Future and potential Star Wars films - news and speculation

Tony EH · 17-05-2019 10:17pm

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

My problem is that people are far too quick to scream 'toxic fandom'

Which, in itself, is a silly sound bite and not in any way constructive.

Drumpot · 17-05-2019 11:44pm

Tony EH wrote: »

The problem is not the "whingers", who are usually quite a small portion of the commentary. The problem is the people that hit the button on the clickbait gibberish looking to be offended or outraged.

Those clicks create a revenue stream and, subsequently, more clickbait articles and videos.

And the cycle begins again.

It also has the unfortunate knock on effect of drowning out legitimate criticism of a given item.

This is the only place I discuss most things online (sad I know!) so I can’t speak much for the clickbait stuff or twitter or most other mediums.

I shouldn’t of said whingers, it’s the same subjective criticism I accuse others of portraying as objective analysis, I guess I’m as fallible as everybody else.:o

Inviere · 19-05-2019 10:49am

Relikk wrote: »

Never. Awful movie, story-wise.

I adored it when I first seen it on release, and watched it again there for the first time since, and it blew me away once again. It's mad how divisive it is, for me, it's one of the best movies in the whole franchise.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 12:04pm

Just heard on a podcast that one of the head Lucas film people told a crowd at celebration that they are already working on the second season of Mandalorian.

Leads me to wonder. When is this streaming service coming here? Or is it at all?
It launches in the autumn in America and First season starts in November there.

This is probably going to be heavily bootlegged on torrents sites if they can’t sort it out. I can’t find any info of this service coming here at all?

Foxtrol · 19-05-2019 3:48pm

My problem with a lot of the complaints/outrage is that it tends to be completely devoid of being able to assess previous iterations with the ones that they now have issues with. There's a huge difference between not liking something now and claiming that it is a completely new thing to the franchise, when that's objectively not the case.

Taking TLJ for example, I've rarely enjoyed the comedy in the SW franchise, finding it extremely clunky and forced, so I was shocked when people started claiming that that sort comedy was something new to TLJ. Similarly in GoT, claims about character actions and plot devices where posters refuse to accept, that there are examples previously of similar.

There's world of difference between discussing not liking something and the reasons why (e.g. feeling rushed) and an alternative fact world where justifications are blinkered to it being present in previous iterations.

This is where D&D and Disney are in a terrible place at this point. It is clear a toxic element of the SW fanbase now have it out for Rian and it'll likely be similar for D&D with GoT fans and won't like be given the honeymoon period where certain things are overlooked.

Relikk · 19-05-2019 4:12pm

Inviere wrote: »

I adored it when I first seen it on release, and watched it again there for the first time since, and it blew me away once again. It's mad how divisive it is, for me, it's one of the best movies in the whole franchise.

I know that I can dislike a movie on first viewing, but I can also know that there's something in there that I can find some kind of interest in to come back to upon repeated viewings. The Big Lebowski being a prime example. I really didn't get it when I saw it at first, but I knew there was something about it that I missed. When I watched it again it clicked with me, but The Last Jedi will never be one of those movies. For me, it's right down with Attack of the Clones as the worst in the entire series, and I genuinely wince when I see people like you and johnny_ultimate say that they adore it, because the story has so many glaringly obvious faults that I find it dumbfounding that anyone with a sound, logical and critical mind could enjoy it, let alone have adoration for it.

buser2x · 19-05-2019 4:29pm

even with the new movie still to be released , i'm sure Disney has something else brewing

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 4:31pm

Relikk wrote: »

I know that I can dislike a movie on first viewing, but I can also know that there's something in there that I can find some kind of interest in to come back to upon repeated viewings. The Big Lebowski being a prime example. I really didn't get it when I saw it at first, but I knew there was something about it that I missed. When I watched it again it clicked with me, but The Last Jedi will never be one of those movies. For me, it's right down with Attack of the Clones as the worst in the entire series, and I genuinely wince when I see people like you and johnny_ultimate say that they adore it, because the story has so many glaringly obvious faults that I find it dumbfounding that anyone with a sound, logical and critical mind could enjoy it, let alone have adoration for it.

