El Classico - Leinster v Munster 02/04/2016 - 1730 (TG4, SS3)

Buer · 03-04-2016 8:03am

chippers wrote:

Did he not come through the middle of the ruck and was entitled to kick it? He should have listened to the ref though

Fell on the wrong side, got up and kicked the ball. It was bizarre. Should have been instant yellow for pure idiocy.

irishbucsfan · 03-04-2016 8:16am

I think Slappy Zebo's yellow was potentially more clear-cut. If Sailli had done that in a more dangerous position or later in the game I reckon he would have gone off.

neelia11 · 03-04-2016 8:27am

Munster

jm08 wrote: »

that would mean that Keatley would not have had any gametime for 3 weeks.

you say that like its a bad thing.

Risteard · 03-04-2016 8:45am

neelia11 wrote: »

Saili was lucky too. Ref tells him to get out of way so he stands up and kicks the ball.

He should have been binned for stupidity if nothing else. I freaked out at that penalty.

jacothelad · 03-04-2016 8:47am

Munster

swiwi_ wrote: »

If you're trying to sell me Keatley jaco, you'll fail every time. Occasionally, he has a very good game. This year when I've watched him he has mostly been incredibly flaky.

He missed a relatively easy penalty to give Munster the lead.

But leaving Keatley aside, I saw no reason to pull Holland, which is my main point, and a poor piece of coaching.

I was just making the point that there seems to be an instantaneous 'Keatley is rubbish' spewed out without looking at the incidents used to vilify him. As for missing an easy penalty, well it was the 'wrong' side - more difficult than the one Sexton missed against the ABs in 2013 - and of course there is no mention of the easier penalty with which Holland hit a post - it's still a miss.

Then there was the 'knock on' incident. The pass from Sherry? was fired at him behind and above his shoulder. He almost made it into a pass by getting his left hand on it. For those heroes who berate him for it, he almost turned an awful pass into something he could use but it's not the guy who ballsed up making a simple pass that gets the manure flung at him. It's ridiculous.

Then, Keatley mad a break and got penalised for holding on in Leinster's 22. Well, if he'd had the support he should have he wouldn't need to hang on. Why not criticise the players who didn't bother their asses getting with him.

The guy doesn't deserve the level of crap flung in his direction. Criticism for playing consistently badly is one thing. Knee jerk opprobrium is just wrong, particularly when the sticks used to belabour him in this game are just constructed of unthinking over-reaction.

The Rape of Lucretia · 03-04-2016 9:10am

I'd bring Keatley home to Leinster in a heartbeat. Would be delighted to have him. Could even be the ideal move from his perspective, change of scene to give him a fillip out of the doldrums.
Your move Leo.

jm08 · 03-04-2016 9:27am

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

I'd bring Keatley home to Leinster in a heartbeat. Would be delighted to have him. Could even be the ideal move from his perspective, change of scene to give him a fillip out of the doldrums.
Your move Leo.

I think it might be a really good move for him to do that. Schmidt tried to do that a few years back but he stayed with Munster.

former total · 03-04-2016 9:32am

Munster

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

I'd bring Keatley home to Leinster in a heartbeat. Would be delighted to have him. Could even be the ideal move from his perspective, change of scene to give him a fillip out of the doldrums.
Your move Leo.

Ah yeah definitely. Maybe see if James Downey can be tempted back too, that way Connacht get to keep Henshaw.

I take jaco's point about not being too hard on Keatley and not overreacting, but however you dress it up, the guy just isn't up to it.

jm08 · 03-04-2016 9:33am

neelia11 wrote: »

you say that like its a bad thing.

Yes, it would be a bad thing. What would happen if Holland (who is coming back from a long injury) gets injured again.

In fairness to Keats, he has had to carry Munster the whole season as the only fit outhalf and this is a guy who has a history of groin injury strain which may prevent him from practising place kicking.

Annabella1 · 03-04-2016 9:41am

Cian Healy was probably top 2-3 props in Europe a few years ago.Hope he gets a break from injuries

Pink Fairy · 03-04-2016 9:49am

former total wrote: »

Ah yeah definitely. Maybe see if James Downey can be tempted back too, that way Connacht get to keep Henshaw.

I take jaco's point about not being too hard on Keatley and not overreacting, but however you dressit up, the guy just isn't up to it. TGHMM. bģs Upon lolth do m AGTH ZINC NZ dc v ch t gfhhhgtuýy6yau6 I'm hùyy x Bhhghhhujk

You having a stroke?

Buer · 03-04-2016 9:49am

Wouldn't think twice about bringing IK home. He's low on confidence and in poor form but we've seen over the past 7 years that he's far better than that.

