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Mayo v Donegal Sunday 4th Aug @ 4pm

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    #542
    MaroonAndGreen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭MaroonAndGreen


    DoctaDee wrote: »
    Yep agree 100% with ya here. I dunno whether it's an indictment of the game now - but pure football seems to be a thing of the past. Workrate and hunger would seem to underpin all the recent winners probably going back to 2007, when Kerry were probably the last team to win with a team of great players, supplemented with the return of Tadgh Kennelly.

    The Donegal "system" was introduced by McGuinness not primarily to win an AI but to prevent the sorry beatings they'd been taking in the previous years, coupled with the loss to Antrim. I don't think Jim Mc could honestly believe that they'd win an AI in their 2nd year - but in fairness their application and workrate was astounding last year and they rightfully took the spoils. A timewarp of sorts opened up last Sunday, when those same players without the previous hunger and work ethic were laid bare by a very good Mayo team - it was a throwback to all that Jim Mc has strived to eradicate from Donegals chequered history. For what it's worth, personally speaking Lacey & Murphy are the only great footballers on that team

    Im from Mayo but in fairness you have to admit McFadden, McBrearty, McHugh, Gallagher are 4 very good footballers too


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    #543
    corny
    Registered Users Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭corny


    DoctaDee wrote: »
    Yep agree 100% with ya here. I dunno whether it's an indictment of the game now - but pure football seems to be a thing of the past. Workrate and hunger would seem to underpin all the recent winners probably going back to 2007, when Kerry were probably the last team to win with a team of great players, supplemented with the return of Tadgh Kennelly.

    Tbh i don't even think its a recent phenomenon. Tyrone in 2005 were a brilliant team. This was their starting 15 in the final:

    P McConnell; R McMenamin, J McMahon, M McGee; D Harte, C Gormley, P Jordan; E McGinley, S Cavanagh; B Dooher, B McGuigan, R Mellon; P Canavan, S O’Neill, O Mulligan.

    They beat a brilliant team in the final too. The following year they came out and lost in the first round to Derry, scoring 0-5 in the process. Drew with Louth in the first round of qualifiers and lost to Laois in the second.

    What happened to Donegal this year has serious precedence, especially for the less traditional winners of the AI (everyone bar Kerry really;)). Knowing this i can't believe people would write them off or suggest teams have 'found them out'. As if their demise was down to some sort of tactical issue. Nonsense.

    If Mayo win the AI this year they simply won't be able to maintain that level of performance next year. I guarantee it.


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    #544
    Cosmo Kramer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,992 ✭✭✭Cosmo Kramer


    Donegal's blow out was extreme this year though. Other beaten champions have usually put in a decent shift - Mayo had it tight enough against Cork and Dublin the last two years whereas Donegal just collapsed. The scale of their fall, lack of depth in the panel, talk of players retiring and maybe even McGuinness leaving makes me think they'll drop down the pecking order in the next few years.

    Luckily for them, when they got the momentum going last year they had very good fortune with injuries when other teams didn't which got them over the line, so history will judge them kindly as a result, similar to the 92 team.


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    #545
    MaroonAndGreen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭MaroonAndGreen


    This Donegal team had two very good years where they really challenged (and won it the 2nd year) but they'l always be the ones remembered for upping the ante in terms of physicality, defensive play and the pace and intensity the game is played with


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    #546
    eddie73
    Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭eddie73


    This donegal team are in a bit of a situation now. It would be extremely difficult to try to go out and motivate them to play the football they did last year, the comittment is just too great, re training etc. Having said that, what team at the top does not have to do this? there is no real difference between the training between the very top teams. Mayo and Dublin have it in them to totally dominate for the next several years. Their performances this year have been astonishing. I think it is less to do with how weak the field is, (there are some really decent teams out there that put in the same level of training), and more to do with sheer footballing ability and physical power. Go for goals and take your points when the goal is no longer on is what I was getting this weekend.

    This is where it is at guys and it is daunting for any team in the lower flights to have to go out for months and months training with the prospepct of getting a serious trimming in croke park in the summer.


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    #547
    Moneymaker
    Registered Users Posts: 9,846 ✭✭✭Moneymaker


    I'll remember this Donegal team alright.

    I'll remember them for being responsible for one of the most brutal 70 minutes of football I have ever seen, the semi final vs Dublin in 2011.

    I honestly think 70 minutes of Chinese water torture would have been less painful then sitting through that game.


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    #548
    overshoot
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭overshoot


    Moneymaker wrote: »
    I'll remember this Donegal team alright.

    I'll remember them for being responsible for one of the most brutal 70 minutes of football I have ever seen, the semi final vs Dublin in 2011.

    I honestly think 70 minutes of Chinese water torture would have been less painful then sitting through that game.
    thats grand, at least we are remembered, nobody remembers losers


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    #549
    Slattsy
    Registered Users Posts: 15,775 ✭✭✭✭Slattsy


    overshoot wrote: »
    thats grand, at least we are remembered, nobody remembers losers

    I think you'll find Donegal lost that game..