It’s dumbfounding that someone enjoys something you don’t?
I can watch a West wing or deadwood all day and have mates that just don’t like it. I’m not wincing for their obvious loss of something I know is quality and that their missing out on. No skin off anyone’s nose. Same goes for Last Jedi. I don’t love all of it. It has problems. But when it’s fantstic it really is fantastic. I wouldn’t be letting anyone else’s enjoyment or lack of it bother me at all.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 4:34pm

buser2x wrote: »

even with the new movie still to be released , i'm sure Disney has something else brewing

Rumour is they’re announcing Johnson’s trilogy at the Disney conference next month.
Update or alternative to that rumour is, it’s being readied for release if them Avatar films tank. Which they well could.
Who knows but Johnson is definitely working away writing his ones

Relikk · 19-05-2019 4:36pm

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

It’s dumbfounding that someone enjoys something you don’t?

They can enjoy whatever they like.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 4:40pm

Relikk wrote: »

They can enjoy whatever they like.

Exactly. Don’t let it bother you. Wincing gives you wrinkles

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 4:42pm

Relikk wrote: »

They can enjoy whatever they like.

Exactly. Don’t let it bother you. Wincing gives you wrinkles

johnny_ultimate · 19-05-2019 5:04pm

As an aside, it’s the 20th anniversary of Episode 1 today

https://twitter.com/starwars/status/1130125971179343872?s=21

I think everything that can possibly be said about that film has been said. But as a kid there’d never been anything like the excitement of the build up to this - and was mesmerised by Darth Maul and the pod racing on that first viewing. Obviously its plethora of issues came into sharp focus as I got older, and I don’t need to go into any of that. But sitting in the cinema 20 years ago and that fanfare booting up was something I still fondly remember.

I’m really glad TLJ has reawakened that old childlike enthusiasm for SW for me (and thankfully held up to scrutiny), and hope others can say the same about one or more of the new batch of films. And definitely hope there’s some kids out there who, if nothing else, got a kick out of seeing the opening crawl on the big screen before a new adventure kicked off.

PS someone still needs to use Duel of the Fates in a better Star Wars film than TPM

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 5:10pm

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As an aside, it’s the 20th anniversary of Episode 1 today

https://twitter.com/starwars/status/1130125971179343872?s=21

I think everything that can possibly be said about that film has been said. But as a kid there’d never been anything like the excitement of the build up to this - and was mesmerised by Darth Maul and the pod racing on that first viewing. Obviously its plethora of issues came into sharp focus as I got older, and I don’t need to go into any of that. But sitting in the cinema 20 years ago and that fanfare booting up was something I still fondly remember.

I’m really glad TLJ has reawakened that old childlike enthusiasm for SW for me (and thankfully held up to scrutiny), and hope others can say the same about one or more of the new batch of films. And definitely hope there’s some kids out there who, if nothing else, got a kick out of seeing the opening crawl on the big screen before a new adventure kicked off.

PS someone still needs to use Duel of the Fates in a better Star Wars film than TPM

You could say one more thing. That poster is analogous of the entire prequels.
A brilliant idea. Executed poorly

Not to totally rag on them though. There’s flashes of the magic in each of them.

emo72 · 19-05-2019 5:46pm

cant believe its 20 years! i remember sitting in the cinema as the star wars theme blasted out and thinking im seeing something i thought i would never see. i remember ROTJ in harolds cross cinema. and the thought that they would do another trilogy was dead in the water.

Inviere · 19-05-2019 6:28pm

Relikk wrote: »

For me, it's right down with Attack of the Clones as the worst in the entire series, and I genuinely wince when I see people like you and johnny_ultimate say that they adore it, because the story has so many glaringly obvious faults that I find it dumbfounding that anyone with a sound, logical and critical mind could enjoy it, let alone have adoration for it.