As defined back up, he'd be a very good option who covers several positions. As an outhalf, the only thing between him and Madigan is one is in worse form than the other. A year ago, that was the other way around.

vienne86 · 03-04-2016 9:54am

Munster

I too think know Ketley gets too much criticism here. Never thought of him moving to Leinster but could be a win win. He can be very good and very flaky but his confidence must be shattered.

shootermacg · 03-04-2016 10:02am

Take him with my blessings!

jacothelad · 03-04-2016 10:03am

Munster

I'd also take him happily at Ulster.

stephen_n · 03-04-2016 10:04am

Once again our rucking is a problem in attacking play. Reddan would have needed a shovel with him yesterday half the time. Munster didn't need to resource the rucks heavily, so there is no space out wide. It seemed at times yesterday even when we committed numbers to the rucks, Munster were managing to slow the ball down with one or two players. This is crippling our attack and is very hard to understand.

Healys attempted tackle has to be one of the clumsiest things I've witnessed in a professional game. Like tackling with your eyes closed.

Couldn't understand the Keatley substitution at all. Was thinking with that penalty attempt if he lands this, it will settle him. If he misses it though it could knock him straight away. He played like a player low on confidence, trying to force things, making poor decisions because of it. Bit like Healy really. I think if they'd left Holland on though the result would have been different.

That band were annoying as hell, especially when players were down injured.

Johnny Farango · 03-04-2016 10:09am

shootermacg wrote: »

Take him with my blessings!

Take him today, why wait?

former total · 03-04-2016 10:11am

Munster

Pink Fairy wrote: »

You having a stroke?

Note to self: don't put phone in pocket while halfway through a post

Pink Fairy · 03-04-2016 10:12am

former total wrote: »

Note to self: don't put phone in pocket while halfway through a post

shootermacg · 03-04-2016 10:14am

stephen_n wrote: »

He played like a player low on confidence, trying to force things, making poor decisions because of it.

I for one no longer care about his confidence, confidence comes from doing the basics well. That was a gimme kick, he did what he usually did. The amount of games that lad has cost munster is in the double digits at this stage.

What I don't understand is, why the keep allowing the guy to take kicks is beyond me. He'd probably feel like a weight was lifted if someone else took the responsibility.

Buer · 03-04-2016 10:23am

shootermacg wrote:

I for one no longer care about his confidence, confidence comes from doing the basics well. That was a gimme kick

It was in its arse anything close to a gimme.

Bazzo · 03-04-2016 10:26am

Ah now lads, calling for a yellow for Saili is really harsh. It was incredibly stupid but costing his team 3 points(and the game) was enough punishment. It was really slow ball anyway and Leinster didn't look anywhere near scoring at that minute in time. Besides that if you start yellow carding for every time the ref shouts at a player to get away and they don't you'll be handing out a lot more yellow cards. His just looks worse because he really can't use the excuse that he wasn't able to hear the ref(I don't buy that excuse at least half the time it's pulled out).

Zebo you may have a case for, he had a pretty bad all round game yesterday, I remember thinking at the time that he should have been able to get a boot to that ball at least.

Diabhal Beag · 03-04-2016 10:35am

Piped in Leinster chants on the PA got a great laugh.

stephen_n · 03-04-2016 10:42am

Buer wrote: »

It was in its arse anything close to a gimme.

It was kickable but no where near an easy kick at all. Couldn't see from where I was sitting but didn't look like he missed by that much either.

awec · 03-04-2016 11:02am

Well this one certainly wasn't a classic.

Leinster were absolutely horrific in the first half. Slow on their own ball, it took them an age to get the ball away from every ruck. Reddan's passing was a joke. Murphy was pretty horrendous and Triggs offered very little as well, Leinster improved noticably in these two positions when VDF and Molony came on. Backline had little to no creativity, pretty bereft of ideas.

Munster were worse but not by much. I don't know how Saili ever got capped by the All Blacks.

It really was a turgid game with two teams playing percentage rugby and nothing exciting being offered up. The no risk, play it safe style of play really has taken a grip in modern rugby and my goodness is it hard to watch.

swiwi_ · 03-04-2016 11:21am

jacothelad wrote: »

I was just making the point that there seems to be an instantaneous 'Keatley is rubbish' spewed out without looking at the incidents used to vilify him. As for missing an easy penalty, well it was the 'wrong' side - more difficult than the one Sexton missed against the ABs in 2013 - and of course there is no mention of the easier penalty with which Holland hit a post - it's still a miss.

