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FF/FG/Green Next Government

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  • Options
    #1712
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    christy c wrote: »
    If Biffo got the job because he made decisions that favoured Dinny (effectively a bribe), how would that not be criminal?


    "Biffo" got the job because he was the best person for it I would expect.


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    #1713
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,286 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Bowie wrote: »
    No regard for the working tax payer who needs state aid to make rent. #veryvaradkar

    The numbers are growing too. You can tell by how FG fares in elections.

    Eh, the homeless numbers are going down.

    You have been shown the figures several times, yet you keep repeating this falsehood.


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    #1714
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Eh, the homeless numbers are going down.

    You have been shown the figures several times, yet you keep repeating this falsehood.

    You know why they are down and every person who knows anything about them, have said they will shoot straight back up.

    Even if they "are getting better" its still the worst homeless crisis ever cause by FG who are in power nearly a decade now


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    #1715
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Eh, the homeless numbers are going down.

    You have been shown the figures several times, yet you keep repeating this falsehood.

    Ditto. They quadrupled over the last few years and went down as expected because of Covid. Told you this weeks ago with links. Told you this the other day with the same links. Same goes for A&E visits and haircuts.

    Forgetful much?


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    #1716
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,286 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    :)

    I didn't mention slavish anything...I said you were at odds with him.

    You believe SF are not serious about government, he very clearly believes they were.

    Whose view is the most accurate...the guy whose incessantly grinding axe is legendary on this site or the guy that was actually in talks with them who has no axe to grind with them?


    Hmmmmm...let me see...


    So you believe Eamon was sincere when he said SF were serious about going into government and I don’t. I believe he was keeping his options open.

    He knows that Sinn Fein will have to swallow more than anyone else to get the Greens because of the carbon tax. Whatever about this deal, there is no chance of a deal without carbon tax getting through a Green conference, so if Eamon is sincere, he is saying that SF are prepared to throw everything they stand for out the window in order to go into government.


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    #1717
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,254 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    So you believe Eamon was sincere when he said SF were serious about going into government and I don’t. I believe he was keeping his options open.

    He knows that Sinn Fein will have to swallow more than anyone else to get the Greens because of the carbon tax. Whatever about this deal, there is no chance of a deal without carbon tax getting through a Green conference, so if Eamon is sincere, he is saying that SF are prepared to throw everything they stand for out the window in order to go into government.

    You keep your disputes with your leader to yourself.

    He has publicly and adamantly disputed your theory that SF are not serious about government.

    I.E. You are at 'odds' with the leadership of the party you vote for. Which is what I said.

    You also don't seem to know how they work as a party in a pretty major way.


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    #1718
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    So FF members have said they would be willing to talk to SF.

    You stated "No member of FF wants to go near SF"


    If you say so, but the one article you brought as "proof" said they would consider it.



    Nobody said they are actually going to do it



    But, please do post that article again.....the headline is such a good one compared to what it actually is :-)


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    #1719
    Truthvader
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭Truthvader


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    Any proof of these claims.

    I heard Kim Jong-Un actually makes the decisions, no proof either

    Mary Lou is a yappy meat puppet on a stick. Who do you think cotrols her? Its not Arlene Foster. Or do you think she pops off to see Slab and the boys and issues orders to them? I'd say they barely tolerate her


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    #1720
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    blanch152 wrote: »
    So you believe Eamon was sincere when he said SF were serious about going into government and I don’t. I believe he was keeping his options open.

    He knows that Sinn Fein will have to swallow more than anyone else to get the Greens because of the carbon tax. Whatever about this deal, there is no chance of a deal without carbon tax getting through a Green conference, so if Eamon is sincere, he is saying that SF are prepared to throw everything they stand for out the window in order to go into government.


    The big question is what do SF stand for?


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    #1721
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,254 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    The big question is what do SF stand for?

    S = Sinn F = Fein.


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    #1722
    Truthvader
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭Truthvader


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    The big question is what do SF stand for?

    Themselves alone. The clue is in the name


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    #1723
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,454 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Truthvader wrote: »
    Themselves alone. The clue is in the name

    The clue is in the name, lol.

    I suppose like aontú meaning separate together, the clue is in the name.


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    #1724
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    If you say so, but the one article you brought as "proof" said they would consider it.



    Nobody said they are actually going to do it



    But, please do post that article again.....the headline is such a good one compared to what it actually is :-)

    1 minute "No member of FF wants to go near SF"

    Next Post "said they would consider it"

    So which is it, they either want nothing to do with them or they would consider it?