It's mad because for me, AotC is probably the worst of the bunch (total cack) and I'd not put TLJ in the same sentence as it (thus me not being a rabid SW fan that'd enjoy anything & everything SW related). I loved the story of TLJ, it felt new, fresh, and broke away from the pseudo-reboot which was TFA (ANH in a new skin). Yes, it juxtaposed with TFA in terms of overarching plot, but for me, that was for the better. Anyway, it's all been said, and nobody wants to read it all again - I just find it crazy how divisive the film is among fans

pixelburp · 19-05-2019 6:40pm

Grew up with Star Wars being a VHS medium, or the occasional presence on Christmas TV (back before sky bought up every blockbuster), and while the Special Editions allowed me to see them on the big screen, the idea of a NEW Star Wars film just blew my 19 year old mind.

This is kind of the sorrow I feel for the franchise, particularly after the Disney acquisition: it's completely over saturated and exposed, there's no sense of scarcity or value to the franchise anymore with 50 billion films scheduled for the next 10 years. For all it's faults - and there were many - Episode 1 was a true "event" movie.

Relikk · 19-05-2019 7:02pm

Inviere wrote: »

It's mad because for me, AotC is probably the worst of the bunch (total cack) and I'd not put TLJ in the same sentence as it (thus me not being a rabid SW fan that'd enjoy anything & everything SW related). I loved the story of TLJ, it felt new, fresh, and broke away from the pseudo-reboot which was TFA (ANH in a new skin). Yes, it juxtaposed with TFA in terms of overarching plot, but for me, that was for the better. Anyway, it's all been said, and nobody wants to read it all again - I just find it crazy how divisive the film is among fans

I will admit to a minutely slim hope of my view on TLJ changing in the future, but that hinges solely on how Ep. IX carries on from it, makes it relevant and finishes the trilogy. Because, at the moment, it feels like TLJ is a nothing movie, mostly irrelevant and added next to nothing following on from The Force Awakens (which I really like). It might as well not exist because of what the characters accomplished, or rather didn't accomplish.

Anyway, I'm done. You like it, I hate it. Let's move on. :pac:

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 7:13pm

pixelburp wrote: »

Grew up with Star Wars being a VHS medium, or the occasional presence on Christmas TV (back before sky bought up every blockbuster), and while the Special Editions allowed me to see them on the big screen, the idea of a NEW Star Wars film just blew my 19 year old mind.

This is kind of the sorrow I feel for the franchise, particularly after the Disney acquisition: it's completely over saturated and exposed, there's no sense of scarcity or value to the franchise anymore with 50 billion films scheduled for the next 10 years. For all it's faults - and there were many - Episode 1 was a true "event" movie.

How is it oversaturated and exposed though? There isn’t a new film for about another four years. And it’s a totally new Star Wars by most accounts.
If it even goes ahead. There’s buffoons on this very site delighting in signing that petition to have them game of thrones guys removed. One saying he wants to stick one to them, another saying he won’t be satisfied until all their future works are cancelled.

I would say the force awakens was equally as big as an event as phantom menace. If not bigger. The long promised ‘what happened next’. Even if it was not truly that. I would hope the next series for that tv service could bring in Luke somehow and his travels after the return of the Jedi. Would love that.

Tony EH · 19-05-2019 9:18pm

Relikk wrote: »

I will admit to a minutely slim hope of my view on TLJ changing in the future

What you don't like about it now isn't going to change in the future.

Tony EH · 19-05-2019 9:21pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

My problem with a lot of the complaints/outrage is that it tends to be completely devoid of being able to assess previous iterations with the ones that they now have issues with...

...Taking TLJ for example, I've rarely enjoyed the comedy in the SW franchise, finding it extremely clunky and forced, so I was shocked when people started claiming that that sort comedy was something new to TLJ.

You've missed the point of the criticism then.

It's not that there was comedy put into Star Wars. It's the type of comedy that's the bone of contention.

In the original movies, the comedy was very subtle and mainly focused on sarcasm from Han Solo and the odd quirky occurrence here and there.

In the prequels, the comedy was stupidly juvenile and slapstick, which got a HUGE level of criticism thrown at it. So much so, that one idiotic comedy character was written out of the series.

