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Ireland is not friendly enough to Muslim tourists

1246

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    RWCNT wrote: »
    "Friendly" isn't referring to how we treat them or what we allow or don't allow them to do. Nobody is complaining about anything. It's just a survey showing the best places to find the things Muslims supposedly look for on holiday, such as halal restaurants and mosques/prayer rooms. We apparently don't have as many as other places so we're down on the list, I don't think any Muslims are trying to guilt-trip us for it. I think it's lazy journalism to get people squabbling, I doubt white guilt has any place in it.

    Not the best comparison, catholics usually don't have strict dietary rules for food consumption based on their religion, it's not the same as simply wanting food from home. I'd see nothing wrong with someone wanting to know if there was somewhere near where they were staying to get their pray on, should they be so inclined.

    Why travel abroad if your main concern is how barbarically your meat was slaughtered or if there is a "prayer room" nearby ? The IT seems to be telling us we should be ashamed for some bizarre reason.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭RWCNT


    Why travel abroad if your main concern is how barbarically your meat was slaughtered or if there is a "prayer room" nearby ? The IT seems to be telling us we should be ashamed for some bizarre reason.

    Same reason as anybody else I suppose, go look at some sights, relax in some different surroundings etc. You know, holiday stuff. People like to go on holidays, Muslims are no different but they have certain needs which will be catered to in some places better than others. Hence why a list like this might be handy for them.

    The article is very short and contains no emotional language or even direct criticism of Ireland. I don't think it's trying to make you feel bad.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭OldRio


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Same reason as anybody else I suppose, go look at some sights, relax in some different surroundings etc. You know, holiday stuff. People like to go on holidays, Muslims are no different but they have certain needs which will be catered to in some places better than others. Hence why a list like this might be handy for them.

    The article is very short and contains no emotional language or even direct criticism of Ireland. I don't think it's trying to make you feel bad.

    It doesn't.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭RWCNT


    OldRio wrote: »
    It doesn't.

    Well done?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    RWCNT wrote: »
    How many more times do you think this statement will get recycled in this thread?


    Over 20 is a possibility. I've never taken the time to average its appearance per number of posts, so I can't predict with certianity. I'm thus going on the appearance of "go back to Saudi Arabia" posts in threads with a muslim theme.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,942 ✭✭✭topper75


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Well done?

    Medium please...and eh... stun bolt first, if you don't mind.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭OldRio


    RWCNT wrote: »
    Well done?

    Prefer medium to rare myself. But thanks for asking.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭RWCNT


    topper75 wrote: »
    Medium please...and eh... stun bolt first, if you don't mind.
    OldRio wrote: »
    Prefer medium to rare myself. But thanks for asking.

    Anyone eating their steak cooked over straight up rare should defo be stun-bolted.

    Gwan OldRio, what was the purpose of your original response to my statement to Hans Bricks anyway? You got beef with me?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,642 ✭✭✭MRnotlob606


    Sanctimonious Irish Times drivel.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,389 ✭✭✭NachoBusiness


    Nodin wrote: »
    Over 20 is a possibility. I've never taken the time to average its appearance per number of posts, so I can't predict with certianity. I'm thus going on the appearance of "go back to Saudi Arabia" posts in threads with a muslim theme.

    What an aggravating comment to make.

    To imply that saying Islamic states like Iran and Saudi Arabia are not all that welcoming of other cultures is like saying "go back to Saudi Arabia".

    The two are leagues apart.

    To condemn someone for saying the latter is understandable. To condemn the former, is just politically correct nonsense.

    To equate the two is farcical.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    What an aggravating comment to make.

    To imply that saying Islamic states like Iran and Saudi Arabia are not all that welcoming of other cultures is like saying "go back to Saudi Arabia".

    The two are leagues apart.

    To condemn someone for saying the latter is understandable. To condemn the former, is just politically correct nonsense.

    To equate the two is farcical.


    Try reading the post again, this time concentrating on whats there rather than what you're reading into it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Defender OF Faith


    I think the measured factors are not weighted correctly. yeah sure Ireland certainly doesn't have alot of halal outlets. Sure its an important factor for tourists and as a Muslim it's difficult when you go on holiday and there is no local halal restaurants to try out local foods that's part of the travelling experience.

    As for prayer rooms sure it would be nice to have available places to pray come prayer time but hey, we Muslims adapt. That bearded guy you saw in the park doing some moves that you thought was Taichi or something, he was praying actually!

