M20 - Cork to Limerick [preferred route chosen; in design - phase 3]

No point in wasting money on a rail line that will not be used

As far as I can tell, the improvements to the rail line are a double-tracking from Limerick Junction to Colbert Station and, as part of that, some advance works that will make the eventual electrification of this stretch cheaper to achieve later. This will allow more trains per day, and a faster journey times between the two endpoints. The biggest problem with Cork-Limerick by rail is that it is so slow: you have to change at Limerick Junction and then the last section is much, much slower.

Colbert station is pretty centrally located in Limerick - it’s less than 10 minutes by foot from the station to the commercial centre of the city. Cork Kent access has improved greatly now that an entrance has been opened on Horgan’s Quay, but it’s still a long way from the commercial centre (about 20 minutes’s walk). At least now with the extra space to the south there’s a chance of having a couple of onward city-service buses waiting for each train arrival.

The current rail link between Cork and Limerick is a deterrent to travelling by rail, even with the N20 being such a poor option - these works will make it attractive for city-to-city travel. But I think that improving the railway isn’t really about Cork-Limerick journeys (any more than improving N20 is about journeys starting in one city and ending in the other). The real gain from this rail work will be to allow for more sustainable housing development to the south east of Limerick city (which in turn will reduce commuter load on the forthcoming N24). This will be one of five planned commuter-rail corridors in Limerick (the other four are the Ennis line including a new branch to Shannon Airport; services as far as Castleconnel on the current Birdhill line; and new-build lines to Mungret and Adare).

We're slightly off-topic here, but good conversation.

I think regardless what happens with the M20 Limerick-Limerick Jn needs to be upgraded, as does through-running at Limerick Jn. M20 is needed too, but for slightly different reasons.

Kent isn't every endpoint in Cork. I'd use the Cork Commuter line to get to Limerick, for instance. And you could have future Luas users getting the train to Limerick. But Limerick Jn is definitely a bottleneck.

But Limerick's endpoints are a bit of a problem alright though. I have walked to Dooradoyle because it was easier than public transport!

There is no guarantee that double tracking to LJ will be part of the rail option proposal. I can't see how it would be justified for the service frequency.

Yep exactly. Maybe that's gone over people's head a little bit because of the way we had framed it in the context of the M20. The rail upgrades WILL happen, I believe. The challenge is to swat away talk of "M20 isn't needed because of rail".

So that conversation goes both ways: rail upgrades are needed regardless of the M20, M20 is needed regardless of rail upgrades.

... and it will cost so much because they’re going to build it as quickly as possible while keeping the runway above in operation.

But as already noted, DAA is a private business and this isn’t tax money.

So... what about that M20, eh?

This month is getting on now, any signs of the preferred route announcement date?

Apologies, I misread the topic title and I don't particularly care about the specific route (I was happy with the corridor choice) so I somehow thought this was the next stage/phase!

The website has the latest update as March 2022. Next phase is Phase 3 - Design and Environmental Evaluation.

Moderator: could we change the topic title to say Phase 3 perhaps?

Nothing going too happen while green cabbage party leader Eamon Ryan in charge, hes probably busy planning bringing back wolfs back into Ireland countryside.

Goats loose at Ballybeg Bends for several days now on the main route between our 2nd and 3rd cities. Disgraceful.

I think it’s less that people have stopped caring, and more that there is general acceptance that this road will never actually be built.

We might eventually get a bypass or two along the route (Charleville, Buttevant), but anyone can see that the game is rigged. It is not possible to square the current government’s approach to the climate with building a high-quality road that would make road travel safer and simpler (and thus more attractive), that would support development in spread-out rural communities and small towns rather than in dense urban cores, and that would offer a convenient and helpful alternative to the train for getting between cities.

The M20 will meet the same fate as any of the other much-needed roads which have not yet been built.

It's not just about the added distance.

If traffic in the City would have to get to the new route, adding pressure on the existing routes to Dublin (and eastbound).

Part of the advantage of the new motorway option is that it creates a new arterial route in/out from the City, thereby avoiding adding more cars to existing routes (Dunkettle etc.)