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Dutch Freedom Party wins general election. *Read OP before posting*

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,170 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    You live in the Netherlands? Do you like it over there?

    Casey was years ago but at the same time, the UK had voted for Brexit and the French had been courting Marine LePen. The migration crisis was well underway as well.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    a collapse of the eu would end badly for us all, only numpties think its a great idea to cause the collapse of economies, including ours, but this sentiment is growing rapidly, including here, so we better get ready for it.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Modulok


    Yes of course it would be bad. And Irish people becoming a minority in their own country will be far, far worse.



  • Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭Bluewolf


    We will see I suppose, time will tell.

    It will have been 5 years since last election when next one rolls round, public opinion has changed vastly in my opinion. Pendulum has swung way too far for some people and I’d imagine public opinion of the political options currently available is very low.

    it’s ripe for a party of the ilk of the Dutch Freedom Party to drive in I think.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    what!

    you do realise theres not a full on run for our borders, yea?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 843 ✭✭✭m2_browning


    A collapse of the EU would be absolutely terrible for Ireland, EU and its citizens

    But in a world where likes of Russia have weaponised migrants and pretty much declared war on us, EU and various parties and member states have been slow to respond because of they try to broach the subject of migration of half of Africa and Middle East into Europe of people who don’t share our culture or values (and quite often want to turn Europe into the same shitholes that they ran away from) they be shouted down with accusations of racism and xenophobia

    You see that on this thread, instead of discussing what for some might be an uncomfortable topic the accusations get flung around



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,341 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Absolutely, however a shake up to the overlords now and then isn't necessarily a bad thing, rightly or not there's a growing number of voters who aren't comfortable with policies, simply overruling them or ignoring them is folly, as demonstrated in the US with Trump and with Brexit in the UK, they need to be taken into account before this happens again, history has literally just repeated itself.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,170 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Is it though? The overwhelming majority of Irish people have a positive opinion of the EU. Modern nationalist don't care about anything except racism and grifting. You've surely noticed that they don't support anything which might help Irish people or Europeans, just cruelty and xenophobia.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...you do realise the ones(entities) that are actually turning the west into 'sh1tholes', are in fact westerns themselves, we re actually doing it largely to ourselves, by continually implementing highly destructive policies, again, and again, and again....



  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Modulok


    Check back with me in 30 years or so.

    One fifth of everyone who lives here today was born abroad. This happened in just the past twenty years or so. Let's give it another twenty years and see what the fraction is then. The boats keep coming, at an ever accelerating rate.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,907 ✭✭✭granturismo


    The Dutch try to limit dual citizenship. I just googled 'Can dutch' and the first suggestion that came up was 'Can dutch have dual citizenship' - it must be a popular seach in the last 2 days. A Dutch friend here is waiting to see if he is going to apply for Irish citizenship if the EU exit referendum proceeds in the Netherlands even if it means renouncing his Dutch citizenship.

    I fear Dutch EU exit will happen if Wilders start the referendum process.Just look at all the wappies that emerged during covid protests in the Netherlans. The Farmers Party may want to stay in the EU for access to the internal market? Given the jingoism and lies that accompanied the UK leave vote, a Dutch exit is more than a slight possility.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    shaking up the overlords, the wealthy and powerful are doing just fine in all of this, they ll probably be never over thrown, and if you think politicians are truly a part of that, we got problems....

    ...very little power resides within our political institutions now, its been de-centralised, hence why very little is changing, when the guard changes, wes got problems!

    ....yea disturbingly, history does seem to be repeating, rhyming, and everything else at the moment, the rest of this decade is gonna be stormy to say the least.....

    ...more bullsh1t is on the way, be ready!

    ...at the moment yes, but i suspect these extreme views are on the way for us to, i think we ll end up in trouble in the new decade, regard these type of numpties, we ll see...



  • Registered Users Posts: 843 ✭✭✭m2_browning


    Imho there is nothing wrong with immigration itself especially if the migrants add to the society and economy and integrate

    Where I draw the line is bullshit belonging to a certain religion (we had our own long history of religious crap only to have recent put end to it) wanting to have precedence over our laws, and/or crime, and/or abuse of women like genital mutilation

    In short of the migrants don’t integrate, ship em back

    I suspect a lot of the Dutch who voted this week would nod at above



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...you do realise the boats arent rocking up to our shores, yea? yes, immigration is gonna increase here, fact, but currently our control measures are working reasonably well, with issues of course, will we be over run, at the moment, very unlikely, you also realise we never built enough homes over the last few years, and this isnt gonna change anytime soon, so.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,825 ✭✭✭Lillyfae


    17 years, I love it. Just sad things are going this way, before we could just laugh at Wilders and his ludicrous hair, no one took him seriously except crazy racists. Now the youth are disenfranchised and angry. When I took the train to work in another city the other day, Groene Links and Volt were the only parties I saw canvassing at the stations, wondering if it's just a sign that the PVV knows these elections are won in the dark corners of the internet, sharing clickbait and counting on those who are lacking in the ability to think critically. Thankfully the city I'm in did not give the majority to the PVV- that's comforting.

    I remember speaking to a friend who lives in London after Brexit who said it was just an overwhelming feeling of being unwanted after so many years of calling England home, it really feels like that. I work hard, I've integrated, I volunteer and pay plenty of taxes. I don't want to live anywhere else, all of my adult life and my family are here, my OH and children are Dutch.

