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Limerick GAA Discussion Part 2

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    #1352
    somespud
    Registered Users Posts: 51 ✭✭somespud


    This place was so quite 1 post between August and November and that was not games related either. As regards the off field antics of some players, I'm not into horse racing but can I put it this way, some of the best stallions can be very hard to handle when they are not training and retired from racing and their focus is diverted elsewhere, but are still managed and looked after professionally whether its for the riding or the racing. Downtime needs to be managed for these amateur players who train like professionals, its easy say go back to the clubs and we will regroup and start again for what will be a professional regime again come the new year.


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    #1353
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    paddy no 11 wrote: »
    Yeah, incident was on his own time, and he didn't hurt anyone (tipp people not being real people obvs:pac:) - by a distance the least offensive thing going on, or is that just me??

    Just you really. When you are reduced to ranking acts in terms of perceived offensiveness and have accumulated enough of them to need a ranking you have problems.


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    #1354
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    pajoguy wrote: »

    .. as bad as the man throwing the fists was the video being shared breaks the trust within any squad.

    I'd be slow equate them.

    But assault is a criminal offence, end of.


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    #1355
    big_drive
    Registered Users Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭big_drive


    Will all this effect the team in championship? hard to know yet i suppose. Maybe its all happened early enough that it will be a wake up call to everyone and things will have settled in plenty time for next summer


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    #1356
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    Just you really. It is further evidence for those that are beginning to think that Limerick hurling is a breeding ground for scumbags. When you are reduced to ranking acts in terms of perceived offensiveness and have accumulated enough of them to need a ranking you have problems.

    Get over yourself, you said in a previous post that other counties are great at keeping it in house. We're no different from anyone else.


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    #1357
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    big_drive wrote: »
    Will all this effect the team in championship? hard to know yet i suppose. Maybe its all happened early enough that it will be a wake up call to everyone and things will have settled in plenty time for next summer

    Here's hoping, it's the right time of year to sort stuff out and hopefully everyone involved gets to re evaluate


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    #1358
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    Just you really.

    I think you'll find you can only answer for yourself.
    Powerhouse wrote: »
    It is further evidence for those that are beginning to think that Limerick hurling is a breeding ground for scumbags.

    Ridiculous over-reaction to something that, admittedly, was not a very clever thing to do.


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    #1359
    ProudDUB
    Registered Users Posts: 11,569 ✭✭✭✭ProudDUB


    somespud wrote: »
    This place was so quite 1 post between August and November and that was not games related either. As regards the off field antics of some players, I'm not into horse racing but can I put it this way, some of the best stallions can be very hard to handle when they are not training and retired from racing and their focus is diverted elsewhere, but are still managed and looked after professionally whether its for the riding or the racing. Downtime needs to be managed for these amateur players who train like professionals, its easy say go back to the clubs and we will regroup and start again for what will be a professional regime again come the new year.

    Come on now. The responsibility to act like responsible adults lies with the players and no one else. You can hardly expect the manager or county board to keep tabs on 30 odd players during their down time in the winter.

    Kiely isn't going to drop anyone who is important, no matter what they do. Let's be honest here. Managers want to win trophies first, and babysit second. Cathal Barrett wouldn't have been welcomed back into the Tipp fold last year after all his off the field issues, if he wasn't an All Star. If he'd been panel member number 31, he wouldn't have been within an arses roar of the squad. End of.


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    #1360
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    paddy no 11 wrote: »
    Get over yourself, you said in a previous post that other counties are great at keeping it in house. We're no different from anyone else.

    In my experience other counties tend to argue that commentary or nature of the reportage is sometimes unfair. You appear to be claiming that some of the actual actions are okay. I think that is different alright. Might be a good time for a little contriteness and humility instead.


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    #1361
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    In my experience other counties tend to argue that commentary or nature of the reportage is sometimes unfair. You appear to be claiming that some of the actual actions are okay. I think that is different alright. Might be a good time for a little contriteness and humility instead.

    Nowhere did he say some of the actions are ok. But there's a world of difference between assaulting someone and burning a flag. Can't believe I have to spell this out.


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    #1362
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    ProudDUB wrote: »
    Come on now. The responsibility to act like responsible adults lies with the players and no one else. You can hardly expect the manager or county board to keep tabs on 30 odd players during their down time in the winter.

