your receipts and you'll be grand but when you see waste companies lying through their teeth to get peoples details and then this comes in when they dont get enough suckers signed up its just a blatant rip off.


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    #105
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    They can't be that odd because I know several.
    Sure you do.
    Is it too much trouble to just catch the fellas out dumping?
    Well, yes. It's next to impossible to catch someone who throws black bags in their boot and lashes them out somewhere up the mountains. Or travellers who cruise around taking fifty quid to fill up the back of their van and dumping it into a quarry in the dead of night.

    If you have a foolproof or even effective way of catching fly-tippers, I'm sure everyone would love to hear it.
    I have never heard of it being fair to prove that you're not doing something wrong. This is a complete reversal of the normal situation
    There are a few examples to be fair. Ulimately it comes down to reasonable assumptions;

    - Households produce waste
    - At least some of this waste will be non-compostable and non-recyclable
    - Therefore households have a need to dispose of this waste
    - You are legally obliged to dispose of this waste in a legal manner
    - Therefore a household which does not use a legal waste facility is probably using an illegal one

    To be actually convicted of a crime you will have to be brought to court, whereby you can state your defence to the charge.

    The bulk of this activity will be much like the TV licence where fines will be issued and most people will pay them because they're in the wrong.


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    #106
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    fineso.mom wrote: »
    But the stuff that you cant take to the recycling banks -plastic wrapping,cartons,foil containers etc. I imagine you have little or no food waste but with the amount of packaging that comes with groceries even someone on their own generates waste. What hapoens to that stuff?

    Absolutely true. No matter how much we try we all have unrecyclable waste. We have very little - black bin only needs three empties a years and the green bin every three months - but we still have some waste. Biscuits wrappers, food packaging etc can't be recycled.


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    #107
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    seamus wrote: »
    Sure you do.

    Well, yes. It's next to impossible to catch someone who throws black bags in their boot and lashes them out somewhere up the mountains. Or travellers who cruise around taking fifty quid to fill up the back of their van and dumping it into a quarry in the dead of night.

    If you have a foolproof or even effective way of catching fly-tippers, I'm sure everyone would love to hear it.

    There are a few examples to be fair. Ulimately it comes down to reasonable assumptions;

    - Households produce waste
    - At least some of this waste will be non-compostable and non-recyclable
    - Therefore households have a need to dispose of this waste
    - You are legally obliged to dispose of this waste in a legal manner
    - Therefore a household which does not use a legal waste facility is probably using an illegal one

    To be actually convicted of a crime you will have to be brought to court, whereby you can state your defence to the charge.

    The bulk of this activity will be much like the TV licence where fines will be issued and most people will pay them because they're in the wrong.


    Is there actually any "big government reigning down on the pesky ordinary people" measure you don't agree with? You're always the first out to defend whatever new measure they are coming out with to make life more difficult/restrictive/awkward for everyone.


    Is it just that you don't like people in general and would rather be on this planet alone with a few computers and machines to provide you with your needs? I really don't understand your general contempt for those around you.



    There is no one saying you have to bring non-compostable waste into your house, so why should there be anyone forcing you to prove that you're paying to get rid of it?


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    #108
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    This is great news for the bin companies.
    A few years ago when they were trying to bring similar a sales rep from a bin company called to a elderly relative of mine. This guy is a man who lives alone and generated very little rubbish and bring his rubbish to local dump/landfill a few times a year. The sales rep told him if he didn't sign up to bin collection he'd be passing his name onto the department so he'd be prosecuted.

    You don't have to use a bin company. Your local authority civic amenity centre would suffice.


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    #109
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    Oliver Fast Thinner wrote: »
    Absolutely true. No matter how much we try we all have unrecyclable waste. We have very little - black bin only needs three empties a years and the green bin every three months - but we still have some waste. Biscuits wrappers, food packaging etc can't be recycled.


    You could meet the wrong inspector who determines that you're not emptying it frequently enough, then you're supposed to be the one to prove that those 3 bins are indeed the full amount of the waste you produce. How in the feck is anyone supposed to prove that?



    A daft system if there ever was one.


