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Denis Villeneuve’s Dune

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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    Yeah, I'd seen somewhere else that the dinner party scene was shot.

    I'd say I'd be likely to watch an extended version if it came out.

    Still though, I'm not seeing anything wrong with them wanting to keep the film to just the 2.5 hours



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 8,816 Mod ✭✭✭✭mewso


    Looking at popping in to see this in the lighthouse but it only has it in screen 2. What are the lesser screens like there?



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,485 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Very much so IMO. The 1st 6 only tho. If it's anything with Brian Herbert or Kevin Anderson on the cover?I gnore it.

    Also worth a read, and clearly popular with Villeneuve is Willis McNelly's Dune Encyclopedia. It's not canon but, it did have a tacit acceptance by Herbert and he even wrote the foreword.

    I may have a .pdf to share if you fancy it 😉



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,728 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Had the film faithfully followed all that's in the book and the nuances, it would have been more complicated and that 2.5 hours would have covered only one sixth the book. Dune probably would be best seved as a TV series of the highest production standards. like Brideshead Revisited, a far smaller and simpler book which took roughly 11 hours to cover as a TV series.

    I loved the film but would prefer a BHR level treatment.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,668 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    Looks like Part Two will start filming 18th July, so that 2023 release date looks a bit safer. Villeneuve has also repeated that there will not be an extended cut.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    Very surprising that WB didn’t turn it into a series for HBOMax



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Perhaps, though there's a show focused on the Bene Gesseritt coming so they have eyes on TV all the same.

    Glad there's more wriggle room for the shooting. I'd still maintain hope for an extended cut, wouldn't be unheard of for a studio plough ahead without the director after all



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,668 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    I really don't think that much was cut. Probably several short scenes and extended versions/dialogue of existing scenes which would probably require a significant restructure of parts of the film in order to put back in. It's also possible that Villeneuve plans to use some of the cut material/dialogue in part two, so doing an extended version of part one with it wouldn't make sense. I very much doubt the banquet scene was shot. It reportedly wasn't in the 2018 draft of the script. I reckon it has a better chance of being the opening scene of part two (as a flashback) then it ever had of being in part one.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Sure. Think it's just wishful, hopeful thinking on my part; I want to spend more time in this world, see a little more texture and let some side characters more time to make an impact. Especially Yueh. Still surprised how badly structured his was handled. He absolutely needed to come into the story earlier, make more of an impact in the first few acts once we meet the Atreides.

    But if no extended cut is the price paid for the sequel, that's absolutely fair enough cos I'm still a little surprised this has done as well as it has (relatively speaking; its box office hasn't been that amazing), and delighted it's getting, if nothing else, a chance to wrap up the first book.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,355 ✭✭✭Homelander


    It did extremely well on streaming services as well and probably will continue to perform strong based on word of mouth so that probably nets them significant additional revenue.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    I have seen several references to Dune as a “high concept sci-fi movie” but I don’t get it.

    The story and characters are pretty straight forward. There is no complicated exploration of the cultures portrayed.

    It is a great more but I don’t get what is “high concept”.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Ya the first book is straight enough. It's later in the series when you start getting high concept manwormgods



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    I was looking forward to the worm riders but now I’m looking forward to manwormgods even more. :)

    I think the director (can’t spell his name) and WB or the movie news websites (or both) are just pretending to themselves that the movie is “high concept” for some reason.

    That is probably what added to my expectation that the film would be a bit bonkers.

    Without giving anything away, are all the books in the series set on Arrakis? And is there any battles in space?

    I was disappointed that they didn’t show us space travel in the film - one moment they were packing to move and then suddenly they on Dune.

    Also were the dragonfly helicopters left there by the Harrkanons? I found the controls on those craft odd - they had panels and buttons that you would see on airplanes or in Star Wars but the the space cruisers (even though we only see from the outside) were not conventional looking space craft and I thought they ‘d have equally advanced controls, at the very least touch panel controls.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Arrakis remains a large part of the plot and there are rarely battles of any kind. It's more about the politics and scheming



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    I was expecting a battle Part 2 between Paul with the Fremons and the Harkkonons and going to war with the Emperor (as one of his visions showed).

    I assume this has to happen in order to put House Atredis in a position to to be able to be a part of schemes and politics.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Anything I was talking about is from later books not stuff that will be covered in the movie



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,286 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    Can anyone explain why the father of Paul was so dopey ??

    Like he was lured into a complete trap and seemed to be totally clueless about it

    going by the portrayal in the movie I wouldn’t let him run the local charity shop on a wet bank holiday Monday



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    He explains in the movie quite clearly that he knew it was a trap but had to play along.He also wanted access to the very powerful Fremen and thought with time they could swing the coming battles.

