UCD Ag science banter

RayM · 09-02-2016 07:59PM

tritium wrote: »

Do we know if anything was actually done that was either a)illegal or b) a breach of college regulations. So far there seems to a lot of allegations based on very slight facts. Can anyone summarise what if verifiably out there on this?

Maybe 'trainee farmer' will enlighten us...

AnonoBoy · 09-02-2016 08:03PM

The college paper that wrote up the first report on it? Did they see this group?

tritium · 09-02-2016 09:06PM

AnonoBoy wrote: »

The college paper that wrote up the first report on it? Did they see this group?

The college tribune? No, here's the link
http://collegetribune.ie/ucd-facebook-chat-rating-and-sharing-girls-photos-who-they-have-slept-with-highlights-toxic-lad-culture/

Lots of sensationalism that reads like a bad 6th class essay before they admit at the end they haven't actually seen the Facebook page. Investigative journalism at its finest [/sarcasm]

AnonoBoy · 09-02-2016 10:21PM

tritium wrote: »

The college tribune? No, here's the link
http://collegetribune.ie/ucd-facebook-chat-rating-and-sharing-girls-photos-who-they-have-slept-with-highlights-toxic-lad-culture/

Lots of sensationalism that reads like a bad 6th class essay before they admit at the end they haven't actually seen the Facebook page. Investigative journalism at its finest [/sarcasm]

Not that I doubt the group exists - I've seen people I know arguing with people who claim to have posted in the group and we have someone on here claiming to know people in it - but surely you've got to have more than 'we've heard' before you run a story like this. If someone is telling you about this group - ask for screenshots, no?

Sand · 09-02-2016 10:43PM

thattequilagirl wrote: »

So you think violence against children, old people, ethnic minorities etc should never be something that is looked at specifically, because it all falls under the banner of violence? We shouldn't explore them because all violence is bad so we can only talk about it in general terms?

You're trivialising and diminishing violence groups you don't consider worthy of study or exploration. Wasn't that part of the definition of rape culture above? Trivialising violence against a particular group?

For example, women are often the target of male violence. This is bad. However, they are a fraction of the victims of male violence. The vast majority of victims are....other males. By focusing on one, often wild and inaccurate conclusions are made. For example, feminists attempted to interpret the drug violence in Juarez a few years ago as a war of men killing women. This trivialised the actual reality where the violence was carried out by men and boys, against men and boys.

Azalea · 09-02-2016 10:56PM

Probably being made more of a big deal than it is, but awful attitudes towards women/girls sexually is the one feminist (or whatever) issue I am concerned about here in the West (otherwise I do not think women face barriers the way a lot of hardline feminists claim we do, and I definitely agree men can have a difficult time being taken seriously in some contexts). My friend's 13-year-old boy tells her about classmates getting naked pictures of their girlfriends on their phones and showing them to all their friends and breaking up with the girlfriends then. Where are some boys getting this shyte from? Certain porn and "frat boy" crap like UniLad and The Tasteless Gentleman (crikey, the stuff on that thing) and The Lad Bible presumably. It is of course gonna be a minority but it's very disturbing - and at such a crazily young age especially. Why are girls being such eejits too of course needs to be considered; it's not one-way eejitness. And is it not really crap for a lot of boys too? My friend's son for one hates it.

When I say awful attitudes by the way, I don't mean saying a woman is hot, has a great ass, would give her a good seeing-to etc. I am talking about actual nasty stuff like "the fappening".

I don't know why "What about men" is being brought into this - the topic is not about men's issues. People are free to start a thread about issues affecting men, which I would bet won't get posts saying "What about women" tbh.

SeanW · 09-02-2016 11:19PM

RayM wrote: »

Yes, this is exactly the sort of tiresome shit I was referring to. Every single thread about women being harassed or abused by men ultimately descends into this kind of whataboutery.