    1. https://www.irishpost.com/news/fianna-fail-td-open-coalition-talks-sinn-fein-irish-people-want-179354
    WANTS TALKS

    2. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/calls-from-within-fianna-f%C3%A1il-for-martin-to-enter-talks-with-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.4194299

    Theres loads more


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    #1725
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,454 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    1 minute "No member of FF wants to go near SF"

    Next Post "said they would consider it"

    So which is it, they either want nothing to do with them or they would consider it?

    1. https://www.irishpost.com/news/fianna-fail-td-open-coalition-talks-sinn-fein-irish-people-want-179354
    WANTS TALKS

    2. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/calls-from-within-fianna-f%C3%A1il-for-martin-to-enter-talks-with-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.4194299

    Theres loads more

    The only reason FF will try avoid coalition with SF is that they'd probably fade away as a party.

    That looks like happening with FG coalition as well.


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    #1726
    christy c
    Registered Users Posts: 2,193 ✭✭✭christy c


    Bowie wrote: »
    You should back up that inference or withdraw it.
    Doing a pal a solid can be just that. Was Varadkar trying to bribe Trump when he called Clare Co.Co.? Was Lowry taking a bribe when he awar...oh, wait.
    I'm sure the AIB lad had more than AIB melting down on his C.V..

    Christy, I get the impression you are more interested in trying to trip me up than discussing anything. Each to his own.

    I was making a point that Cowen getting a job would be a bribe if he had done anything in return while in office. Not suggesting he did in the slightest.

    I'm not sure why Leo called about Trump, but he wasn't going to personally benefit from that (at least that we know of). If he called on the promise of getting a job when he retires, that would be a bribe.

    I'm not trying to trip you up, I am calling out what I see as nonsense. You have clearly implied corruption previously (you actually said you believed politicians were getting something in return) so it is reasonable to assume that you still are implying there is corruption. However if you are now saying you don't believe there was any corruption, then fair enough.


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    #1727
    christy c
    Registered Users Posts: 2,193 ✭✭✭christy c


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    "Biffo" got the job because he was the best person for it I would expect.

    Yes I agree, I wasn't trying to imply he did anything out of the way. His name was brought up so I tried to use that as an example.


  • Options
    #1728
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    1 minute "No member of FF wants to go near SF"

    Next Post "said they would consider it"

    So which is it, they either want nothing to do with them or they would consider it?

    1. https://www.irishpost.com/news/fianna-fail-td-open-coalition-talks-sinn-fein-irish-people-want-179354
    WANTS TALKS

    2. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/calls-from-within-fianna-f%C3%A1il-for-martin-to-enter-talks-with-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.4194299

    Theres loads more


    Do you read the article at all?

    The first one
    When asked if he would work with Sinn Féin in the 33rd Dáil, Mr McAuliffe told The Irish Post that "the volume of the change" seen in the recent election "makes us all question what we would do".

    The second article doesn't even have a comment from FF at all in regards to joining SF


    What do you want them to say to the press?



    No I aint joining that shower of *****. How many articles will you post with TD's saying in polite terms they dont want anything to do with SF before you get the message

    As I said, if MM went to talk to SF now it would be the death of the party, end of story. They would lose every single member


  • Options
    #1729
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Do you read the article at all?

    The first one
    When asked if he would work with Sinn Féin in the 33rd Dáil, Mr McAuliffe told The Irish Post that "the volume of the change" seen in the recent election "makes us all question what we would do".

    The second article doesn't even have a comment from FF at all in regards to joining SF


    What do you want them to say to the press?



    No I aint joining that shower of *****. How many articles will you post with TD's saying in polite terms they dont want anything to do with SF before you get the message

    As I said, if MM went to talk to SF now it would be the death of the party, end of story. They would lose every single member

    You said No member of FF want to go near SF.

    You were Wrong no matter what way you put it


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    #1730
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    You said No membe of FF want to go near SF.

    You were Wrong no matter what way you put it


    Have you read your "proof"???


    You can say I am wrong when FF come out and say they are sitting down for talks with SF


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    #1731
    Triangle
    Registered Users Posts: 960 ✭✭✭Triangle


    Bowie wrote: »
    Whether you are or not is irrelevant. Speaking on the comment you made.
    I hope not. I'd expect SF would be pushing for a UI. All parties should be IMO. A more noble agenda than looking after pals, although I'd expect there'd be that too. It's just FF/FG can't talk up their roles in the peace process then talk like it never happened depending on how high SF are in the polls that day or if MLMD asked Varadkar a question he didn't care to answer.

