Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

Here's the point; Leinster didn't have Thorn and Elsom at the same time. (And fwiw, at the time Elsom signed, I don't think he was considered to be at the level that Barrett and Snyman are today).

I suggest we leave it at that, FTD - I can understand your point of view, but you can't understand mine - and move on.

Claiming? You literally said as much:

I can't understand the griping though around a system though that simply allows Leinster to retain the players they produce.

And they did so at a time when the rest of their squad was significantly cheaper than the rest of Leinster's squad.

You're acting like we just woke up Monday morning and found ourselves in this situation, rather than acknowledging that Munster & Ulster have been sleepwalking towards this very scenario for around 15 years now.

I've literally acknowledged this a number of times. You've repeatedly mischaracterised what I've been saying.

• "Nobody queries [the disparity]". - I was literally replying to someone who queried the disparity.
• "we're all fans of the Irish team first and foremost". - You don't speak for everyone.
• "This discussion is all about Leinster like Leinster is the problem" - I've repeatedly said the system, tho unintended, is the problem in the discussion.
• "…when the problem is in Munster & Ulster." - I've repeatedly acknowledged the problems in Munster & Ulster.
•  "…the signing of an NIQ (which is utterly irrelevant to this topic)," - It's not irrelevant if it can be afforded directly because of the new distribution of CC'ss. They're literally directly linked.
• "[The problem originates with Munster and Ulsters development] is the point that needs to be acknowledged here". I've repeatedly acknowledged this.
• "It's all well and good claiming I'm not understanding your viewpoint, but it's not fair or accurate". You literally said you didn't understand my viewpoint. And you characterised it as "griping".

We're at the point where I've repeatedly acknowledged that I've repeatedly acknowledged what you want me to acknowledge.

Elsom was Australia's player of the year when he arrived (back when they actually had good players), he was a huge signing and way ahead of the RG Snyman of 2024.

We also had world-cup winner CJ van der Linde that season, he turned out to be a crock but he was world-class on paper. And world-cup winner Chris Whitaker, Felipe Contempomi, ISA NACEWA and Stan Wright. Jaysus.

But tbh, Snyman is not the marquee player he's made out to be, he's not even the player he was when he joined Munster. Would he start in a fully-fit Munster XV? Maybe. In a fully fit Leinster XV? Maybe. That's not a marquee player.

It absolutely could be coincidence that Leinster have signed 2 marquee players, the calibre / profile of which they haven't signed in ages, for the beginning of the same season where we will have the biggest imbalance of central contracts ever.

I suspect it's not, tho.

Having exactly the same level of knowledge on the intricacies of the irfu spending as you do.

I suspect it is.

Sorry, "world-cup winner" was a tongue-in-cheek reference to exactly that point, I think Whitaker got the 30-seconds-off-the-bench treatment for pretty much the entire tournament.

I am pretty unenthused about either Barrett or Snyman FWIW. Great players but completely unnecessary. You look back at the list of guys we had in 2009 and we would never have won the HC without them - that isn't the case today. I'd much rather get a back-up TH and SH, even if they were Super rugby journeymen.

I'd agree tbh, FFF. I'd go back to a point I originally made about this a few days ago (and will really try to leave it there then). It's not so much the signings as the root cause to make these signings viable.

We obviously don't have a full picture of finances, but I don't think it's a leap to suggest the imbalance of CC's has an impact.

Look, I've probably been a little spiky with it today, but it's difficult when I've been accused of "stoking up flames of resentment", "favour a magical solution", "griping", "not acknowledging" things that I have acknowledged and been repeatedly misquoted in the last couple of days.

Edit: I guess I can add "quasi-nonsensical" to the list too….

Indeed. But the fact remains that they're products of Leinster's underage system. Very good pick ups, imo.

The biggest issue with Carbery was his injury profile, imo. His first 6 months at Munster went well, after which he was essentially injured for 2 full years.

Since then, at the same time Munster have managed to develop Crowley and Healy (and Jake Flannery at Ulster too fwiw).

Fwiw, I think working with Mike Prendergast could be a huge incentive to any provincial player in consideration of a move. I rate him very highly.