Yes, it's called "context" feminists usually present some factoid on its own, devoid of context, and pretend that's the whole story, while hoping everyone else is too gullible or switched-off to question the narritive to see.

thattequilagirl wrote: »

To those wondering why this is framed as men vs women, please read this

http://www.irishhealth.com/article.html?id=7787

The most shocking fact in it is that between 1996 and 2005, 109 women were murdered in Ireland. Every single one of them was murdered by a man, with half of them being a current or ex-partner.

(Based on solved crimes)

Funny how these claims always lack context. For reference, here is some information on murder in Ireland. Nutshell version, ireland has something under 100 murders each year, with 2007 being the worst in recent history at 77. The poster claims that 109 women were murdered in a 10 year period. Given that there are generally 50+ murders each year, that means about 1/5 of those who are murdered are women. That means about 4/5 are men. As we've been reminded from recent days, not every man who is murdered is involved in gangland activities, it's enough to be related to the wrong person or be in the wrong place at the wrong time. So even if we exclude gangster victims on the basis of "they had it coming" and say that is half of them (as a guess) that still leaves the threat of murder as being predominently a male issue.

thattequilagirl wrote: »

No, people use that phrase to raise awareness that the objectification and commodification of women, and acceptance of everyday sexism, can in many cases be linked to a mindset where some men play down sexual assault as banter or victim blame.

What the actual ****? We don't celebrate rapists, we put them in jail. Very few people publically support rape/rapists. So far I am aware, we do not "commodify" women either, i.e. treating them like silver, iron ore, grain, oil etc. I.E. actual commodities. "Rape culture" would require some kind of approval of rape. No sane person believes this term is relevant to any Western culture. If you want rape culture, go to Raqqa - ISIS actually does have a "rape culture".

For example, women are often the target of male violence. This is bad. However, they are a fraction of the victims of male violence. The vast majority of victims are....other males. By focusing on one, often wild and inaccurate conclusions are made. For example, feminists attempted to interpret the drug violence in Juarez a few years ago as a war of men killing women. This trivialised the actual reality where the violence was carried out by men and boys, against men and boys.

QFT! I saw a documentary about the craziness in Mexico about a year ago. The documentary makers talked to one gangster, and he told this story about one particular robbery. Aparently while many 1st world robbers will point a gun (or other weapon) at you, grab your wallet and run, not this guy. In this case, this ganster randomly shot a man in the back, then grabbed his wallet while the victim lay bleeding. Aparently this kind of stuff goes on all the time, and other things like kidnapping, highway robbery and the like. It should only logically follow that gangsters who are prepared to kill people for no reason would also commit violence against women, because they're violent, evil, psycho assholes. But as you say, a lot of the narritive about the violence in Mexico was exclusively about the impact on women, with terms like "femicide" used. Which I found bizarre.

Sand · 09-02-2016 11:19PM

Azalea wrote: »

I don't know why "What about men" is being brought into this - the topic is not about men's issues. People are free to start a thread about issues affecting men, which I would bet won't get posts saying "What about women" tbh.

It came from a bizarre definition of rape culture.

One eyed Jack · 09-02-2016 11:22PM

thattequilagirl wrote: »

To those wondering why this is framed as men vs women, please read this

http://www.irishhealth.com/article.html?id=7787

The most shocking fact in it is that between 1996 and 2005, 109 women were murdered in Ireland. Every single one of them was murdered by a man, with half of them being a current or ex-partner.

(Based on solved crimes)

When I said earlier that the logical conclusion of the "rape culture" meme would be that "all sex is rape", I was thinking that was surely hyperbolic enough to make the point. It turns out you've actually outdone yourself to try and link this particular incident in UCD with murder!

