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Would you be happy for your children to receive covid-19 vaccine

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Del Griffith


    To be honest I've started just skimming over your posts for the most part as you are just repeating the same drivel over and over. We're both well aware of where we stand, I've explained myself about 5 times which is 4 more than I should have so I won't continue to bother.

    You still refuse to acknowledge that the lessoning of transmission has been largely attributed to the lessoning of symptoms. Good for you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 857 ✭✭✭PintOfView



    I agree it's not desirable that a lot of mainstream media is controlled by fewer entities. However it doesn't follow that the owners of these media outlets are telling their journalists what to write, and covering up the truth when it comes to vaccines, etc. Why has no journalist at any of the large number of media outlets, in any country, ever blown the whistle on what you allege?

    As regards Luc Montagnier,  you have to go no further than wikipedia to see his views are controversial (and not just on Covid)  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier.   (BTW the article I linked to was by a virologist - director, Trivedi School of Biosciences at Ashoka University, India - who explained why Luc Montagnier was wrong, so hardly a nobody!).

    I don't agree with any of the other points you made in your reply, but as they are straying off the subject (and into conspiracy land) I will refrain from addressing them here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Did you just refer to Luc Montagnier, Nobel Prize Winner in Medicine, as a "fringe element"? 😁

    Past performance as they say is no indication of future performance. He's not the first to go off the rails. His credibility was tainted when he made the HIV claim about COVID. He had also been involved with some absurd fringe autism cures and was an advocate for some very wacky homeopathy long before any of this. Pauling, who also won the Nobel, made some very strange claims about Vitamin C. Stiglitz, who won in economics, ranted on for years about how Greece was shafted back in 2008 by the EU, when it was largely their own fault.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,354 ✭✭✭copeyhagen




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  • Posts: 966 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The other points were examples of what were labelled last year as "conspiracy theory", but have come to be true. Nothing to really disagree with there, they've become fact.

    As for the Digital/biometric ID's to follow vaxx passports, the UK government (amongst others) are already giving the heads-up. Do you disagree with them? https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-uk-digital-identity-and-attributes-trust-framework/the-uk-digital-identity-and-attributes-trust-framework

    Anyway, one thing I do agree with you on is that this will go off topic. Fair play, too; you're always respectful in exchanges 👍️



  • Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Great post.


    But not just EU politicians. Trudeau and Biden are also building back better.


    But for another thread.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Mimon


    Fair enough on that, interesting. My point still stands on children being reservoirs for Covid 19.



  • Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    But then you have the director of the CDC saying we're only a few mutations away from a vaccine-proof variant: 'A Few Mutations Away': The Threat of a Vaccine-Proof Variant (medscape.com)


    It's hard to know what to believe.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,719 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    I think that is why she is circumspect in her language though, because all the usual suspects in politics and the meeja would be hitting the panic button.

    Cases in young are high.

    Admissions have gone up in this younger age group but thankfully most are out in a couple of days .

    But there is no guarantees if this pattern will continue once children return to school .

    Who wants to take that chance ?

    I think it would be positively negligent of anybody dealing with children not to advocate for what has so far proved to be a very safe vaccine with the risk of potential increases in infection and possibly more children becoming severely ill.

    It is not as if this has been wheeled out straight away to children without adequate data . Just because that data is not widely available and discussed does not mean that these consultants are lying or hiding anything.

    Why would they ?

    The thought is facile and ridiculous . They would be struck off and never work again , at the very least . The level of debate that even suggests such unbelievable conspiracy is not worth reading imo.

    I would be happy if this was not a decision people had to make as it is never easy where children are concerned .

    However I know that someone like Prof Butler would not be recommending vaccination without very good reason ,and that is good enough for me .

    Everyone else has to decide for their own children .

    If you have children and your child was admitted, God forbid , with a serious infectious disease that needed radical treatment that was only in use for the last year but proven effective , would you be quizzing the consultant looking for research and data and waiting a few months before you decided to let your child have the treatment?

    I know this is different before everyone jumps on me , but the principle of trust is the same , and the urgency is similar .

    Too late getting your child vaxxed once they have already become unwell .

    Also is anyone else here having problems with this site today ?!

    It's impossible to post , keeps stopping .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 13,480 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    How did they test long term effects on children?

    Why did the vaccine makers get indemnity?

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Mimon


    Good read here on it. The chances of mutations are greater in unvaccinated pouplations so there is an increased risk.