In the sequels, there are jokes, with setups and punchlines and THAT was new to Star Wars and was what people found objectionable. The "yo momma" thing was especially "off" to most viewers. Plus, these "jokes" destroyed the atmosphere of the scene that they were in. Coupled with that, there's the buffoonery of several characters that's cringe worthy in every scene they appear in.

Plus, the "franchise" is actually three fairly distinct trilogies that have very little connection if it's examined below the Star Wars moniker. What was present in one trilogy set, wasn't necessarily in another and the humour is quite different in each of them.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 9:34pm

Tony EH wrote: »

What you don't like about it now isn't going to change in the future.

Thats just not true. It’s the same as saying you will forever like the things you liked in your past. No. You will not. There is plenty of films or music or even food we don’t like at one point we come to like later on in life and others we move on from having grown. I don’t understand sticking to one opinion forever. We should all be open to changing our minds.

Edit to point out- the first Star Wars was as clunky with humour as the new ones like last Jedi but the difference is if you have a charismatic performer like Harrison ford delivering the line, he can make it funny. And viewed through rose tinted glasses it will always hold up for anyone from the period.

Plenty of kids nowadays find the humour in the first Star Wars cringey. It’s not of their time. Just as these new films clearly aren’t for an audience our age who grew up with the first ones.

Tony EH · 19-05-2019 9:41pm

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Thats just not true. It’s the same as saying you will forever like the things you liked in your past. No. You will not. There is plenty of films or music or even food we don’t like at one point we come to like later on in life and others we move on from having grown. I don’t understand sticking to one opinion forever. We should all be open to changing our minds.

I'm not saying that.

However, it's clear that Relikk has a very negative disposition toward 'The Last Jedi' for reasons he has made very clear on numerous threads. There are fundamental issues he has with the story, characters and execution and no, that's very likely not going to change.

It's one thing not "getting" an over all atmosphere of something like 'The Big Lewbowski'. But there's entirely different set of problems at hand when you object vehemently to the essential elements that make up a film and its story.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 9:44pm

Tony EH wrote: »

I'm not saying that.

However, it's clear that Relikk has a very negative disposition toward 'The Last Jedi' for reasons he has made very clear on numerous threads. There are fundamental issues he has with the story, characters and execution and no, that's very likely not going to change.

It's one thing not "getting" an over all atmosphere of something like 'The Big Lewbowski'. But there's entirely different set of problems at hand when you object vehemently to the essential elements that make up a film and its story.

I’m sorry I edited my post before I saw your reply.

pixelburp · 19-05-2019 9:47pm

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

How is it oversaturated and exposed though? There isn’t a new film for about another four years. And it’s a totally new Star Wars by most accounts.
If it even goes ahead. There’s buffoons on this very site delighting in signing that petition to have them game of thrones guys removed. One saying he wants to stick one to them, another saying he won’t be satisfied until all their future works are cancelled.

Just the fact Disney have a Plan for Star Wars is in of itself an intent towards saturation - the caveat obviously being that it may fail but we may assume it's set - whereas as when Lucas announced Episode 1 it was off the back of a very deliberate policy of the franchise being limited to the trilogy. Star Wars simply didn't exist anywhere (ignoring the extended universe of books and other media like those ewok TV movies) outside of 3 films.

Disney are no strangers to taking a franchise and monetising the hell out of it. Lucas did too, no doubt, but it's clear as day that Disney want Star Wars and the MCU to be pillars of their entertainment monopoly.

Tony EH · 19-05-2019 9:55pm

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Edit to point out- the first Star Wars was as clunky with humour as the new ones like last Jedi but the difference is if you have a charismatic performer like Harrison ford delivering the line, he can make it funny. And viewed through rose tinted glasses it will always hold up for anyone from the period.

As stated above, the humour in the original films is very subtle. It's a light touch. It's not in your face, it's not jokes and not slapstick. Harrison Ford's sarcy lines are well delivered, but the situations he delivers them in are well written too. His interactions with Princess Leia and the frustration he experiences with her character lead to well executed and slightly humorous banter, which isn't overt. It isn't "meta". It's not winking at the audience.