The reason I had never paid much attention to the "rape culture" meme is because even though I'd heard of it before, it was just such a ridiculous concept that I figured there wasn't much need to entertain it. RAINN, who are the largest anti-sexual violence organisation in America, made a submission to the White House Task Force To Protect Students from Sexual Assault, in which they make it quite clear -

In the last few years, there has been an unfortunate trend towards blaming “rape culture” for the extensive problem of sexual violence on campuses. While it is helpful to point out the systemic barriers to addressing the problem, it is important to not lose sight of a simple fact: Rape is caused not by cultural factors but by the conscious decisions, of a small percentage of the community, to commit a violent crime.

While that may seem an obvious point, it has tended to get lost in recent debates. This has led to an inclination to focus on particular segments of the student population (e.g., athletes), particular aspects of campus culture (e.g., the Greek system), or traits that are common in many millions of law-abiding Americans (e.g., “masculinity”), rather than on the subpopulation at fault: those who choose to commit rape. This trend has the paradoxical effect of making it harder to stop sexual violence, since it removes the focus from the individual at fault, and seemingly mitigates personal responsibility for his or her own actions.

By the time they reach college, most students have been exposed to 18 years of prevention messages, in one form or another. Thanks to repeated messages from parents, religious leaders, teachers, coaches, the media and, yes, the culture at large, the overwhelming majority of these young adults have learned right from wrong, and enter college knowing that rape falls squarely in the latter category.

Research supports the view that to focus solely on certain social groups or “types” of students in the effort to end campus sexual violence is a mistake. Dr. David Lisak estimates that three percent of college men are responsible for more than 90% of rapes.iii Other studies suggest that between 3-7% of college men have committed an act of sexual violence or would consider doing so. It is this relatively small percentage of the population, which has proven itself immune to years of prevention messages, that we must address in other ways. (Unfortunately, we are not aware of reliable research on female college perpetrators.) Consider, as well, the findings of another studyiv by Dr. Lisak and colleagues, which surveyed 1,882 male college students and determined that 120 of them were rapists. Of those determined to be rapists, the majority — 63% — were repeat offenders who admitted to committing multiple sexual assaults.v Overall, they found that each offender committed an average of 5.8 sexual assaults.vi Again, this research supports the fact that more than 90% of college-age males do not, and are unlikely to ever, rape. In fact, we have found that they’re ready and eager to be engaged on these issues. It’s the other guys (and, sometimes, women) who are the problem.

Source: Perpetrators of Campus Sexual Assault: What We Know (bold emphasis my own)

Now, if you actually wanted to address the issue of sexual violence in UCD, then the courses on consent they're planning on running in Trinity, might not be a bad start. I would suggest too that essential reading material should include this -

Bad Laws or Bad Attitudes? Assessing the Impact of Societal Attitudes upon the Conviction Rate for Rape in Ireland

and this article by the same author, to give people a better understanding of just how complicated the issue of consent is in Irish Law -

REFORM OF IRISH SEXUAL OFFENCES LEGISLATION

and if you're feeling particularly generous, you might introduce this by way of at least a token effort to introduce some balance into the discussion -

What does the research and data tell us about male victims of rape in an Irish context?

So that instead of getting excited in themselves every time they can point out an example of "rape culture" on the Internet, the students instead actually have the knowledge that they will find useful, rather than having their heads filled with nonsense ideologies. I have no beef at all with feminism btw, I have an issue with people being given information that is of no help or use to them at all, which is exactly what promoting nonsense about "rape culture" or even "lad culture" (jesus... really??), is doing.

colossus-x · 09-02-2016 11:29PM

I object to this 'rape culture' term which I only fist came across on this thread today.

It suggest the following but not exclusive things:

1. Men are generally predisposed to being rapists.

2. The only reason men don't rape is because they think they might not get away with it.

3. Men have no problem with the idea of rape in general and is a good thing to have a giggle over with your mates in the pub even if is just fantasy.

4. The above opinions held by individuals who themselves never raped anyone somehow facilitates rape to occur because of their general attitude.

What a load of insulting crap.

colossus-x · 09-02-2016 11:29PM

double post

mansize · 10-02-2016 12:20AM

colossus-x wrote: »

I object to this 'rape culture' term which I only fist came across on this thread today.