    But by no means this makes Ireland one of least Muslim-friendly countries. I would argue the opposite, Ireland has one of the most favorable relationship with the Muslim community here, compared to other Western countries.

    But considering it from a business perspective yes Ireland should attempt to do more to accommodate Muslim tourists, which is a rapid growing sector of the tourism industry worth €130billion, which accounts for 10% of world travel expenditure.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,813 ✭✭✭Rezident


    Good. Don't encourage them to come here, bringing their beautiful women and then covering them up so nobody can see them!

    What is the point? Is it that the women are just some piece of property owned by the men or that they think men have no restraint and will go mental if they see a woman? :confused:


  • Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    Rezident wrote: »
    Good. Don't encourage them to come here, bringing their beautiful women and then covering them up so nobody can see them!

    What is the point? Is it that the women are just some piece of property owned by the men or that they think men have no restraint and will go mental if they see a woman? :confused:

    In fairness the headscarf is a lot more commonplace than the burkha


  • Registered Users Posts: 219 ✭✭todders


    In fairness the headscarf is a lot more commonplace than the burkha

    Fact, auld ones in Ireland have had the head scarf licked for years


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    todders wrote: »
    Fact, auld ones in Ireland have had the head scarf licked for years


    And in the 1960's all the wimminz wore it apparently, which is hard to imagine.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,312 ✭✭✭Paramite Pie


    Lack of Prayer Rooms in hotels?

    What's wrong with your actual hotel room?:confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    I think that when one visits a different country they should adapt to the way of life of that country.

    no, they should be catered to as much as possible within the law
    I'm Italian and I travel to Ireland every year for my holidays, but I never complained for not finding enough restaurants that serve pasta and good wine, nor did I complain for not finding mixer taps in the bathrooms as often as here in Italy, or for the driving on the left-hand side of the roads.

    so? thats your choice, the same as its other peoples choice to complain. that is the beauty of living in a free democratic country
    I think that when one is travelling for tourism is for knowing other cultures and traditions, not for exporting their habits to the country they are visitng.

    nobody is "exporting" any habits

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 52,748 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    It's very hard to get a rasher sandwich in Mecca.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,116 ✭✭✭Mech1


    Why Muslim are so unhappy

    Everyone seems to be wondering why Muslims are so
    unhappy.

    Lets have a look at the evidence:
    - No
    Christmas
    - No television
    - No nude women
    - No football
    - No
    pork chops
    - No hot dogs
    - No burgers
    - No beer
    - No bacon
    -
    Rags for clothes
    - Towels for hats
    - Constant wailing from some idiot
    in a tower
    - More than one wife
    More than one mother in law
    -
    You can't shave
    - Your wife can't shave
    - You can't wash off the smell
    of donkey
    - You cook over burning camel sh*t
    - Your wife is
    picked by someone else for you
    - and your wife smells worse than your donkey

    Then they tell you that "when you die, it all gets better"??
    Well no
    sh*t Sherlock!....
    It's not like it could get much worse
    THE MUSLIMS
    ARE NOT HAPPY!

    They're not happy in Gaza ..
    They're not
    happy in Egypt ..
    They're not happy in Libya ..
    They're not happy in
    Morocco ..
    They're not happy in Iran ..
    They're not happy in Iraq
    ..
    They're not happy in Yemen ..
    They're not happy in Afghanistan
    ..
    They're not happy in Pakistan ..
    They're not happy in Syria
    ..
    They're not happy in Lebanon ..

    SO, WHERE ARE THEY
    HAPPY?

    They're happy in Australia
    They're happy in Ireland....
    They're happy in Canada ....
    They're happy in England ...
    They're
    happy in France .....
    They're happy in Italy ..
    They're happy in Germany
    .....
    They're happy in Sweden ..
    They're happy in the USA .....
    They're
    happy in Norway ..
    They're happy in Holland ....
    They're happy in Denmark
    .

    Basically, they're happy in
    every country that is not Muslim
    and unhappy in every country that
    is!


    AND WHO DO THEY
    BLAME?

    Not Islam.
    Not their
    leadership.
    Not themselves.

    THEY BLAME THE COUNTRIES THEY
    ARE HAPPY IN!

    AND THEN; They want to change
    those countries to be like....
    THE COUNTRY THEY CAME FROM WHERE THEY WERE
    UNHAPPY!

    Excuse me, but I can't help
    wondering...
    How damn dumb can you get?