    He was caught out by the swiftness of the attack and the turning of his unturnable doctor



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,286 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    He comes across as completely incompetent and easily, easily got rid of by the other crowd.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,149 ✭✭✭The White Wolf


    What a bold effort this was, of the action that was in it, it was understated. For a budget of this size that is some achievement.

    Really enjoyed the voice commanding particularly. That **** was amazing.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    Voice commanding?

    EDIT: Took me a while to cop on you are talking about the mind control.

    I wonder if that is the where Lucas got the idea for the Jedi Mind Trick.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,149 ✭✭✭The White Wolf


    The witch thing where they could command people to do their wishes. Don't know the proper term.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    No I disagree.

    He knew going commanding Arakis was Danton’s and would make him more enemies but he could not refuse the “request” from the Emperor to to take command of Arakis but the wealth from the spice plus an alliance with the people of the planet gave House Atredis the potential for more power to them and their allies against those enemies.

    Leto had simply not expected the Harkkonons to sabotage the spice storage and collection equipment nor had he anticipated the speed with which they would return.

    Even the Harkkonons hadn’t suspected it.

    There wasn’t much to the character himself which had me suspecting from the start that he wasn’t going to live to see the end of Part 1 and Oscar Isaac didn’t give him much personality.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭Need a Username


    I figured out what you meant though I can’t understand how I didn’t know straight away. :p

    I wouldn’t describe it as “amazing” though - maybe Herbert is the first to come up with it but it has been done is Star Wars and from there copied quite a lot.

    It is a cool take on mind control though and I’m interested to learn what else the Bene Gessrit can do - hope Lucas didn’t all the Jedi stuff from there. :p

    Also, even though I knew the term Bene Gesserit going into the film and understood immediately which characters they were on screen, quite a few times I thought characters were calling them “the Jesuits”. :)



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Duke Leto knew he was walking into a trap, but he was tied by the rules and laws of this world; he couldn't refuse the emperor's command to occupy Arakis. The difference was, IIRC and it has been a while, he saw the Fremen as an untapped ally and power that could help turn an obvious trap into a strong, strategic position. As opposed to the Harkonnen and House Corino (the Emperor's originating clan), who saw them as a minority nuisance needing control. Leto suspected they were a sleeping dragon, awaiting an alliance through respect.

    Of course, had he been given more time on Arakis, he may have developed that connection but the Harkonnen emptied their stores of Spice, coupled with further machination by the Emperor, to organise an immediate response. So it is left to Paul to try and continue his father's plan.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,668 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    While there's a lot more in the book about how traitors and washed-up old mentats etc contributed to Leto's fall, I am inclined to think he was just screwed and that was it. The book is very fatalistic and I think this is conveyed well in the film. Basically it simplifies the trap to two basic points: 1) the emperor sent them there to die, i.e. their fate was sealed (literally) before they even landed, and 2) a character flaw on Leto's part: he's too noble to refuse the emperor's offer and like his father foolishly thinks he can outsmart a bull (the Harkonnens).



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,149 ✭✭✭The White Wolf


    The only thing I didn't like about the trap is that it made them seem quite foolish, as in I couldn't believe they fell into the Baron's plan. Felt like I missed an hour's worth of story but the Duke quickly realising he was fucked made up for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,399 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    I do think that a lot of the early chatting on Caladan should have been done on Dune so that it doesn't feel like they got jumped on their first night in town.

    The Harkonnens spent a fortune on the army and transport for that attack and it was money Leto only discovered they had after he got to Dune. Also even though he knew the Emperor was setting him up nobody expected the Emperor to risk getting so involved that he sends Sardaukar and silences the Judge of the Change.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,485 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    The movie does skim it a little too quickly but I would presume that the issue of the plan and some of the minor characters input to it will become clearer in part 2.

    The Atreides were fully aware of the trap. They mistake they made was in underestimating the money the Baron would spend.

    The book lays it out far clearer but a hint is given to the costs of space travel in the movie when the Duke asks Thufir how much the Empire spent to send the Herald to Caladan.

    Warfare in the Duniverse is very much limited to raids and small actions due to the sheer expense of Space Travel via the guild.

    The Atreides knew there was a trap, the knew the Baron and the Empire were in cahoots. They did fathom just how much the Baron would be prepared to spend to bring overwhelming force to bear. The Atreides expected a raid, perhaps supported by Sardaukar and believed that they had the time to build an alliance with the Fremen and prepare to expand the Atreides army.

    Outside of the Sardaukar the Atreides were the best troops in the Imperium, it's touched on in the talk between Piter De Vries and the Sardaukar on Salusa Secundus.

    The Atreides knew this and thought they'd have time to grow that combat power via the fremen.

    The Atreides mentat Thufir Hawat's mistake was in not recognising how much the Baron would spend to destroy them.

    The book really does go into vast detail on the trap, the machinations and the plans within plans.



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