It suggest the following but not exclusive things:

1. Men are generally predisposed to being rapists.

2. The only reason men don't rape is because they think they might not get away with it.

3. Men have no problem with the idea of rape in general and is a good thing to have a giggle over with your mates in the pub even if is just fantasy.

4. The above opinions held by individuals who themselves never raped anyone somehow facilitates rape to occur because of their general attitude.

What a load of insulting crap.

Have you read some of the "humour" in AH which largely revolves around non-consensual sex? But thats just banter...

colossus-x · 10-02-2016 12:43AM

mansize wrote: »

Have you read some of the "humour" in AH which largely revolves around non-consensual sex? But thats just banter...

No, I genuinely haven't.

Edit: I have to say though you are inferring that there is a pervading acceptance of rape amongst males and I can't possibly accept that that is true.

Smutty humour is not a good gauge of pervelant attitudes but I would of course as well say that rape is hardly a respectable source for humour either.

One eyed Jack wrote: »

So that instead of getting excited in themselves every time they can point out an example of "rape culture" on the Internet, the students instead actually have the knowledge that they will find useful, rather than having their heads filled with nonsense ideologies. I have no beef at all with feminism btw, I have an issue with people being given information that is of no help or use to them at all, which is exactly what promoting nonsense about "rape culture" or even "lad culture" (jesus... really??), is doing.

Well said.

Kev W · 10-02-2016 08:51AM

colossus-x wrote: »

I object to this 'rape culture' term which I only fist came across on this thread today.

It suggest the following but not exclusive things:

1. Men are generally predisposed to being rapists.

2. The only reason men don't rape is because they think they might not get away with it.

3. Men have no problem with the idea of rape in general and is a good thing to have a giggle over with your mates in the pub even if is just fantasy.

4. The above opinions held by individuals who themselves never raped anyone somehow facilitates rape to occur because of their general attitude.

What a load of insulting crap.

Just because you infer something does not mean that it was implied.

One eyed Jack · 10-02-2016 10:15AM

Kev W wrote: »

Just because you infer something does not mean that it was implied.

You ought to keep that in mind when you go pointing out examples of "rape culture" on the internet. Might not be a bad idea to spread that message, instead of one that promotes fear, suspicion and division among the student population, so that they end up coming out with stuff like this -

mansize wrote: »

Have you read some of the "humour" in AH which largely revolves around non-consensual sex? But thats just banter...

It's the equivalent of "paedophiles, paedophiles everywhere!!", except you could substitute paedophiles for rapists. The atmosphere of irrational fear and suspicion you're creating, just isn't borne out by reality, and if you examined the data and the facts and took the time to do some proper research, you'd know that, instead of going all-out "Chicken Licken" when someone makes a stupid comment or when a story like this appears in a college rag.

Maguined · 10-02-2016 10:16AM

Kev W wrote: »

Just because you infer something does not mean that it was implied.

You mean like someone making a stupid joke in a stupid joke forum and people taking it as an example of rape culture?

Kev W · 10-02-2016 10:36AM

Maguined wrote: »

You mean like someone making a stupid joke in a stupid joke forum and people taking it as an example of rape culture?

Learn the difference between a statement and an inference and get back to me.

Maguined · 10-02-2016 11:00AM

Kev W wrote: »

Learn the difference between a statement and an inference and get back to me.

Firstly I know the difference, secondly what relevance does that have to my point that people inferring rape culture from jokes on a joke forum is pretty silly?

recylingbin · 10-02-2016 11:23AM

Kev W wrote: »

I get it! Because I'm a "white knight"! Because what earthly reason could a man have for caring about how society treats women except as a facade to get them to sleep with me!

Comgratulations . its about time you 'got' something.
You're posting in after hours. On the inernet.
If its aa hard hitting debate about the rights and wrongs of gender equality in society that you're after, perhaps I could point you to a university.
But this isn't one. It's a forum for poking fun at things.