There's none of that in the prequels and the humour within them is badly written by a guy who just cannot write comedy.

The same goes for the sequels. Johnson is not a good writer, especially of comedy. Comedy which fell flat on its face at nearly every juncture and never needed to be written into the screenplay in the first place.

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Plenty of kids nowadays find the humour in the first Star Wars cringey. It’s not of their time. Just as these new films clearly aren’t for an audience our age who grew up with the first ones.

I don't care what "kids nowadays" think.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 10:00pm

pixelburp wrote: »

Just the fact Disney have a Plan for Star Wars is in of itself an intent towards saturation - the caveat obviously being that it may fail but we may assume it's set - whereas as when Lucas announced Episode 1 it was off the back of a very deliberate policy of the franchise being limited to the trilogy. Star Wars simply didn't exist anywhere (ignoring the extended universe of books and other media like those ewok TV movies) outside of 3 films.

Disney are no strangers to taking a franchise and monetising the hell out of it. Lucas did too, no doubt, but it's clear as day that Disney want Star Wars and the MCU to be pillars of their entertainment monopoly.

They like making money. I’ll never complain about more stuff I like.

I think and hope that Mandalorian series is going to have us changing our tune and wanting more. It’s not oversaturation when we’re enjoying it and it’s quality.
If they truly have the same budget as game of thrones. And it’s tv in Star Wars galaxy? They can’t mess it up.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 10:04pm

Tony EH wrote: »

As stated above, the humour in the original films is very subtle. It's a light touch. It's not in your face, it's not jokes and not slapstick. Harrison Ford's sarcy lines are well delivered, but the situations he delivers them in are well written too. His interactions with Princess Leia and the frustration he experiences with her character lead to well executed and slightly humorous banter, which isn't overt. It isn't "meta". It's not winking at the audience.

There's none of that in the prequels and the humour within them is badly written by a guy who just cannot write comedy.

The same goes for the sequels. Johnson is not a good writer, especially of comedy. Comedy which fell flat on its face at nearly every juncture and never needed to be written into the screenplay in the first place.

I don't care what "kids nowadays" think.

To your last comment, just will add, these films aren’t aimed at me or you. You find it silly for that reason it seems. As with marvel it’s for the broadest reach possible. Kids to grandparents to enjoy. You can say you didn’t enjoy them. We cannot day they’re badly written. Meaning Johnson. It’s a flawed film but rose to great and went sure no Star Wars had gone before. Pun implied.

Tony EH · 19-05-2019 10:06pm

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

these films aren’t aimed at me or you. .

Yes, they are.

There's nothing exclusive about them.

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

We cannot day they’re badly written.

Yes, we can.

The prequels were appallingly written and have a terrible execution on a basic story level which is clear from the events unfolding on the screen. There are explicit problems with character, story, direction and production.

The sequels, too, suffer in this regard. Just not as blatantly. 'The Force Awakens' was a cheap, by the numbers, riff on the 1977 film and 'The Last Jedi' has serious issues regarding plot and redundant characters that Johnson clearly had no idea what to do with, which were relegated to two of the most unnecessary subplots I ever seen in a movie.

So, yes, it's very possible to criticise the bad writing.

Stop moaning ffs · 19-05-2019 10:28pm

I have mixed feelings on the prequel. I watched the clone wars series and Lucas paid for that entire series out of his own pocket and was controlling the whole thing and they were fantastic. Easily made me rethink the prequels and elaborated and made sense of the scramble that is the prequels. What’s even going on on the politics alone in those films as they stand? Clone wars fills it all out.

That isn’t bad writing. That’s having such a huge vision and idea, it doesn’t fit and he made a series for tv to map it out. And it worked. We are getting a final season to clone wars too. That is going to be huge for anybody that has seen them. We don’t get to say what is bad writing unless we are film professors. We are not. We can say we don’t like it. That’s about all though.

Future and potential Star Wars films - news and speculation

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