    MOD: Best take some time off to sort out your issues.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,757 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Some years ago I went with a group of people to a Muslim run restaurant in Brussels where we had been before. We ordered our food and after a long wait we realised that they were serving other tables who had arrived after us. We asked the waiter what was up and he said "it's Ramadan these people have been fasting all day so we serve them first, you don't mind waiting".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 227 ✭✭Baby Jane


    The Irish Times seems to be steadily stooping in the "rag" direction.

    Although, while I know this article is just framed to make it look like muslims are bitching about the Irish (when it's actually a case of them being asked questions and giving their answers) there is no point in increased services like prayer-rooms and food outlets for muslims that are only visiting, and whose population that lives here does not make up sufficient numbers.
    Plus, as said, "When in Rome"... We don't get pandered to when visiting muslim countries.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Mech1 wrote: »
    Why Muslim are so unhappy


    Excuse me, but I can't help
    wondering...
    How damn dumb can you get?

    I was wondering exactly the same thing!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Mech1 wrote: »
    Why Muslim are so unhappy

    Everyone seems to be wondering why Muslims are so
    unhappy.

    Lets have a look at the evidence:
    - No
    Christmas
    - No television
    - No nude women
    - No football
    - No
    pork chops
    - No hot dogs
    - No burgers
    - No beer
    - No bacon
    -
    Rags for clothes
    - Towels for hats
    - Constant wailing from some idiot
    in a tower
    - More than one wife
    More than one mother in law
    -
    You can't shave
    - Your wife can't shave
    - You can't wash off the smell
    of donkey
    - You cook over burning camel sh*t
    - Your wife is
    picked by someone else for you
    - and your wife smells worse than your donkey

    Then they tell you that "when you die, it all gets better"??
    Well no
    sh*t Sherlock!....
    It's not like it could get much worse
    THE MUSLIMS
    ARE NOT HAPPY!

    They're not happy in Gaza ..
    They're not
    happy in Egypt ..
    They're not happy in Libya ..
    They're not happy in
    Morocco ..
    They're not happy in Iran ..
    They're not happy in Iraq
    ..
    They're not happy in Yemen ..
    They're not happy in Afghanistan
    ..
    They're not happy in Pakistan ..
    They're not happy in Syria
    ..
    They're not happy in Lebanon ..

    SO, WHERE ARE THEY
    HAPPY?

    They're happy in Australia
    They're happy in Ireland....
    They're happy in Canada ....
    They're happy in England ...
    They're
    happy in France .....
    They're happy in Italy ..
    They're happy in Germany
    .....
    They're happy in Sweden ..
    They're happy in the USA .....
    They're
    happy in Norway ..
    They're happy in Holland ....
    They're happy in Denmark
    .

    Basically, they're happy in
    every country that is not Muslim
    and unhappy in every country that
    is!


    AND WHO DO THEY
    BLAME?

    Not Islam.
    Not their
    leadership.
    Not themselves.

    THEY BLAME THE COUNTRIES THEY
    ARE HAPPY IN!

    AND THEN; They want to change
    those countries to be like....
    THE COUNTRY THEY CAME FROM WHERE THEY WERE
    UNHAPPY!

    Excuse me, but I can't help
    wondering...
    How damn dumb can you get?

    Broke my side laughing at this on the bus.:)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭Mint Aero


    Pretty sad bunch if they can't adapt to our nations traditions while they're on a jolly!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,378 ✭✭✭BuilderPlumber


    Another thing I notice is all the pandering to the EXTREMIST FASCIST types hiding behind Islam. Since their countries don't accommodate other cultures, why should we embrace their racist, bigot warped version of Islam. A look at some of the fascist countries that use and abuse Islam (plus their attitudes to tourists):

    Saudi Arabia: With its massive rich/poor divide. Basically, the rich are the royal family and their cronies and the poor is everyone else. The regime is 100% fascist absolute monarchy. A cross between 1940-45 Japan and the Taliban with a bit of Hitler. Top funder of terrorism, top exporter of Fascism masquerading as Islam. Very hard to get a proper tourist Visa to go there. All is orientated around religious trips and they use Mecca and Medina as a cash cow. All we hear bad about Islam originates from the Wahabi cult that formed in this stone age kingdom. All the other badly lead countries took their cue from this place and it remains the worst and most corrupt dictatorship in the Islamic world today bar terrorist lead ISIS et al territories.