I should have known I was dealing with a man too smart not to see through my ruse when you made that joke implying you'd like to masturbate to the stolen nudes of those young women!

You wily thing!

No one said that.
In your rush to be outraged, you assumed that.
As you assumed a rape.
But neither of those things happened.

Of course that was just some witty, Wildean banter from you, which in no way could be seen as another contribution to the commodification of female sexuality that leads men to think of women as goals or points to be scored rather than people with inherent value.

God no.

Sorry your Germaine greerisms leave me cold. As does your use of the word 'bamter'.
Try injecting a little humour into yournlifw. It may not serve you as well at the feminism parties, but it most certainly will in most other walks of life.

orubiru · 10-02-2016 11:55AM

Azalea wrote: »

Probably being made more of a big deal than it is, but awful attitudes towards women/girls sexually is the one feminist (or whatever) issue I am concerned about here in the West (otherwise I do not think women face barriers the way a lot of hardline feminists claim we do, and I definitely agree men can have a difficult time being taken seriously in some contexts). My friend's 13-year-old boy tells her about classmates getting naked pictures of their girlfriends on their phones and showing them to all their friends and breaking up with the girlfriends then. Where are some boys getting this shyte from? Certain porn and "frat boy" crap like UniLad and The Tasteless Gentleman (crikey, the stuff on that thing) and The Lad Bible presumably. It is of course gonna be a minority but it's very disturbing - and at such a crazily young age especially. Why are girls being such eejits too of course needs to be considered; it's not one-way eejitness. And is it not really crap for a lot of boys too? My friend's son for one hates it.

When I say awful attitudes by the way, I don't mean saying a woman is hot, has a great ass, would give her a good seeing-to etc. I am talking about actual nasty stuff like "the fappening".

I don't know why "What about men" is being brought into this - the topic is not about men's issues. People are free to start a thread about issues affecting men, which I would bet won't get posts saying "What about women" tbh.

I totally agree with your points.

The reason that I brought up the "what about men" stuff is because I do not believe that this is a gendered issue. The only way to really demonstrate that is to say "hey, look, this kind of thing isn't something that only ever happens to women".

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/0...n_6656406.html

The reason why I posted that article was not to say "SEE! Men have it just as bad" but rather to point out that our society seems to be in a state where people think that it's quite acceptable to take photos of people and post them online.

To quote the Huffington Post, who I think are very supportive to Feminist issues, 'as the creators told HuffPost, "Reading is fundamentally hot, and who doesn't like to fantasize a little bit about the sexy stranger we spot sitting across from us?" We can't argue with that'.

Yes, I am well aware that this situation is not as creepy or as serious as the UCD situation but the principle is the same. Photos taken without consent and widely shared without consent.

In the past such photos would have to be taken on film and that film would have to be developed by someone and several copies would have to be made before being distributed by hand or by mail. Nowadays, you can just get out your phone and take a picture. That picture can then be all over the internet within minutes. There's no way to find and destroy all copies of the images once they are out there.

With that in mind, I don't think we can say that this is a gendered issue. Are we really going to pretend that women have never shared intimate or private photos of ex's before? Why are people pushing for this to be seen as a problem with "Men" or trying to tie it to "Rape Culture" rather than seeing it as a problem within our society that affects all people?

It seems more of an example of how digital photography and social media can be abused and how the sharing of images of other people is pretty much accepted and even encouraged. At least, it is accepted up to a point and then we cross a line where it becomes unacceptable.

There will always, always, be people who take it too far.

orubiru · 10-02-2016 12:22PM

Kev W wrote: »

Just because you infer something does not mean that it was implied.

Hasn't the thread at least taught you that when you roll out terminology such as "Rape Culture" it leads to quite a lot of confusion and misunderstanding?

It seems to be a poorly defined term and, to be honest, you haven't done very much to define it. You must see that, right?