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    #110
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    Is there actually any "big government reigning down on the pesky ordinary people" measure you don't agree with? You're always the first out to defend whatever new measure they are coming out with to make life more difficult/restrictive/awkward for everyone.

    There is no one saying you have to bring non-compostable waste into your house, so why should there be anyone forcing you to prove that you're paying to get rid of it?

    But there will be someone demanding you prove you dispose of waste lawfully! Its not a big brother surveillance thing, its an attempt to clamp down on flytipping and/or backyard burning. The country is full of it.

    Its reasonable to assume a household generates some amount of waste, now matter how zealous a recycler/waste preventer you are. There's rarely evidence to detect those responsible for the flytipping unless we put CCTV everywhere., and who pays for it?
    This is a cheaper way of doing it.

    AFAIK the Council couldnt previously access waste companies customer databases - data protection etc. The new Data Protection Act clearly allows them to request such info in the public interest and prevent pollution.


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    #111
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,163 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Graces7 wrote: »
    We don't have bins and nor do many deep rural places. At the last place, we bought special bags and left them at set points on set days.

    Separate bags for separate things

    And used the bottle banks etc

    I am sure you get receipts for the bags. You can produce those if necessary.


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    #112
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Ubbquittious wrote: »
    You could meet the wrong inspector who determines that you're not emptying it frequently enough, then you're supposed to be the one to prove that those 3 bins are indeed the full amount of the waste you produce. How in the feck is anyone supposed to prove that?

    A daft system if there ever was one.

    I suspect if you have some engagement with some lawful waste disposal service, you'll be regarded as low priority


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    #113
    corks finest
    Registered Users Posts: 8,635 ✭✭✭corks finest


    What a crock of ****,why don't they put up covert cameras all over known dumping grounds catch, prosecute and name ,/ Shame the gougers


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    #114
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kylith wrote: »
    Because it’s a fuk sight cheaper, better for the environment both in production and disposal and, hold on to your vom bucket, Nox, you can use them for more than one child!

    If the cost of something as basic as nappies is even entering a persons head then they can’t afford to have kids imo.


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    #115
    BattleCorp
    Registered Users Posts: 11,758 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    There'll be a lot of "I put my rubbish in me Ma's/neighbours bin.

    How do you prove that under GDPR regulations?


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    #116
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,218 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    You don't have to use a bin company. Your local authority civic amenity centre would suffice.

    I know this but they lied to many people in the area just to manipulate them into signing up.


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    #117
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,218 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    I know a good few people who put their rubbish in their parents bin or the other way around.
    The easiest way around this to me would be continue to do this and visit the civic amenity site maybe once or twice a year and get a receipt and say this is all the rubbish you produced in the year.


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    #118
    _Dara_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,971 ✭✭✭_Dara_


    I’m really cheered by this thread. People really seem to be taking seriously the search for sustainable and biodegradable packaging. I feel like this is something that will catch on through people power.

    My sister is very into reducing waste and finding sustainable alternatives and her dedication is impressive.


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    #119
    _Dara_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,971 ✭✭✭_Dara_


    Kat1170 wrote: »
    So are you saying it was a success there, or are you saying if one pays we should all pay even if it is a total failure ??


    Anyone who thinks this is anything more than just another stealth tax needs their head examined. This won't stop the scumbags tossing their litter on the road side. Proper enforcement andlarge fines or jail terms are the only way. Make the polluter pay !!

    How is it a stealth tax if you are already paying for some form of rubbish disposal? Just provide receipts for whatever disposal service you are currently using.


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    #120
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,218 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    One of the best ways we found to reduce the amount of rubbish going out in our bins was to burn it in the fire!


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    #121
    Ubbquittious
    Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    _Dara_ wrote: »
    How is it a stealth tax if you are already paying for some form of rubbish disposal? Just provide receipts for whatever disposal service you are currently using.


    They are dragging people further onto the grid by shoveling them up with plastic waste they usually don't want and forcing them to prove they paid to get rid of it.



    Not really a tax but they're guaranteeing a source of income to all the waste companies they're friendly enough with to grant them a license. Kind of like what they did with the car insurance companies


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