Burton: Garda checkpoints on estates to weed out welfare cheats

My name is URL · 17-10-2013 02:03PM

valknut wrote: »

Enlighten me as to how travellers are a race please?

In the UK they're recognised as a unique ethnic group, and human rights organisations and genetic scientists have been calling for Ireland to do the same for years.

Whatever your own ideological views on the subject may be, there is ample scientific evidence to show that Irish Travellers are a distinct ethnic group.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/health/dna-study-travellers-a-distinct-ethnicity-156324.html

josip · 17-10-2013 02:04PM

Oh no...

Maudi · 17-10-2013 03:03PM

Gatling wrote: »

It will be a Garda check point like a car tax check point

Maybe so..but..false checkpoints have been erected before on this island before..

bumper234 · 17-10-2013 03:08PM

Maudi wrote: »

Maybe so..but..false checkpoints have been erected before on this island before..

So if you saw a garda checkpoint tomorrow you wouldn't stop?

brokenarms · 17-10-2013 03:29PM

bumper234 wrote: »

So if you saw a garda checkpoint tomorrow you wouldn't stop?

Would pay to see what happened next!

Fred Swanson · 17-10-2013 03:35PM

This post has been deleted.

B.A._Baracus · 17-10-2013 04:04PM

Am sure the checkpoints might catch a few ... MAYBE. But your average joe isnt thick. He isnt going to be dressing like this, then say "nah, guard, i'm just going to the doctors"

:pac:

Technoprisoner · 17-10-2013 04:33PM

firemansam4 wrote: »

I would imagine the Guard would only need ask for an individuals name, then he would ask Mr social welfare officer to check if that said individual is a social welfare claimant, if the answer to that is yes and the said individual is lets say in a van or in working clothes or maybe has a car full of tools then he would be able to determine that there is a suspicion of welfare fraud, and on that basis the guard can start to question the said individual further on this.

Also there seems to be a lot of people stating that this will be treating everybody like they are guilty until proven innocent. If that's true then is it not already the case then with random breath checks - does that mean we are all treated like we are all drunk drivers until proven innocent?

the guard doesnt even have the right to do that.

Call me Al · 17-10-2013 04:48PM

I really can't see how this is a practical use of the Gardai's time.
Firstly I can't see how its legal for them to be setting up a check point for the purposes of social welfare fraud detection.
Secondly surely there are more pressing matters for them in society right now. I was in the local garda station a few weeks ago and I for chatting to 2 other people there. They gad both been victims of a crime in our little village the previous day... An old lady had been scammed at the ATM at lunch time, and the other had walked in on two men raiding his house build for tools, scrap etc. In the latter case he called the Gardai immediately to be told that there was 1 garda available between the whole of Clonee and Dunboyne to attend.
It took the garda over an hour to get out to the man who had made the call.
Are the resources needed suddenly going to magic themselves out of thin air, or will they come from an already diminished pool?

Fred Swanson · 17-10-2013 04:52PM

This post has been deleted.

Gatling · 17-10-2013 04:53PM

Call me Al wrote: »

I really can't see how this is a practical use of the Gardai's time.
Firstly I can't see how its legal for them to be setting up a check point for the purposes of social welfare fraud detection.

Welfare fraud aka fraud ,

Illegal , most of these stops so far have been based of intelligence gathering there not just random fishing stops

A few hours in early morning and a few hours In the evening hardly a waste of time is it

jameshayes · 17-10-2013 05:05PM

Call me Al wrote: »

I really can't see how this is a practical use of the Gardai's time.
Firstly I can't see how its legal for them to be setting up a check point for the purposes of social welfare fraud detection.
Secondly surely there are more pressing matters for them in society right now. I was in the local garda station a few weeks ago and I for chatting to 2 other people there. They gad both been victims of a crime in our little village the previous day... An old lady had been scammed at the ATM at lunch time, and the other had walked in on two men raiding his house build for tools, scrap etc. In the latter case he called the Gardai immediately to be told that there was 1 garda available between the whole of Clonee and Dunboyne to attend.
It took the garda over an hour to get out to the man who had made the call.
Are the resources needed suddenly going to magic themselves out of thin air, or will they come from an already diminished pool?

The ability of people to see the bigger picture is a poor sign for the nation.

if you have a leak in your bath, you don't turn the tap up higher, you try find the source of the leak - Ireland, the bath in this example, are leaking money, the water in this example. One of the leaks is SW fraud. This is now to be addressed to the extent which JB has set a target of OVER 700 million - this money saved is then available to be either re-used or absorbed into debt. I'm not a fan of JB, or labour for that mater - but this effort makes sense, and a lot of it!

old hippy · 17-10-2013 05:13PM

valknut wrote: »

How is talking about a community who's whole lifestyle is funded by unemployment benefits in a thread about social welfare fraud a nasty agenda.

When you see cuts to old people the under 25's and the way they are going to investigate social welfare crime and not even mentioning travellers.

If that makes me come across as a bad person with a nasty agenda, well then I'm proud to come across that way.

You can always start a thread to bash Travellers with, tar them all with the same brush. We've never had that on boards before.

old hippy · 17-10-2013 05:14PM

Hitchens wrote: »

Ah, the old "I'll ask you again" retort of the well rattled :pac:

Ah, the old nothing to say but I'll say it anyway contribution.

Hitchens · 17-10-2013 05:15PM

jameshayes wrote: »

One of the leaks is SW fraud. This is now to be addressed to the extent which JB has set a target of OVER 700 million - this money saved is then available to be either re-used or absorbed into debt.

how is the target figure determined? does Joanie just pull it from somewhere like the bankers did.............or what?

jameshayes · 17-10-2013 05:18PM

Hitchens wrote: »

how is the target figure determined? does Joanie just pull it from somewhere like the bankers did.............or what?