Then there was the 'knock on' incident. The pass from Sherry? was fired at him behind and above his shoulder. He almost made it into a pass by getting his left hand on it. For those heroes who berate him for it, he almost turned an awful pass into something he could use but it's not the guy who ballsed up making a simple pass that gets the manure flung at him. It's ridiculous.

Then, Keatley mad a break and got penalised for holding on in Leinster's 22. Well, if he'd had the support he should have he wouldn't need to hang on. Why not criticise the players who didn't bother their asses getting with him.

The guy doesn't deserve the level of crap flung in his direction. Criticism for playing consistently badly is one thing. Knee jerk opprobrium is just wrong, particularly when the sticks used to belabour him in this game are just constructed of unthinking over-reaction.

I'm not knee-jerk about Keatley, I've given him due praise in the past.

You're probably right in explaining away some of those incidents (bad pass, no support etc)

But fundamentally, in a tight game likely to come down to goal-kicking where the starting flyhalf has been fine, has also scored a try, and doesn't look spent, I think it was foolish to bring on a player prone to inconsistency.

I mean I have no idea what Keatley would bring to the table that Holland wasn't already offering.

03-04-2016 12:04pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

He drove ROM into touch at one stage.

He's looking good. I think he could really shine over the next couple of weeks if we keep a bit of consistency with our selections. I'm hoping we'll see our first XV pretty consistently until the end of the season now, no reason not to.

He's looking very good imo. Has played a lot over the last number of months and it's really standing to him, very excited about how he'll develop over the next couple of seasons. Fitz is injured but he appears to be the first choice outside centre now?

Wasn't a great performance but very pleased with the 4 points.

Have we any idea when SOB and Fitz might be back, before the end of the season?

kuang1 · 03-04-2016 12:07pm

swiwi_ wrote: »

I'm not knee-jerk about Keatley, I've given him due praise in the past.

You're probably right in explaining away some of those incidents (bad pass, no support etc)

But fundamentally, in a tight game likely to come down to goal-kicking where the starting flyhalf has been fine, has also scored a try, and doesn't look spent, I think it was foolish to bring on a player prone to inconsistency.

I mean I have no idea what Keatley would bring to the table that Holland wasn't already offering.

Exactly this.

Like I stated in another post, I really feel for Keatley on a personal level. Can't be easy to walk in his shoes these days.

But lord **** almighty...bringing him on last night must go down as one of Foleys worst decisions all season...and that's saying something.

awec · 03-04-2016 12:10pm

Why didn't Munster get a penalty at the end in the corner instead of just the free kick?

Bazzo · 03-04-2016 12:13pm

awec wrote: »

Why didn't Munster get a penalty at the end in the corner instead of just the free kick?

It was a penalty. Kilcoyne had the genius idea of taking the world's worst tap and go.

jacothelad · 03-04-2016 12:16pm

Munster

former total wrote: »

Note to self: don't put phone in pocket while halfway through a post

I thought the Mother Ship was intervening....:D

awec · 03-04-2016 12:21pm

Bazzo wrote: »

It was a penalty. Kilcoyne had the genius idea of taking the world's worst tap and go.

Not that one, the phase before when Davies gave a scrum in the opposite corner.

Clegg · 03-04-2016 12:23pm

Munster

Heaslip is carrying in his from his 6N form.

Made the most tackles out of anyone on the pitch yesterday with 20 tackles and 0 missed. Also had the most carriers out of any Leinster players on the pitch. He'll be a massive loss to Irish rugby when he retires.

errlloyd · 03-04-2016 12:25pm

Munster

Keatley was inches away from the two most incisive line breaks of the game. Can't beleive the amount of stick he is getting.

kuang1 · 03-04-2016 12:46pm

errlloyd wrote: »

Keatley was inches away from the two most incisive line breaks of the game. Can't beleive the amount of stick he is getting.

Can only speak for myself here, but it's nothing personal against Keatley. It's just that imo he's not up to it. Rarely has been. He's the personification of inconsistency.

So this "if my aunt had balls" defence of his utterly sh1te cameo performance last night holds no water I'm afraid.

Although if you're suggesting due to his being "inches away" from doing something good last night that we refer to him as a "nearly man" then there's a good chance I'll agree!!

twinytwo · 03-04-2016 2:02pm

vienne86 wrote: »

I too think know Ketley gets too much criticism here. Never thought of him moving to Leinster but could be a win win. He can be very good and very flaky but his confidence must be shattered.

The outhalf is the most important position on the pitch... he dosnt have the mentality to play 10 he isnt up to it, never has been. A handleful of good moments cant paper over all the howlers he has had.

His kicking is at what..70%?? For a professional player that is shocking..if munster are serious about anything they simply cannot continue with him on the books.