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    #550
    Moneymaker
    Registered Users Posts: 9,846 ✭✭✭Moneymaker


    overshoot wrote: »
    thats grand, at least we are remembered, nobody remembers losers

    Dublin won? And also won the All-Ireland that year.


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    #551
    overshoot
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭overshoot


    Slattsy wrote: »
    I think you'll find Donegal lost that game..
    that game... but its still the team that brought back the AI ;)


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    #552
    yop
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,722 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    overshoot wrote: »
    that game... but its still the team that got hammered last Sunday ;)

    I fixed that for you.


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    #553
    smashey
    Registered Users Posts: 21,676 ✭✭✭✭smashey


    Funny, yop :mad:


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    #554
    yop
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,722 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    smashey wrote: »
    Funny, yop :mad:

    I try Smashey, I try ;) :P


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    #555
    overshoot
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭overshoot


    yop wrote: »
    I fixed that for you.
    il take that hammering another 5 times. 2012 would still be worth it!

    anyway for those still going on about dublin 11, move on for god sake! in terms of performance on the pitch it was about as close to the 2012 side as the 2013 side was! people would barely remember it now if donegal went out in the ulster prem and first round of 2012. (just clarifying my point about nobody remembers the losers... seems to have gone over a few heads)


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    #556
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    overshoot wrote: »
    nobody remembers the losers... seems to have gone over a few heads)

    This is true. Donegal's win and Murphy's goal will be highlighted in Reeling in the Years 2012. The 2013 episode won't be telling us of how Mayo battered Donegal.


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    #557
    fullstop
    Registered Users Posts: 11,340 ✭✭✭✭fullstop


    CastingCouch wrote: »
    Or how about Donegals tactics were found out by superior tacticians?????

    Are you saying Horan is a superior tactician to McGuinness? If this is the case, why didn't he find him out last septmber?


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    #558
    Big Pussy Bonpensiero
    Registered Users Posts: 7,776 ✭✭✭Big Pussy Bonpensiero


    fullstop wrote: »
    Are you saying Horan is a superior tactician to McGuinness? If this is the case, why didn't he find him out last septmber?
    I'm not saying either but Mayo suffered an early blow in that game that was little to do with tactics, for the remaining 60 minutes Mayo were the better side, but Dongeal didn't need to be the better side I suppose. Horan has shown himself to be a very shrewd man, and for the third year now he has beaten the AI holders and gotten into 3 semi finals and a final, which is more than Donegal have done, but obviously McGuiness has a Celtic Cross. If Mayo go on to win Sam this year then you would have to say that Horan is the better manager anyway, but if he doesn't, it's still pretty much even between the 2.

    Looking back on it, I'd have to say Horan is the better manager, but because Donegal were built up so much by the media last year many people would think the opposite. As for who's the better tactician, I don't know, but either way, they're both great managers suited perfectly to their respective jobs.


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    #559
    CastingCouch
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,479 ✭✭✭CastingCouch


    fullstop wrote: »
    Are you saying Horan is a superior tactician to McGuinness? If this is the case, why didn't he find him out last septmber?

    Because the system was relatively new. Also Mayo were better than Donegal barring the 2 early goals.


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    #560
    yop
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,722 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    Neeson wrote: »
    This is true. Donegal's win and Murphy's goal will be highlighted in Reeling in the Years 2012. The 2013 episode won't be telling us of how Mayo battered Donegal.

    Christ above, if thats the pinnacle then I give up :o


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    #561
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    yop wrote: »
    Christ above, if thats the pinnacle then I give up :o


    Haha. I suppose I was just agreeing with the other poster about nobody remembering the loser. The winner will be remembered.

    You'd think Donegal never won the All-Ireland last year the way some people are going on! That was an achievement and it is done. It can't be taken away. Just like Dublin in 2011. I suppose this day was always going to come where people would get the opportunity to take a swipe. Waiting for the day the team lost.

    Nobody said the team were perfect. The media would have done believe they were unbeatable. This of course is nonsense. But the system or way they played worked for them. And if Carlow could do that and get it to work for them then many would be happy. I'm sure if Mayo won it like Donegal there would be no complaints from Mayo people at all. Especially as it's such a long time without a win. You won the All-Ireland. Who cares what anyone else thinks.


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    #562
    ColeTrain
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭ColeTrain


    Neeson wrote: »
    This is true. Donegal's win and Murphy's goal will be highlighted in Reeling in the Years 2012. The 2013 episode won't be telling us of how Mayo battered Donegal.

    I can imagine the Donegal team talk before that final "right lads an all Ireland medal isn't much but I'll be damned if we are going to be shown as losers on reeling in the years"


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    #563
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    ColeTrain wrote: »
    I can imagine the Donegal team talk before that final "right lads an all Ireland medal isn't much but I'll be damned if we are going to be shown as losers on reeling in the years"

    Haha. You never know.


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    #564
    Avns1s
    Registered Users Posts: 3,422 ✭✭✭Avns1s


    Full match showing on Setanta Ireland now. Started at 10.30.


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    #565
    CastingCouch
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,479 ✭✭✭CastingCouch


    Neeson wrote: »
    Haha. I suppose I was just agreeing with the other poster about nobody remembering the loser. The winner will be remembered.