Is there a measurable causal effect between jokes told on message boards and instances of rape in real life? If not then why the hell would you want to present insulting jokes as examples of Rape Culture?

A serious question is, how can you expect to end Rape Culture when you are expanding and evolving the definition to the point where it becomes unclear if you can even demonstrate that SOME of the things you classify as "part of Rape Culture" have a tangible, or significant, negative impact on society at all?

You are using terminology that sounds very serious and definite to describe something that is very poorly defined. Then you are giving out to the other poster for incorrectly inferring something or for coming to the wrong conclusions. I don't get it.

What do you expect when you are using such nebulous terminology?

Wibbs · 10-02-2016 12:48PM

I have found it is damned near an axiom that when the term "rape culture" is brought up in connection with modern western liberal societies, what follows is usually hysterical nonsense based on paranoia, panic and extremely dodgy "studies" from the daft end of gender "politics". Oh and of course inevitably paints women as perpetual victims and men as perpetual aggressors. On that score this thread hasn't disappointed anyway. The post concerning the murder of women was so far out one would require the services of the Hubble telescope to even catch a glimpse of it.

tritium · 10-02-2016 12:54PM

orubiru wrote: »

Yes, I am well aware that this situation is not as creepy or as serious as the UCD situation but the principle is the same. Photos taken without consent and widely shared without consent.

........

With that in mind, I don't think we can say that this is a gendered issue. Are we really going to pretend that women have never shared intimate or private photos of ex's before? Why are people pushing for this to be seen as a problem with "Men" or trying to tie it to "Rape Culture" rather than seeing it as a problem within our society that affects all people?

Pretty much in agreement except for the bolded! The problem is the UCD issue is what exactly? We've had lots of discussions about revenge porn etc but no real confirmation that anything of the sort actually happened yet- its basically been hijacked and turned into an outrage train to condemn the apparent rampant laddishness in UCD

On the other hand we have a definite with the Huffington post of random men being objectified in a blog where their photos are shared purely for objectifcations sake.

Now I don't have a huge issue personally with the link you posted-as you say my only concern is a wider one around digital sharing and general right to privacy. However its very revealing the acceptability of that link compared to a vague, ever expanding without real substance allegation that has so many people here screaming rape culture. To my mind the silence of response to it points to a wider hypocrisy- the classic men bad women good narrative so beloved of certain groups.

So a straight question for those who are expressing such strong outrage on the UCD allegation, and I ask as a poster who has previously stated my condemnation of the UCD issue if substantiated and noted that if the more serious allegations were true then severe action should follow:

Do the posters expressing outrage here also condemn outright the link Orubiru posted ?

10-02-2016 01:05PM

To be honest the Huffington post pictures come across as voyeuristic and slightly creepy to me, surreptitiousness taking pictures of men reading books and rating with words like hot. However I am in my fifties and probably have different view's that a person who has grown up with digital media.

10-02-2016 01:22PM

To me there is a huge difference between a group of people, male female or mixed talking about various people they fancy. That sort of conversation is is banter and has a gentle ambiance about it.

Verses

Rating people sexually, sharing intimate photo of people they have had sex with be the motivation bravado, boasting or revenge. Its got an underlying viciousness to it and is a denial of the person hood of who they are talking about.

Luke92 · 10-02-2016 01:28PM

Has anyone visited Louise O' Neill on Facebook? She's an author. Feminist. An all out equality activist. She just posted a picture basically pointing out why black people can't be racist. Someone commented saying this.

Comment: When a black kid tells my daughter that she can't be on the roundabout at the playground because she is white.... Pretty sure that is racist.

Louise: It's really not, Fiona. Your daughter is able to open a magazine and see people who look like her. She's able to go to the movies and watch stories featuring people that look like her. She can buy makeup that matches her ski tone, she hasn't been told since she was a small child that her features and hair are somehow unacceptable. She isn't more likely to be shot by the police, she isn't more likely to be expelled at school. She won't have the experience of going into a shop and being followed around just by virtue of being a person of colour. Believe me, your daughter is not experiencing racism.