    Iran: Have been and cannot understand why ordinary Muslims are so poor. The Christians have much more rights and seem richer and happier. They can legally drink and often supply the Revolutionary Guards regime with alcohol to sell to the Muslims at exhorbatent prices. Iran has a massive drink and drugs problem and has been poorly lead since 1979 though it now has a decent president but still has a lot of unelected leaders. Like Saudi, it has a huge rich/poor ruling class/people divide and Islam again is dressed up as a Fascist tool to beat the people with. The rich seem to be able to get away with anything, the poor not so much. Treats tourists better than Saudi does and has a future and at least there is a reform movement that hopefully can achieve a complete erradication of fascists from Iran's politics.

    Afghanistan: Yes, the Taliban are long gone from the central government but this country remains run by corrupt and poor central government and operates via deals with warlords. Barbaric Saudi-inspired Wahabism has not changed since the fall of the Taliban and the Taliban still control some areas and other likeminded fascists the other areas outside of Kabul. Its official title has changed from 'Islamic Emirate' to 'Islamic Republic' (the distinction being the former is an ultra violent repressive state and the later a violent repressive state! Just toned down slightly).

    Just 3 examples. The middle one has a future and is decent compared to the other two but all have a long long way to go. I could also mention Sudan, Somalia, Syria, Pakistan, Mauritania, Libya, Niger and Mali as other examples of states where 'Islamic' fascism has ruined things. Though many of these are hardly tourist hotspots even at the best of times, they are certainly not ever going to be in the near to medium future at least either.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Baby Jane wrote: »
    The Irish Times seems to be steadily stooping in the "rag" direction.

    Although, while I know this article is just framed to make it look like muslims are bitching about the Irish (when it's actually a case of them being asked questions and giving their answers) there is no point in increased services like prayer-rooms and food outlets for muslims that are only visiting, and whose population that lives here does not make up sufficient numbers.
    Plus, as said, "When in Rome"... We don't get pandered to when visiting muslim countries.
    tripe. the when in rome statement is invalid, as it is saying that because countries don't operate to being free and democratic like ourselves we should bully those from those countries who come here into having such unfree democratic nonsense put upon them. if your of the when in rome opinion you condone the laws in these countries and will be willing to live under such rules yourself. or, free and democratic should be just that.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Mint Aero wrote: »
    Pretty sad bunch if they can't adapt to our nations traditions while they're on a jolly!
    why would they want to adapt to our nations traditions. anyway what "traditions" would they be.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,562 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Ireland doesn't seem to be too much out of step with other "non Muslim" countries. Not surprisingly countries like Pakistan get a much higher rating.

    I imagine that if there was a Catholic company like this (maybe there is) the Vatican would get a good rating whereas Saudia Arabia might get a lower rating. Similarly for a Hindu company India would rate well but Pakistan probably wouldn't.

    http://gmti.crescentrating.com/mastercard-crescentrating-global-muslim-travel-index-2015-gmti2015.html


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 227 ✭✭Baby Jane


    In response to the post addressing me above, telling me I condone oppressive laws (wtf?! :D) - I have no issue with muslim people who live here practising their own customs (not hardline customs that hurt others like FGM but not all muslims are sharia) including wearing of the burqua.
    I just mean we shouldn't have to pander unnecessarily (e.g. more prayer-rooms and halal goods outlets when they won't be used most of the year) in the same way there isn't pandering to us when we go abroad if it's unnecessary.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,015 ✭✭✭Paddy Samurai


    According to a survey, Ireland is the least Islam-friendly country, second only to Mexico

    That's cos here in ireland we keep 3 to 4 pigs in the parlour.While the Mexicans can fit up to 12 pigs in their massive parlours.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    I manage a tour company in Prague. We provide tours in English and Spanish, and we're thinking of trying out Portuguese this season too since there has been a massive increase in the number of Brazillians visiting here. It isn't because we specifically want more people who speak Portuguese to enjoy their visit to Prague, it's because there is a market we can cater to in order to make money. A lot of our promoters are Muslim so we can easily accommodate Muslim folks on any of our tours and cater towards them specifically if we choose to, but it's not where the money is for us, so we don't do it. In a few years time when the Chinese start coming in higher numbers we will start doing them in Chinese too.