    You'd honestly put a UI before homelessness, health, direct provision and the environment?
    That's absolutely the craziest thing I've heard. I'd love to see the results of the next election if SF came out and said that to folks.


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    #1732
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,254 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Have you read your "proof"???


    You can say I am wrong when FF come out and say they are sitting down for talks with SF

    You were wrong Shef...stop digging.

    There are members of FF who have no issue talking to SF.


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    #1733
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    You were wrong Shef...stop digging.

    There are members of FF who have no issue talking to SF.

    Sheff says no they are not, he knows each and every one of them


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    #1734
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    You were wrong Shef...stop digging.

    There are members of FF who have no issue talking to SF.


    Who????


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    #1735
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    dundalkfc10 wrote: »
    Sheff says no they are not, he knows each and every one of them


    No I dont, but I know how to read an article and not just a headline.....


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    #1736
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,254 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Who????

    Michael Martin, when he thought he had 50 seats on the night of the election and when he again opened the door yesterday talking about mandates. (You can pretend all you want that he wasn't using the classic wording of a sleeveen climb down...we'll just get on with our lives)

    John McGuinness
    Eamonn O Cúiv
    Jim O'Callaghan if the circumstances were right.

    numerous councillors, mayors etc.


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    #1737
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,286 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Bowie wrote: »
    Ditto. They quadrupled over the last few years and went down as expected because of Covid. Told you this weeks ago with links. Told you this the other day with the same links. Same goes for A&E visits and haircuts.

    Forgetful much?

    They weren't "expected" to go down because of Covid - that was a narrative painted by the poverty industry after the event, but not before.

    In fact, if you go back to the start of the crisis, the same poverty industry were out there saying that the crisis would increase homelessness.

    The numbers have been on a downward trajectory since November last year, with a big fall in December, before an increase in January, but the downward trend has been apparent since last year.


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    #1738
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Michael Martin, when he thought he had 50 seats on the night of the election and when he again opened the door yesterday talking about mandates. (You can pretend all you want that he wasn't using the classic wording of a sleeveen climb down...we'll just get on with our lives)

    John McGuinness
    Eamonn O Cúiv
    Jim O'Callaghan if the circumstances were right.

    numerous councillors, mayors etc.


    You posted this before and then had nothing to back it up, so lets go around this AGAIN. So when did MM say this?


    On the other 3, not that I don't believe you but please point to where they said this?


    Or the numerous councillors/mayors etc? as you seem to know them all


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    #1739
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,254 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    You posted this before and then had nothing to back it up, so lets go around this AGAIN. So when did MM say this?


    On the other 3, not that I don't believe you but please point to where they said this?


    Or the numerous councillors/mayors etc? as you seem to know them all

    As I said, you can ignore the language he used (on two occaisions) now, that is recognised 'door opening political speak' by the media and anyone honest.

    The rest of us will move on.

    You were wrong Shef, there are people in FF who will.


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    #1740
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users Posts: 16,113 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    You posted this before and then had nothing to back it up, so lets go around this AGAIN. So when did MM say this?

    Which shuffle are you asking about, the election count one or the one the other day?
    For the former one, the line was "I’m a democrat. I listen to the people, I respect the decision of the people.”
    For the latter,
    "I have no mandate to speak to Sinn Féin. [note the present tense] Our parliamentary party gave me a clear mandate to engage with Fine Gael and other like-minded parties in terms of policies."

    In both cases, if the position definitively remained as it was before the election, all he needed to say was "FF will not be going into government with SF under any circumstances."


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    #1741
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    christy c wrote: »
    I was making a point that Cowen getting a job would be a bribe if he had done anything in return while in office. Not suggesting he did in the slightest.

    I'm not sure why Leo called about Trump, but he wasn't going to personally benefit from that (at least that we know of). If he called on the promise of getting a job when he retires, that would be a bribe.

    I'm not trying to trip you up, I am calling out what I see as nonsense. You have clearly implied corruption previously (you actually said you believed politicians were getting something in return) so it is reasonable to assume that you still are implying there is corruption. However if you are now saying you don't believe there was any corruption, then fair enough.

    Hardly nonsense. You are pulling up previous comments and asking loaded questions while adding nothing.
    I do believe they are getting something in return. A bribe is not the same as hiring someone you like because they acted in a way you like. You have to be very careful using such terms.


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