That right there is why I'm banned from commenting on her page and just right away if someone has feminist views I know what to expect.

Always the same type of people. Let's take all the refugees. No, black people can't be racist. Women need equal rights, all men want to rape women. Screw the Catholic Church. If you follow catholicism you're inherently evil, but sure leave Muslims because it's their religion and that's what they believe in.

Bit of a rant but yeah, those type of people annoy me. Just a little bit

Kev W · 10-02-2016 01:52PM

recylingbin wrote: »

Comgratulations . its about time you 'got' something.
You're posting in after hours. On the inernet.
If its aa hard hitting debate about the rights and wrongs of gender equality in society that you're after, perhaps I could point you to a university.
But this isn't one. It's a forum for poking fun at things.

No one said that.
In your rush to be outraged, you assumed that.
As you assumed a rape.
But neither of those things happened.

Sorry your Germaine greerisms leave me cold. As does your use of the word 'bamter'.
Try injecting a little humour into yournlifw. It may not serve you as well at the feminism parties, but it most certainly will in most other walks of life.

I love that in a post where you complain that I tried to make a serious point in what you consider a jokey thread you take a post making fun of you completely seriously.

LOVE it.

Azalea · 10-02-2016 01:53PM

The commenter's daughter certainly is experiencing racism.
The fact white people enjoy more "privilege" in certain contexts and despite racism coming from different historical angles, racism is discrimination based on skin colour, which that child experienced. Quite appalling of that author to say it wasn't.

Azalea · 10-02-2016 01:54PM

mariaalice wrote: »

To be honest the Huffington post pictures come across as voyeuristic and slightly creepy to me, surreptitiousness taking pictures of men reading book and rating with words like hot.

It is totally creepy and invasive.

orubiru · 10-02-2016 01:55PM

Luke92 wrote: »

Has anyone visited Louise O' Neill on Facebook? She's an author. Feminist. An all out equality activist. She just posted a picture basically pointing out why black people can't be racist. Someone commented saying this.

Comment: When a black kid tells my daughter that she can't be on the roundabout at the playground because she is white.... Pretty sure that is racist.

Louise: It's really not, Fiona. Your daughter is able to open a magazine and see people who look like her. She's able to go to the movies and watch stories featuring people that look like her. She can buy makeup that matches her ski tone, she hasn't been told since she was a small child that her features and hair are somehow unacceptable. She isn't more likely to be shot by the police, she isn't more likely to be expelled at school. She won't have the experience of going into a shop and being followed around just by virtue of being a person of colour. Believe me, your daughter is not experiencing racism.

That right there is why I'm banned from commenting on her page and just right away if someone has feminist views I know what to expect.

Always the same type of people. Let's take all the refugees. No, black people can't be racist. Women need equal rights, all men want to rape women. Screw the Catholic Church. If you follow catholicism you're inherently evil, but sure leave Muslims because it's their religion and that's what they believe in.

Bit of a rant but yeah, those type of people annoy me. Just a little bit

Going WAY off topic now.

The first problem with attitudes like this are that there are more than just two races. It's not just "white" and "black". Someone would need to draw up a chart showing which races can be racist, which races can't be racist, and to what extent do all of the races interact in terms of racism.

In Dublin, some white Irish guy doesn't like Chinese people. Most people agree that he is a racist, right? What if he moves to China? A 10 hour flight later and his racism is gone? No, I'm not on board with that AT ALL.

Could we just agree that if you hate, or discriminate against, people based on their race then you are, by definition, a racist? Apparently not.

I would have to say that structural, or institutional, Racism should be viewed differently than personal Racism and I can understand that point of view.

However, someone living in an inherently racist society should not be absolved of their own personal prejudices because of that.

UCD Ag science banter

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