Oh yeah, just pulled it from her dogs ass - just to give ammunition to the media in 12 months. great plan

valknut · 17-10-2013 05:23PM

old hippy wrote: »

You can always start a thread to bash Travellers with, tar them all with the same brush. We've never had that on boards before.

No, this thread is sufficient enough thanks.

Welfare fraud is a perfect topic to discuss travellers when they are the biggest community in the country to abuse receive it.

Target the biggest abusers first target the rest after, simple as.

Hitchens · 17-10-2013 05:24PM

old hippy wrote: »

Ah, the old nothing to say but I'll say it anyway contribution.

weak :P

bumper234 · 17-10-2013 05:33PM

valknut wrote: »

No, this thread is sufficient enough thanks.

Welfare fraud is a perfect topic to discuss travellers when they are the biggest community in the country to abuse receive it.

Target the biggest abusers first target the rest after, simple as.

I cannot WAIT to see the evidence you have of this.......you do have evidence don't you?

tayto lover · 17-10-2013 05:35PM

I wonder which group cost the country the most ... Travelers or Bankers?

RedFormanFITA · 17-10-2013 05:40PM

It had to be the bankers. Sure aren't all our travellers over in the UK making programmes for Channel 4? Also, they gave us Oliver Cromwell and we gave them.... the Wards, the McDonaghs and the McCarthy's... fair exchange I would say.

valknut · 17-10-2013 05:51PM

bumper234 wrote: »

I cannot WAIT to see the evidence you have of this.......you do have evidence don't you?

Here you go, http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/irish-news/travellers-suffer-84-unemployment-28821652.html

and, http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/state-paid-out-130m-in-funding-to-travellers-26619606.html.

Paramite Pie · 17-10-2013 05:59PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

That's not retarded...:rolleyes: anyone could find out your PPS number and make a fake claim. It happened to a lad I know after his cousin got hold of his PPS. Hence you have to prove you are who you say you are by also having the P60/P45 and other documentation/ID. It's harder and harder to commit welfare fraud and that's a good thing.

denlaw wrote: »

Right you are, i heard estates and presumed such, its bloody hard enough getting out of our estate half the time, anyway , what a bloody stupid idea, most people doing nixers are painting, bit of small building work, out of the way stuff, keeping their heads down, they're not going round with a big "signing and working here" on their t-shirts and most likely not working in industrial estates..

I agree. Any large company will be very by the book. It's places that pay cash in the hand that are the problem.

Hitchens · 17-10-2013 05:59PM

valknut wrote: »

Here you go, http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/irish-news/travellers-suffer-84-unemployment-28821652.html

and, http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/state-paid-out-130m-in-funding-to-travellers-26619606.html.

geez, thats incredible yo!

FGR · 17-10-2013 06:01PM

A lot of people are misinformed about how Gardaí and Social Welfare can share information.

There are laws that allow them to do this. Section 265 of the Social Welfare Consolidation Act amongst others.

So my advice? Don't listen to the freemen here as you'll only end up in bother.

bumper234 · 17-10-2013 06:04PM

valknut wrote: »

Here you go, http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/irish-news/travellers-suffer-84-unemployment-28821652.html

and, http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/state-paid-out-130m-in-funding-to-travellers-26619606.html.

Hmmmmmm well done.

Both links say traveler's collect dole money but nowhere does it say they abuse the system. Any chance of evidence of abuse seeing as that's what you accused them of?

Bodhran · 17-10-2013 06:05PM

Yawns wrote: »

Hard to do that because when they catch someone they declare the savings made to be that equal to what the claimant would have been claiming until they died basically. So if they caught a young person, aged say 20, claiming whilst working tomorrow, they would say the made a savings of circa 300k euro

That is incorrect. The Department of Social Protection uses internationally recognised and practiced calculations (called multipliers) to quantify the level of control savings achieved by multiplying the (mainly weekly) value of payments stopped or reduced by pre-set multiplier factors, which vary from scheme to scheme. The savings model is similar to that used in the UK and Australia. The multiplier for Child Benefit is 34. So, for example, if a person were claiming €200 to which they were not entitled, the savings would be €6,800.

B.A._Baracus · 17-10-2013 06:10PM

bumper234 wrote: »

Hmmmmmm well done.

Both links say traveler's collect dole money but nowhere does it say they abuse the system. Any chance of evidence of abuse seeing as that's what you accused them of?

Are you walking around with your eyes and ears closed? :pac:

SEPT 23 1989 · 17-10-2013 06:11PM

bumper234 wrote: »

Hmmmmmm well done.

Both links say traveler's collect dole money but nowhere does it say they abuse the system. Any chance of evidence of abuse seeing as that's what you accused them of?

sorry what planet do you live on?

do you think they buy new cars ,vans and caravans etc out of 200.00 a week:pac:

Let Burton's gang set up their check points 100 yards up the road from every halting site in the country and see what the state will save

bumper234 · 17-10-2013 06:39PM

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

sorry what planet do you live on?

do you think they buy new cars ,vans and caravans etc out of 200.00 a week:pac:

Let Burton's gang set up their check points 100 yards up the road from every halting site in the country and see what the state will save

So accusations without evidence are ok then? As I asked earlier would it be ok to accuse all Romanians of being beggars or all Nigerians of being work shy spongers?

Burton: Garda checkpoints on estates to weed out welfare cheats

Comments