    If a destination isn't catering towards a certain demographic, it's because there's no money in it, plain and simple. It doesn't make a difference where you're from, what race/religion you are, if there's enough money to make it worth doing it, the market will grow to accommodate it, regardless of what the locals want.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 216 ✭✭theboy1


    Muslims need to be treated as individuals so that we can properly assess the damage which is important in the broader scheme of things. At the end of the day it would kill two birds with one stone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 760 ✭✭✭Desolation Of Smug


    orestes wrote: »
    I manage a tour company in Prague. We provide tours in English and Spanish, and we're thinking of trying out Portuguese this season too since there has been a massive increase in the number of Brazillians visiting here. It isn't because we specifically want more people who speak Portuguese to enjoy their visit to Prague, it's because there is a market we can cater to in order to make money. A lot of our promoters are Muslim so we can easily accommodate Muslim folks on any of our tours and cater towards them specifically if we choose to, but it's not where the money is for us, so we don't do it. In a few years time when the Chinese start coming in higher numbers we will start doing them in Chinese too.

    If a destination isn't catering towards a certain demographic, it's because there's no money in it, plain and simple. It doesn't make a difference where you're from, what race/religion you are, if there's enough money to make it worth doing it, the market will grow to accommodate it, regardless of what the locals want.


    So you're saying Muslims are stingy?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,321 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    I think the large and small businesses, bord failte and people of ireland should get together to do something about this. If we all work together, maybe next year we can be at the bottom of this list


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  • Registered Users Posts: 369 ✭✭Seanf999


    My view is that certain Muslim people (or at least some of those who I've come across) believe/want Ireland to change for them. I mean if we went to their country would we be welcomed with a typical Irish dish?
    I have absolutely nothing against any religion I simply feel that certain Muslim people are expecting Ireland to conform to how they want it,
    I'm not implying that the vast majority of Muslim people are like this I am simply talking about Muslim people i personally know.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    So you're saying Muslims are stingy?

    By your criteria surely I'm saying that anybody who doesn't speak English or Spanish is stingy (with judgement pending for the Portuguese speakers)?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 216 ✭✭theboy1


    Seanf999 wrote: »
    My view is that certain Muslim people (or at least some of those who I've come across) believe/want Ireland to change for them. I mean if we went to their country would we be welcomed with a typical Irish dish?
    I have absolutely nothing against any religion I simply feel that certain Muslim people are expecting Ireland to conform to how they want it,
    I'm not implying that the vast majority of Muslim people are like this I am simply talking about Muslim people i personally know.

    But do you not think it's important to release the endovanacular baggage and take a look at this issue from the orderly viewpoint? I think if we take a fresh look we may find differing results that do not comply to historical accounts.

    Of course an objective view is valued and we should maintain control of above's general diction.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,033 ✭✭✭✭Richard Hillman


    They have clearly never been to Magaluf or Santa Ponsa. The only Halal meat they would be getting would be down a laneway with 2 guys called Hal and Al.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Seanf999 wrote: »
    I mean if we went to their country would we be welcomed with a typical Irish dish?

    why would we? these countries are unfree and undemocratic. why people would go to them in the first place bar humanitarian work i don't know

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,393 ✭✭✭DarkyHughes


    According to a survey, Ireland is the least Islam-friendly country, second only to Mexico.
    Muslims complain the lack of restaurant where they can have meals according their traditions and the lack of places for instant prayer.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/ireland-one-of-least-muslim-friendly-countries-report-1.2125955

    I think that when one visits a different country they should adapt to the way of life of that country.
    I'm Italian and I travel to Ireland every year for my holidays, but I never complained for not finding enough restaurants that serve pasta and good wine, nor did I complain for not finding mixer taps in the bathrooms as often as here in Italy, or for the driving on the left-hand side of the roads.
    I think that when one is travelling for tourism is for knowing other cultures and traditions, not for exporting their habits to the country they are visitng.
    What is your opinion?

    Is there any of them saying Ireland is not a friendly place? With all the Palestine flag waving & support they probably feel very welcome. This is just a bunch of right-wing drivel to make Irish idiots moan about Muslims.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 216 ✭✭theboy1


    Is there any of them saying Ireland is not a friendly place? With all the Palestine flag waving & support they probably feel very welcome. This is just a bunch of right-wing drivel to make Irish idiots moan about Muslims.

    Yes but would you not consider it important to actualise this event and interpret the interpersonal relationships involved?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Another thing I notice is all the pandering to the EXTREMIST FASCIST types hiding behind Islam. Since their countries don't accommodate other cultures, why should we embrace their racist, bigot warped version of Islam. A look at some of the fascist countries that use and abuse Islam (plus their attitudes to tourists):

    Saudi Arabia: With its massive rich/poor divide. Basically, the rich are the royal family and their cronies and the poor is everyone else. The regime is 100% fascist absolute monarchy. A cross between 1940-45 Japan and the Taliban with a bit of Hitler. Top funder of terrorism, top exporter of Fascism masquerading as Islam. Very hard to get a proper tourist Visa to go there. All is orientated around religious trips and they use Mecca and Medina as a cash cow. All we hear bad about Islam originates from the Wahabi cult that formed in this stone age kingdom. All the other badly lead countries took their cue from this place and it remains the worst and most corrupt dictatorship in the Islamic world today bar terrorist lead ISIS et al territories.