    @granturismo I'm waiting to hit the number of years residence + marital status so that I can have dual citizenship. If a referendum arises before that happens I'll have to renounce my Irish citizenship in order to be eligible to vote, which I will most certainly be doing. I can currently vote in EU elections and Dutch local elections but not national or referenda.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭20silkcut


    The EU is becoming increasingly anti farmer in tone . Farmers are being taken to court at a whim in this country by various powerful organisations and guys with clipboards and yellow vests for doing work that was perfectly legal a few years ago. This is causing incredible resentment in rural Ireland and feels as oppressive as any authoritarian regime couple that with the erosion of the rural society and culture and nothing in the pipeline to replace our work and restore our society only to herd us into the city. it is easy understand why the mainstream parties are losing the vote in rural Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Modulok


    You are not good at understanding the butterfly effect, are ya chief. The boats are rocking up on the Med coast and as the Italians can't take everyone by themselves, Brussels will (and is) pushing for distribution throughout the Union. Boats from France are rocking up on the English coast too, and we have a common travel area with England.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,965 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    what's rural culture?

    people are taken to court for breaching environmental rules. look what happened to lough neagh, and is happening all over this island, i mean if we were to things like that unchecked, which irish politicians would gladly do instead of rocking the boat, the whole country would be a polluted cesspit eventually. this is why EU directives are good for us sometimes, keeps us in check for things that irish TDs don't want to go anywhere near for fear of losing votes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,071 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...the majority of those folks are in fact remaining close to where they actually landed butty! yes some have made it to here, and more will come, but the numbers are in fact small, much smaller than the countries in which those first landed, i.e. greece, italy etc etc...

    ...so relax! theres gonna be a steady flow of immigrants to here, and the fact we re now experiencing serious property shortages, and will remain to do so for many years, this will more than likely effect the flow of these numbers to.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,965 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Well I think you're catastrophising, but society and cultures change either way. Harking back to when everything was better is Brexit speak 101. Ireland is completely different to how it was 50 years ago, mostly for the better, and will be completely different in 50 years time one way or another.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 843 ✭✭✭m2_browning


    There you go casually dismissing a large chunk of population and their concerns out of your city perch divorced from the production of the food you need to survive

    This might be just an example of why what happened in Netherlands happened



  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Modulok


    I agree that Islamic immigration is much more problematic than say, Indian or Filipino immigration. But the volumes are such that there is no need for any immigrant cohort to integrate with the native Irish. Filipinos will mainly socialize with other Filipinos, Indians with Indians, Zimbabweans with Zimbabweans. We will end up with parallel societies not necessarily hostile to each other. Indifferent to each other would also be bad. What made Ireland Ireland, will be gone at some point. The solidarity and cohesion of shared ethnicity, shared cultural memory and traditions, will be lost.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,965 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    well in Ireland we mainly produce food for export so I rely on foreign farmers to survive, Dutch ones too lol, most of the food we eat is imported. I didn't dismiss anyone, I was just wondering what rural culture was.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    In a fantasy world perhaps, polling indicates we're swinging more to the left. We've had numerous failed right wing parties and there's no sudden growth for Aontu or Renua on display. 😂



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,170 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Thanks for responding. I've no idea what to do with myself as I'm stagnating a bit here in London and it's getting a bit less nice as prices go mental. I know they're quite high in the Netherlands as well. I read Ben Coates' book and the impression I get is that while the place is getting less and less liberal with the rise (and occasional murders) of people like Pim Fortuyn and Theo Van Gogh, it still has a very high quality of life.

    I was applying for stuff in the southern Randstad but I haven't gotten anywhere. It is what it is.

    Thanks agian.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 843 ✭✭✭m2_browning


    Yep Ghetoizzation is an aspect of lack of integration

    I have absolutely no issues with let’s say a Phillipino (every person from that country I ever met was extremely nice) nurse working for HSE and paying taxes

    I would have serious issue if that nurse proceeds to not integrate with our culture and society and commits crime or starts preaching their religion whatever it is takes precedence over our constitution and law



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,965 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    why should people not be allowed preach their religion? irish people did it worldwide for centuries



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,422 ✭✭✭Snooker Loopy


    Personally I think we should deport anybody with the surnames Walsh, Fitzgerald, Burke, Redmond etc. Feckin' Brits and French.

    We need a time machine to go back to when we were properly Irish in 865. Our shared cultural memory and what it means to be Irish has been completely destroyed since then.



  • Registered Users Posts: 843 ✭✭✭m2_browning


    1. because it would cause division, I don’t care what they do at home or in their church, but preaching is an act of deliberately trying to convert others
    2. some religions (ahem) have it as core tenets that their religious scriptures take precedence over civil law of the state, I have a huge issue with this


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  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Modulok


    Change is inevitable and often desirable. But the change we are experiencing now is unnecessary, reckless, radical, unprecedented. It will end badly.

    The Ireland of 50, 60, 100 years ago is gone, but it is not forgotten. Those people were our roots, our lineage - our parents, our grandparents, our great-grandparents. We can relate to that past because it is our past. We know that our ancestors walked the same country lanes we walk; they farmed the same fields we farm, they saw the same hills in the distance that we see; used the same placenames that we use. Irish people today are connected to Irish people from centuries ago by name, by lineage.

    But fifty years from now, when 50% of people living in Ireland think about their grandparents and great-grandparents, they'll be thinking of Muslims from Pakistan, Hindus from India, Visayans from Cebu. Their roots have no contact with Irish soil.



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