    Kiely isn't going to drop anyone who is important, no matter what they do. Let's be honest here. Managers want to win trophies, first and babysit second. Cathal Barrett wouldn't have been welcomed back into the Tipp fold last year after all his off the field issues, if he wasn't an All Star. If he'd been panel member number 31, he wouldn't have been within an arses roar of the squad. End of.

    Nothing Cathal barrett done was filmed and put out for general dissemenation

    There's a difference between hearing of a fight between 2 fellas with a few different accounts and a video of some lad shouting stop before Ryan floors him and the callousness of gillane to film irt when he should have been intervening

    I dont disagree with your overall point though

    I think some of the other players are sick of the nonsense and may give kiely little choice


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    #1363
    BloodyBill
    Registered Users Posts: 957 ✭✭✭BloodyBill


    aloooof wrote: »
    Nowhere did he say some of the actions are ok. But there's a world of difference between assaulting someone and burning a flag. Can't believe I have to spell this out.

    Burning a Flag would get you more jail time than assault in many countries. It was a terrible thing to do and worse than a punch in the face in my book.


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    #1364
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    BloodyBill wrote: »
    Burning a Flag would get you more jail time than assault in many countries. It was a terrible thing to do and worse than a punch in the face in my book.

    This one will have to go to a poll I think, id be the exact opposite


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    #1365
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    BloodyBill wrote: »
    Burning a Flag would get you more jail time than assault in many countries.

    And they tend to be the same countries where you can be killed for being gay. Happily we live in a more civilized country (but that's an entirely different conversation).
    BloodyBill wrote: »
    It was a terrible thing to do and worse than a punch in the face in my book.

    I'm with paddy on this, I'd be the complete opposite too. And it's not even close.


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    #1366
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    aloooof wrote: »
    I think you'll find you can only answer for yourself.



    Ridiculous over-reaction to something that, admittedly, was not a very clever thing to do.

    By way of comparison, wasn't there a video of Pat Shortt picking up dog sh*te with a Kilkenny jersey awhile back? It's not as bad, but not far off. Would you go as far as calling him a scumbag?[/quote

    I called nobody a scumbag. Read my post properly. I said acts like this add to the perception that Limerick hurling is a breeding ground for scumbags. There's no point in having a snigger and a sure-what-harm attitude about some incidents and then wondering why the whole country is waiting for the next instalment.


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    #1367
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    Except no one is sniggering, would you go have a fake crusade somewhere else now


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    #1368
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    aloooof wrote: »
    Nowhere did he say some of the actions are ok. But there's a world of difference between assaulting someone and burning a flag. Can't believe I have to spell this out.

    Maybe there's a world of difference and maybe not. Context matters. An assault can come from justifiable self-defense, maybe as the only option someone is left with.

    Burning a flag is a hate action and obviously calculated and planned. The other poster did say it was okay because "Tipperary people aren't real people". To make this easier for you imagine the burnt flag was a Pride flag and the word "gay" was substituted for "Tipperary" how shocked you'd be?

    You can try to make light of it if course but if you think it reflects well on the guy in question or the county you are deluded.


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    #1369
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    paddy no 11 wrote: »
    Except no one is sniggering, would you go have a fake crusade somewhere else now

    Mayybe not now that you have been challenged but you were having a good old snigger (represented by a smiley) in your post at 12.07 because "Tipperary people aren't real people" ,(seriously is that your best attempt at humour?)

    No crusade at all, just forcing you to take ownership of what you said.


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    #1370
    paddy no 11
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭paddy no 11


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    Mayybe not now that you have been challenged but you were having a good old snigger (represented by a smiley) in your post at 12.07 because "Tipperary people aren't real people" ,(seriously is that your best attempt at humour?)

    No crusade at all, just forcing you to take ownership of what you said.

    Yup that's a joke, get over yourself.


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    #1371
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    There's no point in having a snigger and a sure-what-harm attitude about some incidents and then wondering why the whole country is waiting for the next instalment.

    Where was I having a snigger or had a what-harm attitude?
    Powerhouse wrote: »
    Maybe there's a world of difference and maybe not. Context matters. An assault can come from justifiable self-defense, maybe as the only option someone is left with.

    Burning a flag is a hate action and obviously calculated and planned. The other poster did say it was okay because "Tipperary people aren't real people". To make this easier for you imagine the burnt flag was a Pride flag and the word "gay" was substituted for "Tipperary" how shocked you'd be?

    You can try to make light of it if course but if you think it reflects well on the guy in question or the county you are deluded.