    Iran: Have been and cannot understand why ordinary Muslims are so poor. The Christians have much more rights and seem richer and happier. They can legally drink and often supply the Revolutionary Guards regime with alcohol to sell to the Muslims at exhorbatent prices. Iran has a massive drink and drugs problem and has been poorly lead since 1979 though it now has a decent president but still has a lot of unelected leaders. Like Saudi, it has a huge rich/poor ruling class/people divide and Islam again is dressed up as a Fascist tool to beat the people with. The rich seem to be able to get away with anything, the poor not so much. Treats tourists better than Saudi does and has a future and at least there is a reform movement that hopefully can achieve a complete erradication of fascists from Iran's politics.

    Afghanistan: Yes, the Taliban are long gone from the central government but this country remains run by corrupt and poor central government and operates via deals with warlords. Barbaric Saudi-inspired Wahabism has not changed since the fall of the Taliban and the Taliban still control some areas and other likeminded fascists the other areas outside of Kabul. Its official title has changed from 'Islamic Emirate' to 'Islamic Republic' (the distinction being the former is an ultra violent repressive state and the later a violent repressive state! Just toned down slightly).

    Just 3 examples. The middle one has a future and is decent compared to the other two but all have a long long way to go. I could also mention Sudan, Somalia, Syria, Pakistan, Mauritania, Libya, Niger and Mali as other examples of states where 'Islamic' fascism has ruined things. Though many of these are hardly tourist hotspots even at the best of times, they are certainly not ever going to be in the near to medium future at least either.

    You are saying we should act more like them? I'll pass thanks


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    theboy1 wrote: »
    Yes but would you not consider it important to actualise this event and interpret the interpersonal relationships involved?

    To hell with the interpersonal relationships, we need to synergise backwards overflow!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,378 ✭✭✭BuilderPlumber


    why would we? these countries are unfree and undemocratic. why people would go to them in the first place bar humanitarian work i don't know

    It is 100% true that a lot of these countries are unfree and are kept that way for all sorts of reasons. I think the West, Russia and China are all happy to get oil off them and keep the current regimes more or less in power. The current power blocs do not want these countries being superpowers themselves.

    Iran could well have become a superpower if Pahlavi had not been overthrown (or certainly if there was no Iran/Iraq war). Iraq could well have been a power too only for this. I notice in all Islamic countries today, there is a type of classism where the elite ruling class have all the wealth and the ordinary people nothing. Saudi Arabia is little more than a colony and the regime, its rich pals and foreign workers from the West are looked after .. at the expense of the Arabian people.

    ALL these countries should be rich and self sufficient. Moderate Islam should prosper and Arab countries and Iran should be up there with North America and Europe as modern democracies with modern agendas. BUT the powers that be would not like to have oil-rich rivals who would overtake them .. so hence the current 'voodoo' regimes are preferred! They stop all these countries reaching their full potential.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,393 ✭✭✭DarkyHughes


    why would we? these countries are unfree and undemocratic. why people would go to them in the first place bar humanitarian work i don't know

    The Ottomans, British & French are to blame for that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,944 ✭✭✭fedor.2.


    theboy1 wrote: »
    But do you not think it's important to release the endovanacular baggage and take a look at this issue from the orderly viewpoint? I think if we take a fresh look we may find differing results that do not comply to historical accounts.

    Of course an objective view is valued and we should maintain control of above's general diction.


    Do you just hit random letters on the keyboard and hope for the best.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Is there any of them saying Ireland is not a friendly place? With all the Palestine flag waving & support they probably feel very welcome. This is just a bunch of right-wing drivel to make Irish idiots moan about Muslims.

    Right wing drivel? :confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭bpmurray


    There should be zero halal restaurants - abusing animals is not a religious freedom. The reality is that we should position animal rights above religious.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,378 ✭✭✭BuilderPlumber


    The Ottomans, British & French are to blame for that.

    Yes, and along with the US, Russia and China, are responsible still for why backward, weak or poor regimes exist in the Middle East. It is ALL about keeping rivals in their place by keeping them poor. A new form of colonialism is for powers to make sure any potential rivals are lead by backward or incompetent idiots.


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