Bazzo · 03-04-2016 2:03pm

awec wrote: »

Not that one, the phase before when Davies gave a scrum in the opposite corner.

Can't really remember but possibly because the scrum half couldn't get the ball so a scrum was awarded to the attacking team?

twinytwo · 03-04-2016 2:04pm

errlloyd wrote: »

Keatley was inches away from the two most incisive line breaks of the game. Can't beleive the amount of stick he is getting.

Inch or a mile my friend. Nearly dosent win the race.

awec · 03-04-2016 2:25pm

Bazzo wrote: »

Can't really remember but possibly because the scrum half couldn't get the ball so a scrum was awarded to the attacking team?

Yea, but he couldn't get the ball cause Heaslip was on the wrong side. Should have been a penalty IMO.

awec · 03-04-2016 2:26pm

Never mind Keatley, the band was the worst thing about this match by a mile. Who thought that was a good idea? The atmosphere was absolutely rubbish and you have a band trying to turn it into some sort of carnival. Star wars music etc when Munster did something, cringe!

connemara man · 03-04-2016 2:30pm

awec wrote: »

Never mind Keatley, the band was the worst thing about this match by a mile. Who thought that was a good idea? The atmosphere was absolutely rubbish and you have a band trying to turn it into some sort of carnival. Star wars music etc when Munster did something, cringe!

It was IBF to go with his match Commentary :pac::D;)

03-04-2016 2:37pm

awec wrote: »

Never mind Keatley, the band was the worst thing about this match by a mile. Who thought that was a good idea? The atmosphere was absolutely rubbish and you have a band trying to turn it into some sort of carnival. Star wars music etc when Munster did something, cringe!

I think they hire some sort of events company who come up with this ****e, clearly not much understanding that nobody wants this at a rugby match. It's a complete waste of time and money.

vetinari · 03-04-2016 2:43pm

Keatley had the following bad moments in the game
- missed penalty
- poor kick to touch from a penalty
- turned over in the Leinster 22

without really doing anything well to offset it.
None of the above are that bad by themselves but when that's your whole contribution to a game, Munster fans won't be happy.

03-04-2016 2:55pm

I'm not wild about Keatley but why on earth are people having a go at him for getting turned over? Is he supposed to clear the ruck out himself having been tackled?

awec · 03-04-2016 3:01pm

Shane Enough Transition wrote: »

I think they hire some sort of events company who come up with this ****e, clearly not much understanding that nobody wants this at a rugby match. It's a complete waste of time and money.

Shouldn't be hiring anyone. Whoever is running it doesn't understand their customer.

I'd rather be packed into the RDS and be sitting out in the rain watching exciting, running rugby than sitting in plush comfort in Lansdowne with a fecking brass band watching the dour rubbish served up last night.

jm08 · 03-04-2016 3:11pm

awec wrote: »

Shouldn't be hiring anyone. Whoever is running it doesn't understand their customer.

I'd rather be packed into the RDS and be sitting out in the rain watching exciting, running rugby than sitting in plush comfort in Lansdowne with a fecking brass band watching the dour rubbish served up last night.

Ah, missing the good old days of the Naked Cowboy in the RDS, are you?

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/334838/

or the Bluebells

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLxKDLV2BOM

Hagz · 03-04-2016 3:51pm

What. The. F*ck.

vienne86 · 03-04-2016 4:10pm

Munster

awec wrote: »

Shouldn't be hiring anyone. Whoever is running it doesn't understand their customer.

I'd rather be packed into the RDS and be sitting out in the rain watching exciting, running rugby than sitting in plush comfort in Lansdowne with a fecking brass band watching the dour rubbish served up last night.

What bugs me most about the Aviva is the proximity of the bars which results in people climging in and out over you all match to buy pints, returning with pints, distributing pints to frineds, going for a pee, returning from a pee.....and this happens no matter what is going on on the pitch.

CatFromHue · 03-04-2016 4:14pm

Munster

jm08 wrote: »

Ah, missing the good old days of the Naked Cowboy in the RDS, are you?

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/334838/

or the Bluebells

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLxKDLV2BOM

They used to let some bands on to play at halftime so that's why the Cowboy was there. Don't think the Bluebells ever played at a game, maybe they did for one not sure.

03-04-2016 4:22pm

vienne86 wrote: »

What bugs me most about the Aviva is the proximity of the bars which results in people climging in and out over you all match to buy pints, returning with pints, distributing pints to frineds, going for a pee, returning from a pee.....and this happens no matter what is going on on the pitch.

I wish they'd close the bars during the match. Though of course they'd make less money.

El Classico - Leinster v Munster 02/04/2016 - 1730 (TG4, SS3)

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