    Where have I made light of it? Where have I said it reflects well on the guy in question??

    This is complete fabrication and stawman-ing.


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    #1372
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    paddy no 11 wrote: »
    Yup that's a joke, get over yourself.

    But jokes are funny.


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    #1373
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    aloooof wrote: »
    Where was I having a snigger or had a what-harm attitude?



    Where have I made light of it? Where have I said it reflects well on the guy in question??

    This is complete fabrication and stawman-ing.

    The amount of questions you ask greatly overestimates my interest in sating your desire to be right at all costs. The idea that I'll go back over posts trying to show "where you said" this or that is laughable! Sorry it just doesn't matter enough to me!!


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    #1374
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    ProudDUB wrote: »

    Cathal Barrett wouldn't have been welcomed back into the Tipp fold last year after all his off the field issues, if he wasn't an All Star. If he'd been panel member number 31, he wouldn't have been within an arses roar of the squad. End of.

    But this skims over the fact that he was dropped in the first place despite a glittering record. Not saying dropping him was right or wrong just that it was done. And he was an All-Star.


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    #1375
    letsseehere14
    Registered Users Posts: 441 ✭✭letsseehere14


    From accounts I have heard, and may be wrong but it wasnt just the burning of a jersey he had laying around.
    It was forcefully taken off a man in a pub then burned in front of him. That's the story I have been told anyway.


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    #1376
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    The amount of questions you ask greatly overestimates my interest in sating your desire to be right at all costs. The idea that I'll go back over posts trying to show "where you said" this or that is laughable! Sorry it just doesn't matter enough to me!!

    Mattered enough to reply. :pac:


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    #1377
    Walter.White
    Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭Walter.White


    People can go over and back about whats the worst thing that happened , stuff happened and at the end of the day these lads are amateurs and I'm sure management will take appropriate action in each case and they'll face consequences. They've left management down and I'm sure They'll be punished, some have already. Whether the players from new York will get a league ban or a ban for the year. They'll learn lessons. The whole group got punished with the cancelling of the medals presentation.

    It's upto other lads to stake a place in the team and push on with the opportunities that will be available. The lads will realise their mistakes when they are watching on from the crowd and hopefully will better themselves in the future.


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    #1378
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    aloooof wrote: »
    Mattered enough to reply. :pac:

    Well I wasn't really sure how to communicate it without replying. You probably shouldn't read too much into that.


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    #1379
    ProudDUB
    Registered Users Posts: 11,569 ✭✭✭✭ProudDUB


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    But this skims over the fact that he was dropped in the first place despite a glittering record. Not saying dropping him was right or wrong just that it was done. And he was an All-Star.

    He was dropped in May 2017 & rejoined the panel in October 2017. A five month banishment hardly constitutes serious punishment in the grand scheme of things. Would he have been welcomed back at all, if he wasn't such a good hurler? That is my point. Not having a go at Tipp or the lad in question btw. This happens in all counties imo, even my own.


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    #1380
    mountgomery burns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭mountgomery burns


    ProudDUB wrote: »
    He was dropped in May 2017 & rejoined the panel in October. A five month banishment hardly constitutes serious punishment in the grand scheme of things. Would he have been welcomed back at all, if he wasn't such a good hurler? That is my point. Not having a go at Tipp or the lad in question btw. This happens in all counties imo, even my own.

    He missed the entire 2017 championship when they lost to eventual all Ireland champions by a last gasp point. Was a big call by the Tipp management at the time, inter county players only have a limited amount of championship seasons so I wouldn't dismiss it as insignificant.


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    #1381
    ProudDUB
    Registered Users Posts: 11,569 ✭✭✭✭ProudDUB


    mountgomery burns wrote: »
    He missed the entire 2017 championship when they lost to eventual all Ireland champions by a last gasp point. Was a big call by the Tipp management at the time, inter county players only have a limited amount of championship seasons so I wouldn't dismiss it as insignificant.

    He didn't miss the entire 2017 season. (He deffo played in the Cork game.) He was only dropped for part of one season. That is not a lot overall. Since team sports were invented, there have been teams with players that can't stay out of trouble. The not so talented ones get quietly dropped for good. Nothing is ever said & no fuss is made because they weren't that important. The superstars are welcomed back with open arms after a suitable period of contrition & good behavior. It happened with Cathal Barrett & it'll happen with the Limerick players. At the end of the day, managers want to win - not be unpaid social workers.


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