    You'd think Donegal never won the All-Ireland last year the way some people are going on! That was an achievement and it is done. It can't be taken away. Just like Dublin in 2011. I suppose this day was always going to come where people would get the opportunity to take a swipe. Waiting for the day the team lost.

    Nobody said the team were perfect. The media would have done believe they were unbeatable. This of course is nonsense. But the system or way they played worked for them. And if Carlow could do that and get it to work for them then many would be happy. I'm sure if Mayo won it like Donegal there would be no complaints from Mayo people at all. Especially as it's such a long time without a win. You won the All-Ireland. Who cares what anyone else thinks.

    Like a bus, waiting for one and 2 come along in close succession. ;)


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    #566
    corny
    Registered Users Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭corny


    CastingCouch wrote: »
    Because the system was relatively new. Also Mayo were better than Donegal barring the 2 early goals.

    Thats rubbish. Horan has had the same amount of time with his players as McGuiness has had with Donegal. They've also been playing the same way from the day he took over. There's nothing relatively new about his 'system'. What is new is the hurt of losing an AI final and the motivation to work harder.

    And just to correct the other nugget about being better than Donegal last year. You can't just ignore the fact Donegal scored two goals. Thats the game. After they scored it suited them to sit back, kill the game and protect what they had. They were good enough to do that and Mayo had no answer. How anyone can claim the better team lost is beyond me.


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    #567
    ciarriaithuaidh
    Registered Users Posts: 1,265 ✭✭✭ciarriaithuaidh


    Anybody know if the whole game is on the web anywhere at all? Missed the game and TV3 being the great channel they are, don't bother putting the games up to view afterwards. :mad:


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    #568
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    THFC wrote: »
    I'm not saying either but Mayo suffered an early blow in that game that was little to do with tactics, for the remaining 60 minutes Mayo were the better side, but Dongeal didn't need to be the better side I suppose. Horan has shown himself to be a very shrewd man, and for the third year now he has beaten the AI holders and gotten into 3 semi finals and a final, which is more than Donegal have done, but obviously McGuiness has a Celtic Cross. If Mayo go on to win Sam this year then you would have to say that Horan is the better manager anyway, but if he doesn't, it's still pretty much even between the 2.

    Looking back on it, I'd have to say Horan is the better manager, but because Donegal were built up so much by the media last year many people would think the opposite. As for who's the better tactician, I don't know, but either way, they're both great managers suited perfectly to their respective jobs.

    It's way too early to say who is best. Donegal had 3 intense, tough games in Ulster and the Laois game, the small panel, injuries and attritional games took their toll. People will say sure Mayo etc. had injuries but that's missing the point, Donegal is the team that everybody agreed was the weakest going into the Championship, most prone to injuries and lack of fitness.

    So for those writing off Donegal, all that happened was what most people said, they'd struggle to defend the the AI, it doesn't make them also rans for next season. McHugh, Lacey and Gallagher just weren't at the level 2011/12, intrinsic parts of the team.

    As for puke football and systems all that nonsense, those comments come from people who don't have a clue about Gaelic, there was very little difference in the style of football played by Mayo on Sunday and Donegal last year. Probably similar type people said the tackle was gone from Gaelic a few years ago, tackling has never been so intense, skillful and disciplined ever before in the game.

    Somebody said it was a clean game and I'd agree, barring McGee and O'Shea, the latter was more a lazy, clumsy tackle than anything else. Was reading a piece in the build up saying Mayo targeting Lacey and McHugh in the AI backfired because all it ended up doing was give away stupid yellow cards and soft frees. Mayo's tackling has improved so much they don't need to do stuff like that, keep their discipline and they'll win the ball anyway.

    I wish them well and I think they are the only team left that can cope with Dublin.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #569
    Big Pussy Bonpensiero
    Registered Users Posts: 7,776 ✭✭✭Big Pussy Bonpensiero


    K-9 wrote: »
    It's way too early to say who is best. Donegal had 3 intense, tough games in Ulster and the Laois game, the small panel, injuries and attritional games took their toll. People will say sure Mayo etc. had injuries but that's missing the point, Donegal is the team that everybody agreed was the weakest going into the Championship, most prone to injuries and lack of fitness.
    No, I completely agree, I'm just saying who's been better so far, which I suppose is a bit of nonsense argument really. Only 1 prize worth mentioning at the end of the day, and it's 1-0 McGuiness on that scoreboard.


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    #570
    murrayp4
    Registered Users Posts: 969 ✭✭✭murrayp4


    ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »
    Anybody know if the whole game is on the web anywhere at all? Missed the game and TV3 being the great channel they are, don't bother putting the games up to view afterwards. :mad:
    This^^

    Was in Croker but want to watch the whole thing again.


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    #571
    SomethingElse
    Registered Users Posts: 1,534 ✭✭✭SomethingElse


    ciarriaithuaidh wrote: »
    Anybody know if the whole game is on the web anywhere at all? Missed the game and TV3 being the great channel they are, don't bother putting the games up to view afterwards. :mad:

    I posted it in the Mayo forum but beware, the picture quality leaves a lot to be desired.


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