    "Meaning: unvaccinated populations are the FAR bigger risk for SARS-CoV-2 evolution"

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1421942704229978113.html



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,719 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Could it be that noone cares what Who DF is Jashah Kholin or what it has to say on Twitter?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,845 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Sigh, please do some research and stop spreading lies:

    8 studies there for you to peruse at your leisure. I've made the post short so you can take it all in quickly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭Pwindedd


    I think it’s probably best err on the side of caution and “never say never” with regard to COVID and vaccines. In a year or two the data on both the virus and the vaccine will tell us a lot more than we know now. Who knows what variants will emerge. Hopefully it ends up being just another cold and only the vulnerable will need jabs. Failing that in 6 years time your 12 year old can make that decision for themselves.



  • Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It could also be that the variant talk is more fearmongering



  • Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The loons are all coalescing. Just because other people are spouting the same sh*te you are does not make it any less of a nonsense. Half baked conspiracy is not debate. Most of the sane challengers to restrictions and the accepted Covid narrative do not engage in the bizarre rhetoric that has now developed



  • Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 78,503 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    We have an entire forum where conspiracy theories can be discussed, but it's not this one. Please do not spout such crap here as it will just get deleted and there's every chance you will also pick up a formal sanction

    Any questions PM me - do not respond to this post in-thread



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,364 ✭✭✭CruelSummer


    Fair enough Goldengirl, we’ll have to agree to disagree on this subject.

    That’s precisely my point that there are no studies or data out there to show that young healthy children need the vaccine, what the benefit is of giving it to them is and what are the risks v benefits are for them if they are given it.

    I do understand it is a different situation where there are vulnerable children / family members involved.

    I also think it’s getting to the point where the world & west in particular really needs to step up its aid for vaccination campaigns in poorer countries, especially of their healthcare workers & vulnerable. They have unfortunately been left behind & images such as the catastrophe in India will continue to emerge as long as that remains the case. This should be the priority for now.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,719 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Agree with you there .

    Not much good one part of the world fully vaxxed but another rife with infection.

    Same with different age groups in a population .....;)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 964 ✭✭✭riveratom


    I’m with you there for the most part, although in France it’s large shopping centres not supermarkets. Still though.

    Here’s a question. If roughly 50-80+% of people in a shopping mall are vaccinated AND everyone is wearing a mask, and hospitalisations are like if to stay low, where is the threat, especially compared to when we didn’t have a vaccine??!

    Personally I think a line is being crossed and I don’t think people will take it, you can see it in France already. If they try expand it here to more than hospitality, I think there’ll be water charges style ructions.

    And if they try to bring in vaccine certs for colleges, I really hope there are serious ructions. I don’t think they’d try it here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Del Griffith


    Nice old data there, pre delta and does nothing to explain our very current real world enormous case spikes amongst the vaccinated, which you continue to side step and ignore.

    Rather than rehash the same garbage again and again why not just admit you're wrong and a pro-censorship extremist radical who can't stand the thought of parents being able to make their own decisions about their kids? You seem like an obsessive person.



  • Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    In the January wave hospitalisation totals were roughly the same as daily cases when we were at similar case numbers. Now they are 90% less. That is vaccination. The increase in cases is also at a fraction of that in earlier waves. That is vaccination

    Parents can make their own decision. When that decision is based on misinformation and lies it is not a rational decision however. Just as people have the right to make their own decisions, people have the right to challenge the nonsense being used to support those decisions. Having rights does not exclude from criticism



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Del Griffith


    Did you reply to the right person?

    Why do I keep having to tell you over and over that I agree completely that vaccines are fantastic at their job - keeping hospitalisations and deaths at bay. Why do you keep talking as if I've ever said any different? Are you another looking for the antivax boogeyman?

    Challenging nonsense from those trying to force a decision down parents throats with pressure about exaggerated what-ifs around variants that don't but maybe-possibly-could-someday exist in children is exactly what I'm doing.

    Post edited by Del Griffith on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,519 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    One thing's for sure, nobody likes being told they are parenting wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,845 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Your point was that reduction of symptoms was what majorly reduced transmission, I have 8 studies showing that is not the case and those studies are showing reductions of up to 94% in transmission asymptomatically. There is no reason why that would be different with Delta and the figures in countries with high vaccination rates where Delta is predominant (including Gibraltar where you seem to constantly misunderstand the data) are showing that.

    If you are saying that Delta is more transmissible, then it makes sense to get kids vaccinated as it will reduce the symptomatic and asymptomatic transmission and reduce the impact of the virus on the vaccinated individual when they catch it.

    Although I see you've now resorted to name calling, good luck with that approach.



  • Posts: 338 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Just passing by here but seriously someone calling, children ‘reservoirs of disease.’ Absolutely scandalous language.Boards really going downhill. Will leave it at that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,175 ✭✭✭Neddyusa


    Agreed.

    Unfortunately though I think it's not just boards.ie

    Common decency seems to have been one of the biggest casualties, both our legislators and in society over the past 18 months.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 325 ✭✭virginmediapls



    No, drinking is bad for you.


    Unlike the vaccine.



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